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In addition to the clutch plates slightly rubbing, you're also only driving half the gearbox in neutral but the whole gearbox plus half the clutch in gear.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:06
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Ola posted:In addition to the clutch plates slightly rubbing, you're also only driving half the gearbox in neutral but the whole gearbox plus half the clutch in gear. Well and the entire engine, more importantly - you're unlikely to notice an extra shaft's worth of friction but the effect of trying to move the entire engine is going to be a lot more noticeable.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:09
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Z3n posted:You have a bad battery. This might not be true. I just ran a battery down to ~10v due to a bad starter on my sportster. Recharged the battery with an actual charger, swapped out the starter with a good one, fired right up and has kept a charge. Z3n posted:Also a fully charged battery should be around 12.7 or so when ignition is off, around 12.5 when ignition is on, and with the bike running and reved to around 1/3rd of total RPM, at around 14. If none of these are true you have a problem. This is definitely true. It should be around 12.6-13v key off and lose .01-.2v key on engine off (KOEO). When running, the battery should be getting more voltage than it had before starting and is therefore charging. So roughly 14v. Renaissance Robot posted:Speaking of starting problems, I checked my battery this morning* and got 12.9v across the terminals. I thought this meant it might be okay but several minutes later I'm down to 11.1v with a still-dead bike. Two different mechanics have told me the carbs need cleaning, could that be making it harder to start? Obviously at 11v it's not going to start now without a jump or a new battery, but I'd have thought 12.9 would be enough. A good way to test if the starter is bad without removing it is to either jump from a known good battery of similar cranking amps or attach it to a charger/jump starter and see if the bike starts. If it starts that means your battery isn't putting out enough amperage to start the bike. If it still doesn't start that means the problem isn't your battery. Check the cables from the battery for resistance. If they are fine then it suggests the starter is the issue.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:30
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Well and the entire engine, more importantly - you're unlikely to notice an extra shaft's worth of friction but the effect of trying to move the entire engine is going to be a lot more noticeable. You're probably not driving the engine. It's heavier to push the bike in gear with the clutch in compared to neutral - but there's not so much friction you actually spin the motor. And it's not so much the friction of the second shaft, but the gearing, which makes the clutch friction work harder against the rear tire. One exception is shifting down at high speed while holding the clutch in - depending on temps and adjustment you can see the revs go higher than idle.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:47
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Ola posted:You're probably not driving the engine. It's heavier to push the bike in gear with the clutch in compared to neutral - but there's not so much friction you actually spin the motor. And it's not so much the friction of the second shaft, but the gearing, which makes the clutch friction work harder against the rear tire. One exception is shifting down at high speed while holding the clutch in - depending on temps and adjustment you can see the revs go higher than idle. That's what i mean though. In gear with the clutch in and engine stopped you'll get the maximum possible amount of drag because the engine is basically an anchor - the fact that the gearbox will also be adding to that equation doesn't really matter because of the drag the engine is putting in. The clutch stiction is pretty much a constant (at least until you're putting so much heat from fiction into the system that it begins to affect the viscosity of the oil). If the clutch was connected directly to the crank it would still be the same amount of drag.
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Nov 22, 2015 23:26
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goddamnedtwisto posted:That's what i mean though. In gear with the clutch in and engine stopped you'll get the maximum possible amount of drag because the engine is basically an anchor - the fact that the gearbox will also be adding to that equation doesn't really matter because of the drag the engine is putting in. No, if you have the clutch out, then you're getting the engine friction + compression resistance. With the clutch in, the engine is not moving. The input side of the clutch also stays put. It doesn't matter if it's connected to a 250 cc engine or bolted to Mount Rushmore, the input side of the clutch is still, the output side is being moved by you and the friction is the biggest force working against you, but the gearbox still has friction. Try it for yourself next time you change clutch plates for instance. goddamnedtwisto posted:The clutch stiction is pretty much a constant (at least until you're putting so much heat from fiction into the system that it begins to affect the viscosity of the oil). If the clutch was connected directly to the crank it would still be the same amount of drag. No, that's where the gearing comes in. The higher the gear it's in, the easier it is to work against the friction. So moving the bike around with the clutch pulled in in 1st is harder than in 2nd because the output side of the clutch rotates more times per wheel revolution.
