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Zythrst posted:Sam B has no credibility. No leftist entertainer forged from the last eight years does. They're all soft and weak because they've forgotten, or never knew, what it was like under the Bush years. Ineffective leftist pundits are going to go fast in the next four years. Trevor Noah will probably be first.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:05
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Mirthless posted:No leftist entertainer forged from the last eight years does. They're all soft and weak because they've forgotten, or never knew, what it was like under the Bush years. if last night's TDS was any indication, this is likely
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Nov 10, 2016 21:06
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Lawman 0 posted:just for the record you're still an idiot. ok
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Nov 10, 2016 21:06
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Heaps of Sheeps posted:Just lmao @ people suggesting more Democrats to run as the answer to this issue. Did you loving jabronis not learn anything this week? The Democratic Party is over; it's a trash organization that cannot be reformed and it needs to be put in the dumpster where it belongs. We need a new party of the people. Then take it over from the inside. Indications suggest that that the time is ripe. The leadership has failed but the structure is there. And if you believe Hillary Clinton is a lovely candidate with no redeeming qualities as you probably do, it has a good chunk of the American populace willing to vote for a completely lovely candidate behind it, which it has locked up and your new party of the people wouldn't have. This is why the right-populist Tea Party has been successful in getting what it wants (deadlocked government, extremist R leaders, no tax raises or additional government programs). Organization and experts and infrastructure aren't a bad thing, inherently. Like, let's do a counterfactual. Imagine if when Trump runs and gets the R nomination, the RNC decides to dump on him entirely rather than reluctantly falling in line. No funding. No infrastructure. No data. It tells its voters to stay home, because even Clinton nominating Bernie Sanders for Supreme Court Justice is better than Donald Trump nominating Peter Thiel. They all go and back Mcmuffin instead. Donald Trump does a third party run. I think you'd see Clinton dunk the gently caress out of him, even with nothing else changing. Conversely, imagine if Sanders went third party and Clinton did everything right. She made a message that resonated with the white working class, got true intersectionality between the dispossessed like Sanders wanted, etc etc. But you'd have Sanders there spreading a similar message, just even moreso. I think you'd see Clinton get owned even worse than she did now. But not only do the elite have an outsize voice, false class consciousness is huge in America. People think of themselves as temporarily embarrassed millionaires. You need a party by and for the people, which advocates progressive policy and left-wing economics, which is against austerity and for tax raises and for long-term infrastructure investment and for jobs and against financial fuckery, but you also need to assure people that it isn't going to take away their hard-earned money. And I think that's the other part of Donald Trump's magical lie we aren't discussing. He was talking about how he'd bring jobs back, but also about how he's let you keep the money you earned. About how the government is taking away your money and wasting it. You need some elite appeal because there are a lot of not-wealthy people who think they're part of the elite and will therefore vote for pro-elite policies. The fact that doing so will allow the elite to acquiesce to you rather than trying to sabotage you is a side benefit.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:07
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I don't quite understand the anger at people like Bernie and Warren that some are expressing because they've said they'll work with Trump on populist issues. He's president whether they like it or not and there is real crossover in what he talked about in his campaign and what they want to do. If they can get part of their agenda passed with a republican led house and senate who cares if Trump is the guy signing it in to law?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:08
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mastershakeman posted:my co-workers have been hyping him and Gavin newsome all morning oh man, you guys thought romney was a robot? wait until you meet gavin on the national stage
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Nov 10, 2016 21:08
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Thoguh posted:I don't quite understand the anger at people like Bernie and Warren that some are expressing because they've said they'll work with Trump on populist issues. He's president whether they like it or not and there is real crossover in what he talked about in his campaign and what they want to do. If they can get part of their agenda passed with a republican led house and senate who cares if Trump is the guy signing it in to law? from what ive seen the people mad about bernie at the least have been posters that hate the gently caress out of him to begin with
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Nov 10, 2016 21:08
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mastershakeman posted:my co-workers have been hyping him and Gavin newsome all morning gavin newsome is another one that must be stopped at all costs also in the look for tolerable democrats, keep an eye on Cortez Masto, she owes her seat due to nevada being the only rapidly unionizing state in the country and it is sounding like she's gonna go full "gently caress trump" https://twitter.com/CatherineForNV/status/796428045489827840 https://twitter.com/CatherineForNV/status/796428815828299776 https://twitter.com/CatherineForNV/status/796429129595764736
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Nov 10, 2016 21:08
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Oh Snapple! posted:remember when hill shills got mad as gently caress about the bernie folks booing him and cuomo during the DNC lol Need bigger signs here stat!!!
