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Poll: Who Should Be Leader of HM Most Loyal Opposition? This poll is closed. |
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| Jeremy Corbyn |
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95 | 18.63% |
| Dennis Skinner |
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53 | 10.39% |
| Angus Robertson |
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20 | 3.92% |
| Tim Farron |
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9 | 1.76% |
| Paul Ukips |
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7 | 1.37% |
| Robot Lenin |
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105 | 20.59% |
| Tony Blair |
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28 | 5.49% |
| Pissflaps |
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193 | 37.84% |
| Total: | 510 votes | ||
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It seems our working class has the opposite issue to the US's. In America, everyone is a temporarily embarrassed millionaire, and this produces negative political effects with voters giving rich people tax cuts because "one day i'll be them". In the UK the working class seems to have fallen into such despair that economics no longer matter. Stability no longer matters. They don't care about anything other than the brown people they might see in the street or that some nebulous job they could have got was taken by Schrodinger's immigrant. We have a working class so conscience of what their lot is that they have all become nihilists. It's not good.
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Mar 22, 2017 12:55
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jBrereton posted:Well since the whole thing is being done under a massive cloud of secrecy I suppose we'll just have to see what TTIP brings to the continent. Didn't both TTIP and CETA look to be dead as gently caress back in late 2016?
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Mar 22, 2017 12:56
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Pissflaps posted:Are you sure you're not thinking of the word cloud created from focus groups conducted with ex labour supporters about why they were no longer going to vote labour? And it had CORBYN in massive letters right in the middle? Get a dream diary god
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Mar 22, 2017 13:00
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Breath Ray posted:These aren't so different. Opposition to immigration often boils down to the economy if you think about it Yes. They're worried about the economy 
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Mar 22, 2017 13:01
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Wasn't TTIP one of the first things The Donald scrapped?
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Mar 22, 2017 13:01
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https://twitter.com/YouGov/status/844508955166552065
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Mar 22, 2017 13:01
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Regarde Aduck posted:It seems our working class has the opposite issue to the US's. In America, everyone is a temporarily embarrassed millionaire, and this produces negative political effects with voters giving rich people tax cuts because "one day i'll be them". In the UK the working class seems to have fallen into such despair that economics no longer matter. Stability no longer matters. They don't care about anything other than the brown people they might see in the street or that some nebulous job they could have got was taken by Schrodinger's immigrant. We have a working class so conscience of what their lot is that they have all become nihilists. It's not good. Ah, the elusive Schrodinger's immigrant, the one where they are taking benefits, jobs, all the doctors appointments and the strangling our businesses with their own brand of ethic shops. But those word clouds, it's not about immigration!
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Mar 22, 2017 13:03
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Comrade Cheggorsky posted:I think there is some merit in the Labour Party embracing some sort of patriotism, people love that poo poo Yup. The notion that any party could attemp both to be unpatriotic and also to govern the country is absurd. It's not just wrong, it's absurd, it's facrcical. There is some kind of sick twisted belief that many fools cling on to that all patriotism or nationalism or pride in your country is bad, that a country shouldn't look out for itself first and foremost. It's broken-brained insanity, absolutely disconnected from how real people think and feel.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:04
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baka kaba posted:Get a dream diary god I don't understand this post.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:04
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Lord of the Llamas posted:Yes. They're worried about the economy I voted leave for impecxably lefty reasins! Graham Norton says the economy will be fine anyway
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Mar 22, 2017 13:06
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Zephro posted:Imagine you're a policeman wanting to do some dodgy, under-the-table hacking of those drat dirty Greenpeace types who, as well all know, are the single biggest threat this country faces. You could do it yourself, or you could do what everyone else is doing and outsource that poo poo to India: 
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Mar 22, 2017 13:07
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Breath Ray posted:I voted leave for impecxably lefty reasins! Graham Norton says the economy will be fine anyway Mate, you made a typo. It's spelled raisins. Oberleutnant posted:IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE YOU HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR This country is great.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:09
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hakimashou posted:Yup. The notion that any party could attemp both to be unpatriotic and also to govern the country is absurd. It's not just wrong, it's absurd, it's facrcical. You think that genocide is fine if it works, so I'm happy to disagree with you on this. Nationalism is a disease and the sooner we're rid of it, the better. Also, go gently caress yourself.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:10
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Oberleutnant posted:IF YOU HAVE NOTHING TO HIDE YOU HAVE NOTHING TO FEAR
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Mar 22, 2017 13:19