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Nov 22, 2015 23:40
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Ola posted:No, if you have the clutch out, then you're getting the engine friction + compression resistance. With the clutch in, the engine is not moving. The input side of the clutch also stays put. It doesn't matter if it's connected to a 250 cc engine or bolted to Mount Rushmore, the input side of the clutch is still, the output side is being moved by you and the friction is the biggest force working against you, but the gearbox still has friction. Try it for yourself next time you change clutch plates for instance. You know what, I'm having a total brainfart here and forgetting where the clutch is in the drivetrain. For some reason I had it in mind it was between the gearbox and final drive. And this is why I don't work on my own bike or anything more mechanically complicated than Ikea furniture.
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Nov 22, 2015 23:50
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I assumed the main reason for the different feel was the adhesion of the oil between the clutch plates, not anything to do with spinning 1 shaft vs. 2. The oil bath friction is definitely why the wheel spins slowly when you have the bike on a stand, in gear, running but with the clutch disengaged. It acts like a really crappy torque converter. In effect, a wet clutch will never actually be 100% disconnected. Someone with a dry clutch want to report their experience of pushing the bike around?
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Nov 23, 2015 01:42
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Dry clutches are lovely for pushing bikes around. gently caress wet clutches.
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Nov 23, 2015 02:28
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:Dry clutches are lovely for pushing bikes around. gently caress wet clutches. Seconding this, although the bike in question was an NSR250, not a duc or bmw.
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Nov 23, 2015 03:10
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Fuckkkkkk. 1199 with 44k, easy miles, all maintenance records for 6500. Yay or run?
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Nov 23, 2015 18:49
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Hahaha, "easy miles".
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Nov 23, 2015 18:51
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Are you gonna come out ahead if you have to swap the engine?
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Nov 23, 2015 18:53
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clutchpuck posted:Hahaha, "easy miles". It's my buddies bike. It has literally been used to commute.
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Nov 23, 2015 19:25
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Is there any problem/point using copper grease on my battery screws? I gather there's some kind of white crap it's preferable to use to prevent seizing, but I don't have any of that and I do have a tube of copper grease, soooo
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Nov 23, 2015 19:26
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It isn't necessary to put anything on there, battery leads aren't really something that will seize. ninja edit: unless your battery is corroding, but then you have other issues
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Nov 23, 2015 20:41
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Only thing I'd put on a battery terminal is a star washer.
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Nov 23, 2015 20:55
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I rarely see battery screws locked up but depending on the bike I often see corrosion on the terminals. I have to put vaseline type poo poo on the terminals on my old BMW or they corrode so bad the connectors fall apart. No idea why, I've checked the system for overcharging or draining, it's fine.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:02
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Rev. Dr. Moses P. Lester posted:I rarely see battery screws locked up but depending on the bike I often see corrosion on the terminals. I have to put vaseline type poo poo on the terminals on my old BMW or they corrode so bad the connectors fall apart. No idea why, I've checked the system for overcharging or draining, it's fine. Galvanic corrosion maybe? Anyway yeah, just slap some vaseline on the thread and slather it round the terminals once they're on (NOT around the terminal before you put the clamp on... don't ask) to waterproof it.
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Nov 23, 2015 21:09
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Turns out it's a moot question, shop guy greased the threads up for me  Also my bike starts now 
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Nov 23, 2015 21:28
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iwentdoodie posted:It's my buddies bike. It has literally been used to commute. My commute miles are the hardest miles I put on it.
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Nov 24, 2015 02:55
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cursedshitbox posted:My commute miles are the hardest miles I put on it. Right? Nothin like having to drop to first, dip into the next lane, and gun it because you're stuck behind some rear end in a top hat doing 35-45 in a very busy 65 while everyone is doing 75.
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Nov 24, 2015 04:02
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Speaking of seized, I was trying to get my front wheel off today to change the tire, and NOPE. I thought I was finally getting the axel nut to turn but it turned out to be the edges starting to strip, stopped immediately. I was having a really hard time with the bent-up cotter pin until I just used the needle nose pliers to cut the round end off and pulled the rest though. Fortunately the tire is not all that bad, once I get the rest of the stuff sorted out I guess I can ride it into a shop and have them do it. Next time I'm out at the wreckers I'll see if they've got a replacement nut, in case they have to cut the thing off. Also I lost my keys last night, which included the only key I had for the postie  Had meant to get a replacement made but there aren't any locksmiths around my usual haunts, and I've never lost my keys before so it was kinda low priority. Fortunately it was easy enough to pop the ignition out of the frame (as luck would have it, I had a lens wrench I brought along with me when I moved that worked for getting the locking ring off), if they don't turn up in the lost and found at my work site tonight, then I'll get some more cut.
