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Gorelab posted:I honestly don't trust McFarlane to not end up in the Family Guy style comedy. It would be worse if it was closer to "A Million Ways to Die in the West", a comedy with no actual jokes in it.
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Jul 23, 2017 19:52
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Shibawanko posted:I don't even really give a poo poo about Spock or Kirk. The high point was TNG and DS9 but the remakers like to pretend those shows didn't exist. Which is really weird, at least for TNG, because TNG was super popular even if it hasnt become quite as much of a cultural juggernaut as TOS, and the generation that grew up with TNG are now adults with disposable income and kids of their own to introduce to Star Trek. Every single other TV show from the 80's and 90's is getting sequels and remakes, why not TNG?
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Jul 23, 2017 19:54
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Shibawanko posted:I don't even really give a poo poo about Spock or Kirk. The high point was TNG and DS9 but the remakers like to pretend those shows didn't exist. I know they can't really be faulted for mentioning this stuff, but I got a kick out of the Discovery cast talking up certain aspects of their show as revolutionary to the franchise even though DS9 did it 20 years ago.
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Jul 23, 2017 19:57
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TOS was a show built on the concepts of the stories. The characters were basically archetypes. TNG had much more of an established universe. It's a lot easier to drop things into the TOS framework than into the TNG framework.
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Jul 23, 2017 19:58
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When that trailer had to mention "BEFORE SPOCK, BEFORE KIRK" i knew it'd be some hokey old man poo poo with lensflares again
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Jul 23, 2017 20:00
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Tighclops posted:We are fortunate to live in a time where at least we can pirate this thing to see if it's any good first before wasting our money on it. The pilot is literally free, you don't need to pirate it.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:05
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Goons going with Seth MacFarlane's Orville instead of Discovery are making a horrible, horrible mistake and I am fully prepared to die for this cause. If you seek to challenge me please meet me in the Buc-ee's parking lot near Texas Motor Speedway in Fort Worth and bring a reproduction batlh'etlh at a pre-determined time.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:08
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Can someone explain what about the laugh-free Orville trailer is making people give Seth MacFarlane the benefit of the doubt?
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Jul 23, 2017 20:13
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Timby posted:The pilot is literally free, you don't need to pirate it. I'm going to anyway because I'm a petty man and it'll make me feel better e: in my defense I haven't seen anything MacFarlane has done in years so my opinion of his new show is based more on the non-sphincter tighteningly serious tone and look of the it's trailer
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Jul 23, 2017 20:14
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marktheando posted:Can someone explain what about the laugh-free Orville trailer is making people give Seth MacFarlane the benefit of the doubt? What's that line in The American President? "They're so thirsty for it they'll crawl through the desert toward a mirage, and when they discover there's no water, they'll drink the sand." I think opinion on Discovery might be a little more approaching ambivalence, at the very least, if almost every aspect of its pre-production and production hadn't been reported to be the mother of all clusterfucks.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:23
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McSpanky posted:"What if they made a trailer for DS9 full of action scenes and war dialogue and klingons, what then https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-mUBRfv27yo
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Jul 23, 2017 20:25
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T.C. posted:TOS was a show built on the concepts of the stories. The characters were basically archetypes. TNG had much more of an established universe. It's a lot easier to drop things into the TOS framework than into the TNG framework. That's why so many wish they would just go past TNG. There is no need to put anything in a TOS or TNG framework, why is it so hard to move on? All those prequel shows look anyways more advanced but instead of embracing something really new they still do this awkward dance of trying to make something new out of old stuff. Just create a new show and set it a few decades (at least) after Ds9/Voyager and then there isn't even much canon that will hold you back in your stories (plot). There are so many great stories and settings you could imagine...
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Jul 23, 2017 20:42
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marktheando posted:Can someone explain what about the laugh-free Orville trailer is making people give Seth MacFarlane the benefit of the doubt? The first trailer was even more jokey. So while they're equally unfunny, the new trailer fails less. For what it's worth, McFarlane claims it isn't a comedy, but rather a light-hearted adventure.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:47
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I've got no interest in the ToS era at all. TNG/DS9 is indeed where it's at. But maybe that's why I'm not too bothered by the way Discovery's going with it. Okay, it's trying to position itself in "history" and that's difficult and constraining, and I wouldn't call it a good move... but from what we've seen, especially aesthetically, it's not treating those restraints too seriously. The Klingons are the antagonists, and rather than trying to recreate really limited ToS costumes, they've gone all out making them the alien 'other,' in contrast to familiar Starfleet. This is good, because the only acceptable message a Star Trek show can have in the end is "we should all get along" and pushing an over-the-top visceral otherness to the enemy from the start is a great way to give that ultimate message more meaning in the end. Even these weirdos are people who we have to work with to make a future we like. That kind of stuff can make for good Star Trek. I've heard all the production rumors. Of course this could be a trainwreck. But I don't see any point assuming that beforehand. At best you get to be smug that you called it on an internet forum. At worst you're poisoning a potentially nice experience with your hardcore negative expectations. Inescapable Duck posted:Then again, maybe a captain who struggles to take anything seriously is exactly what you want when dealing with the frontier weirdness of space. If Orville is a series of references to Star Trek scenarios, or just an office sitcom set on a spaceship, it will be bad. If it ends up using the humor as a lubricant to get you into stories with interesting concepts, then it will be a good show in the tradition of Star Trek. There's no indication that it's the later from the trailer, but if McFarlane is really a fan of Star Trek like he supposedly is, we might end up pleasantly surprised.
