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Neo Rasa posted:I didn't say "realistic," I said being able to sell the fight in the heat of the moment, there's a huge difference (BrianWilly's other examples from BvS and Wonder Woman are actually a very good examples). No they aren't simply because they are not explained well by BrianWIlly. How do you sell a fight in the heat of the moment? Does this mean character motivation? Impact of the hits? how it flows?
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Jun 28, 2017 20:19
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BrianWilly posted:I would place the freeway -> busy street -> Steve vs Bucky fight in Cap: Winter Solder above the BvS warehouse scene, though it's not truly a fair contest since the Winter Soldier one is more like multiple different scenes chained together really well. The BvS scene has a bit more clarity overall, but suffers a bit from the same issue as all the other Batman films where he, like, clearly isn't able to use his full bodily range of motion. BrianWilly posted:It's many orders of magnitude better than the Nolan fights, mind you. They mostly make it work in BvS by sticking with the close-in, elbows tight, hunkered fistfighting that works for an armored combatant, but there are still various moments where maybe blows just a fraction longer to land or his joints bend just a few degrees less than they should. Tiny bits like that can make a huge difference, especially when they stack up over time, and makes it seem clear, to me at least, that the suit is still hindering him more than it isn't. The Cap/Bucky fight looks good if you don't mind that Bourne Identity style of choreography where the director employs many, many cuts of very close shots to disguise the actor's lack of skill. The Nolan fights really suffered from all that Keysi bullshit--you could tell that, aside from his costume being heavy as sin, Bale wasn't really comfortable with it. There are times when you see another henchman in frame clearly waiting for his "turn" to attack Bale like Jim Kelly in Hot Potato. I think the BvS fight worked well in large part because the choreographers are guys whose experience is in karate and kickboxing, instead of the trend in Filipino arts that's been a trend for the past several years. It's true that everything is slower, more visible, with more blocking (and no head movement) compared to real fighters, but that's normal for movies. Chuck Norris made sure you could see everything he was doing, too.
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Jun 28, 2017 20:19
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Snowman_McK posted:I've watched the scene a fair few times, and I still have no idea what you mean. Don't suppose you could show us a gif. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=klidfZG9oZQ
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Jun 28, 2017 20:40
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Davros1 posted:Do you think people are fighting for real in movies? Look at that linked clip - what "story" are these two athletes telling? Don't make me bump the Foxcatcher thread! HUNDU THE BEAST GOD fucked around with this message at 21:31 on Jun 28, 2017 |
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Jun 28, 2017 21:26
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MacheteZombie posted:He needs a crew called "The Tolerant Left" Which results in a babyface turn of The Tolerant Left kicking the poo poo out of him for selling out to The Man. "So much for the tolerant left!" he cries out, as they bury him and seize the bookings of production, finally putting the working man over wyoming posted:By not doing this. This could have all been one shot. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=79ditPebZ8g
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Jun 28, 2017 22:36
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Mr. Apollo posted:I think they mean the bit around 0:37 here. I knew the Wonder Woman scene he was referring to, but not the movements Batman shows off being restricted in. howe_sam posted:The salmon ladder is practically Arrow's signature training exercise at this point. Is that the one who looks like Lucy Lawless? Carrying on Arrow's tradition of only hiring actors and actresses who look like other, more famous people? Taintrunner posted:This could have all been one shot. I never really liked that scene. It's technically impressive, but you can see the seams, the way everyone has to telegraph their shots to allow Jaa a margin of error, or how you can almost sense everyone scurrying into position just off camera, or how Jaa walks really slowly to conserve energy. It's not even the best fight scene in the movie, but it's a great example of 'look what we can do' and it is impressive.
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Jun 29, 2017 01:11
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Snowman_McK posted:Is that the one who looks like Lucy Lawless? Carrying on Arrow's tradition of only hiring actors and actresses who look like other, more famous people? i have never thought that Black/White Canary actress (or any other actress in the show) looked anything remotely similar Lucy Lawless.
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Jun 29, 2017 05:25
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Maaaybe Katrina Law a little bit
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Jun 29, 2017 11:51
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Taintrunner posted:This could have all been one shot.
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Jun 29, 2017 12:50
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'one shot scenes' are quickly catching up to 'cast a wrestler' as the internet's favourite things to demand from film makers.
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Jun 29, 2017 13:05
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It would be better with practical effects.
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Jun 29, 2017 13:25
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HHH stars in Birdman, with effects by Harryhausen
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Jun 29, 2017 13:35
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Mr. Apollo posted:I think they mean the bit around 0:37 here. And at 0:59 you see a bullet deflected off of her greaves, which should settle the No Man's Land debate. And this is how you shoot action, point 7 especially: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z1PCtIaM_GQ
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Jun 29, 2017 14:30
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SleepCousinDeath posted:Wrestling is stupid and bad, yes. I'm sorry, I think you meant to post the time that Robocop showed up. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JcLlxXqKCRE
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Jun 29, 2017 14:49
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well why not posted:HHH stars in Birdman, with effects by Harryhausen Does he have to get stop motion scooby-doo off of drug charges?
