UKMT General Elextravaganza 2017: Lord Buckethead would have won

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > UKMT General Elextravaganza 2017: Lord Buckethead would have won

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What is the best flav... you all know what this question is: This poll is closed.
Labour	907	49.92%
Theresa May Team (Conservative)	48	2.64%
Liberal Democrats	31	1.71%
UKIP	13	0.72%
Plaid Cymru	25	1.38%
Green	22	1.21%
Scottish Socialist Party	12	0.66%
Scottish Conservative Party	1	0.06%
Scottish National Party	59	3.25%
Some Kind of Irish Unionist	4	0.22%
Alliance / Irish Nonsectarian	3	0.17%
Some Kind of Irish Nationalist	36	1.98%
Misc. Far Left Trots	35	1.93%
Misc. Far Right Fash	8	0.44%
Monster Raving Loony	49	2.70%
Space Navies Party	39	2.15%
Independent / Single Issue	2	0.11%
Can't Vote	188	10.35%
Won't Vote	8	0.44%
Spoiled Ballot	15	0.83%
Pissflaps	312	17.17%
Total:	1817 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

CptAwesome: Nov 2, 2005

CoolCab posted:

that is a really, really good leak. that's the political equivalent of an ex-girlfriend telling everyone you've got a gigantic cock- sure, it's embarrassing for a moment, but once that dust clears- is it all that bad?

can't say i agree with this allegory

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:00

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# ? May 22, 2024 08:42

jabby: Oct 27, 2010

JFairfax posted:

It was leaked to the political editor of the Mirror, it was def done by someone friendly to the corbyn campaign.

v. clever.

It was actually leaked to the Mirror and the Telegraph simultaneously.

Which does to be honest smack of someone friendly to the campaign trying to give themselves a bit of deniability. Someone hostile would probably just have leaked it to the Telegraph.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:00

RabidWeasel: Aug 4, 2007; Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!

Baron Corbyn posted:

yeah, I worry whether this might not actually be about Tim going off to stop the chemicals turning the frogs gay but setting up an Orange Booker to provide support for a minority Tory government that doesn't repulse half of its own MPs.

Another Con-Lib coalition would be the return of The Dark Timeline but at least it would almost certainly mean a soft Brexit (or the LDs give up every iota of their remaining credability which actually seems more likely tbh)

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:00

Collateral: Feb 17, 2010

namesake posted:

And yet swore off any coalition with Labour before this election and was part of the Tory-Lib Dem coalition cabinet meaning he's about as leftwing as Blair.

The old Labour party is not 100% of a progressive alliance.
Times change.

pumpinglemma posted:

Didn't he contribute to the Orange Book, though?

He did. Read some of what he has to say outside of that.

Another Person posted:

he said "as any lib dem can get"

let it sink in

Which is still further left than 60% of the PLP.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:01

namesake: Jun 19, 2006; "When I was a girl, around 12 or 13, I had a fantasy that I'd grow up to marry Captain Scarlet, but he'd be busy fighting the Mysterons so I'd cuckold him with the sexiest people I could think of - Nigel Mansell, Pat Sharp and Mr. Blobby."

Another Person posted:

he said "as any lib dem can get"

let it sink in

Despite having a powerful rightwing (Orange bookers, natch) the Lib Dem base has been about localism, meaning decent services and protecting civil liberties so I imagine in the past lots of Lib Dems could be described as left rather than New Labour left.

Hmmm, you know what? I've got no PMs but if anyone important sees this I'd like the Jammy gang tag too. Just hope it doesn't remove the amazing gift I've already gotten from Our Mysterious Benefactor.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:02

kustomkarkommando: Oct 22, 2012

Just lol if Vince Cable becomes leader imo

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:03

goddamnedtwisto: Dec 31, 2004; If you ask me about the mole people in the London Underground, I WILL be forced to kill you; Fun Shoe

SpaceCadetBob posted:

Once the fire reached the massive scale we see in the pictures, if it did penetrate the units from the outside, a sprinkler system would not have helped in any way.

