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mind the walrus posted:What did they think didn't work?
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Oct 31, 2016 06:26
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Nessus posted:Better direction for Morn. I liked him but he just hogged every scene he was in. Christ, he wouldn't shut up. I know a lot of people get mad when you compare DS9 to Babylon 5, but if you think of his monologues, Morn was probably the G'Kar of DS9.,
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Oct 31, 2016 06:44
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mind the walrus posted:What did they think didn't work? I can tell what they didn't think didn't work. Vic.
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Oct 31, 2016 09:05
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Vic was fine. I don't get why people bitch about Vic so much, considering most episodes that he appears in are also good ones. I always took him as showing just another side of war. If the Dominion War is WW2 in space, Vic is US Army propaganda performers who travelled around to keep troop morale high. His role fit in with the overall war story.
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Oct 31, 2016 09:44
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Vic felt a bit like a rehash of The Doctor's character arc, compressed into the final season of an otherwise great show. "Wow, the crew sure came to accept this holo-singer as a person really fast; meanwhile, the holo-doctor over on the bad Star Trek has been working on it for, what, 5 years, and still has difficulty getting his own shipmates to accept his personhood?"
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Oct 31, 2016 09:55
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I thought it was kinda weird how you have "It's Only a Paper Moon", with it's theme of 'Don't hide away in Vic's fantasy world, you have to face reality', then just a few episodes later you have "Badda-Bing Badda-Bang", which was basically 'Everyone, drop everything! We need to hang out in Vic's fantasy world!'
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Oct 31, 2016 13:02
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How are the audio versions of those books? I think I've got some credits on audible for them.
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Oct 31, 2016 13:58
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Angry Salami posted:I thought it was kinda weird how you have "It's Only a Paper Moon", with it's theme of 'Don't hide away in Vic's fantasy world, you have to face reality', then just a few episodes later you have "Badda-Bing Badda-Bang", which was basically 'Everyone, drop everything! We need to hang out in Vic's fantasy world!' Isn't it a matter of context? "Don't hide away in Vic's fantasy world FOREVER, you have to face reality" vs "the hideaway we go to so we can unwind from the grim reality we face needs some attention" was how I saw them.
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Oct 31, 2016 15:11
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McNally posted:Isn't it a matter of context? "Don't hide away in Vic's fantasy world FOREVER, you have to face reality" vs "the hideaway we go to so we can unwind from the grim reality we face needs some attention" was how I saw them. It just felt kind of thematically weird that Vic's had been used twice as an unhealthy escape from reality - in "Paper Moon" and Worf sulking there in the season 7 opener, but then in the same season you get an episode that's all about how awesome Vic's is and how everyone should be trying to stop it
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Oct 31, 2016 15:25
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So wait, these books say that the DS9 writers don't think Vic Fontaine really worked? VINDICATION.
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Oct 31, 2016 15:43
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Kingtheninja posted:How are the audio versions of those books? I think I've got some credits on audible for them. It's ok, a few different narrators to read the clips to make it interesting since there are no characters. The first hour of each is a slog since a large portion of it is them reading off the names of people. There a quite a few segments about Gene being an rear end in a top hat. The Fuzzy Hulk fucked around with this message at 16:02 on Oct 31, 2016 |
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Oct 31, 2016 15:58
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I didn't like vic 
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Oct 31, 2016 16:01
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The Dark One posted:Loose hips destroy ships. I just realized they probably had Commander Comedy Height sit on the console just to keep him in frame.
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Oct 31, 2016 20:13
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Rhyno posted:So wait, these books say that the DS9 writers don't think Vic Fontaine really worked? No, I was just making a dumb joke that they definitely think he did work, mostly because of posts like that  Going by interviews Ira Behr certainly loved having him.
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Oct 31, 2016 20:13
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They admit season 1 dax and season 1 bashir needed some work. In fact the studio demanded Siddig be fired after season 1 but they circled the wagons and protected him. They then gave dax more adventure and her klingon stuff in an attempt to have her do anything.
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Oct 31, 2016 20:59
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Baronjutter posted:They admit season 1 dax and season 1 bashir needed some work. In fact the studio demanded Siddig be fired after season 1 but they circled the wagons and protected him. They then gave dax more adventure and her klingon stuff in an attempt to have her do anything. I'm really glad they didn't fire Siddiq. I really think Bashir had the most character development of anyone in the series.
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Oct 31, 2016 21:58
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Ogmius815 posted:I'm really glad they didn't fire Siddiq. I really think Bashir had the most character development of anyone in the series. I'm probably the only one who loves genetically superior Bashir.
