CanPol Megathread: Big Changus

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PT6A: Jan 5, 2006; Public school teachers are callous dictators who won't lift a finger to stop children from peeing in my plane

Cultural Imperial posted:

Did you guys see Albertans are calling for Notley to be murdered for passing some farm labor safety bill? loving lol. If Albertans aren't the worst loving scum on earth I don't know what is

I hope they get caught and get sent to prison, because we really have too many complete loving retards wandering around free in this province.

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:09

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# ? May 13, 2024 23:38

cowofwar: Jul 30, 2002; by Athanatos

PT6A posted:

I hope they get caught and get sent to prison, because we really have too many complete loving retards wandering around free in this province.

You sent us equalization transfers and we sent you our retards.

Thanks.

Sadly, we still have many more.

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:28

David Corbett: Feb 6, 2008; Courage, my friends; 'tis not too late to build a better world.

PT6A posted:

I hope they get caught and get sent to prison, because we really have too many complete loving retards wandering around free in this province.

gently caress, I'll second that. Threatening to assassinate a political leader over a loving farm bill is so far over the top that whomever does it should spend a bit of time as a guest of Her Majesty until they've calmed the hell down. Wish prison actually worked that way.

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:37

Lain Iwakura: Aug 5, 2004; The body exists only to verify one's own existence.; Taco Defender

Cultural Imperial posted:

Did you guys see Albertans are calling for Notley to be murdered for passing some farm labor safety bill? loving lol. If Albertans aren't the worst loving scum on earth I don't know what is

I dared to read the comments on the CBC's article today:

quote:

While the threats of violence are absolutely unacceptable, the politicians in Alberta need to look long and hard in the mirror. If they're intent on pushing through bills without consultation and without input, they're going to get pushback from frustrated people and groups.

Now, the threats are unacceptable. Completely. No one with an ounce of decency would behave in such as way, and it's truly despicable.

Our politicians, claiming they are bullied, crying, while claiming to be acting on behalf of the citizenry, maybe need to take a step back, consider, thoroughly, how their actions are perceived, and how they impact others. If they are going to make rash decisions, you need to be strong enough to deal with the fallout.

No matter what a politician does, someone isn't going to be happy. that's life. If you cannot take the heat (and again, I don't believe death threats qualify as 'heat'), they may want to consider a different line of work.

quote:

How do we know who's side the RCMP are on? Call in the army.

quote:

I don't see a difference between someone uttering threats and social media. If someone was talking to you in the street the way these luddites are on social media, they would be arrested, charged with uttering threats and probably have a psych assessment done. Because people are on facebook/ twitter, there seems to be a grey area. Maybe the NDP should pass a law to ensure internet threats carry the same weight as an in-person threat.

quote:

they are cutting their own throats as they say or "bringing it upon themselves" by their actions. trying to change a province or country overnight will never work and there will be dire consequences when you are ruining peoples lives on a daily basis. Thats socialism for you.

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:41

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Constant Hamprince posted:

I support a greater role for religion in the federal government so long as it means we can declare Anglicanism the state religion and put Papist devil-worshiping traitors like Kenney in camps.

I like how they were all, "fine, we'll put God in there if it'll placate you conservative wankers" and ever since the courts have been like "yeah that doesn't actually mean anything. Sorry bout it"

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:44

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

We need to round up all these wheat king hosers and send them to Afghanistan as bacha bazi tribute to appease the Taliban

Boom two birds with one stone

# ? Dec 11, 2015 23:56

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

I am lolling at the humongous alligator tears over Vancouver's 12 new bike lanes. Mayor moonbeam is a loving moron but this suburban angst is delicious

# ? Dec 12, 2015 00:21

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

https://www.facebook.com/GlobalNews/videos/934330436614722/

Trudeau's speech at Pearson welcoming refugees. There's a bit in there about giving them SINs and health cards that I like because it will drive conservatives insane. The rest of it I like because it paints a vision of Canada that I want to see more of, as a welcoming and inclusive place.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 00:26

HackensackBackpack: Aug 20, 2007; Who needs a house out in Hackensack? Is that all you get for your money?

vyelkin posted:

https://www.facebook.com/GlobalNews/videos/934330436614722/

Trudeau's speech at Pearson welcoming refugees. There's a bit in there about giving them SINs and health cards that I like because it will drive conservatives insane. The rest of it I like because it paints a vision of Canada that I want to see more of, as a welcoming and inclusive place.