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Breath Ray posted:I voted leave for impecxably lefty reasins! Graham Norton says the economy will be fine anyway Don't be mean.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:19
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I can't get enough of are Dan
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Lord of the Llamas posted:Yes. They're worried about the economy They did though, since they've been told over and over immigrants are the reason they're unemployed.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:34
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hakimashou posted:There is some kind of sick twisted belief that many fools cling on to that all patriotism or nationalism or pride in your country is bad, that a country shouldn't look out for itself first and foremost. It's broken-brained insanity, absolutely disconnected from how real people think and feel. You are a sick and diseased man and you should seek help or the cleansing purity of self immolation. Nationalism is a disease and you my friend are just another metastasis.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:42
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goddamnedtwisto posted:Well we're talking about ridiculous security theatre in Western nations, so may as well keep it on those terms. See also the restrictions on liquids, put in place 20 years after the Bojinka plot first attempted to use liquid explosives on a plane. Nobody gave a poo poo about it until they planned trying it on a flight from the UK. I once sat in, more or less by accident, on a round table discussion of active security measures for passenger flights, with reps from BA, BAE, Boeing, Airbus and so on. And it was pretty horrifying, in the way that conversations often are when companies are literally discussing how much money they'd be willing to invest per life potentially saved, weighed up against the potential for lawsuits and lost revenue. But I recall that they were discussing SAM countermeasures, and said basically that it wasn't worth it, way too expensive, it would never happen until a passenger plane was actually brought down by one. Then some poor naif in the audience went, well what about that Malaysian flight that went down with a bunch of Dutch people on board. And the panel chair just shook his head and explained as though to a child, that happened over Ukraine, that doesn't count. It would need to be like in takeoff from Heathrow or Charles de Gaulle or something. And all the rest of the panel nodded wisely in agreement. big scary monsters fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Mar 22, 2017 |
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Mar 22, 2017 13:45
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The last page is a p.good example of what Mark Blyth talks about here: http://www.readcube.com/articles/10...iogDvuklQ%3D%3D quote:The racism diagnosis as a “convenient truth”? In this article he also trashed the stats people have brought out to support culture over economics argument.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:49
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Party Boat posted:Does anyone fancy a job as a liaison between Corbyn and the PLP? I am applying to this job, possibly multiple times. Breath Ray posted:These aren't so different. Opposition to immigration often boils down to the economy if you think about it yes. Opposition ot immigration is opposition to having an economy. This does not explain why they voted leave, though? Pissflaps posted:https://twitter.com/make_trouble/status/844512043646496768 there are some very serious issues here, I see very little common ground between the concerns of remain and the concerns of leave, I see very little common ground between the concerns of leave and reality. The anti-reality side won. I don't see this as being a hard problem to fix provided the government and media are in full cooperation to start rush training a new breed of journalist base and the media agree to walk lockstep in line with reality and the material concerns of the population.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:50
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why is may so in love with grammar schools despite everyone else being against them?
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Mar 22, 2017 13:50
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Jose posted:why is may so in love with grammar schools despite everyone else being against them? rhymes with milk snatcher e; it'd be real great fun to get hold of some tory spads and ask just how good their drugs are and why May needs to be a thatcher-churchill robot hybrit at all times. More fun to beat them up and take their drugs though. Spangly A fucked around with this message at 13:54 on Mar 22, 2017 |
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Mar 22, 2017 13:52
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Jose posted:why is may so in love with grammar schools despite everyone else being against them? Tory.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:52
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Barry Foster posted:Tory. even most of them seem to think they're a bad idea at least politically
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Mar 22, 2017 13:55
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Barry Foster posted:Tory. but it appeals to a certain hardcore section of the population, a lot of whom had drifted to UKIP.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:56
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big scary monsters posted:I once sat in, more or less by accident, on a round table discussion of active security measures for passenger flights, with reps from BA, BAE, Boeing, Airbus and so on. And it was pretty horrifying, in the way that conversations often are when companies are literally discussing how much money they'd be willing to invest per life potentially saved, weighed up against the potential for lawsuits and lost revenue. Are you sure they weren't referring to the fact that MH17 was brought down from 33000ft over a known conflict zone? It's not really comparable to someone having a punt with a soviet-era manpad near a western airport is it.
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Mar 22, 2017 13:58
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Ken Livingstone threatening to take Labour to judicial review in the same interview as complaining certain MPs are "damaging the Labour party" is an interesting contrast. did he lose self-awareness along with gaining his Nazi obsession?
