SUK ZONE: it's all a pointless exercise and you're just screaming into the void

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > SUK ZONE: it's all a pointless exercise and you're just screaming into the void

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Thoguh: Nov 8, 2002; College Slice

Peel posted:

Harry Reid's statement: http://www.reid.senate.gov/press_releases/2016-11-11-reid-statement-on-the-election-of-donald-trump#.WCXUjsQ8KnM

Harry Reid can gently caress off.

Nobody bought the Trump is a russian plant thing Harry. You can stop talking about Vlad.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:51

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# ? May 9, 2024 21:16

Fast Luck: Feb 2, 1988

tadashi posted:

People hated Hillary so much that she swept the Southern states and crushed Bernie in Pennsylvania.

At some point, people are going to have to accept that plenty of Democratic voters didn't hate Hillary and some even loved her. The Clintons helped save John Lewis' seat in the insurrection by anti-LGBT black candidates in the 1992 primary in Atlanta and it's a big reason she has so many supporters here. Just because her general election campaign went to poo poo doesn't mean you can rewrite the last 25 years.

Of course many Dems didn't hate Hillary. That's more because she was the face of their party, though, than because she believed in a $15 minimum wage "where appropriate," believed in student debt forgiveness "for entrepreneurs," or because she attacked single payer health care because establishing it would mean ending Obamacare.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:52

Seizure Meat: Jul 23, 2008; by Smythe

tadashi posted:

At some point you have to realize what's done is done and stop banging the drum for the same poo poo the GOP has been hammering into people's heads for 25 years. You can say the campaign was poo poo and realize this at the same time.

The point is she won in states that absolutely were not going to go Democrat, and Bernie won in the states that actually decided the election. Pointing to the south as proof Hillary had wide support, which I don't disagree with, is pointless because it didn't matter in the larger picture.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:53

The Puppet Master: Apr 9, 2005; Would you fuck me? I'd fuck me. I'd fuck me hard.

Thoguh posted:

Harry Reid can gently caress off.

Nobody bought the Trump is a russian plant thing Harry. You can stop talking about Vlad.

hey hey hey! That Russian Plant is our President now

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:58

Fast Luck: Feb 2, 1988

VikingSkull posted:

The point is she won in states that absolutely were not going to go Democrat, and Bernie won in the states that actually decided the election. Pointing to the south as proof Hillary had wide support, which I don't disagree with, is pointless because it didn't matter in the larger picture.

Well, she did win PA, FL, OH in the primary, which are crucial swing states (that she then went on to lose)

I don't think the response to this is that she won the bad states in the primary. The response is that she pulled the already reliable Democratic voters without bringing in any new blood. She was poison to independents, young people, and rural voters. And we knew that and people argued it didn't matter, just like they argued it didn't matter she was under federal investigation. We all got hoodwinked and lied to by the pundits throughout the entire primary process. The polls showing Hillary will struggle with Trump don't matter because it's early, is something they said and people repeated

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:58

Seizure Meat: Jul 23, 2008; by Smythe

Fast Luck posted:

Well, she did win PA, FL, OH in the primary, which are crucial swing states (that she then went on to lose)

I don't think the response to this is that she won the bad states in the primary. The response is that she pulled the already reliable Democratic voters without bringing in any new blood. She was poison to independents, young people, and rural voters. And we knew that and people argued it didn't matter, just like they argued it didn't matter she was under federal investigation. We (not necessarily the posters here, but the dem primary voters) got hoodwinked and lied to

That's a fair point.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:58

Matt Zerella: Oct 7, 2002; Norris'es are back baby. It's good again. Awoouu (fox Howl)

Fast Luck posted:

Well, she did win PA, FL, OH in the primary, which are crucial swing states (that she then went on to lose)

I don't think the response to this is that she won the bad states in the primary. The response is that she pulled the already reliable Democratic voters without bringing in any new blood. She was poison to independents, young people, and rural voters. And we knew that and people argued it didn't matter, just like they argued it didn't matter she was under federal investigation. We (not necessarily the posters here, but the dem primary voters) got hoodwinked and lied to

"Won"

