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Mill Village posted:Games get printed a month or so before release so developers keep working on it, hence a patch at release. Also games are very complicated so things need to be patched. While that is a fair assessment I take issue with the fact that some games are released with major areas of content missing (FF15 as the example).
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Jul 17, 2017 15:43
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NikkolasKing posted:So, as I bought FFXII HD, now seems like a good time to go back and try to finish FFVI for the first time. (I don't get my brain, either) I might have been inspired by the earlier talk of "what? You played a game for several hours an didn't like it? Play it some more!" I really feel like there must be esomething here I am not appreciating and if I just keep at it, I'll see it. Sabin's playstyle is 100% based around Street Fighter commands and Setzer is pretty fun with the slots Also equip Locke with Offering and Genji Glove and use Steal for maximum stealiness
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Jul 17, 2017 15:45
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Emron posted:I'm playing through Zodiac Age and never played the original, so I have a few questions: You absolutely can't gently caress yourself with classes unless you do something weird like 6 machinists. Don't stress. No way to prioritize stealing gambits, short of turning gambits off and manually stealing. Sell all enemy drops except the Giant Serpentskin (that gets used for a quest) and Teleport Stones.
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Jul 17, 2017 15:50
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Vargatron posted:Isn't the whole patch after release mentality the order of the day with AAA devs? It seems to me that every game gets a day one patch of some sort right out of the gate. that's not at all comparable with how hosed ff15 was
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Jul 17, 2017 15:52
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corn in the bible posted:that's not at all comparable with how hosed ff15 was Which was delayed specifically to avoid a Day One Patch (which it still had, was gigantic, and mostly added enormous supplementary material cutscenes interspersed with actual necessary gameplay adjustments) So like can you imagine what would have happened if XV had come out when it was supposed to
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Jul 17, 2017 15:56
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exquisite tea posted:You can see why amnesia + brainwashing is such a common trope among FF protagonists because they look like total dumbasses otherwise. I mean, the most obvious protagonist where that wasn't the case was Lightning so they tried to deal with all those random factoids with the codex and everyone hated it. FFXV was able to get away with more exposition because a lot of questions could be asked because "we're dumb sheltered teenagers from the city" Mass Effect does somewhat of the same thing with a codex and I never heard nearly as many complaints about it, but perhaps it's the balance of what people feel is important information in the FNC codices that is the problem. Oxxidation posted:I compare this whining to Tabata's extremely specific and to-the-point discussion of FFXV's design process and I come away unimpressed. I can understand why he's a bit frustrated, but it really just changes the story from "Delays are all Nomura's fault" to "Delays are mostly Nomura's fault". A more competent producer would have worked around the staffing issues rather than shrugging. Mill Village posted:Games get printed a month or so before release so developers keep working on it, hence a patch at release. Also games are very complicated so things need to be patched. It's actually a neat thing to me that there are few pieces of software that need to integrate so many different systems with real time or near real time processing in as solid a way as most AAA video games.
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Jul 17, 2017 15:59
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Emron posted:I'm playing through Zodiac Age and never played the original, so I have a few questions: Sell drops except teleport stones and that one rare thing that's needed for the quest to re-unlock barheim passage
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Jul 17, 2017 16:01
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So what happens if I've sold the serpentskin?
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Jul 17, 2017 16:03
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Vargatron posted:So what happens if I've sold the serpentskin? You get a less good reward, nothing major
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Jul 17, 2017 16:05
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Kalenn Istarion posted:I mean, the most obvious protagonist where that wasn't the case was Lightning so they tried to deal with all those random factoids with the codex and everyone hated it. FFXV was able to get away with more exposition because a lot of questions could be asked because "we're dumb sheltered teenagers from the city" Mass Effect skirted around this in basically the same way that FFX did, by having humans be relative newcomers to the galactic stage and therefore making sense that the main character wouldn't already know about everything. I appreciated that FFXIII at least tried to get away from "the protagonist knows absolutely nothing" in its exposition although it could have been built up a little more gently.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:06
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Vargatron posted:So what happens if I've sold the serpentskin? You don't get a Golden Amulet, but you still get the key to Barheim Passage.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:09
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I somehow found a Golden Amulet in the Orville Yemen Sandsea. Where did I find it?