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Nov 10, 2016 21:09
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Oh Snapple! posted:Say one thing about Hillary Clinton, say she connects with affluent white women in the twilight of their careers who need one last moment of validation. Any hope of validation for Clinton went flying out the window when she said we have to unify under Trump.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:10
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Thoguh posted:I don't quite understand the anger at people like Bernie and Warren that some are expressing because they've said they'll work with Trump on populist issues. He's president whether they like it or not and there is real crossover in what he talked about in his campaign and what they want to do. If they can get part of their agenda passed with a republican led house and senate who cares if Trump is the guy signing it in to law? i mean bernie's whole message was "hey if trump proposes something good (which he won't) i'm willing to look at it otherwise he can eat poo poo"
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Nov 10, 2016 21:10
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MJ12 posted:Then take it over from the inside. Indications suggest that that the time is ripe. The leadership has failed but the structure is there. And if you believe Hillary Clinton is a lovely candidate with no redeeming qualities as you probably do, it has a good chunk of the American populace willing to vote for a completely lovely candidate behind it, which it has locked up and your new party of the people wouldn't have. This is why the right-populist Tea Party has been successful in getting what it wants (deadlocked government, extremist R leaders, no tax raises or additional government programs). Organization and experts and infrastructure aren't a bad thing, inherently. So you're suggesting a strategy of kindly asking the ruling class to give up their power? Here lemme write up a quick article describing the many times in history when that's worked: ...
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Nov 10, 2016 21:10
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Mirthless posted:No leftist entertainer forged from the last eight years does. They're all soft and weak because they've forgotten, or never knew, what it was like under the Bush years. This is The Age of Chapo
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Nov 10, 2016 21:10
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Thoguh posted:I don't quite understand the anger at people like Bernie and Warren that some are expressing because they've said they'll work with Trump on populist issues. He's president whether they like it or not and there is real crossover in what he talked about in his campaign and what they want to do. If they can get part of their agenda passed with a republican led house and senate who cares if Trump is the guy signing it in to law? No dummy you don't fix things, you keep them around as wedge issues, jeez man.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:12
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LmaoTheKid posted:One Democrat said that... I voted for him, and tried to get him the nomination. This is a thread for how mainstream Democrats can fix things going forward. The answer is that they need populism. Actual populism is loud, shouty, and very thin on specifics. It is also angry at the right targets, because if it isn't it'll be angry at the wrong ones. The right targets are globalists. I do not mean jews or whatever, I mean people who consider themselves citizens of the world. We can be citizens of the world after we get our poo poo together. Until then, gently caress the world except when it benefits us. Fighting global warming benefits us, giving aid money benefits us, our diplomatic stances benefit us. The Dems need to get loud and angry about these things, not about the things that don't. Clinton should have been saying no DAPL, she should have been talking about mitigating the effects of climate change as a way to get people Over There to stay Over There, and she should have repudiated globalists and shouted America First. We can absolutely make those words mean whatever we want, the Republicans don't have a monopoly on propaganda.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:11
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Pomp posted:When do I wake up I thought you were already woke.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:11
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Have Terry Crews reprise his role as President Camacho and run him on the Dem ticket 2020 to outcrazy Donald Trump. I'm not sure if i'm joking or not.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:12
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Zikan posted:i wouldn't be surprised if Cory Booker is looking into a run
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Nov 10, 2016 21:12
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Fast Luck posted:He sucks for shilling for Bain Capital of all places, he's probably not economically progressive at all, and would just lead to the dems continuing to hemorrhage house and senate seats. He might be able to win the presidency though. So sort of like Obama which is why he must be stopped. he would essentially be charismatic hillary that can give a decent speech. it would be a victory for third wayism and if we plan to actually govern this country we need to purge it out
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Nov 10, 2016 21:15
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Heaps of Sheeps posted:So you're suggesting a strategy of kindly asking the ruling class to give up their power? Here lemme write up a quick article describing the many times in history when that's worked: When the ruling class is desperate for some way to assure themselves that they won't be completely hosed, and an easy way to do that is to take over the machines they created and turn them towards your ends, so they feel safer about it and don't directly oppose you. I don't think that's hard, a lot of them seem pretty desperate. Also the other main point is that there is all this shiny infrastructure which gives you a pretty significant base ripe for the taking, you might as well take it rather than put the "trash organization" into the dumpster along with whatever guys vote (D) as a reflex because you don't really need that 20% or 30% of the vote. Like maybe when you're seeing mass flight from the Democratic party you'd be right. But it's not there yet, and if the Democrats run a populist message I don't think it'll happen. And I think that Venom Snake is right that there's a lot of people willing to try that. MJ12 has issued a correction as of 21:19 on Nov 10, 2016 |