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:59

CheesyDog: Jul 4, 2007; by FactsAreUseless

Peel posted:

tbf she probably would have won with better data

losing by several small margins in key states means there's a laundry list of things she could have done differently to win. the democrats were blindsided but not blown out

This race was against the most unorganized campaign in decades if not centuries. Even with bad data it should not have been remotely competitive. If Clinton had squeaked it out all of the structural issues would remain and the first competent RNC candidate to take up Trump's unfocused populism would crush the Dems in the midwest.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:59

A GIANT PARSNIP: Apr 13, 2010; Too much fuckin' eggnog

LmaoTheKid posted:

"Boy howdy, that Hillary, she did so well in a primary she helped rig in her favor with people who love her! Look at all those southern states she won and then lost in the GE while not paying attention to states she lost in the primaries. God I love her!" -an idiot

"Look at how she took over the Democratic Party! Of course she'll win the election!" -Many idiots, including myself, 72 hours ago :negative:

We were out of touch with the needs of huge chunks of our population, and we loving lost because of it. That's okay! That's supposed to happen! It happens because if it didn't, we'd get worse and worse at reading the population and eventually you'd have a violent overthrow and lose everything.

People are loving pissed off and that's why every election in the last decade besides 2012 was a gently caress you to whoever was in power. We're now the heirs to that! The question isn't if we'll win in 2018 and 2020 - the question is if we put in people who will actually help fix our structural problems, or if we're gonna elect some dumb bullshit that's just gonna get washed out again in 2022 and 2024.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 16:59

TyrantWD: Nov 6, 2010; Ignore my doomerism, I don't think better things are possible

A GIANT PARSNIP posted:

"I'm gonna drop a factory right into the middle of this town, and we're gonna make the fuckers who sold you out pay for it!" is going to win you votes, dude.

As long as its a factory that makes the same widgets that the previous factory did. Trump is not promising these workers jobs in factories for the new economy - his appeal was promising to bring back the exact same types of jobs that were lost.

The Democrats can't, and shouldn't promise to bring back Carrier air conditioner factory jobs. A false promise of restoring old glory is always going to win out over a pledge to build some new kind of prosperity.

Everyone trying to figure out how to reach out to blue collar white voters in the rust belt is wasting their time. Trump has the winning message for them, and the Democratic Party is not going to top that. The winning formula for the Democrats is to attract white, college educated voters - who still favored Trump. They can appeal to those voters far easier, and far more authentically, and trying to chase down the Trump base is only going to result in more failure.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:01

Thoguh: Nov 8, 2002; College Slice

Found this for the dead candidate thread but I wanted to post it here to in order to remind everybody of the evening when C-SPAM peaked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ajdSgvmj5Ps

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:01

Pener Kropoopkin: Jan 30, 2013

https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/797068041842520064

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:02

Peel: Dec 3, 2007

Thoguh posted:

Harry Reid can gently caress off.

Nobody bought the Trump is a russian plant thing Harry. You can stop talking about Vlad.

that's uh, not the main thrust of that statement

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:02

Woof Blitzer: Dec 29, 2012; [-]

zen death robot posted:

Who's pushing strong for a city/county merger?

Haha you think that is going to happen ever

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:04

Phi230: Feb 2, 2016; by Fluffdaddy

We just got poo poo on by a loud lunatic

we are the mensheviks again except more poo poo like Kadets

time to be less Kerensky and more Lenin

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:06

Seizure Meat: Jul 23, 2008; by Smythe

Pener Kropoopkin posted:

https://twitter.com/mtracey/status/797068041842520064

If someone coins the term "Western Spring" I'll lose my poo poo

wait it was me, I think I did it

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:07

DaveWoo: Aug 14, 2004; Fun Shoe

A new DNC challenger approaches :siren:

https://twitter.com/jeneps/status/797105432074588160

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:06

Jenner: Jun 5, 2011; Lowtax banned me because he thought I was trolling by acting really stupid. I wasn't acting.

A GIANT PARSNIP posted:

Hey I wanted to thank you for sticking with this thread, and I really hope others from the campaign are watching this thread and taking notes.