On the other hand, the exterior fire could very well have not penetrated the building at all. It is quite possible that the interior fire and exterior fire were separate beasts. There was a fire somewhere in the middle east last year where a huge amount of exterior siding went up in flames, but the fire never penetrated the building and the interior was relatively undamaged. So one possible explanation of the fire is that it started inside the building and then spread separately throughout the interior floors while the fire on the exterior while visually terrifying may not have actually caused any real damage. In this case a sprinkler system would have slowed the interior fire spread and probably would have saved lives.

edit: Wow, my very first AV, thanks annon UKMT goon.

It was a hot night last night and most British houses don't have aircon, so their windows would have been open.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:04

EvilHawk: Sep 15, 2009; LIVARPOOL!

Klopp's 13pts clear thanks to video ref

The Lib Dems literally just fought an election on opposing the Tories plans for Brexit and basically anything else that they were proposing (presumably, I doubt anyone bothered reading their manifesto). There's no way they support the Tories in exchange for anything.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:06

ookiimarukochan: Apr 4, 2011

communism bitch posted:

Wow. I saw somebody upthread say it was council owned but privately managed and for some reason assumed it was social housing of some sort.

Right to buy works for flats as well as houses - and the flat in question had been on rightmove for ~6 months i.e. it was priced far too high (my cousin, who works in rentals, has said that the market in central London has been cold for at least a year as prices have become too unaffordable)

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:07

Verizian: Dec 18, 2004; The spiky one.

kustomkarkommando posted:

Just lol if Vince Cable becomes leader imo

Corbyn as PM, Tom Watson demoted to regulate the media and Cable-led Lib Dems offering confidence votes in exchange for an investigation into everything Rupert Murdoch has ever touched. Never underestimate the allure of revenge for centrists.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:09

Pershing: Feb 21, 2010; John "Black Jack" Pershing
Hard Fucking Core

SpaceCadetBob posted:

edit: Wow, my very first AV, thanks annon UKMT goon.

You're welcome. I read and enjoyed your fire safety posts.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:12

Lord of the Llamas: Jul 9, 2002; EULER'VE TO SEE IT VENN SOMEONE CALLS IT THE WRONG THING AND PROVOKES MY WRATH

https://twitter.com/PrisonPlanet/status/874650640215146496

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:13

Collateral: Feb 17, 2010

kustomkarkommando posted:

Just lol if Vince Cable becomes leader imo

The only other real candidates are Ed Davey and Jo Swinton. I don't mind a return to, say a nostalgia for, another Scottish Jo to lead the revival of the party.

You never know.

Local Lib Dems are positioned left of local Labour as popularity is purchasing power, and we* have very little credit.

*I rejoined after 7 years in a huff over 2010.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:13

Trickjaw: Jun 23, 2005; Nadie puede dar lo que no tiene

Where is your God now, Farron?

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:15

ultrabindu: Jan 28, 2009

https://twitter.com/hackneylad/status/875016195833032704

how much more miserable can this get?

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:17

AVeryLargeRadish: Aug 19, 2011; I LITERALLY DON'T KNOW HOW TO NOT BE A WEIRD SEXUAL CREEP ABOUT PREPUBESCENT ANIME GIRLS, READ ALL ABOUT IT HERE!!!

SpaceCadetBob posted:

This is the big question. If the fire did penetrate the building from the exterior siding repeatedly, then the line of questions would go like this.
1. Is the cladding material a huge fire risk to buildings? Did it undergo flame spread testing? Was it listed for fire retardant properties? Why the gently caress is it on the market if not.
2. If the material is legit, was it installed incorrectly? Does it need to have fire gaps or baffles at certain horizontal or vertical distances? If it wasn't installed correctly then there is negligence.

OTOH, if the exterior fire was kept separated from the interior fire, then the question is how did the fire hop floors. (my personal assumption is that even with 1 hour separations on the floor, you can pretty much assume the whole floor is toast if the Fire service doesn't respond quickly enough). Did the fire travel through a vertical chase that we old and just unnoticed during recent renovations, or was a new vertical chase created during renovations and not properly fire stopped. The former could potential be coughed up to ignorance, but the second would be direct negligence.