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Oct 31, 2016 21:58
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Rhyno posted:I'm probably the only one who loves genetically superior Bashir. I don't really think it makes a difference and am thus neutral.
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Oct 31, 2016 21:59
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I love and cheer for everyone on that show except dax, but after reading this DS9 poo poo I feel sorry for the actress she went through some serious poo poo. She also basically beat up the "science advisor" at a party because his techno-babble she had to deliver was ruining her life. He did't know she hated it so much and was causing her so much anxiety to they nixed her character just being there to deliver the technobullshit.
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Oct 31, 2016 22:02
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WickedHate posted:I don't really think it makes a difference and am thus neutral. The difference between pre and post augment Bashir was before everyone knew he was an augment, he'd just be a normal geeky dude. After everyone knew, every line of his was something like "the square root of 2567 is 50.665570163573606033087907718517." I hated that. They always wanted to wink wink nudge nudge remind everyone that he's a superman with a superbrain but it just didn't make any sense. Did him finding out that he was augmented make him smart? Why wasn't he inhumanly smart and able to do Data-esque calculations before he knew this?
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Oct 31, 2016 22:13
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Rhyno posted:I'm probably the only one who loves genetically superior Bashir. Nah, I like him too, he's great. It's odd that they would want to fire the actor though. I had always gotten the impression that the issue with Bashir was that he was a terribly written character for the first season or so, not that there was anything particularly wrong with Siddiq's performance or anything. Baronjutter posted:I love and cheer for everyone on that show except dax, but after reading this DS9 poo poo I feel sorry for the actress she went through some serious poo poo. She also basically beat up the "science advisor" at a party because his techno-babble she had to deliver was ruining her life. He did't know she hated it so much and was causing her so much anxiety to they nixed her character just being there to deliver the technobullshit. Didn't Terry Farrel also have issues with being outside and poo poo? Like, actual health reasons? I've heard it mentioned, but never really heard any details regarding it. Cojawfee posted:The difference between pre and post augment Bashir was before everyone knew he was an augment, he'd just be a normal geeky dude. After everyone knew, every line of his was something like "the square root of 2567 is 50.665570163573606033087907718517." I hated that. They always wanted to wink wink nudge nudge remind everyone that he's a superman with a superbrain but it just didn't make any sense. Did him finding out that he was augmented make him smart? Why wasn't he inhumanly smart and able to do Data-esque calculations before he knew this? Pretty sure that it's covered in the reveal that he tried to keep a low profile once he learned what his parents had done, since actually trying to use his abilities to their fullest would raise suspicions and destroy any career prospects he might have had. QuantaStarFire fucked around with this message at 22:26 on Oct 31, 2016 |
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Oct 31, 2016 22:19
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QuantaStarFire posted:Nah, I like him too, he's great. Yeah she had some serious health issues and had recurring horrible bronchitis through a lot of season 1. She was also cast last min and got a strong sense her character didn't really have a place or strength and had so much anxiety she wasn't sleeping (which of course made her health worse) What I'm really getting from reading all this ds9 cast and crew stuff is that they might not have been best huggy friends like the TNG cast, they were extremely professional, supportive, and loyal and everyone from writer to actor to producer were all very much on the same team. They eventually got an "us against the world" sort of attitude where they didn't care what the network or fans wanted, they just wanted to make the best TV they could, based on what they all agreed was good, and they're all very (rightfully) proud of what they made. Baronjutter fucked around with this message at 22:29 on Oct 31, 2016 |
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Oct 31, 2016 22:26
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QuantaStarFire posted:Nah, I like him too, he's great. I love Bashir and Siddig, but he had some really bad line reads in the first season. That scream when he wakes up in Move Along Home comes to mind as the worst part of a terrible episode.
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Oct 31, 2016 22:47
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MorgaineDax posted:I love Bashir and Siddig, but he had some really bad line reads in the first season. That scream when he wakes up in Move Along Home comes to mind as the worst part of a terrible episode. 
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Oct 31, 2016 23:22
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Baronjutter posted:Yeah she had some serious health issues and had recurring horrible bronchitis through a lot of season 1. She was also cast last min and got a strong sense her character didn't really have a place or strength and had so much anxiety she wasn't sleeping (which of course made her health worse) The DS9 cast kinda reminds me of the TOS cast, minus most of the decade-long grudges.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:47
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MorgaineDax posted:I love Bashir and Siddig, but he had some really bad line reads in the first season. Peak Season 1 Bashir was that time he got possessed by the serial killer dude and proceeded to devour every piece of scenery on the show.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:52
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Big Mean Jerk posted:The DS9 cast kinda reminds me of the TOS cast, minus most of the decade-long grudges. Yeah, because nobody on the cast was as big a shithead as Shat.