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Jul 17, 2017 16:11
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Selling stuff can screw you out of making bazaar stuff like the tournesol but only an actual crazy person would ever want to make the tournesol
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Jul 17, 2017 16:12
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Calaveron posted:I somehow found a Golden Amulet in the Orville Yemen Sandsea. Where did I find it? It's on one of the northern rigs, I think. corn in the bible posted:Selling stuff can screw you out of making bazaar stuff like the tournesol but only an actual crazy person would ever want to make the tournesol That was really only a problem in the original. Now you can just get poo poo from chests or from trial mode. Definitely not worth stressing about how you sell stuff anymore.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:13
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Kalenn Istarion posted:I mean, the most obvious protagonist where that wasn't the case was Lightning so they tried to deal with all those random factoids with the codex and everyone hated it. FFXV was able to get away with more exposition because a lot of questions could be asked because "we're dumb sheltered teenagers from the city" For me personally, it was the near total lack of explanation of XIII's cosmology that bugged me. Going into XIII-2, I doubt I was alone in not understanding anythng about Etro, Lindzei or the rest of it. In fact, XIII made it sound like the cosmology was "God made fal'Cie and humans and that's it."
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Jul 17, 2017 16:15
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corn in the bible posted:Selling stuff can screw you out of making bazaar stuff like the tournesol but only an actual crazy person would ever want to make the tournesol It doesn't actually screw you out of getting stuff, it will just be less efficient. Also I've made the tournesol twice and now will probably do it a third time, its kinda fun imo.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:28
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NikkolasKing posted:So, as I bought FFXII HD, now seems like a good time to go back and try to finish FFVI for the first time. (I don't get my brain, either) I might have been inspired by the earlier talk of "what? You played a game for several hours an didn't like it? Play it some more!" I really feel like there must be esomething here I am not appreciating and if I just keep at it, I'll see it. Combat is terrible, honestly. It's by far the easiest game in the series. Magic is crazy overpowered and everyone can use it except the Berserker character. Cyan is the worst character and even he can destroy the game with ease. People give you poo poo for liking difficulty mods but I'd seriously recommend something like Brave New World or another similar hack if you want to have fun with the gameplay.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:34
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Mega64 posted:Combat is terrible, honestly. It's by far the easiest game in the series. Magic is crazy overpowered and everyone can use it except the Berserker character. Cyan is the worst character and even he can destroy the game with ease. It's funny you should mention this, I was thinking of doing exactly that but from what I've read on here, BNW is more than a gameplay mod, it changes the story or script, too. For my first whole run of a game that is largely celebrated for its story and characters, I don't want to do that. Looking it up, there are a ton of FFVI hacks out there. I could probably maybe find one that is enjoyable but leaves the story intact like this FFVI HardType. There's also this one called Randomizer which sounds interesting but probably should be left for a second playthrough.
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Jul 17, 2017 16:52
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Tools mostly aren't great but by the end you'll just have a character casting Ultima five times every go and that's not much better really
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Jul 17, 2017 16:59
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Mega64 posted:Combat is terrible, honestly. It's by far the easiest game in the series. Magic is crazy overpowered and everyone can use it except the Berserker character. Cyan is the worst character and even he can destroy the game with ease. I'm not sure I'd call it the 'easiest' game by far when you have strong rivals like FFVIII the 'destroy nearly everything with physicals after 1/6th of the game' or FFX the RPS strategy.
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Jul 17, 2017 17:33
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ApplesandOranges posted:I'm not sure I'd call it the 'easiest' game by far when you have strong rivals like FFVIII the 'destroy nearly everything with physicals after 1/6th of the game' or FFX the RPS strategy. FFVIII or FFX require you to at least understand the mechanics a little to shatter the game. In FF6 you can trivialize huge chunks of the game with the default tools given to you which require no special effort. That's also ignoring that its highest damage potential is insane.I mean it's the game with Gau in it and Gau is probably in the top 3 most broken RPG characters of all time.
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Jul 17, 2017 17:35
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My friend and I were able to effortlessly beat FF6 over a couple weekends when we were 11 years old and I was even more of a gigantic idiot than I am now, there's no way it can't be dead simple.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:05
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any idiot can realize that if you just give the person who can cast ultima the thing that lets you cast four times at once then they'll win every fight, and that is indeed what happens
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Jul 17, 2017 18:07
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Brave New World is my favourite FF6 challenge hack but EvilType, despite its name, is also a great difficulty mod that doesn't make it crazy hard, just hard enough for it to be fun.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:23
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Does it alter the script, or just the gameplay?