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Nov 24, 2015 07:24
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Marxalot posted:Right? Nothin like having to drop to first, dip into the next lane, and gun it because you're stuck behind some rear end in a top hat doing 35-45 in a very busy 65 while everyone is doing 75. I literally just set my cruise control to like 70 and lean back/chill. These days I don't even touch the handlebars really until I'm getting back off the highway. 
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Nov 24, 2015 08:01
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Tactical Lesbian posted:cruise control Ya lost me
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Nov 24, 2015 08:05
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Slavvy posted:Ya lost me Cruise control on bikes is awesome. How else am I gonna pull off my helmet while riding to deal with that super annoying itch on my scalp?
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Nov 24, 2015 08:41
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Z3n posted:Cruise control on bikes is awesome. How else am I gonna pull off my helmet while riding to deal with that super annoying itch on my scalp? Not to mention my texting.
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Nov 24, 2015 08:46
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Z3n posted:Cruise control on bikes is awesome. How else am I gonna pull off my helmet while riding to deal with that super annoying itch on my scalp? You're ridiculous. I just set the cruise and tweet.
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Nov 24, 2015 09:37
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Can you get an aftermarket cruise control? I always have trouble opening my beers while I'm riding.
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Nov 24, 2015 09:46
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I'd be lying if I said I haven't set cruise control, laid back on my dry bag and straight up watched youtube on my phone for at least a hundred miles combined total. yeah. I know.
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Nov 24, 2015 09:47
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Tactical Lesbian posted:I'd be lying if I said I haven't set cruise control, laid back on my dry bag and straight up watched youtube on my phone for at least a hundred miles combined total. This owns and I will probably do the same thing when I have to ride from the Bay Area to LA on I-5.
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Nov 24, 2015 10:46
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Tactical Lesbian posted:I'd be lying if I said I haven't set cruise control, laid back on my dry bag and straight up watched youtube on my phone for at least a hundred miles combined total. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sgIF-0DiXl4
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Nov 24, 2015 13:42
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Tactical Lesbian posted:I literally just set my cruise control to like 70 and lean back/chill. These days I don't even touch the handlebars really until I'm getting back off the highway. Except I'm in Houston and don't get to do that unless it's really late or really early. Also gently caress semis.
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Nov 24, 2015 15:40
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Chichevache posted:This owns and I will probably do the same thing when I have to ride from the Bay Area to LA on I-5. Please do and write back to us when you're burning in hell for crimes against DRZ nation
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Nov 24, 2015 18:13
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Razzled posted:Please do and write back to us when you're burning in hell for crimes against DRZ nation I will live forever, because I feed on the souls of vehicles I kill.  This explains why I will be here shitposting 15 years from now while an expert rider like Z3n gets pretzeled in the axle of a big rig next December. (Boy, I'm sure going to be embarrassed if Z3n dies soon. Zen, if you're planning on dying, please make sure it is ball cancer or something.)
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Nov 24, 2015 18:17
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too late you've already doomed him to be a trucker hood ornament way to go chiche
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Nov 24, 2015 18:33
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Razzled posted:too late you've already doomed him to be a trucker hood ornament Sweet av there, Mailbox.
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Nov 24, 2015 19:09
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Razzled posted:too late you've already doomed him to be a trucker hood ornament I promise to use my powers for good in the future. Nsap is next.
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Nov 24, 2015 19:54
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Seent it and yeah pretty much, except my bike is more like a couch when travel fit. Marxalot posted:Except I'm in Houston and don't get to do that unless it's really late or really early. I only do this when I'm on like hundred mile stretches of flat interstate in the middle of Illinois or something when I'm ~trekking~ up north. Or when I'm commuting to work, minus the YouTube/Crunchyroll/Netflix bit. Soooo many people take pictures/video of me doing it too, so that's funny. I hope I find myself on Vine one of these days. Hopefully they're recording when I die horribly tbh so I can live on as a dank meme
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Nov 24, 2015 23:59
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Chichevache posted:I will live forever, because I feed on the souls of vehicles I kill. why did you leave your 300lb bike on the side of the 101 for 3 days?
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Nov 25, 2015 00:03
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