These people just want their lives back. They used to go to work, bond with their co-workers, bitch about their managers, and spend 8 hours a day doing something that was useful. Then they went home to their house and their wives and their kids and felt good about putting in a full day's work. They turned on the TV, maybe cracked open a beer, and had conversations about being able to take that vacation in a few years, or maybe this year we'll be able to redo the bathroom. Yeah maybe they weren't the smartest person in the world or "management material" or whatever the gently caress people judged them by, but they woke up every morning, put their pants on, and showed up to work 2 minutes early to Do Something that needed to be done. They worked hard and were loyal and were proud of it.

Sending these people a check in the mail might keep them from literally dying, but it won't Let Them Live. These people want want to go Do Something. They want to be useful. They want to have co-workers they can laugh with and managers to bitch about. They want to count down the days until that vacation. They want to feel proud again.

The Democratic Party switches between ignoring these people and sneering at them for their silly, backward, uneducated ways. The GOP tells them "We can't fix this but I swear those idiots broke it, and I'll go punch 'em in the nose for ya!" Maybe 10 years ago when the factory closed down they weren't susceptible to that message, but after 10 years of no jobs and watching their town fall apart and their buddy's suicide and the divorce and their kids fleeing for the loving hills they're god drat angry. And you know what? They have every loving right to be angry, because they were loyal and they worked hard and in exchange the capitalist class sold them the gently caress out so some loving CFO could watch his loving numbers tick up a hair.

We can 100% offer solutions to this as a party without sacrificing a single god drat thing. We can build green energy factories in these counties. We can build research centers in these counties. We can build healthcare centers in these counties. Take whatever liberal priority you can think of and we can build something here to help fix things nationally and help these people locally.

People are saying we just need to bump this group or that group's turnout levels back to Obama levels. Great! I do too! But here is something we can do in addition to that! Here is something that helps people who have been savaged by the capitalist class and helps fight global warming or helps advance research or helps improve healthcare in this county. Why the gently caress wouldn't we want to do this?

Amen.
Jesus loving christ capitalism.
We are fed thus crock of poo poo that if we work hard and do a good job we will be rewarded. That we can't accept help or free hand outs because needing help and charity is weak and a sign of failure. We are told we must provide for ourselves and if our situation is poo poo we have to pull ourselves up by our bootstraps. But all that work hard and don't complain bootstraps bullshit did is create a labor class that was ripe for exploitation. That got underpaid for their work. And when their needs and costs started cutting into profit margins these people's loyalties were not rewarded. They were thrown to the loving wolves and abandoned while the companies they had loyally worked at for decades hosed off to China, or India, or Vietnam or Bangladesh or wherever so that they could make a bigger profit for themselves.

And Democrats told them they would help then and kept them on the line and strung them along and never really loving delivered and gently caress us. Now Trump is doing the same. And Trump is right to blame the establishment and blame the Democrats. But he's not right about blaming the Mexicans and the Muslims. They should not be angry at the people who are just as much victims of this flawed system as they are. This crab bucketing, this divisive tactic of divide and conquer is what is keeping Americans from creating real change. We're too busy squabbling and hating each other to focus on the people really at fault which is the rich elites, the corporations and our bought politicians who sold us out for their own profit and continue to bleed us dry.

We were so worried about corporate interests controlling the government but they always have and by voting in Trump we have handed the government over to corporate interests completely.

All because we were desperate for salvation.

gently caress capitalism.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:08

a messed up horse: Mar 11, 2014; by Nyc_Tattoo

Venom Snake posted:

Seriously it pisses me off when people suggest that we should lust for the days of when people died of ruined lungs and asbestos poisoning (but everyone had a job right?). We need to give these people a chance to enjoy the prosperity that others are getting to enjoy. Guaranteed minimum income. Programs to resettle people stuck in dead rural towns. Rebuilding of infrastructure. Bring them into the 21st Century; don't doom them to living in the 20th century forever.

