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Focacciasaurus_Rex posted:I can't decide what to get for my ascendencies. Beacon of Corruption is good. You get some chaos resistance and your spirits fart out caustic clouds when they expire/are desummoned. For the last 2* points I'd probably get the one that lets offering skills apply to you, forgot the name. *technically last 4 but it may be a while before you want to dance with Uber!Izaro.
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Jun 18, 2016 18:41
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Alright goons, since this has been repeated in chat a bunch I just wanna do the math and see if anyone can show me where my math is wrong, or if yall are just assuming or repeating stuff you heard elsewhere. Here are the base numbers I am using, which seem like a reasonable starting point for this calculation: Level 20 BV: 108–162 physical damage (135 average) Damage effectiveness: 30% Max roll spell damage Vinktars: 25–90 added to spells (57.5 average) Physical conversion VInktars: 20% Warlords Mark: global 2% life/mana leech Vessel of Vinktar: lightning 20% life/mana leech Taste of Hate+Hatred = 70% phys added as cold With physical conversion vinktar: 108 physical damage/27 lightning damage/94 cold damage 202 damage leech @ 2% + 27 leech @ 20% 4.04+5.2 With added to spells vinktar: 135 physical damage/17.25 lightning damage/94 cold damage 246 damage leech @ 2% + 17 leech @ 20% 4.92+3.4 Physical Conversion Vinktar total: 9.24 damage leech per hit (~10% more) 202 damage per hit Added to Spells Vinktar total: 8.36 damage leech per hit 246 damage per hit (~20% more) It seems to me that added to spells vinktar is clearly better, especially when you factor in poison damage (conversion means you have 20% less poison damage) and enemy resistances (enemies taking significantly less lightning damage and providing less leech in the process as well). Even if I had a 6L with lvl 4 empower and 21 blade vortex, when you factor in enemy resists (especially on bosses), I am probably going to leech a very similar amount and do significantly more damage with the added damage to spells vinktar. Is there something I forgot here or ...? Maybe if you were running wrath and added lightning gems and using phys to lightning and doing a whole different build, I can see conversion working well, but for most BV characters (phys based) the added to spells seems superior or equal in every way... MannersPlease fucked around with this message at 20:03 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 19:58
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Vinktars leech always has full effect, and leeches mana. Warlords is reduced against bosses and doesnt work on hexproof. E: And the leech% gets buffed by flask effect nodes
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Jun 18, 2016 20:03
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TheRat posted:Vinktars leech always has full effect, and leeches mana. Warlords is reduced against bosses and doesnt work on hexproof. Ok but this doesnt tell me how my math is wrong...do you know actual numbers for average resist on bosses? The wiki seems outdated, I'm not sure where to look for that information, so I can only respond with generalities: I have flask effect nodes but I also have curse effect nodes , and I would assume most bosses have significant resistances which kinda makes it seem that vinktars doesn't always have full effect, since all of its damage (and therefore leech) is getting a major reduced effectiveness by boss resistances. For me, bosses only reduce curse by 30%, so if they have at least 30% lit resist then my example calculation applies. If they have more than 30% resist (I would suspect this to be the norm) then the entire post still stands - added to spells is clearly superior. Maybe only when bosses have 0% resist, and their full 60% curse effectiveness, then it's a toss up (still not the 100% vote for conversion that goons seem to be swearing by). Warlords also leeches mana. I personally don't have to worry about hexproof but I guess in a hexproof map you would leech significantly more with vinktars (and still have significant less damage though), but still in all other situations... MannersPlease fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 20:16
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MannersPlease posted:Warlords also leeches mana But you didnt include it in your calculations. Also hexproof isnt just a mapmod, there are plenty of hexproof packs of mobs. Conversion also makes it easier to tank phys reflect. TheRat fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 20:19
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TheRat posted:But you didnt include it in your calculations. Damage leech per hit implies both, supported by the top of the post where I listed life/mana leech...
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Jun 18, 2016 20:22
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You are also doing calculations on a base gem that hasnt been scaled up at all, massively benefitting added damage over conversion.