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Mar 22, 2017 13:58
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Cerv posted:Ken Livingstone threatening to take Labour to judicial review in the same interview as complaining certain MPs are "damaging the Labour party" is an interesting contrast. did he lose self-awareness along with gaining his Nazi obsession? I am not sure that Ken has ever been particularly endowed with much in the way of self-awareness unfortunately.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:02
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Jose posted:why is may so in love with grammar schools despite everyone else being against them? to approach it from a more human side (May is definitely a bog standard waste of a fetus rather than one of the policywanker lizards like her cohorts), she went to one, it was great, why can't children have great education. I think this most showed through with her atrocious PMQs against corbyn on the matter; she's never researched it, she just feels it. She doesn't even know the approval. She tried to argue that corbyn was taking away priveleges and here you see that's she's genuinely operating on the politics/economics zero sum game model. I honestly believe her when she defends grammar schools as being good. I really feel she thinks they add something to society. Because she somehow appears to seriously believe that without grammar schools, all the other schools would be poo poo forever, without higher standards to compete. Eton always gets the same defence of "raising the bar" rather than the more accurate "hitting the poor with the bar and holding them down". May thinks poors are stupid and there's nothing broken in normal education that needs fixing, and that grammar schools need to be allowed freedom to develop their special talents. I went to a catholic primary, a CoE grammar that turned into an academy after I left, and briefly, a state-sponsored private school. The money and standards disparity were huge; the private school was filthy,nearly a quarter of the staff plainly weren't fit to teach (including the chem teacher that taught basic explosives), they had advance prep for OFSTED and would spend the day arranging "talent"and giving some of us the day off, and lessons were absolutely nothing more than exam prep. I don't mean studying, we hosed about doing drama and music and weird extracurrricular poo poo and then when it was crunch time the teachers would dictate our entire coursework and prepare cheatsheets for exams. Grammars and Private education must be abolished as a matter of course; there is only one fit standard for what is best for children, and that is whatever we can determine with evidence is best for children.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:04
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big scary monsters posted:I once sat in, more or less by accident, on a round table discussion of active security measures for passenger flights, with reps from BA, BAE, Boeing, Airbus and so on. And it was pretty horrifying, in the way that conversations often are when companies are literally discussing how much money they'd be willing to invest per life potentially saved, weighed up against the potential for lawsuits and lost revenue. Even in an ideal anarcho-communist society you'd have to draw some quantitative value on lives lost if you wanted to have planes, even if that was measured in labor-hours or communal resource partitions or whatever replacement for capital was concocted. The main advantage of such a setup is that you'd in theory have more to invest because in safety because there wouldn't be a chunk marked 'capital returns' siphoned off for profit, and you could adopt a more scientific approach to what you protect against (how likely is this to happen vs. how likely will people go with a competitor) but you're still going to have to draw a line where you say that the plane or bathroom or road junction is about safe enough. Cerv posted:most of her Tory colleagues are against them too.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:06
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Even May's people seem to be aware Grammar schools are bad politically as they briefed a whole bunch of stuff after the budget about how she didn't think it was the issue for now. She somehow manages to be able to talk out of both sides of her mouth on this and no one holds her to account for it.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:07
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His Divine Shadow posted:The last page is a p.good example of what Mark Blyth talks about here: So, so this.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:09
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Guavanaut posted:In any situation you have to do that though. If you went with the position of some pro-life philosophers that a life has infinite and unknowable value, you wouldn't have aircraft. Or bathrooms. Yeah I realise that and of course intellectually I knew that these kinds of calculations must take place. But it's still quite another thing to be sat in a room and there's some guy going "well our 737 carries X number of people, expected legal liability per fatality $Y, so we're willing to spend $Z per plane on improving security this year".
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Mar 22, 2017 14:35
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Piers Morgan is apparently to shut up on Twitter for charity. I will pay £10,000 if he takes he takes a rope and hangs himself. Is he up for that?
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Mar 22, 2017 14:40
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Cerv posted:Ken Livingstone threatening to take Labour to judicial review in the same interview as complaining certain MPs are "damaging the Labour party" is an interesting contrast. did he lose self-awareness along with gaining his Nazi obsession? Well, as the saying goes, it takes one to know one.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:54
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His Divine Shadow posted:The last page is a p.good example of what Mark Blyth talks about here: On the other hand, voting to leave the EU doesn't do anything about inequality or unemployment, so I'm not especially convinced that people who did so aren't actually just racist and/or stupid?
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Mar 22, 2017 14:54
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big scary monsters posted:Yeah I realise that and of course intellectually I knew that these kinds of calculations must take place. But it's still quite another thing to be sat in a room and there's some guy going "well our 737 carries X number of people, expected legal liability per fatality $Y, so we're willing to spend $Z per plane on improving security this year". It's an actual observed thing. WMain00 posted:Piers Morgan is apparently to shut up on Twitter for charity.
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Mar 22, 2017 14:59
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His Divine Shadow posted:The last page is a p.good example of what Mark Blyth talks about here: It seems to me that there's always going to be ~15% of the population that are hard core Culture >> Economics on either side and then the Economics >> Culture people swing back and forth depending on the economy and what side the establishment are pushing.
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Mar 22, 2017 15:00
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goddamnedtwisto posted:There's a couple of different effects. At high speed, the hole will be enlarged by the fuselage peeling away in the airstream. At high altitude, the sheer force of air will enlarge the hole even further and if any loose item happens to block the hole thanks to the fluid hammer effect - all of the air is moving towards the hole, anything blocking that movement will suddenly be dealing with a much higher transient pressure - the effect is massively multiplied. This happened with Aloha Airlines Flight 243:
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Mar 22, 2017 15:20
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Guavanaut posted:That's why people don't trust actuaries, pragmatists, or moral philosophers. Actuarial science is a wonderful tool needed in many ways for the day to day running of societies. Actuaries are creepy motherfuckers with daddy issues who get paid to tell toyota how many negligent manslaughters they can afford this year. How do you control for disliking actuaries? it's the perfect job for any non-narcissist psychopath. People don't like those either.
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Mar 22, 2017 15:35
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