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Jul 23, 2017 20:58
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Eiba posted:I've got no interest in the ToS era at all. TNG/DS9 is indeed where it's at. I know no-one of my generation who cares about TOS. The JJ Abrams movies seem like they're aimed at a young audience, so then when Benedict Cumberbatch said he's Khan, with this sense of gravity, I was just like... Yeah, I kind of know who that is, but I was a sperm and an egg when any of this 60's crap was relevant. Who is supposed to find this exciting?
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Jul 23, 2017 21:44
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If you don't like or at least understand the appeal of TOS I'm not sure you really have any credibility in opining about the course of the franchise
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Jul 23, 2017 21:46
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No, it's true. I don't know about you guys but I hang out with 30 year olds and TNG and DS9 come up way more often than I was expecting. TOS not at all.
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Jul 23, 2017 21:48
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skasion posted:If you don't like or at least understand the appeal of TOS I'm not sure you really have any credibility in opining about the course of the franchise I don't hate watching it, but it's pretty dated, with an aged fanbase. Why not go for something people in their 30's today watched as kids?
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Jul 23, 2017 21:50
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Yeah I'm sure a modern retelling of TNG or DS9 would be less poo poo because that's what everyone remembers an-
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Jul 23, 2017 21:53
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Timby posted:What's that line in The American President? "They're so thirsty for it they'll crawl through the desert toward a mirage, and when they discover there's no water, they'll drink the sand." Also the reason people obsessively consume 40k vidya games and mods even though there hasn't been so much as a mediocre entry in like seven years. If they just made a Star Trek show in the late 2070s or wherever DS9 et al left off--which may as well have been Discovery for all anyone cares--that would have been fine. I dare say it would have received more buzz than trying to re-polish Classic Trek for the umpteenth time.
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Jul 23, 2017 22:13
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WampaLord posted:You got a source for that? Timby, as usual, is correct. It was a chance meeting at a fundraiser, and she was too busy loving Roddenberry to quit.
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Jul 23, 2017 22:15
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Trickjaw posted:Timby, as usual, is correct. It was a chance meeting at a fundraiser, and she was too busy loving Roddenberry to quit. You got a source for that?
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Jul 23, 2017 22:17
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quote:Before his work on Star Trek, he began relationships with both Nichelle Nichols and Majel Barrett.[18] After he met Nichols when she was cast in "To Set It Right", an episode of The Lieutenant, he began a friendship that lasted for the rest of his life. During the early period, prior to Star Trek, they entered into a romantic liaison that she described as falling in love.[19] At the same time, after meeting Barrett during the filming of the episode "In the Highest Tradition", they became friends and soon entered into a relationship.[20] After several months he introduced Nichols to Barrett, with whom he had also been having a relationship. At the time, Roddenberry wanted to remain in an open relationship with both women,[19] but Nichols, recognising Barrett's devotion to him, ended the affair as she did not want to be "the other woman to the other woman".[21] Barrett and Nichols had met previously when Nichols auditioned for The Singing Nun.[21] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Personal_life_of_Gene_Roddenberry#Nichelle_Nichols_and_Majel_Barrett Never mind why this topic has its own Wiki page. Generally as far as Nichols-MLK, superfans smell a rat: https://www.trekbbs.com/threads/nicholss-mlk-story-latest-re-telling.126759/
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Jul 23, 2017 22:25
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I'm glad the Discovery trailer brought in all the first-time posters and their hot takes on TOS
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Jul 23, 2017 22:28
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Drone posted:Likewise I never understood far-right-wing types who like Star Trek. It's literally a post-capitalist big-government utopia. That's painting with a very wide brush. Capitalism, socialism, etc. are all methods of distributing scarce resources. Given post-scarcity as a starting point, the landscape is totally different. It's not necessarily tied to capitalism to the point that it would cease to have meaning in the absence of capitalism. What's libertarianism in essence - maximum liberty while not infringing the rights of others. That seems plenty compatible with the society we're shown.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:04
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Arglebargle III posted:No, it's true. I don't know about you guys but I hang out with 30 year olds and TNG and DS9 come up way more often than I was expecting. TOS not at all. I'm pretty sure I'm the only person I know who's seen any appreciable amount of TOS, and that's with several friends who are Star Trek fans. Also all people in their late 20s or early 30s.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:33
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It's weird that boomers love classic trek and the movies and think of it when they think of "star trek" while people who grew up with DS9/TNG think of those series.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:36
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I'm younger than 30 and TOS is Trek to me. The spinoffs are spinoffs. I don't think it's any surprise that there's not much appetite yet for spinoffs of spinoffs. If they keep pissing on the TOS era though, there will probably eventually be more TNG era media by default.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:40
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No one's saying it's weird, but I bet plenty of boomers think of TNG when talking about Star Trek too. My dad grew up with TOS and Star Trek for him was still TNG-era stuff more than TOS. You're talking about an absurdly popular show that spawned 21 seasons of TV over a decade and a half. That's just naturally going to catch way more people. There's just way more of it.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:40
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The only good TOS is... half the movies?