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Jun 29, 2017 14:58
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mllaneza posted:And at 0:59 you see a bullet deflected off of her greaves, which should settle the No Man's Land debate.
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Jun 29, 2017 17:30
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Mr. Apollo posted:I was watching the No Man's Land bit again and you can see some bullets ricocheting off of them too.  
MariusLecter fucked around with this message at 19:19 on Jun 29, 2017 |
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Jun 29, 2017 19:16
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During the closing credits animation, you can also see where the bullets are hitting her shield and greaves. http://www.artofthetitle.com/title/wonder-woman/ 1:36-ish
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Jun 29, 2017 21:39
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So do directors just not use stunt doubles as much? They can make them look like the actors to have a less obvious transition if that's the problem.
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Jun 30, 2017 00:07
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well why not posted:'one shot scenes' are quickly catching up to 'cast a wrestler' as the internet's favourite things to demand from film makers. Until you realise that even the best extended take fight scenes are a shadow of the best ones that aren't.
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Jun 30, 2017 06:49
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Wrestling matches are done in a single take but no company in the world would present one in a single shot
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Jun 30, 2017 11:50
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I saw it last night and really enjoyed it. One thing that I really liked was that there was no hamfisted movie sexism where someone who very clearly is aware of the female superhero's abilities makes some crack about "lol women amirite" and then gets knocked down a peg by karma. Those always make me cringe. I also liked how Diana's naivety was portrayed - she was shown to clearly not be stupid, and the way she and Pine's characters had equal value in achieving their goals was well-handled. I also really dig the animation in Hyppolyta's flashback, that was rad. Will probably have more thoughts later, but that covers my initial takeaways. E: also I liked that Diana didn't have any angst about killing or her powers in general; that gets pretty tiresome in superhero origin stories. She's not a psycho murderer but she clearly doesn't have an issue with killing on the battlefield, which fits with her pseudo-greek cultural origin.
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Jun 30, 2017 19:51
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Agreeing with all of this. I've said some of this before but I was talking to some people at work about it today and they echoed a lot of the same feelings. When I saw it I kept expecting at least one of the characters to not want to follow her because she's a woman and to learn by the end of he movie that maybe women can be as competent as men. It was nice to see that all the guys very quickly realized she was an absolute bad rear end and that they were best suited to acting as support for her. Steve was never made the butt of jokes or teased about following her either. Sure Charlie and Sammy made some jokes about believing she was brought to life by Zeus and her destiny was to kill Ares but it was never about her being a woman. When ever Steve steeped in to try and shield Diana or strip her from doing something it was never because she was a woman, it was always for some sort of reason like jeopardizing the mission when she wanted to kill Ludendorff at the gala or fearing she was going to be mowed down by German machine guns. Both Diana and Steve were just allowed to exist as characters and work as a team without forcing tropes or stereotypes on them. Also, they still allowed her to be the hero without resorting to any macho stereotypes. She was allowed to be feminine and a sword swinging killer. I hate it when naive characters are portrayed as stupid. Diana's naivety and purity were some of her strengths. She had a very clear sense of right and wrong and was frustrated by all the compromises that men constantly made that resulted in inaction. It was nice to see that her innocence and purity to the realities of The World of Man wasn't portrayed with the creepy "virginal innocence" you sometimes get. She was trained from birth to be a warrior and grew up in a warrior culture. During the Doomsday fight in Batman v Superman she was the only one who seemed to be actually enjoying and relishing the battle. Batman and Superman both kept having to pull themselves back into the fight but every time Diana got knocked down she got right back up, shook herself off and charged back into the fight. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 23:03 on Jun 30, 2017 |
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Jun 30, 2017 23:00
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Wonder Woman passed the (domestic) gross of Batman v Superman as of yesterday.
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Jul 1, 2017 01:06
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Idahoant posted:Wonder Woman passed the (domestic) gross of Batman v Superman as of yesterday. Needs another 8 mil to catch it adjusted for inflation but that'll happen by the beginning of next week and possibly before the weekend Al Borland Corp. posted:Wrestling matches are done in a single take but no company in the world would present one in a single shot You can certainly do this with a filmed fight scene or wrestling, but you need to take cues from ballet or Chinese opera and it requires a heavy and considered stylization
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Jul 1, 2017 01:19
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Idahoant posted:Wonder Woman passed the (domestic) gross of Batman v Superman as of yesterday. Okay, now we're in for the long haul. It's already beat every DC film except Dark Knight and Dark Knight Rises on the homefront but if it can catch up to Guardians of the Galaxy Vol 2 (and it's steadily closing that gap day by day) then it might just have enough momentum left to breach the $400m barrier where it'll also have a shot at overtaking every Marvel film other than Avengers and Age of Ultron.  http://www.boxofficemojo.com/genres/chart/?id=superhero.htm
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Jul 1, 2017 01:31
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In the scene where Diana is fighting in the Veld center square, after she flips the armored car she's surrounded by Germans. She deflects some bullets and then we see one of the soldiers get shot. She turns to look and you see Steve appear over her shoulder and behind her shooting with his shotgun. Steve glances at her and then goes back to shooting but there's a slow motion focus on her looking at Steve. Why? She knows the squad was right behind her because she looked down at them as she was running across the rooftops. Is it supposed to be because he originally said "they're not there to save everyone" and now he's there with her trying to save everyone? It just seemed like she was surprised to see him. I also noticed that during that scene she's always in the foreground and Steve is behind her. I guess that is supposed to show that he has her back?