Canada takes in thousands of refugees a year, and has for decades. We've even taken in Muslim refugees in significant numbers in the past. This is getting a lot of attention for being an election promise and a big PR event for Trudeau, so natch it's going to get people all ratcheted up if they already have a hate-on for Muslims.

I saw a comment on one of these stories were one person went "I hope Trudeau didn't give them a Canada Goose jacket! That's better than most Canadians can afford." and the reply goes, "If you can't compete with an 18 month old refugee with no winter coat, that's not on them, that's on you." :iceburn:

# ? Dec 12, 2015 01:12

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

The Ottawa Experimental Farm has been under threat from development for some time. Now with the new government it's time to see if they're serious about science:

quote:

If Trudeau�s serious about science, he�ll prove it with the Experimental Farm

by Pete Anderson

The debate underway over the future of a field at Ottawa�s Central Experimental Farm promises to shed light on the new Liberal government�s promises for real change, respect for scientists and a return to transparency.

Late last month, the Ottawa Hospital announced that public consultations will take place early next year regarding the design of a new Civic campus planned for experimental plots used in climate change research that feeds into the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change. No consultations have been held in the year since John Baird announced that up to 60 acres would be severed from the Experimental Farm. Baird�s gift represents the worst impulses of his government: silencing scientists and eschewing transparency in decision-making.

In line with the Conservative government�s practices, only a small handful of civil servants with the NCC, the Ottawa Hospital and Agriculture and Agri-Food Canada were aware of the transfer before the press conference. Everyone from federal scientists to the provincial and municipal governments, the Friends of the Farm and the Farm�s Advisory Council were left in the dark.

When the Friends initially spoke out against the transfer, the Conservative government quietly threatened to dissolve them.

The scientists who have dedicated their working lives to decades-long international research projects on the composition of soil, tilling practices, and climate change learned they were losing their fields through the press release. When one scientist confronted his manager he was told �they [the NCC and Hospital] didn�t care� about the loss of invaluable research land.

Environment Minister Catherine McKenna � also the MP for Ottawa Centre, which includes the Experimental Farm � Heritage Minister M�lanie Joly and Agriculture Minister Lawrence MacAulay together have a unique opportunity to demonstrate their government�s commitment to science and governmental transparency in how they approach the future of the Experimental Farm.

The Central Experimental Farm is one of the longest continuously operating agricultural research stations in the world. Its soils are a rare and irreplaceable archive of 130 years of research in support of Canadian farmers. Its achievements include the development of Marquis wheat in the early twentieth century. More recently, its scientists have been taking part in an international partnership on the effects of climate change on agricultural practices.

Under the previous government, scientists were not allowed to speak about their research publicly, creating a vacuum around the important work underway on the threatened sixty acres. Any meaningful consultation must include a clear and honest statement of what is being lost.
Retired scientists in Canada and their international counterparts already have written against the severance. It�s time to give Canada�s federal agricultural scientists the opportunity to share their important research before it�s lost.

The Experimental Farm is a National Historic Site of Canada; the severance of 60 acres from the farm shows the weakness and ineffectiveness of federal heritage laws. The federal government can only protect heritage sites that it owns. If the federal government refuses to protect its own heritage sites, it sends a message that no one else should care for theirs, either.

At the core of the debate is transparency in government decision-making. Despite the Experimental Farm�s long-term management plan based on extensive public consultation, there was not even a single public consultation session before the severance was announced. Indeed, the Ottawa Hospital has fought, delayed and cancelled all attempts to hear from the public until now, insisting on no consultations until the land lease was finalized. The consultations planned for the new year are about the design � not the location � of a new campus. Any consultation that leaves the location off the table amounts to window-dressing.