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Jun 18, 2016 20:27
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The fringe cases of conversion being better for hexproof (added spells still will get you by) and reflect (also very easy to just have a phys to light gem swap) don't seem like they are worth losing massive poison damage in every case, physical damage that isn't as easily resisted in every case, and paying 2.5+ more exalteds for.TheRat posted:You are also doing calculations on a base gem that hasnt been scaled up at all, massively benefitting added damage over conversion. That could be where I am wrong. I thought my gems (crit chance, crit damage, faster cast, conc) as well as my damage on gear and tree (area damage, spell damage) scale both the physical damage from the gem as well as the added damage from the flask, so if I want to do all that math I can but the relationship/weighting between the two would stay the same. Are you telling me that all my gear/tree/gems will scale my blade vortex gem but not my flask? MannersPlease fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 20:31
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MannersPlease posted:Are you telling me that all my gear/tree/gems will scale my blade vortex gem but not my flask? Partially, yes. E: http://pathofexile.gamepedia.com/Damage_conversion
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Jun 18, 2016 20:33
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TheRat posted:Partially, yes. care to elaborate which ones don't scale my flat ele damage
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Jun 18, 2016 20:34
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MannersPlease posted:care to elaborate which ones don't scale my flat ele damage If you get physical damage nodes/belt/etc, they will scale your blade vortex's physical part before the calculations are made for any conversions and similar stuff like vinktars/taste of hate. So by nature of your initial physical damage being more powerful, vinktars conversion will be more powerful while vinktars added flat will not. E: I'm pretty sure the same goes for spell damage
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Jun 18, 2016 20:41
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TheRat posted:If you get physical damage nodes/belt/etc, they will scale your blade vortex's physical part before the calculations are made for any conversions and similar stuff like vinktars/taste of hate. So by nature of your initial physical damage being more powerful, vinktars conversion will be more powerful while vinktars added flat will not. If you are a shadow this might be worth figuring out, but I have no physical damage nodes so this doesn't apply at all. I would assume the opposite for added x-x spell damage, that it would scale them equally just fine. If you get it on gear/gems/auras it is scaled by your spell damage nodes, why wouldn't it be the same from a flask?
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Jun 18, 2016 20:48
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MannersPlease posted:If you are a shadow this might be worth figuring out, but I have no physical damage nodes so this doesn't apply at all. Auras arent scaled by spell damage, they are scaled by elemental damage. E: And while you may not have physical damage, you definitely have spell damage in there somewhere I hope?
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Jun 18, 2016 20:50
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TheRat posted:Auras arent scaled by spell damage, they are scaled by elemental damage. I do have a ton of spell damage. Something like 250 on gear+tree, and another 70 or so area maybe? So I just threw in a lvl 17 anger, which adds 72.5 flat fire to spells, times .3 for effectiveness, 21.75 flat fire damage. But my tooltip shows 73.5 flat fire damage now, which is about in line with all my increased % area+ spell damage. Are you sure that added spell damage from auras aren't scaled? The same thing happens with added lightning gem - it shows the gem damage to be similar on gem and tooltip, despite the .3 effectiveness (which is because of my %increased, no?) It's the same with how added flat physical damage works, right? scaled up by your gems, gear, and tree - regardless of where it originated (rings, amulets, etc) MannersPlease fucked around with this message at 21:00 on Jun 18, 2016 |
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Jun 18, 2016 20:55
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Yeah I'm not certain about spell damage, so you might be right about that one.
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Jun 18, 2016 21:10
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Pretty new to the game, what's a safe shadow build for clearing all the main content? Can I just dick around and experiment with what I like?
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Jun 18, 2016 22:17
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Leveling to get to merciless is really boring
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Jun 18, 2016 22:21
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Elderbean posted:Pretty new to the game, what's a safe shadow build for clearing all the main content? Can I just dick around and experiment with what I like? bladefall poison traps saboteur, respec to mines for the real hard content actually selfcast poison bladefall migth be less boring if you just want get to maps
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Jun 18, 2016 22:34
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 Possibly the only good quest reward item I've ever gotten. And I'm even leveling EQ! (Probably gonna sell it...)
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Jun 18, 2016 22:43
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Elderbean posted:Pretty new to the game, what's a safe shadow build for clearing all the main content? Can I just dick around and experiment with what I like? Lightning Trap and Ice Trap. Bladefall traps the other guy mentioned are equally as powerful and can be scaled up higher, but has 0 room to experiment. With the dedicated trap skills you can switch out your support gems a bunch-- though cluster traps will always be taking up a support gem slot for any trap skill --and play around with your passives more since you have elemental scaling.
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Jun 18, 2016 22:52
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The March Hare posted:
 sell it
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Jun 18, 2016 23:57
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Kind of bored of Grim Dawn and Diablo 3 at the moment so I'm going to give this a shot; I read the OP- anything else good to know for a beginner? Not super worried about builds right now, I like to mess around and explore at first as I learn the mechanics.
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Jun 19, 2016 00:03
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panda clue posted:
Yeah, trying to work out a price for it.
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Jun 19, 2016 00:07
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I would guess at least 2 exalts, probably more, but I can't say for certain since this league's economy is a bit wack.
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Jun 19, 2016 00:14
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FastestGunAlive posted:Kind of bored of Grim Dawn and Diablo 3 at the moment so I'm going to give this a shot; I read the OP- anything else good to know for a beginner? Not super worried about builds right now, I like to mess around and explore at first as I learn the mechanics. OP covers pretty much everything you need to know. I recommend joining the guild so you can ask goons any questions you have while playing, though.