I'm guessing the cladding was not properly tested, not with the fire spreading across it so quickly as witnesses report, as far as I can tell it's a mix of aluminum and plastic which sounds like a potent cocktail with enough heat. I remember seeing a video of a "test" from some state in the US with terrible standards that basically involved taking a sample of the material and just putting a lighter to it for a couple minutes, no simulation testing or anything like that because of budget cuts.

Anyway, as far as this fire goes I'm coming at it from the angle of "What is the most slapdash, cheapest and quickest way to make these renovations?" and then you need to look for evidence of that sort of thing being done. One of the scenarios I came up with is the ducting for the central heating system not being sufficiently fireproofed and acting as a chimney to spread the fire between floors through the interfloor fire breaks. If the ducting was installed by cutting into the building from the outside while replacing the cladding and therefore right next to the cladding that could explain both the spread from floor to floor and the spread up the cladding.

I am not an architect or expert in any of this, just a random speculator, so take all of this with a giant grain of salt.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:20

dispatch_async: Nov 28, 2014; Imagine having the time to have played through 20 generations of one family in The Sims 2. Imagine making the original two members of that family Neil Buchanan and Cat Deeley. Imagine complaining to Maxis there was no technological progression. You've successfully imagined my life

https://twitter.com/johnharris1969/status/874997836592664576

Amazing.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:27

SpaceCadetBob: Dec 27, 2012

BBC now has a post saying that the refurb company has issued a revised statement. The original said the project met all safety standards, while the new one says that it met all regulations and was issued a CO from the building dept.

They shook.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:31

Junior G-man: Sep 15, 2004; Wrapped in a mystery, inside an enigma

dispatch_async posted:

Amazing.

That is loving glorious. "Please don't talk to people about their concerns, ever. It will put them off voting Tory. You may be tempted to interact, but please BEEP BOOP"

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:31

TheRat: Aug 30, 2006

CoolCab posted:

so, conspiracy theory time. the point at which the corbyn campaign stopped pathetically floundering and started making sudden and utterly unexpected gains was not the manifesto was published, but when the manifesto was leaked. this, which most people assumed was done by someone trying to sabotage corbyn, had a huge impact: first, it was adequately radical that it made the news: policies that were extreme one day were being discussed the next, even if it was in a "what an extreme idea!" context. second, it saved corbyn an embarrassing, in-fight laden conference on these radical proposals: he would have had to spend tons of his (virtually nonexistent) political capital to get these things passed: instead, they had to be passed, they had defacto been promised. people talked about them there had been commitariat think pieces digesting them, they were literally front page news.

that is a really, really good leak. that's the political equivalent of an ex-girlfriend telling everyone you've got a gigantic cock- sure, it's embarrassing for a moment, but once that dust clears- is it all that bad?

All the good poo poo started happening after James Schneider took over as chief of strategy or whatever his job is.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:32

Killed By Death: Jun 29, 2013

EvilHawk posted:

The Lib Dems literally just fought an election on opposing the Tories plans for Brexit and basically anything else that they were proposing (presumably, I doubt anyone bothered reading their manifesto). There's no way they support the Tories in exchange for anything.

Yeah but that was like a whole week ago, and it's the Lib Dems we're talking about here.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:37

TheRat: Aug 30, 2006

https://twitter.com/MayaGoodfellow/status/875058527676637184

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:38

jabby: Oct 27, 2010

ultrabindu posted:

https://twitter.com/hackneylad/status/875016195833032704

how much more miserable can this get?

Here's a statement from the boss of the company that manages the tower block, regarding whether they listened to residents crying out that their homes were death traps.

Robert Black posted:

We do listen, we have listened and that's what we're doing. We had no expectation this would happen, we are absolutely devastated by it.

At this stage I can listen to what people are saying but I don't have any information and therefore it's really difficult for me to comment. We will be working with the fire brigade and police.

'We listened to the people saying this place was a firetrap. We had no expectation that it would turn out to be a firetrap. We're devastated, this is such a surprise.'

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:39

Miftan: Mar 31, 2012; Terry knows what he can do with his bloody chocolate orange...