During the election, Trudeau and the Liberals promised to bring real change to Ottawa, to respect government scientists, and to return transparency to the federal government. At the Central Experimental Farm, they have a golden opportunity to show Canadians what change ought to look like.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 01:44

Scaramouche: Mar 26, 2001; SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

I agree it seems a lot of hullabaloo for only a slight uptick in what Canada accepts normally, but given the slapfights in the US and some of the objections of the New Right in Europe it feels... nice? I normally feel a kind of corrosive cynicism about Canada and I not-felt that for almost entire minutes at a time while reading those #welcometocanada tweets. I think what broke me is that one of my millennial cousins came and asked me how he should defend it to his dad over Christmas dinner completely unprompted. These world stage moves are often not that substantial in reality, but they can be potent symbols nonetheless.

EDIT-Jeez guys I'm all verklempt here. Is this optimism or an incipient stroke?
http://www.straight.com/arts/596361/vancouver-mens-chorus-sings-gay-syrian-refugees

Scaramouche fucked around with this message at 01:50 on Dec 12, 2015

# ? Dec 12, 2015 01:45

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

Cultural Imperial posted:

I am lolling at the humongous alligator tears over Vancouver's 12 new bike lanes. Mayor moonbeam is a loving moron but this suburban angst is delicious

Yep im happy to keep him around as long as the alternative is NPA shitheads. Suburban motorist rage is the sweetest syrup.

COPE was pretty bad too at the end and a lot of them are now in charge of the BCNDP :gonk:

# ? Dec 12, 2015 01:48

Franks Happy Place: Mar 15, 2011; It is by weed alone I set my mind in motion. It is by the dank of Sapho that thoughts acquire speed, the lips acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by weed alone I set my mind in motion.

THC posted:

Yep im happy to keep him around as long as the alternative is NPA shitheads. Suburban motorist rage is the sweetest syrup.

COPE was pretty bad too at the end and a lot of them are now in charge of the BCNDP

COPE are a bunch of incurable fuckwits.

I'm seriously considering a quixotic mayoral run next time on a platform of:

-Saving millions of dollars by mandating free housing for everyone, and building it on city land that is set to be sold off to developers, and

-Creating a public Internet utility that would offer $20 a month FTTN to any resident who wants it.

I probably wouldn't win but by God I'd have some fun. :allears:

# ? Dec 12, 2015 01:55

Ron_Jeremy: Sep 29, 2003

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/2015/12/11/justin-trudeau-still-riding-high-in-popular-support-poll-shows.html

The bitter, bitter tears of National Post columnists sustains me.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 03:12

Scaramouche: Mar 26, 2001; SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

You know after reading all the articles, and all the comments (some juicy ones on NPR and Times of India) about this Syrian refugee thing I've come to realize, gently caress em. I would rather die in hope than live in fear.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:11

ChairMaster: Aug 22, 2009; by R. Guyovich

Scaramouche posted:

I agree it seems a lot of hullabaloo for only a slight uptick in what Canada accepts normally, but given the slapfights in the US and some of the objections of the New Right in Europe it feels... nice? I normally feel a kind of corrosive cynicism about Canada and I not-felt that for almost entire minutes at a time while reading those #welcometocanada tweets. I think what broke me is that one of my millennial cousins came and asked me how he should defend it to his dad over Christmas dinner completely unprompted. These world stage moves are often not that substantial in reality, but they can be potent symbols nonetheless.

EDIT-Jeez guys I'm all verklempt here. Is this optimism or an incipient stroke?
http://www.straight.com/arts/596361/vancouver-mens-chorus-sings-gay-syrian-refugees

It's honestly a little strange to feel something positive about Canada these days other than "thank Christ I wasn't born in America. Trudeau may be another useless small-c conservative leader of a useless party that tricks people into thinking it's progressive, but he's at least doing a good job with this stuff.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:19

Brannock: Feb 9, 2006; by exmarx; Fallen Rib

ChairMaster posted:

Trudeau may be another useless small-c conservative leader of a useless party that tricks people into thinking it's progressive,

How about an informal moratorium on this sort of blazing insight, ironic or otherwise, until JT actually does something worthy of it?

