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NikkolasKing posted:Then her dad got murdered and where as Lacus just kind of boohoo'ed about that, .. What? Lacus Clyne's dad got murdered and she went on to lead a guerilla rebellion against the government while staging underground video-jackings to launch messages of protest and eventually stole a carrier and took military action. Like even if you write some of that off as "her organization did it" she was literally on the front lines and giving speeches and poo poo the entire time. There's a lot of problems with Lacus Clyne but "her dad got murdered and she just cried over it" is an absurdly inaccurate description of what happens. If anything it's literally the opposite, she goes from zero to having assassins kill people and hijacking radio broadcasts in nothing flat. This is, I think, another case of the weird character divorce between SEED and Destiny coming into play. In Gundam SEED Lacus is scheming as poo poo. Her entire sweet act is just that, an act. She acts sweet and naive and uses Haro to hack open the doors in the Archangel and gather information and so-on while going "oh gosh, Mr. Haro, you're just so naughty." Once things start going south in PLANT she's literally shown broadcasting on hijacked television signals with a fake CGI Lacus Clyne and having soldiers kill people and masterminding robotjackings and stuff. The entire point of the character is that she is a lot more cunning than she lets on and only rarely lets anyone see it. She's not Haman Karn but there's a reason the "Lacus Clyne masterminded everything" jokes have an edge of truth to them. Then in Destiny she loses any element of that and is just a sweet perfect flawless moe pacifist princess who makes people listen to her through idol songs and speeches and everything she does is above the board and she is no threat to anyone except bad people. There's literally no edge to the character anymore. She doesn't do anything but exist, give speeches, and have everyone talk about how amazing she is. She's basically even more devolved-into-a-one-note-character than Kira Yamato is, but she already was a pretty crappy character so it gets even worse there. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 17:20 on Feb 4, 2016 |
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Feb 4, 2016 17:06
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No mention of those boots? I mean, oy, those boots.
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Feb 4, 2016 18:41
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Please, please do a review of one of the Frost Bros regular outfits sometime down the line. You should do Shagia's outfit, but Olba would be fine too.
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Feb 4, 2016 18:50
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 gently caress off, Glemy. You tool.
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Feb 4, 2016 18:50
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The Missing Link posted:
I didn't know Mashmyre was gifted in the force
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Feb 4, 2016 18:53
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Droyer posted:I didn't know Mashmyre was gifted in the force Doesn't take much to send somebody flying in low G.
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Feb 4, 2016 18:54
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The Missing Link posted:
Glemmy's really more of a Kylo Ren himself.
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Feb 4, 2016 18:56
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Sharkopath posted:https://twitter.com/nnn_2nd/status/694206419789152256 Crosspost.
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Feb 4, 2016 19:04
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The first thing I'm gonna do when my Rodi arrives is change that dull green coating.
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Feb 4, 2016 19:35
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NikkolasKing posted:I think one thing that really sets Relena above and beyond her clones like Lacus is that Relena was not created this way. She was not always Ms. Peace and Love. She was originally just a lonely rich kid piningover Heero. Then her dad got murdered and where as Lacus just kind of boohoo'ed about that, Relena went out, got a gun, and tried to blow off Lady Une's head. It's the first really proactive thing she does in the series and it's fitting that one of the last things she does in the series is specifically pass up the chance to repeat the incident without missing this time. In short, Relena was not born some great messiah of love and pacifism, she actually had development that made her that way. We got to see her grow and change in a way none of her clones did. You may have had a point if Relena actually had any character development. She doesn't. One episode we last see her screeching for Zechs' blood in Antarctica, then some dozen+ episodes later she resurfaces as the writer's mouthpiece for Peace with nothing in the interim. Not only was she not "born some great messiah of love and pacifism", as you put it, she may as well be a completely different character. Development? She's not even on the screen to develop. The show just hopes it's been so long, the audience forgot. That's the opposite of a good character. Sorry.
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Feb 4, 2016 19:48
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ImpAtom posted:.. What? She was doing that all before he was murdered, if the montage in SEED is in the correct order. I literally have that scene right here if you want and Lacus' speeches were happening before they found and killed her dad. Her dad dying didn't really change much. quote:This is, I think, another case of the weird character divorce between SEED and Destiny coming into play. In Gundam SEED Lacus is scheming as poo poo. Her entire sweet act is just that, an act. She acts sweet and naive and uses Haro to hack open the doors in the Archangel and gather information and so-on while going "oh gosh, Mr. Haro, you're just so naughty." Once things start going south in PLANT she's literally shown broadcasting on hijacked television signals with a fake CGI Lacus Clyne and having soldiers kill people and masterminding robotjackings and stuff. The entire point of the character is that she is a lot more cunning than she lets on and only rarely lets anyone see it. She's not Haman Karn but there's a reason the "Lacus Clyne masterminded everything" jokes have an edge of truth to them. I can see what you mean here, though. I never liked Lacus and I don't doubt Destiny might have further distorted my memories.