Buddy? gently caress you.

e; Alright, in the spirit of being somewhat constructive instead of just angry, here's how that reads: "You've been watching your sons and daughters pack up and leave for the past 30 years, and we want to make that happen more quickly." Speaking as a person in the rust belt, I don't want my friends and family to leave. As baffling as it might sound, many of us living here like our homes, we like our neighbors, we love our families. Personally, I like the Great Lake I grew up on the shore of, I like the climate, I like the trees and the black squirrels and a whole host of other things about where I live. Someone who considers my home "flyover country" telling me they want to "resettle" me makes me see red, and tells me they don't actually give a gently caress about my life.

a messed up horse has issued a correction as of 17:39 on Nov 11, 2016

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:07

A GIANT PARSNIP: Apr 13, 2010; Too much fuckin' eggnog

TyrantWD posted:

As long as its a factory that makes the same widgets that the previous factory did. Trump is not promising these workers jobs in factories for the new economy - his appeal was promising to bring back the exact same types of jobs that were lost.

The Democrats can't, and shouldn't promise to bring back Carrier air conditioner factory jobs. A false promise of restoring old glory is always going to win out over a pledge to build some new kind of prosperity.

Everyone trying to figure out how to reach out to blue collar white voters in the rust belt is wasting their time. Trump has the winning message for them, and the Democratic Party is not going to top that. The winning formula for the Democrats is to attract white, college educated voters - who still favored Trump. They appeal to those voters far easier, and far more authentically, and trying to chase down the Trump base is only going to result in more failure.

Trump didn't offer them poo poo besides revenge. The problem is the Democratic Party offers them nothing at all. What would you do if you lost everything? If your jobs were gone, your town collapsed, your buddy killed himself, your wife divorced you, your kids are either embarrassed and fleeing or stuck in poo poo? What would you choose if one person offered nothing and another one offered revenge?

It costs us literally nothing to offer these people something else. Who the gently caress is going to stop voting Democratic because we went to small towns and promised to open up green energy factories or research centers or health clinics?

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:08

Thoguh: Nov 8, 2002; College Slice

DaveWoo posted:

A new DNC challenger approaches

https://twitter.com/jeneps/status/797105432074588160

Just like we all took a hard look at his hard abs. Save us MO'M.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:08

Hilario Baldness: Feb 10, 2005; Grimey Drawer

I mean a third party would be cool, but Sanders essentially just inherited a brand name product for the price of nothing at all.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:09

comingafteryouall: Aug 2, 2011

Thoguh posted:

Harry Reid can gently caress off.

Nobody bought the Trump is a russian plant thing Harry. You can stop talking about Vlad.

lol Harry Reid delivered the goods in his state. Don't blame him.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:09

Sheng-Ji Yang: Mar 5, 2014

DaveWoo posted:

A new DNC challenger approaches

https://twitter.com/jeneps/status/797105432074588160

gently caress off mom

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:09

Thoguh: Nov 8, 2002; College Slice

Peel posted:

that's uh, not the main thrust of that statement

No, but he couldn't help to bring it up.

He can still gently caress off though. He was part of the group that did everything the possibly could to bury Bernie and hold up Hillary.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:11

A GIANT PARSNIP: Apr 13, 2010; Too much fuckin' eggnog

I mean for gently caress's sake these people were savaged by the capitalist class and now desperately need help. Aren't these the people the Democratic Party are supposed to help?

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:11

DaveWoo: Aug 14, 2004; Fun Shoe

Hilario Baldness posted:

I mean a third party would be cool, but Sanders essentially just inherited a brand name product for the price of nothing at all.

Brand's kinda tarnished, tho

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:11

Fast Luck: Feb 2, 1988

Thoguh posted:

Harry Reid can gently caress off.

Nobody bought the Trump is a russian plant thing Harry. You can stop talking about Vlad.

In fact most people wanted us to work with Russia. And Hillary spent months beating the cold war drum anyway. The margins in favor of working with Russia were massive landslide margins
https://twitter.com/immolations/status/796751694763790339

Talk about counterproductive. She could have been spending that time actually ranting about billionaihs from Wall Street or you know anything positive for once but chose this instead

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:12

comingafteryouall: Aug 2, 2011

DaveWoo posted:

A new DNC challenger approaches

https://twitter.com/jeneps/status/797105432074588160

Martin O'Malley can gently caress off

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:12

Zikan: Feb 29, 2004

jesus if O'Malley is running, that means multiple establishment candidates. the fact that they couldn't get schumer is still hopeful because to give you an idea of how much of a clintonite schumer is

this was in october

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:12

Modus Pwnens: Dec 29, 2004

That's a great statement from Harry Reid.