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:31

Juul-Whip: Mar 10, 2008

He's pretty liberal.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:35

ChairMaster: Aug 22, 2009; by R. Guyovich

Brannock posted:

How about an informal moratorium on this sort of blazing insight, ironic or otherwise, until JT actually does something worthy of it?

I'd say the burden lies with him to change a perfectly reasonable assumption based on the party that he's the leader of.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:41

Tighclops: Jan 23, 2008; Unable to deal with it; Grimey Drawer

The onus is on the Liberals to prove that they will not, in fact, Lib.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 04:55

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

I find it fitting that the poster most willing to get deep dicked by Trudeau II is not old enough to remember what a loving dumpster fire of corruption the Chretien liberals were.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:02

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

Brannock posted:

How about an informal moratorium on this sort of blazing insight, ironic or otherwise, until JT actually does something worthy of it?

So, did you miss this, or is it just convenient to ignore?

Helsing posted:

I realize this article has already been posted but I feel like it really calls out for a bit of annotation.

Also Ikantski this is what you've been labelling a "progressive government" which, depending on how one thinks about it, either suggests progressive is a meaningless term that says more about how a party markets itself than how it governs or else that "progressive" is not the right label to be using for the Federal Liberals.

(1) -- Bill Morneau was the chair of the C.D. Howe Institute until 2014.

(2) -- This is exactly what happened at the beginning of Dalton McGuinty's first term as Ontario premier in 2003.

(3) -- To reiterate: this is the agency that employed Bill Morneau up until last year!

(4) a.-- Liberal economics 101: putting a couple hundreds bucks in the pockets of "middle class" Canadians is worth undermining the fiscal solvency of universal government programs like medicare.

(4) b.-- That "middle class tax cut" is disproportionately going to favour the rich

(5) -- The Canadian Council of Chief Executives is a powerful and influential business lobby group founded in the 1970s. It's current Chair person is one Paul Desmarais Jr., Co-Chief Executive Officer of Power Corporation of Canada and a native son of Canada's very own domestic oligarchy. The Desmarais family are notorious for their close relationship to federal politicians, especially in the Liberal party, and the aptly named Power cCorporation has lined the pockets of many Liberal (and other) politicians and operatives.:

(6) -- John Manley, who is President and Chief Executive Officer of the Canadian Council of Chief Executives. Oh, he was also Deputy Prime Minister between 2002 and 2003 for the Liberals. Noticing a pattern yet?

(7) -- Liberal campaigning 101: promise anything to get elected, especially if it involves "the middle class". Don't worry, after you're elected you can blame the previous government for running a secret deficit, or claim that international economic conditions were worse than expected.

(8) -- Modern "Keynesianism" 101: nevermind what Keynes may or may not have said. Never mind the fact that the historical record shows that the middle class in Canada is mostly a byproduct of 1) direct spending by government through universal programs and 2) a strong labour movement. Instead rely on an empirically questionable and economically imprecise set of assumptions about "multiplier" effects, and claim that the hands outs you give to your business friends and / or a couple key ridings you'll need to hold on to are meant to stimulate the economy. Whatever you do don't actually establish any more universal social programs paid for out of general evenue, such as daycare, dental care, optometry, pharma-care, a guaranteed basic income, etc. because those might actually work, which would make people less reliant on market incomes, which in turn would make them less dependent on their masters in the private sector, and that would really not be in the interests of the Liberal party's real base base, would it? (Here's a pro read for those of you who want an old but still good source on why corporate executives will tend to oppose government transfers, even when it's seemingly in their own best economic interests.)

tl;dr -- don't get fooled again

So yeah, here we go again with the party that did more to cute the Canadian welfare state than Harper could have dreamed of -- the party that slashed our social programs and then ploughed the money into corporate income tax cuts. The party that promised to renegotiate our bad trade deals on the campaign trail and instead doubled down on them once in office.