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Feb 4, 2016 20:08
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Darth Walrus posted:No mention of those boots? They kind of fit the outfit, they remind me of weird sci-fi space gaiters.
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Feb 4, 2016 20:23
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I haven't seen beyond the first couple of episodes of ZZ, but you know what, I actually like that big rear end space dragon badge, silly as it is. Certainly more so than a lot of the casual clothes of the rest of the cast. I can't write an eloquent defense of it since I know poo poo all about fashion (quite obviously to say that I like it) so I'm not even going to try, but it works for me regardless.
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Feb 5, 2016 00:22
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Whatever floats your space boat. I myself think it'd have helped Glemy more with his claims to actually dress like a old school Zabi.
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Feb 5, 2016 00:25
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I find the dragon badge aesthetically pleasing and like the colors it adds to his chest, but there's no denying it would be really stupid in reality.
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Feb 5, 2016 00:27
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Oh, it definitely would, but so would a lot of anime and game stylistic choices. Hell, Trieze's outfit would probably look silly on most people in this day and age and that looks baller as hell on him.
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Feb 5, 2016 00:29
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Dragon badge would kind of work if it was in the middle of something like this cuirass here now. Metal or classical leather.
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Feb 5, 2016 00:32
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ImpAtom posted:The entire point of the character is that she is a lot more cunning than she lets on and only rarely lets anyone see it. She's not Haman Karn but there's a reason the "Lacus Clyne masterminded everything" jokes have an edge of truth to them The government was lovely and her having an impostor was indeed true, but its still an act of sheer balls and arrogance really. 
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Feb 5, 2016 03:45
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ImpAtom posted:.. What? This is pretty much correct until you get to GSD. Her father's killing made the stakes a lot more higher with Patrick Zala taking the gloves off. You forgot that she got Rau Le Creuset of all people back off despite having no actual power by playing the optics of the situation. Her sweet act is both not/real, she really does want people to get along and uses her idol position to push that, but once it's go time, it's on. I don't remember her ordering any assassinations, although she has no problems having her people firing on and killing PLANT military personal. She doesn't shrink from taking responsibility of it and pretty much says yeah, her hands are drenched in blood during her final monologue in SEED. In between SEED and GSD she effectively abdicates as a leader of her faction and public life. Converts the infrastructure she help create into terminal because she believed PLANT was in good hands with the remainder of the Clyne/moderate faction(Eileen Canaver) who took over at the end of SEED. Even though she isn't in a direct leadership position any more, she is still smart enough to have lowkey security installed including a beam resistant bunker and a rebuilt freedom for protection and having a mobile base to go to via repaired Archangel. Lacus never loses her edge when she comes up with a plan for her to get back to space(By playing her own fake twin and using her former idol skills) so she can directly control the space based assets like building the DOM team, custom Gaia, two Nuclear Gundams, investigate Durannal's plans, personally deliver Strike Freedom/Infinite Justice while playing decoy for the folks at the asteroid factory, then TV jack at Durannal's weakest moment. Reforms the TSA while bringing in defectors from both side via terminal. Despite a poorly written note and great danger to herself, she decides to confront her evil twin knowing it was a trap by going in with her best shooter while having a Gundam on stand by. Goes up against Durannal at his height of his military power with all the fancy super weapons and wins. Despite all that she has done, her character has already almost fully matured and run it's course. The development she goes through is one where she starts out the optimist and gets a far bit more cynical/pragmatic where she either realises or is effectively forced by destiny to take up the leadership of PLANT to maintain and build a lasting peace instead of handing it off like last time. She doesn't want that much power, but maintains a connection to that in GSD, but is willing to use it and understands the usefulness of power unlike Cagalli Yula Athha who politically gets her poo poo kicked in. Lacus's power does have it's limits though as she has no control of Orb politics nor have much direct influence as LOGOS/Blue Cosmos in EA. Her power comes from her own faction which is mostly paid for by Orb, EA and PLANT as they are mostly defectors in place for the latters. You must have mixed up Meer and Lacus as Lacus sings one song in the series in the bunker during world break. It is during SEED where she tries to get get people to calm down with songs. But that is before the poo poo really hits the fan via father's death. By GSD her being an Idol or acting like a ditz is gone outside of the spaceport escape. Kira on the other hand while kicking all kinds of rear end, character wise has even less space to move. You could say he knows what he wants unlike in SEED in his final confrontation with Rau Le Creuset where he didn't have an effective reply to Rau Le Creuset nihilism other than to say people aren't like that. To be fair no one could have talked down a Omnicidal Manic on the verge of being proven right via killing all life on Earth. A problem in GSD is that he doesn't seem to acknowledge the people he must have killed along the way in GSD. His technical pacifism goes too far placing his friends in danger and almost getting himself killed. He still hasn't learned how to use a gun properly by not firing it at all let alone to kill even when others are dying next to him. GSD could have done with a lot more episodes with no Robot fights to flesh out the characters ala IBO.