Not that I mind Owen Smith back in, but does he have anything to do with norn iron?

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:39

GEORGE W BUSHI: Jul 1, 2012

Of all the people to put back into the Shadow Cabinet, he picks Owen Smith lmao.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:40

Nothingtoseehere: Nov 11, 2010

It's a good choice, given it displays "look, I forgave a MP who ran against me for leadership!" while Owen Smith is the least threatening of the out-crowd at the moment.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:42

Red Oktober: May 24, 2006; wiggly eyes!

jabby posted:

It was actually leaked to the Mirror and the Telegraph simultaneously.

Which does to be honest smack of someone friendly to the campaign trying to give themselves a bit of deniability. Someone hostile would probably just have leaked it to the Telegraph.

It's also great, because it allows the leak to be discussed for a week before you actually have to comment on it.

"We don't comment on leaks."

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:43

Sarah Bellum: Oct 21, 2008

Miftan posted:

Not that I mind Owen Smith back in, but does he have anything to do with norn iron?

It's honestly best if they (and SoS for NI) don''t. It's also a truly lovely task.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:44

Party Boat: Nov 1, 2007; where did that other dog come from

who is he

Miftan posted:

Not that I mind Owen Smith back in, but does he have anything to do with norn iron?

He was a spad to Paul Murphy when he was NI secretary so it seems like a decent brief.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:44

Miftan: Mar 31, 2012; Terry knows what he can do with his bloody chocolate orange...

Fair enough, hopefully he has actually repented and won't gently caress anything up for socialism

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:45

jabby: Oct 27, 2010

nothing to seehere posted:

It's a good choice, given it displays "look, I forgave a MP who ran against me for leadership!" while Owen Smith is the least threatening of the out-crowd at the moment.

Yup. Smith is clearly not a Corbynista, so it shows 'reaching out'. But he's already neutered himself by running for the leadership and being defeated, so he poses no real threat. Anyone else Corbyn promoted could potentially use the position to challenge him in the future.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:46

ThomasPaine: Feb 4, 2009; We have no compassion and we ask no compassion from you. When our turn comes, we shall not make excuses for the terror.

Baron Corbyn posted:

Of all the people to put back into the Shadow Cabinet, he picks Owen Smith lmao.

For a job it's looking increasingly impossible not to gently caress up. Hilarious.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:47

JFairfax: Oct 23, 2008; by FactsAreUseless

Smith was very polite and respectful of Corbyn after the results came in and seemed to be all aboard the Corbyn train.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:47

StoicFnord: Jul 27, 2012; "If you want to make enemies....try to change something."; College Slice

Posted this in the election thread, but relevant :

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UN3e-aYUusc

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:48

Malcolm XML: Aug 8, 2009; I always knew it would end like ｔｈｉｓ．

namesake posted:

For a kindly pacifist Corbyn is really good at putting his rivals in the ground.

Beware of an old man in a profession where men usually die young.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:53

Regarde Aduck: Oct 19, 2012; c l o u d k i t t e n; Grimey Drawer

Baron Corbyn posted:

yeah, I worry whether this might not actually be about Tim going off to stop the chemicals turning the frogs gay but setting up an Orange Booker to provide support for a minority Tory government that doesn't repulse half of its own MPs.

It does seem to be fitting together nicely for another Comdem Coalition.

Baron Corbyn posted:

Of all the people to put back into the Shadow Cabinet, he picks Owen Smith lmao.

I think Owen Smith means well. He's just a boring non entity. As opposed to someone like Hillary Benn who is a piece of poo poo.

Regarde Aduck fucked around with this message at 19:58 on Jun 14, 2017

# ? Jun 14, 2017 19:55

Camrath: Mar 19, 2004; The UKMT Fudge Baron

Regarde Aduck posted:

It does seem to be fitting together nicely for another Comdem Coalition.

I think Owen Smith means well. He's just a boring non entity. As opposed to someone like Hillary Benn who is a piece of poo poo.

If the libdems do go condem again, it will be their suicide note for good. Especially with the way the mood is now swinging.

# ? Jun 14, 2017 20:05