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Jun 19, 2016 00:25
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The March Hare posted:
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Jun 19, 2016 01:13
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Count Uvula posted:OP covers pretty much everything you need to know. I recommend joining the guild so you can ask goons any questions you have while playing, though. I wouldn't mind a guild invite myself. IGN- Grumbledor_II
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Jun 19, 2016 02:37
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Well I played for an hour to try it out and I got a skill that let me flood the screen with floating, flaming, homing skulls so I think I am going to like this a lorn
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Jun 19, 2016 03:29
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How is stun recovery as a mod? Is it basically a wasted slot? Or is it something sought after?
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Jun 19, 2016 06:35
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Zotix posted:How is stun recovery as a mod? Is it basically a wasted slot? Or is it something sought after? Completely undesirable. It's okay (in effect, not valuation) on the shields that have it as an implicit.
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Jun 19, 2016 06:38
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That sucks. I found these boots Serpentscale boots: 71a, 71 e 8% armor evasion 10% Rarity of items 31% fire resist 33% cold resist 30% move speed 7% stun I hope they would still be worth something.
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Jun 19, 2016 06:59
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you really want life or ES on boots to go with those resistances and 30% movespeed
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Jun 19, 2016 07:01
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Zotix posted:That sucks. I found these boots A low defense roll and a stun roll is likely a hybrid roll. Those stack with the regular defense roll, so they can be fairly valuable on an ES base.
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Jun 19, 2016 07:06
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Yeah, the stun could be from a hybrid prefix, or a stun recovery suffix. Meanwhile, the item rarity could be a prefix or a suffix. So it's possible that there's room for a prefix in order to craft life.
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Jun 19, 2016 07:16
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Phobophilia posted:Yeah, the stun could be from a hybrid prefix, or a stun recovery suffix. Meanwhile, the item rarity could be a prefix or a suffix. So it's possible that there's room for a prefix in order to craft life. There are three resists, so there's no room for another suffix. Best case scenario is hybrid roll.
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Jun 19, 2016 11:07
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queeb posted:I'm doing this right now. only level 48 but it's pretty drat strong with the first 2 ascendency nodes, I can only see it getting more insane once I start picking up damage nodes and stuff in the ranger area. First ~40 levels are ok, i just leveled with a elemental bow/storm cloud, since you get some ele damage nodes over in the templar are before shooting over to ranger. once you hit 40 and pick up a couple crit nodes, holy jesus. Do reccomend. What is your build? Ive found a greeat looking one using Lioneye's Fall but they cost a tonne. I'm still very tempted though. My main concern is I've never been a huge bow guy, but that was patches and patches ago, it seems better now. ps the build Im thinking of goes like this - http://tinyurl.com/zvn4sgb Plenty ele dmg early on and plenty of life by 90 (with room for 4 more nodes if you go higher). The staff nodes get converted into bow nodes with the unique gems. Startng out I guess you head for the ele triangle through some life. Then probably down and back around to the massive life block near Scion... well it depends, I suppose you need to time your it so when you can use DFP you can slot in your expensive jewels and start making use of all that crit potential. I have heard split arrow is good.... what about tornado shot? Touchdown Boy fucked around with this message at 12:48 on Jun 19, 2016 |
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Jun 19, 2016 12:44
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I'm doing that build as well, but I'm running it as a Pathfinder - makes the early pathing a lot easier and I don't need a Lioneye's Fall. I've got 16% elemental penetration too, so I'm not even feeling the loss of Inquisitor that badly!
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Jun 19, 2016 15:56
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theshim posted:I'm doing that build as well, but I'm running it as a Pathfinder - makes the early pathing a lot easier and I don't need a Lioneye's Fall. I've got 16% elemental penetration too, so I'm not even feeling the loss of Inquisitor that badly! Yeah ive started off as Inquisitor and its kinda fun. The early middle game might be a bit iffy, will see. I liked the look of doing it this way (even though its probably more expensive!) because of those nice staff nodes that generate power and endurance charges... I hope they convert now!!
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Jun 19, 2016 16:21
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So I've only been back like 7 days and I'm trying to get my head around all of the recipes and incorporating them into my playing. How do you guys keep a stockpile of alchemy shards? It seems they are needed for a lot of things, like alching strongboxes in maps, maps themselves after t7, prismatic rings, etc. I'm going to start doing the chaos recipe tonight I think. Also, what should I do with my poop prismatic rings that I get after alching the prismatic that I get from 3 two stone rings? Just use them in the chaos recipe?
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Jun 19, 2016 17:51
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I haven't found keeping alchs to be too much of a problem just from selling gear that grants shards (item rarity, +level gems, chaos resistance). That's what I do with my crap prismatics.
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Jun 19, 2016 18:28
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