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Feb 5, 2016 03:54
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Lacus was cunning as gently caress during Destiny too, it was just even more behind the scenes. Those assassins that attacked the orphanage were totally hers, not Durandal's. All of Destiny was her scheming behind the scenes to get Kira to clear her path to world domination, and she won.
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Feb 5, 2016 16:03
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oohhboy posted:This is pretty much correct until you get to GSD. Lacus succeeds in GSD but she succeeds by being entirely open and forthright. She doesn't really scheme. She just has political connections and anything that be scheming takes place entirely offscreen. She's very open about what she does compared to SEED where she's constantly putting on different faces. (Which is why she is supposed to be constantly wearing different outfits too, IIRC one of the art books confirmed that.) There's no sense that she is planning a deeper game beyond the jokes about it whereas that was a big part of what she was doing in SEED. In a better series Meer would have thrown her right the gently caress off because her game of pretending to be less capable than she was would have been co-opted by Durandal and I imagine to some degree that was the intention, it just didn't get executed at all. Which is really SEED D's problem in a nutshell. It's utterly trivial to trace how each character has a coherent and sensible (for Gundam) plot arc and just was not followed through on.
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Feb 5, 2016 16:28
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Whizbang posted:Lacus was cunning as gently caress during Destiny too, it was just even more behind the scenes. Those assassins that attacked the orphanage were totally hers, not Durandal's. All of Destiny was her scheming behind the scenes to get Kira to clear her path to world domination, and she won. I know this is the joke theory people put out but I kind of wish it were true.
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Feb 5, 2016 17:36
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Raxivace posted:I know this is the joke theory people put out but I kind of wish it were true. Sadly it can't be. No one on that staff has the pull to make Kira and Lacus anything other than unquestionable heroes with no flaws.
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Feb 5, 2016 20:31
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Raxivace posted:I know this is the joke theory people put out but I kind of wish it were true. It's factually what happens, regardless of writer intent. Lacus leads an insurgent third faction that builds up power and waits in the wings until the EA/ZAFT beat each other into paste and then basically shanks both of them in the belly and takes over the earth sphere. The series pretty explicitly ends with Lacus pretty much ruling all of space and Cagalli pretty much ruling the earth with Kira standing by as the enforcer of the new regime.
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Feb 5, 2016 23:20
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TheManSeries posted:Sadly it can't be. No one on that staff has the pull to make Kira and Lacus anything other than unquestionable heroes with no flaws. I really wish that one quote that said Durandal was the hero and Kira/Lacus were the villains was legit. In any event, we still have no idea if that attack at the start of Destiny was organized by anybody. The crazy guy who tried to drop...something on Earth, I forget what.
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Feb 6, 2016 03:30
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NikkolasKing posted:I really wish that one quote that said Durandal was the hero and Kira/Lacus were the villains was legit. The blown out remains of Junius Seven IIRC
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Feb 6, 2016 04:13
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Kanos posted:It's factually what happens, regardless of writer intent. Lacus leads an insurgent third faction that builds up power and waits in the wings until the EA/ZAFT beat each other into paste and then basically shanks both of them in the belly and takes over the earth sphere. The series pretty explicitly ends with Lacus pretty much ruling all of space and Cagalli pretty much ruling the earth with Kira standing by as the enforcer of the new regime. Sure, but what about the idea of the assassins actually being hired by Lacus as some kind of false flag operation?