As I've repeated ad nauseum, it really doesn't matter what a party promises to do while campaigning. Actually look at who the party recruits, and check out where party members end up after serving their time in government.

But hey, they're gonna legalize weed.

p.s. -- because I can't go one post without complaining about the NDP. Read over this post and if you feel outraged by anything here then take a long hard think on how you feel about Brian Topp or Bard Lavigne going to work for corporate lobbying / strategy firms. A social democratic party that lets it's top leaders and advisers sup at the trough of corporate corruption (and this is certainly corruption regardless of the fact it's technically legal) is a bad joke.

...

Cultural Imperial posted:

I find it fitting that the poster most willing to get deep dicked by Trudeau II is not old enough to remember what a loving dumpster fire of corruption the Chretien liberals were.

IIRC he's an American, he has no experience with Liberal government at all

infernal machines fucked around with this message at 05:25 on Dec 12, 2015

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:23

Brannock: Feb 9, 2006; by exmarx; Fallen Rib

Sorry that I don't want to read endless and identical griping about how the libs are totally gonna lib anyday now! Yes Bill Morneau is bad etc

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:29

Postess with the Mostest: Apr 4, 2007; Arabian nights
'neath Arabian moons
A fool off his guard
could fall and fall hard
out there on the dunes

Brannock posted:

How about an informal moratorium on this sort of blazing insight, ironic or otherwise, until JT actually does something worthy of it?

So far Trudeau was off by 60% on refugees they'd get in this year, 40% off on revenue from 1% tax hike, the mortgage changes today were a joke, he changed the $10b deficit promise to a goal and bizarrely asked a bunch of civil servants to voluntarily resign so he could appoint his own shills. The guy is good at symbolic gestures and photo ops. There's lots of money to spend now, give him a few years of Buttsing the debt and the austerity will come just like Ontario.

Edit: And he's going to cancel mincome for parents.

Postess with the Mostest fucked around with this message at 05:35 on Dec 12, 2015

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:30

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

Brannock posted:

Sorry that I don't want to read endless and identical griping about how the libs are totally gonna lib anyday now! Yes Bill Morneau is bad etc

So the Libs are already libbing, but we can just pretend it isn't happening as long as it isn't covered in the popular press.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:36

Hal_2005: Feb 23, 2007

PT6A posted:

I hope they get caught and get sent to prison, because we really have too many complete loving retards wandering around free in this province.

At the least, the guy will be nailed with a criminal charge against a Govt. official. I think that is what they did to the crazies who threatened Klein a few times in the 90's.

On the context of the farmers, and I cant believe I'm the only one sticking up for the proletariat on D&D but C-6 is going to really ruin farm economics. In much the same way health insurance is a major drain on a company's working capital (vs. self directed plans) adding meaningless compensation and labor plans to a farm will mean marginal farms (family plots) will be uneconomic, esp. in this wheat/oat/corn/soy environment. Unlike US Agricrops, where most of the farming is done by mega corps and heavily automated farming, Canada is about 80% family operated farms.

Since many children on farms work for their University fund, the effect of placing family 'college funds' into EI and Alberta union benifits is actually a wealth transfer, and is a major reason why the farmers are upset. But hey, yokels voted for NDP, so I enjoy watching their salty tears. All those old farming oligarchs can suck my salty dick on the way back to Ontario or Quebec.

To get back to the explanation;

This implies most labor on a farm is family hands, or cash croppers who work on a seasonal basis whenever the harvest or cash planting occurs. Under the new bill, at 7% margins (the average gross for an Alberta Rancher/Farmer) their plots will need to have at least 100 acres under till to make the world go round, on a US dollar adjusted basis. Since I don't see too many Nebraska style mega-farms in the EID, this will mean most farms (the "middle class" of alberta) will need to sell out, lowering the depleted Alberta dairy & meat industry yields over the next 3 years due to the lag in restocking which happens after major land holdings are consolidated.