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Jul 17, 2017 18:33
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ApplesandOranges posted:If you have someone else with a HP = 100% - Fira (or some other AoE ability) gambit, that'll usually soften all the enemies up to turn off Steal after the first attempt. Yeah, I was considering that. But it seems wonky to have to do AOE damage to get the steal guy to stop stealing. Gaming the system against itself. Seems like the gambit system should be capable of those things, and they could have done more on the PS2, but oh well. I'd rather just make the stealer the party leader rather than have somebody waste aoe damage when they could be focusing on the main target instead. I reserve AOE for situations with lots of monsters or weak monsters.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:36
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They added some dumb swearing that you can get a patch or an alternate version that takes it out but I didn't notice any huge changes in the script.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:36
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ImpAtom posted:FFVIII or FFX require you to at least understand the mechanics a little to shatter the game. In FF6 you can trivialize huge chunks of the game with the default tools given to you which require no special effort. I get that Gau has a high ceiling but he really isn't that great relative to other characters, because he requires non-trivial investment to become a literal death god as opposed to the most of the other characters, who require no investment whatsoever.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:43
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Kalenn Istarion posted:
LMAO you've never worked in software development before, have you? You sound like every pointy haired boss from Dilbert idiot manager I've ever worked with in the last 20 years of my corporate career. GJ being the epitome of the stereotypical entitled whiny gamer. 
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Jul 17, 2017 18:49
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Kalenn Istarion posted:I mean, the most obvious protagonist where that wasn't the case was Lightning so they tried to deal with all those random factoids with the codex and everyone hated it. FFXV was able to get away with more exposition because a lot of questions could be asked because "we're dumb sheltered teenagers from the city" Its how you do it and also what people expect from the game they're going into. Expectations are huge and really color your experience and I think publishers and marketing teams VASTLY gently caress up customer expectations of their game products and shoot themselves in the foot. (See Halo 5) The Dark Souls series did almost all its world-building with that style of 'codex entries' and literally everybody loved it and raved about it. But people expect different things from different games. Kalenn Istarion posted:I can understand why he's a bit frustrated, but it really just changes the story from "Delays are all Nomura's fault" to "Delays are mostly Nomura's fault". A more competent producer would have worked around the staffing issues rather than shrugging. lmao what Kalenn Istarion posted:It's actually a neat thing to me that there are few pieces of software that need to integrate so many different systems with real time or near real time processing in as solid a way as most AAA video games. again lmao what Games are cool but most games are held together by duct tape and pretty lovely compared to non-games software. Compare a final fantasy game to like, Google... or IBM's Watson.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:54
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dukerson posted:I get that Gau has a high ceiling but he really isn't that great relative to other characters, because he requires non-trivial investment to become a literal death god as opposed to the most of the other characters, who require no investment whatsoever. He doesn't though. Like honestly you can get Stray Cat as soon as you recruit Gau and Stray Cat alone would put him high up the list.
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Jul 17, 2017 18:57
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i think ff15 is better than 12
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Jul 17, 2017 19:00
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My problem with FF13's codex entries versus... well, pretty much any other game with them is that it gave me information on the characters mental states and how they felt about certain things happening in the plot. That bothers me because that should be character building done through the script and performance, not just vomited at me in a text file. I can understand the world building aspect, but if I feel like I don't understand plot points in a Final Fantasy game unless I read some codex entry, that's a problem.
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Jul 17, 2017 19:33
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Lucas Archer posted:My problem with FF13's codex entries versus... well, pretty much any other game with them is that it gave me information on the characters mental states and how they felt about certain things happening in the plot. That bothers me because that should be character building done through the script and performance, not just vomited at me in a text file. I can understand the world building aspect, but if I feel like I don't understand plot points in a Final Fantasy game unless I read some codex entry, that's a problem. 12 did the same thing. Good luck figuring out Gabranth's deal without the codex. It's worse since you have to defeat a certain number of some random enemy to get to the juicy parts.
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Jul 17, 2017 19:36
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Also souls games do it pretty good because the codex is just gears and items in short bursts that encourage you to piece it all together What's the codex like in the xiii games
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Jul 17, 2017 19:36
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corn in the bible posted:i think ff15 is better than 12 nobody cares tho
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Jul 17, 2017 19:38
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Renoistic posted:12 did the same thing. Good luck figuring out Gabranth's deal without the codex. It's worse since you have to defeat a certain number of some random enemy to get to the juicy parts. Eh? I never had to read the Codexes to understand Gabranth's character at all. It's pretty straightforward. His backstory with Basch and their homeland is mentioned pretty often in cutscenes.
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Jul 17, 2017 19:41
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The solution starting us in the face all along. Vaan and Penelo sound have been moogles.
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Jul 17, 2017 19:42
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whats the goon consensus on ff15 now that its been out for a whileKelp Me! posted:nobody cares tho i care
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Jul 17, 2017 19:43
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Consensus on Final Fantasy is impossible.
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Jul 17, 2017 19:44
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