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Feb 6, 2016 04:20
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NikkolasKing posted:I really wish that one quote that said Durandal was the hero and Kira/Lacus were the villains was legit. The attack at the start of Destiny was a legit action by former Zala sympathizers but Durandal provided them with materials secretly. It's something that would have happened even without him though, just probably in crappier GuAIZes.
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Feb 6, 2016 04:33
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Raxivace posted:Sure, but what about the idea of the assassins actually being hired by Lacus as some kind of false flag operation? The assassins were Durandal's last frantic effort to stop Lacus before she rose to crush the world under her heel. Heroes, all of them, just unprepared for a man with a shotgun arm and Lacus having built a battleship hangar under her house.
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Feb 6, 2016 08:27
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For a coordinator black-ops team, they sure were poo poo at their jobs.
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Feb 6, 2016 11:13
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The idea that Lacus false flagged the attack on her or that she wanted to take over the world or is the villain is idiotic. At the end of SEED her faction staged a Coup D'etat on the PLANTS giving her effective control of Space. Earth itself is far too large for any faction to take over by guile or by force, why do you think people kept building those WMD super weapons? It's because they can't physically subjugate the planet with any army that is sustainable or leaves the planet a complete wreak. EA itself is a federation not a singular faction, even they don't control the Earth. In SEED Lacus choose not to take up the leadership PLANTS. At the end of GSD she does take it as she believes that her previous choice was a mistake in hindsight. Orb isn't in control of Earth nor were they portrayed as expanding their sphere, remaining nominally isolationist. They might be one of the most intact nation on Earth, but Atlantic Federation(USA) still exists with their economy physically undamaged. Even if the attack on Lacus didn't happen, eventually she would have gotten wind via Terminal and start making moves. If Durandal ordered the attack he is an idiot as it moved up the timetable for Lacus's moves, he used specialist ZAFT MS instead of EA MS. Had he not attacked he would have won as the Heroes would have been too slow. The real dumb thing though is that he ran Meer while Lacus was still alive giving her reason to start digging either way. If the show "Killed" Lacus early on then had Durandal bring out Meer, it would have made a lot more sense. The attack was both equal parts dumb and plot hole.
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Feb 6, 2016 11:18
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Feb 6, 2016 16:21
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I and no doubt the oddly off putting doctor from the Argma approve. And speaking of slightly crazy purple haired anime characters now this next addition of SeanBeanShako's Gundam Uniform Review is here. Tonight I'm going to obsess and nitpick over the space duds of THE MAN FROM JUPITER Paptimus Scirocco. All impressionable traumatised, hormone ridden of crazy people please leave the room because this man will make you do things. Crazy things. With mobile suits. And not the kinky type of crazy things. Dangerous crazy things. So lets have a look at what the more charismatic UC characters likes to wear in between seissions of murdering idiot SS wannabies and making confused 17 year olds cry.  Humor is mankind's greatest blessing. Well thing for sure, this man is consistant and really really enjoys wearing the colour white. Personally, I think that is a risky move in a job where half of the time you are trying to murder people covertly or overtly with giant space robots. Unless there is a planet Hoth in the Gundam universe people are going to see this man coming a mile away. It doesn't help he rolls in quite possibly one of the more fatter mobile suits as well. Plus when you think about it wear and tear will make the whole look impractical. Pamptimus has a closet full of something like eleven more copies of this uniform and half of them have obvious food and other embarassing related stains and one or two have faded into a nasty grey. Still the dude has balls picking a look we mostly associate with either swarthy south american dicatators or southern gentlemen who like to sip mint julips and write books about whacky frontier orphan antics. Both which when you think about the UC certainly do exist. Jamitov was a loving idiot for sort of getting a red flag when he saw Pampti strutting about the place wearing this thing and not looking into the whole rumours of the incoming space betrayl.  I have come to free you all from the pull of gravity...and god awful style deviant art watermarks.... I like the red shoulder board style epaulettes now instead of the huge gently caress of 19th century ones usual anime villains/space pirates embrace. It is actually quite subtle now, and a nice minimal use of colour. They are match his more traditional cuffs on his sleeves as well but oddly enough his collar is black. Usually in more traditional style old military uniforms the cuffs, collars and edges of the tail or coat back usually are the same colour. It is the same colour as his hair band which holds up his hair. I'll get more into how I feel about his hair style later. We're focusing on the uniform a bit more. I like the length of the cut of his tunic. It is very very Eastern like a Russian or Ottoman style coat. Unlike Glemy he has resisted the urge to have holsters or anything useless at all hanging off him which makes sense as we saw in Zeta this man only gets personal if he thinks he can get away with it. Huh, speaking of Glemy those are the same sort of light space boots as the Totomeister (his choice of his nickname) would wear. I'm not sure about the boots being white. I think black or brown leather really would work better. All it all, It actually is a pretty memoriable and impressive little look. People from the Jupiter fleet certainly do have style. It is kind of a shame though we don't see anyone else rocking the same sort of style since everyone else around the man is a Titan/Rogue Titan and they just bring their own gear or Titan stuff with them. My only non clothing complaint is the hair style. It might just be me, but personally instead of his current hair style now I think a sort of shorter one with a Roman style laurel wreath thing in his hair would certainly have helped bringing forth the arrogant and confident charisma of the character. Plus it would fit with his Italian sounding name and obvious god complex too. Aside from that, possibly different colour boots or pants. But it works. 3 out of 5 Garma heads. Next time, I babble a bit about all the Federation uniforms. All of them.  Smoke space weed every day SeanBeansShako fucked around with this message at 15:52 on Feb 28, 2016 |
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Feb 6, 2016 17:54
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Thank you for doing these. Detailed analyses of neat outfits strikes my fancy. I definitely agree with how nice looking Scirocco's uniform is. The man has class. I can't help but make fun of that hairstyle, however.