During this period, since AB relies heavily on corporate taxation of which farming is a component this will actually make Alberta much more dependent on oil revenues over the 2017-2020 period. Which will in turn require her to introduce a PST to meet the debt/credit agency bond ratings for Alberta Muni's which start rolling over in 2018 and need to maintain a certain tax revenue to keep their borrowing yield.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:36

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Hal_2005 posted:

At the least, the guy will be nailed with a criminal charge against a Govt. official. I think that is what they did to the crazies who threatened Klein a few times in the 90's.

On the context of the farmers, and I cant believe I'm the only one sticking up for the proletariat on D&D but C-6 is going to really ruin farm economics. In much the same way health insurance is a major drain on a company's working capital (vs. self directed plans) adding meaningless compensation and labor plans to a farm will mean marginal farms (family plots) will be uneconomic, esp. in this wheat/oat/corn/soy environment. Unlike US Agricrops, where most of the farming is done by mega corps and heavily automated farming, Canada is about 80% family operated farms.

Since many children on farms work for their University fund, the effect of placing family 'college funds' into EI and Alberta union benifits is actually a wealth transfer, and is a major reason why the farmers are upset. But hey, yokels voted for NDP, so I enjoy watching their salty tears. All those old farming oligarchs can suck my salty dick on the way back to Ontario or Quebec.

To get back to the explanation;

This implies most labor on a farm is family hands, or cash croppers who work on a seasonal basis whenever the harvest or cash planting occurs. Under the new bill, at 7% margins (the average gross for an Alberta Rancher/Farmer) their plots will need to have at least 100 acres under till to make the world go round, on a US dollar adjusted basis. Since I don't see too many Nebraska style mega-farms in the EID, this will mean most farms (the "middle class" of alberta) will need to sell out, lowering the depleted Alberta dairy & meat industry yields over the next 3 years due to the lag in restocking which happens after major land holdings are consolidated.

During this period, since AB relies heavily on corporate taxation of which farming is a component this will actually make Alberta much more dependent on oil revenues over the 2017-2020 period. Which will in turn require her to introduce a PST to meet the debt/credit agency bond ratings for Alberta Muni's which start rolling over in 2018 and need to maintain a certain tax revenue to keep their borrowing yield.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:41

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

Are you seriously arguing that family farms cannot afford to follow health and safety regulations?

If we have to make sure Timmy doesn't fall into the grain thresher, the bank is gonna take the farm Ma!

infernal machines fucked around with this message at 05:44 on Dec 12, 2015

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:41

T8R: Aug 9, 2005; Yes, I would like some tea!

Hal_2005 posted:

Since many children on farms work for their University fund, the effect of placing family 'college funds' into EI and Alberta union benifits is actually a wealth transfer, and is a major reason why the farmers are upset. But hey, yokels voted for NDP, so I enjoy watching their salty tears. All those old farming oligarchs can suck my salty dick on the way back to Ontario or Quebec.

To get back to the explanation;

This implies most labor on a farm is family hands, or cash croppers who work on a seasonal basis whenever the harvest or cash planting occurs. Under the new bill, at 7% margins (the average gross for an Alberta Rancher/Farmer) their plots will need to have at least 100 acres under till to make the world go round, on a US dollar adjusted basis. Since I don't see too many Nebraska style mega-farms in the EID, this will mean most farms (the "middle class" of alberta) will need to sell out, lowering the depleted Alberta dairy & meat industry yields over the next 3 years due to the lag in restocking which happens after major land holdings are consolidated.

Alberta farm and ranch producers with waged individuals who are not the owner or related to the owner will be affected.

Farm families who do not have any waged workers will not be affected.

Unpaid farm and ranch workers, such as relatives, friends and neighbours helping out on the family farm, will not be affected. Children doing chores or participating in 4-H are also not affected.