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Oct 31, 2016 23:56
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Delsaber posted:Peak Season 1 Bashir was that time he got possessed by the serial killer dude and proceeded to devour every piece of scenery on the show.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:00
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Nessus posted:Oh yeah, that was loving amazing. It's like he gained Sisko-level Acting powers but couldn't control them FTFY
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Nov 1, 2016 00:06
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Didn't they have to redub his voice because it was so bad in that episode? I really want to hear that original voice.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:35
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Rhyno posted:So wait, these books say that the DS9 writers don't think Vic Fontaine really worked? Baloogan posted:I didn't like vic Oh god no not again please Vic Fontaine ground DS9 to a halt every time he showed up, gently caress Vic, despite his kind nature
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Nov 1, 2016 00:46
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QuantaStarFire posted:Didn't Terry Farrel also have issues with being outside and poo poo? Like, actual health reasons? I've heard it mentioned, but never really heard any details regarding it. As for Siddig, I totally understand why the augment revelation would've pissed him off. Look at it in context: in the middle of the fifth season, it was revealed that he'd been replaced by a changeling for about 3-4 episodes. Unfortunately, this was a spur-of-the-moment revelation by the writers, so he'd been playing Bashir "wrong" for all those episodes. Two episodes later and they pull the same stunt with the augment revelation, which means he was basically playing the character wrong since day one. If I was an actor, I'd be pretty pissed off too, and I'd be half expecting the "Bashir is secretly a woman who's fallen in love with Miles" script to land in my mailbox any moment. MorgaineDax posted:Didn't they have to redub his voice because it was so bad in that episode? I really want to hear that original voice. The one I remember was when Avery Brooks was playing Joran Dax in "Facets" and in the first take he did this quiet creepy voice and apparently everyone on the crew thought it was too intense. Marshal Radisic fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Nov 1, 2016 |
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Nov 1, 2016 00:47
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Marshal Radisic posted:As for Siddig, I totally understand why the augment revelation would've pissed him off. Look at it in context: in the middle of the fifth season, it was revealed that he'd been replaced by a changeling for about 3-4 episodes. Unfortunately, this was a spur-of-the-moment revelation by the writers, so he'd been playing Bashir "wrong" for all those episodes. Two episodes later and they pull the same stunt with the augment revelation, which means he was basically playing the character wrong since day one. If I was an actor, I'd be pretty pissed off too, and I'd be half expecting the "Bashir is secretly a woman who's fallen in love with Miles" script to land in my mailbox any moment. I'm 100% sympathetic I just think that watching DS9, I never really noticed a change in Bashir between pre-reveal and post-reveal.
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Nov 1, 2016 00:51
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I hated Vic when the shows first aired. In retrospect, I think this was because he was not the Defiant or a Quantum Torpedo explosion. Upon each successive rewatch over the years, I have liked him more and more. Vic is good.
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Nov 1, 2016 01:22
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I thought the Bashir reveal brought a more interesting dynamic to a character who didn't have a lot going on prior to that. Personally I think by far his best episodes are the Section 31 ones and the ones with the 'misfit' augments. He's a good actor but he got very little to work with initially. I never cared much for Jadzia...I liked Ezri better to some degree because she actually was uncomfortable with her situation, whereas Jadzia seemed to have few flaws.
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Nov 1, 2016 01:35
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WickedHate posted:I'm 100% sympathetic I just think that watching DS9, I never really noticed a change in Bashir between pre-reveal and post-reveal. I don't get why just because a guy is a super genius it has to invalidate the character choice that he was also a spazzy young annoying dork.
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Nov 1, 2016 01:35
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If you can't get down with how awesome Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang is then maybe you hate fun?
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Nov 1, 2016 01:47
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I like Vic, but he's almost fourth wall breaking between being able to control the holosuite and access the station comm system, and no one seems to care much. It makes you wonder where in the hell Bashir actually bought him. Maybe Vic is actually an alien with light mind control powers posing as a holo program or something.
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Nov 1, 2016 02:31
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Zurui posted:If you can't get down with how awesome Badda-Bing, Badda-Bang is then maybe you hate fun? I'm pretty sure fun is illegal. It's 2016 after all.
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Nov 1, 2016 02:33
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QuantaStarFire posted:Didn't Terry Farrel also have issues with being outside and poo poo? Like, actual health reasons? I've heard it mentioned, but never really heard any details regarding it. She had to be kept in the shade as much as possible during location shoots because she basically explodes when exposed to natural sunlight.
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Nov 1, 2016 04:34
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