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Jul 23, 2017 23:45
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Gorelab posted:The only good TOS is... half the movies? A little over a third of the episodes, four of the six original movies and the beginning of Generations are all good.
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Jul 23, 2017 23:57
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I can understand them wanting to start with a relatively fresh slate because there were like 20 seasons of advanced techno-mcguffins to deal with and the fandom who knows and cares about that poo poo, too. It was like the problem Niven had with Known Space once he introduced Teela; at a certain point when the luck is explicit storytelling becomes hard.
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Jul 24, 2017 00:44
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Nessus posted:I can understand them wanting to start with a relatively fresh slate because there were like 20 seasons of advanced techno-mcguffins to deal with and the fandom who knows and cares about that poo poo, too. It was like the problem Niven had with Known Space once he introduced Teela; at a certain point when the luck is explicit storytelling becomes hard. Talk about an appropriate response username. I was watching the Discovery trailer today and thought to myself, "drat, I wish someone would man up and do a Known Space series. Star Trek may be tapped out..."
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Jul 24, 2017 01:05
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mycomancy posted:Talk about an appropriate response username. I don't think Star Trek is tapped out in the sense of "They can't do good stories in that setting, universe, constellation of signifiers, whatever." I do think you could argue that setting something post-Voyager would have more downside from its setting than upside. There is, of course, no reason why you couldn't use elements of the "start" of the TNG/DS9/VOY era to inform the "maximum cultural impact" stuff they draw off of from TOS. I felt like Beyond was trying to do some of that. e: Another problem with doing a Known Space show: You have to pay Larry Niven, and as a crusty old guy from money, you're not gonna be getting it for cheap.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:16
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marktheando posted:Can someone explain what about the laugh-free Orville trailer is making people give Seth MacFarlane the benefit of the doubt? I don't know if you genuinely didn't like the trailer or if you're just doing the "heh, Seth McFarlane sucks poo poo, right?" thing. I'm not one to like Seth McFarlane all that much. He usually takes a funny joke and then runs it into the ground until it's dead, then puts it in his show. Even then, I still enjoyed the trailer for Orville. I'm giving it a shot to see if there is someone to rein him in. If not, whatever. It's a FOX show, it will be cancelled after the first season anyway.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:20
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BrutalistMcDonalds posted:Goons going with Seth MacFarlane's Orville instead of Discovery are making a horrible, horrible mistake and I am fully prepared to die for this cause. Who the gently caress is already deciding on watching either one and not the other? Watch both, then decide.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:43
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Well, I'll only be watching the first episode of Discovery because that's the only one that will be readily available. All-Access is a dumpster fire garbage streaming service and they will never get any of my money.
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Jul 24, 2017 01:58
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bull3964 posted:Well, I'll only be watching the first episode of Discovery because that's the only one that will be readily available. I hope the view rates are way higher in every country it's on Netflix so they realize the huge mistake they made. I'm certainly not paying what they're charging for CBS
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Jul 24, 2017 02:59
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The Bloop posted:I hope the view rates are way higher in every country it's on Netflix so they realize the huge mistake they made.
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Jul 24, 2017 03:12
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The Bloop posted:Who the gently caress is already deciding on watching either one and not the other? No, you see it's very important that we form strong opinions now and then vehemently defend them down the line in the face of all evidence. It's called being fan.
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