OHS has jurisdiction on a farm or ranch where there are wage earners who are not family members of the owner.

Bill 6 does not apply to recreational activities, such as hunting on farmland.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:45

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

T8R posted:

Alberta farm and ranch producers with waged individuals who are not the owner or related to the owner will be affected.

Farm families who do not have any waged workers will not be affected.

Unpaid farm and ranch workers, such as relatives, friends and neighbours helping out on the family farm, will not be affected. Children doing chores or participating in 4-H are also not affected.

OHS has jurisdiction on a farm or ranch where there are wage earners who are not family members of the owner.

Bill 6 does not apply to recreational activities, such as hunting on farmland.

hal2005 caught straight up lying again.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:48

Hal_2005: Feb 23, 2007

Cultural Imperial posted:

hal2005 caught straight up lying again.

Nope. Kindly check the act dumbass. I had to read it more then twice with legal counsel verifying each statement so dig deeper then a NDP press release which is totally unbiased, amirte?

Edit: Jesus you wasted 3 posts on 1 explanation? When did you go off your meds? Farm margins are so well documented as a cash intensive operation I'm not sure how I could even argue against trying to explain farming is not exactly a earnings rich field of work.

Farms work on trade credit. They also work on operating loans financed by their crop insurance premiums and sold forward contracts for harvested production. Layering into this poo poo sandwich, nearly all farmland and machinery is financed by land leases/mortgages. So pray tell, CI (keeper of D&D's domestic debt bubblewatch), how can overleveraged families who monetize all land revenue each year to meet their operating interest payments find fresh cash to set aside for defined benefit accounts remitted to the AB govt ?

Seriously, its Friday. Go out. Get laid.

Hal_2005 fucked around with this message at 05:59 on Dec 12, 2015

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:50

CAPTAIN CAPSLOCK: Sep 11, 2001

Ikantski posted:

So far Trudeau was off by 60% on refugees they'd get in this year, 40% off on revenue from 1% tax hike, the mortgage changes today were a joke, he changed the $10b deficit promise to a goal and bizarrely asked a bunch of civil servants to voluntarily resign so he could appoint his own shills. The guy is good at symbolic gestures and photo ops. There's lots of money to spend now, give him a few years of Buttsing the debt and the austerity will come just like Ontario.

Edit: And he's going to cancel mincome for parents.

Let's not pretend those patronage appointment extensions weren't completely hosed.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:52

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

infernal machines posted:

Are you seriously arguing that family farms cannot afford to follow health and safety regulations?

If we have to make sure Timmy doesn't fall into the grain thresher, the bank is gonna take the farm Ma!

"On the context of the farmers, and I cant believe I'm the only one sticking up for the proletariat on D&D but C-6 is going to really ruin farm economics. In much the same way health insurance is a major drain on a company's working capital (vs. self directed plans) adding meaningless compensation and labor plans to a farm will mean marginal farms (family plots) will be uneconomic, esp. in this wheat/oat/corn/soy environment. Unlike US Agricrops, where most of the farming is done by mega corps and heavily automated farming, Canada is about 80% family operated farms. "

"In much the same way health insurance is a major drain on a company's working capital (vs. self directed plans) adding meaningless compensation and labor plans to a farm will mean marginal farms (family plots) will be uneconomic, esp. in this wheat/oat/corn/soy environment"

"health insurance is a major drain on a company's working capital"

Basically I'm going to support this farm bill forever in the hopes that it might be even half as bad for Canadians as nationalized healthcare.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:53

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Hal_2005 posted:

Nope. Kindly check the act dumbass. I had to read it more then twice with legal counsel verifying each statement so dig deeper then a NDP press release which is totally unbiased, amirte?

keep doubling down fuckhead

my legal council says kindly go eat out their rear end in a top hat

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:53

infernal machines: Oct 11, 2012; we monitor many frequencies. we listen always. came a voice, out of the babel of tongues, speaking to us. it played us a mighty dub.