I strongly agree with a lot in this thread, that an actual economic vision is needed rather than a shaming-based campaign, and that the failings of the DNC and Third Wayism are many, but neither should we ignore the pain and fear a lot of vulnerable groups are feeling right now. To deny racism and sexism and authoritarianism would be as grave a mistake as was focusing entirely on them. Let's not replace one bubble with another.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:15

Typo: Aug 19, 2009; Chernigov Military Aviation Lyceum
The Fighting Slowpokes

DaveWoo posted:

Brand's kinda tarnished, tho

only in the same sense that coca cola got tarnished after new coke

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:14

Strep Vote: May 5, 2004; أنا أحب حليب الشوكولاتة

I'm like 11 pages behind but given the attitudes from the Democratic voters in this thread, we probably have a better chance of turning the Republican party into the socialist party. We just won't call it socialism.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:15

HannibalBarca: Sep 11, 2016; History shows, again and again, how nature points out the folly of man.

I learned a very hard lesson earlier this year that nothing good ever comes from Maryland and, as such, I will do everything in my power to stop Martin O'Malley from making us all have to learn it.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:15

Zikan: Feb 29, 2004

Thoguh posted:

No, but he couldn't help to bring it up.

He can still gently caress off though. He was part of the group that did everything the possibly could to bury Bernie and hold up Hillary.

reid knows how to build a machine to turnout voters that isn't smoke and mirror's like robby mook's failure and owed his seat to organized labor. nevada is literally the only bright spot for organized labor in the country because the dems there did not poo poo on it. he can be utilized after pennance is done to push things like support for organized labor that isn't bullshit.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:17

A GIANT PARSNIP: Apr 13, 2010; Too much fuckin' eggnog

Modus Pwnens posted:

That's a great statement from Harry Reid.

I strongly agree with a lot in this thread, that an actual economic vision is needed rather than a shaming-based campaign, and that the failings of the DNC and Third Wayism are many, but neither should we ignore the pain and fear a lot of vulnerable groups are feeling right now. To deny racism and sexism and authoritarianism would be as grave a mistake as was focusing entirely on them. Let's not replace one bubble with another.

"The Democratic Party fights for social and economic justice for All Americans. We'll fight like hell for citizens who face legal and social discrimination every moment of their lives, and we'll fight like hell to bring opportunity back to hard working Americans who were sold out."

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:19

Al!: Apr 2, 2010

A GIANT PARSNIP posted:

"The Democratic Party fights for social and economic justice for All Americans. We'll fight like hell for citizens who face legal and social discrimination every moment of their lives, and we'll fight like hell to bring opportunity back to hard working Americans who were sold out."

sounds like a bunch of sjws to me

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:20

mrmcd: Feb 22, 2003; Pictured: The only good cop (a fictional one).

Oh another crazy prediction:

I think Blutah 2020 will be a thing, as the Harry Reid / Ken Jennings faction of Mormons get a new revelation through to finally give up on bothering gentiles about abortion and go back to their socialism and public works economic roots. Plus they get to join the coalition reshaping the western states around them that hasn't threatened to literally commit genocide against them in the last election. If you had put McMuffin's votes in the D column it would've happened this year.

Also they are totally going to legalize weed, because they're quickly becoming surrounded by states with nice mountain resorts and legal weed, tourism is a huge part of their economy, and the drop in ski business is already starting to spook them, from what I hear.

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:21

Peel: Dec 3, 2007

Zikan posted:

jesus if O'Malley is running, that means multiple establishment candidates. the fact that they couldn't get schumer is still hopeful because to give you an idea of how much of a clintonite schumer is

this was in october

holy lol

decently-off suburban republicans aren't going to vote for the party of blm dude

we talk about getting back white working class voters not because that's trump's or the republicans' mainstay but because it's the only part of it theoretically winnable

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:21

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# ? May 9, 2024 21:16

R. Guyovich: Dec 25, 1991

Phi230 posted:

We just got poo poo on by a loud lunatic

we are the mensheviks again except more poo poo like Kadets

time to be less Kerensky and more Lenin

goddamn right

# ? Nov 11, 2016 17:29

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > C-SPAM > SUK ZONE: it's all a pointless exercise and you're just screaming into the void

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