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Nov 10, 2016 21:16
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Peztopiary posted:I voted for him, and tried to get him the nomination. This is a thread for how mainstream Democrats can fix things going forward. The answer is that they need populism. Actual populism is loud, shouty, and very thin on specifics. It is also angry at the right targets, because if it isn't it'll be angry at the wrong ones. The right targets are globalists. I do not mean jews or whatever, I mean people who consider themselves citizens of the world. We can be citizens of the world after we get our poo poo together. Until then, gently caress the world except when it benefits us. Fighting global warming benefits us, giving aid money benefits us, our diplomatic stances benefit us. The Dems need to get loud and angry about these things, not about the things that don't. Clinton should have been saying no DAPL, she should have been talking about mitigating the effects of climate change as a way to get people Over There to stay Over There, and she should have repudiated globalists and shouted America First. We can absolutely make those words mean whatever we want, the Republicans don't have a monopoly on propaganda. Peztopiary posted:I think we'll see a strong backlash against some of the Alt-Right stuff. Listening to the losing side after the election you hear people angry about racism/sexism/bigotry who didn't vote. Well gently caress, if you don't vote you don't matter. You can start by not saying people who don't vote don't matter.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:17
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Treating disenfranchised people as disposable demographics who don't factor into your political calculus is why you got the numbers wrong AND loving LOST.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:19
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mastershakeman posted:yea it's loving hilarious. she didn't want an Obama 2.0 and completely wrecked the party apparatus with help from Kaine and dws Very Pragmatic.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:20
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What about Al Franken?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:22
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Peztopiary posted:I voted for him, and tried to get him the nomination. This is a thread for how mainstream Democrats can fix things going forward. The answer is that they need populism. Actual populism is loud, shouty, and very thin on specifics. It is also angry at the right targets, because if it isn't it'll be angry at the wrong ones. The right targets are globalists. I do not mean jews or whatever, I mean people who consider themselves citizens of the world. We can be citizens of the world after we get our poo poo together. Until then, gently caress the world except when it benefits us. Fighting global warming benefits us, giving aid money benefits us, our diplomatic stances benefit us. The Dems need to get loud and angry about these things, not about the things that don't. Clinton should have been saying no DAPL, she should have been talking about mitigating the effects of climate change as a way to get people Over There to stay Over There, and she should have repudiated globalists and shouted America First. We can absolutely make those words mean whatever we want, the Republicans don't have a monopoly on propaganda. Pener Kropoopkin posted:Treating disenfranchised people as disposable demographics who don't factor into your political calculus is why you got the numbers wrong AND loving LOST.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:23
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RENEGADE CUCKSKY posted:FYI, I can say with nearly 100% certainty that this is happening right now because the DNC is practically begging the AFL-CIO to not abandon them going forward. I hope they do, because labor unions are to the Dems what religious groups are to the Repubs: groups they feel like they can ignore because their support isn't conditional anymore.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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Heaps of Sheeps posted:So you're suggesting a strategy of kindly asking the ruling class to give up their power? Here lemme write up a quick article describing the many times in history when that's worked: the left's reflexive attitude towards opportunity is of course defeatism
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Nov 10, 2016 21:24
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Fast Luck posted:He sucks for shilling for Bain Capital of all places, he's probably not economically progressive at all, and would just lead to the dems continuing to hemorrhage house and senate seats. He might be able to win the presidency though. So sort of like Obama https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=co7GpMks8UA thsi guy will play well in the rust belt
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Nov 10, 2016 21:25
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:You can start by not saying people who don't vote don't matter. The only time it's acceptable to say people who don't vote don't matter is if it's part of a pitch to convince them that they can matter and should matter while offering someone or something that is worth voting for. And even then it's kind of a risky proposal.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:26
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agent_wildflower posted:What about Al Franken? Big Hillary supporter who shat on Bernie as hard as he could Al Franken?