Hal_2005 posted:

Nope. Kindly check the act dumbass. I had to read it more then twice with legal counsel verifying each statement so dig deeper then a NDP press release which is totally unbiased, amirte?

Okay, so what specifically about family farms makes it uneconomical to follow basic health and safety laws that apply to all other businesses? And, what makes their business viable and worthy of special exemption if this is the case?

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:54

vyelkin: Jan 2, 2011

Cultural Imperial posted:

keep doubling down fuckhead

my legal council says kindly go eat out their rear end in a top hat

Hey come on CI, my uncle works for Nintendo and he totally said that this act is bad.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:54

Scaramouche: Mar 26, 2001; SPACE FACE! SPACE FACE!

I can't speak to farms generally, but my uncle owns a sub-100 acre dairy farm who had his three kids work as unpaid labour. One of them does not have a hand any more. Because it got eaten by the thresher. When he was 12.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:55

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

vyelkin posted:

Hey come on CI, my uncle works for Nintendo and he totally said that this act is bad.

my legal council says your uncle is probably going to be out of a job soon

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:55

Dreylad: Jun 19, 2001

Also for GTA people the Crombie report is out on the Greenbelt..

The committee focused on farmers' concerns that the current Greenbelt Plan's "protected countryside" emphasizes preservation of pastoral scenery, and has been indifferent to the needs of the agri-food sector:

quote:

Healthy Agricultural Economy
A recurring theme during this review was the need for an improved understanding of all the needs of the agricultural sector. As we heard during the consultations, �saving the land won�t save the farmer.� We believe that a complete agricultural system should include not only the agricultural land base, but also other elements of the agri-food sector that are essential to support a healthy agricultural economy over the long term. During the Coordinated Review, we heard about some key issues that could be addressed by such an approach. They include infrastructure, water management, succession planning for older farmers and access to agricultural land for new farmers.

From the executive summary:

quote:

Supporting Agriculture
The GGH [Greater Golden Horseshoe] has high-quality soils and climatic conditions that make it ideally suited for a wide range of crops and livestock, including the specialty crop areas in Niagara Region and Holland Marsh. These same qualities have also made this region a highly desirable place to live, from the original Aboriginal land users to the early settlers from Europe and the more recent immigrants from around the world. Agriculture today is a major contributor to Ontario�s economy, identity and way of life.
During the consultations for this review, many associations and individuals in the farming sector emphasized that farmland is a finite resource and the planning regime in the GGH needs strengthening to stem the ongoing loss of agricultural land to other land uses. We also heard concerns about threats to the viability of agriculture from speculative land investments, land use conflicts in near-urban areas, complex regulations and deficiencies in rural infrastructure.

Recognizing the fundamental importance of agriculture in the GGH, our recommendations focus on:

Promoting the identification, mapping and protection of an agricultural system throughout the region

Implementing stronger criteria to limit the loss and fragmentation of prime agricultural lands, particularly in the outer-ring municipalities beyond the Greenbelt

Supporting productive agriculture

Recognizing the importance of locally sourced food and urban agriculture

Integrating the needs of agriculture throughout the plans, for example when considering settlement area expansion, the rural economy, management of natural resources, infrastructure development, climate change and plan implementation

Applying an agriculture lens to other provincial policies and programs (such as climate change, transportation and infrastructure, financial tools, community improvement plans and education) to address the unique needs of agriculture in the GGH.

To me, the executive summary has a bunch of good recommendations, such as: protection of critical watersheds within the Greenbelt, including climate change considerations into future planning decisions, and addressing dirt dumping concerns - "improving the management of excess soil from development sites" - which has become a big problem in Durham region.

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:56

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# ? May 13, 2024 23:38

namaste friends: Sep 18, 2004; by Smythe

Scaramouche posted:

I can't speak to farms generally, but my uncle owns a sub-100 acre dairy farm who had his three kids work as unpaid labour. One of them does not have a hand any more. Because it got eaten by the thresher. When he was 12.

Whoa dude, does your uncle have a file with hal2005's legal council?

# ? Dec 12, 2015 05:56

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