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Jul 2, 2017 00:42
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Mr. Apollo posted:In the scene where Diana is fighting in the Veld center square, after she flips the armored car she's surrounded by Germans. She deflects some bullets and then we see one of the soldiers get shot. She turns to look and you see Steve appear over her shoulder and behind her shooting with his shotgun. Steve glances at her and then goes back to shooting but there's a slow motion focus on her looking at Steve. Why? She knows the squad was right behind her because she looked down at them as she was running across the rooftops. Is it supposed to be because he originally said "they're not there to save everyone" and now he's there with her trying to save everyone? It just seemed like she was surprised to see him. I thought it was more smuggness. Like, "see? You DO want to save people."
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Jul 2, 2017 01:18
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spacetoaster posted:I thought it was more smuggness. Like, "see? You DO want to save people."
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Jul 2, 2017 01:23
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Mr. Apollo posted:Hmm, yeah maybe. Thinking about it again, it's not an expression of surprise; she just stares at him. Was that scene before she had the realization that people are more complex than just "Ares is controlling them!"? Perhaps she was thinking her beliefs were being justified. *edit* I know that WW was a great movie, and I loved it. But I got some perspective by watching suicide squad again last night. Holy cow that movie sucks more every time you watch it. So bad. I don't know who all had a hand in WW, but DC better make sure they keep them around. And SS also tried the whole "sex sells" angle with constant focus on Margot Robbie's rear end and Will Smith's bare chest. It was so over the top retarded. And so was the dialog. And the plot. spacetoaster fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jul 2, 2017 |
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Jul 2, 2017 01:26
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You could read a lot into that scene and I think that was intentional. I also felt it communicated that theyre having some bonding through battle. WW isnt just fighting as a lone warrior shes fighting with soldiers in combat like the amazons did on the beach in act one. They even cap the action with the whole gang setting her up for aunt Antiope's Shield Maneuver. 
MariusLecter fucked around with this message at 02:04 on Jul 2, 2017 |
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Jul 2, 2017 02:01
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spacetoaster posted:Was that scene before she had the realization that people are more complex than just "Ares is controlling them!"? Yeah SS was lousy. I know people are surprised that it had a larger budget than WW but I'm wondering how much salaries contributes to that.
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Jul 2, 2017 02:32
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Mr. Apollo posted:Yeah SS was lousy. I know people are surprised that it had a larger budget than WW but I'm wondering how much salaries contributes to that. Suicide Squad's production budget was $26 million larger than Wonder Woman and according to the sites I just googled Will Smith was paid $20m and Jared Leto was paid $7m. They weren't sure what the other cast members were paid but I'm guessing that the guy who played Slipknot wasn't paid very much. 
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Jul 2, 2017 02:45
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MariusLecter posted:You could read a lot into that scene and I think that was intentional. There's a another scene in No Man's Land just prior to this when she's pinned down and Steve and the team come and offer support to help clear the path for her. There's several back and forth looks exchanged and you get a sense of "we're here for you" being communicated. I think the scene later when Diana and Steve are sitting at the fountain he says "You did this" and Diana responds with "We did" emphasizes this. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 03:29 on Jul 2, 2017 |
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Jul 2, 2017 02:47
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I read the scene as Diana recognizing that Steve truly is an honorable man, fighting for those who can't fight for themselves. Like he earned brownie points with her by killing bad guys 
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Jul 2, 2017 07:24
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Yeah I think that was part of it too. It just focused on the two of them fighting. I'm sure the rest of the squad was fighting too but I think it was about the relationship and bonding between the two of them.
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Jul 2, 2017 07:40
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I like how there wasn't really contrived bickering or fighting among the crew, that was nice. They had good chemistry. I was waiting to cringe at the Native American guy but his dialogue was good even if his costume wasn't very subtle.
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Jul 2, 2017 15:07
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And the actor made his own costume
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Jul 2, 2017 15:12
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MariusLecter posted:I also felt it communicated that theyre having some bonding through battle. WW isnt just fighting as a lone warrior shes fighting with soldiers in combat like the amazons did on the beach in act one. They even cap the action with the whole gang setting her up for aunt Antiope's Shield Maneuver. In Veld she's again fighting Germans but this time as Wonder Woman and she experiences her greatest triumph when she liberates the village and all the residents thank her.
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Jul 2, 2017 23:00
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Ok, the news is saying we'll get the bluray/dvd in August. I want to see the deleted scenes. I'm also really interested in the director's commentary.
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Jul 2, 2017 23:13
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