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Nov 10, 2016 21:27
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Thoguh posted:Big Hillary supporter who shat on Bernie as hard as he could Al Franken? I never saw this  But hillfolk were getting so bad I started ducking out for days at a time at one point so I probably missed it.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:28
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HannibalBarca posted:Speaking of the Democratic party being in shambles right now, let's count the ways: Pener Kropoopkin posted:Treating disenfranchised people as disposable demographics who don't factor into your political calculus is why you got the numbers wrong AND loving LOST. loving these so hard. We/they knew this day was coming, but they thought it would be 2020 or 2024 maybe even later. Unfortunately, they ignored the rurals/blue collars/whites and after smelling their own farts for a long enough time until they started activily making GBS threads on there groups, was some of it justified, yeah, but they pissed away the majority in the hopes goal that is a long ways away.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:30
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Thoguh posted:Big Hillary supporter who shat on Bernie as hard as he could Al Franken? Yeah, he supported Hillary but he definitely did not poo poo on Bernie.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:31
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agent_wildflower posted:What about Al Franken? Hates freedom.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:31
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We are going to have to work with people who supported hillary, and we don't want to alienate them any more than we do anyone else. But we do need to make them understand that her and her power structure are loving dead, and we do need to ignore and oppose anyone who tries to rebuild it in her image.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:33
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Homework Explainer posted:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=co7GpMks8UA dude is absolutely gonna be the last gasp of the neoliberals if sanders is successful in a corbyn style takeover of the DNC Thoguh posted:Big Hillary supporter who shat on Bernie as hard as he could Al Franken? there's gonna be a lot of these, we need to allow some to make penance but make sure they're fully behind left economic populism or else imo
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Nov 10, 2016 21:33
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Dapper_Swindler posted:loving these so hard. We/they knew this day was coming, but they thought it would be 2020 or 2024 maybe even later. Unfortunately, they ignored the rurals/blue collars/whites and after smelling their own farts for a long enough time until they started activily making GBS threads on there groups, was some of it justified, yeah, but they pissed away the majority in the hopes goal that is a long ways away. OTOH maybe it's good that the dems has to face those issues today instead of in 2020
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Nov 10, 2016 21:34
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quote:As a first step, I believe it necessary for the members and leadership of the Democratic National Committee to step down and be replaced by people who are determined to create a party that represents America -- including all those who feel powerless and disenfranchised, and who have been left out of our politics and left behind in our economy. if robert reich ran for president I'd vote for him
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Nov 10, 2016 21:36
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Fullhouse posted:if robert reich ran for president I'd vote for him he needs to gently caress off as does everyone who was in the fuckbarn clinton white house
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Nov 10, 2016 21:37
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This came up yesterday but I don't think it got answered. Did it ever come out if any of that Hillary Victory Fund money made it back to the states after the convention? Because the democrats continued their trend of losing statehouses and governorships on Tuesday and that's going to impact people's day to day lives a lot more than having an orange buffoon in the White House will.
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Nov 10, 2016 21:39
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