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Feb 6, 2016 20:09
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These are really awesome, and it amuses me that you did Treize and Scirocco right off the bat as they're my favorite villains from the franchise.
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Feb 6, 2016 20:59
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oohhboy posted:. If Durandal ordered the attack he is an idiot as it moved up the timetable for Lacus's moves, Lacus was already going back to PLANT. That is what prompted the attack. I think a lot of people forget that Durandal wasn't attacking out of the blue for no reason. Lacus was prepping to go back to PLANT when the assassination attempt happened. ImpAtom fucked around with this message at 21:04 on Feb 6, 2016 |
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Feb 6, 2016 21:01
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They do have some pretty memoriable duds. I'll get to Char eventually, he'll have a seperate post compared to the Zeon.
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Feb 6, 2016 21:02
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SeanBeansShako posted:They do have some pretty memoriable duds. I'll get to Char eventually, he'll have a seperate post compared to the Zeon. All of char's outfits or just the 0079 one?
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Feb 6, 2016 21:03
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Droyer posted:All of char's outfits or just the 0079 one? Possibly, I'm not sure about this Quattro guy though. He isn't an Char.
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Feb 6, 2016 21:05
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oohhboy posted:The idea that Lacus false flagged the attack on her or that she wanted to take over the world or is the villain is idiotic. ZAFT was actually doing a pretty bang-up job of ruining the EA's poo poo completely in SEED with nothing but N-Jammers and conventional forces; if the Archangel crew hadn't managed to stop the infiltrators from jacking the Strike for the EA to base mobile suit development off of, the EA would have been proper hosed even before the superlaser came online. The Earth Alliance is only a federation in theory. The Atlantic Federation was the supreme power in the Alliance to the point where they were able to do poo poo like drop the Destroy in Europe and have it go on a death march without fearing repercussions from their allies, and the Atlantic Federation itself was a total puppet of LOGOS. In effect, the Earth Alliance as of Destiny is basically an illuminati dictatorship unified for one goal and dissenting opinions are too insignificant to matter. ORB is theoretically not in control of the Earth at the end of Destiny. However, they have two major points of power: First, their leader is a personal friend and family member of the ruler of all of PLANT. Second, they are the home of one the most advanced producers of military technology in the Earth Sphere which is capable of churning out a massive army at a virtual moment's notice. Cagalli, their leader, is a wildly emotional girl with strong opinions on what is right and wrong and has a history of making terribly dangerous decisions for the sake of making a stand for her principles. How long do you think the remaining nutjobs running the Atlantic Federation are going to last without getting an Orb Freedom Invasion if they keep doing poo poo like genociding Coordinators? Destiny is full of a ton of really dumb plot holes but the attack on Lacus makes perfect sense from the standpoint that Durandal absolutely had to eliminate Lacus at some point. Her power as both a symbol and a schemer is so great that it pretty much eclipses everyone else in the setting, and he would know that she'd be absolutely opposed to his plans. His only downfall was not expecting her to have built a fortified battleship hangar under her goddamn house. Bringing out Meer anyway is still smart because even if Lacus is alive he could use Meer to call into question the real Lacus's credibility and dilute Lacus's power as a symbol. In a smarter written show he would have done that, but he didn't.
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Feb 6, 2016 21:06
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