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ManofManyAliases posted:Lol - more armchairing by OSC and/or Derek-alt (I don't know and I don't care either way). Fact is, ToS are upheld in case law very regularly (Wireless providers, cable providers, etc) and there are cases where they are not. It's case law and up to interpretation by the presiding court. Even though CA has strong consumer protection, CA tends to favor the UCC and business (especially small business) to allow for the flow of transactions. When did a bunch of marketing sizzle videos become a game? It would be the quickest court case in history. Plaintiff: "Hi, your honor, here are the receipts for purchases made on CIG's website for a game." Judge: "CIG could we please see the game?" Defendant: "There is no game..." Judge: "Why are we here?"
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Aug 9, 2017 17:21
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ManofManyAliases posted:
Too bad you don't know — and wouldn't know — if they had been. CIG is happy to oblige refund requests because the law forces them to, and the ToS doesn't alter the law. They're seen as the bad guy because their business practices and their entire business model is predatory and abusive. Tippis fucked around with this message at 17:29 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 17:25
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ManofManyAliases posted:Hey Pal: I think I can continue to be as smug as I want in knowing that CIG is hard at work making the foundational systems that will carry the project for the next decade. 5 Years in (6, by some fuzzy math by resident non-accredited PhDs) is not a call for concern. I think a lot of the hurt and pain experienced by some of you stems from the fact that you have no insight into a private company's operations or financials and just bark at clouds because half of you don't understand the gaming business. CIG projected deadlines. CIG missed deadlines because of reasons (contractors leaving, internal structuring, whatever). CIG learned form mistakes and have toned-down deadline speak. Comparatively, the project is more open than the likes of EA or Activision, or any other gaming studio when it comes to systems, gameplay, art, etc.  Oh man, where the heck is that laughing techno vikings gif when you need it?  I personally love watching In fact the PU has hardly changed since it was released, and even though it's had many cosmetic add ons, it still plays like baby's first Cryengine mod.  We do have insight into their financials, we know they proudly display how much they've taken from the public but are coy to show how much they spend or have spent, we know they've taken loans, but they are coy about those too, we know how many CIG/RSI forum accounts have been created, but CIG twist that into a "number of financial backers" figure wrongly. They are not hard at work making a game, they are hard at work making and maintaining ways to take as much money as possible from the public, it's not even hard to spot these days, they are literally the African Prince email of the game dev world and the only people they are hurting are the people throwing money at them who seem to enjoy being battered by their love, you'll cotton on eventually, but that'll be because of CIG, not because of us or what we find out/say. Also, lol at suggesting goons have no game dev experience, there's quite a few former and current devs who post here.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:25
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Judge: The chatbox sucks.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:25
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C-Bangin' it 
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As much it pains me, I'm forced to agree with MoMa for the following reasons:
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Aug 9, 2017 17:29
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Mr.Tophat posted:As much it pains me, I'm forced to agree with MoMa for the following reasons: You're right. That is a very compelling list of stuff that supports his case.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:30
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ManofManyAliases posted:Fact is, they have not been legally challenged, and if so, it'll most likely fall to arbitration. CIG has been happy to oblige refund requests. I'm not sure why some still see them as the bad guy. People need to be smarter with financial management instead of blaming the business. Seems to me like businesses should not sell products that they cannot produce, but I am not a lawyer or game developer so what do I know.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:30
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Mr.Tophat posted:As much it pains me, I'm forced to agree with MoMa for the following reasons: furthermore:
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Aug 9, 2017 17:36
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Thoatse posted:furthermore: In hindsight I now feel foolish for not including this originally
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Aug 9, 2017 17:39
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Mr.Tophat posted:In hindsight I now feel foolish for not including this originally You can always go back and refactor your post.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:40
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Aug 9, 2017 17:42
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G0RF posted:Have fun little bees That's a fairly specific callback to Eve. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vfv1QtZDirY SUAS!
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Aug 9, 2017 17:42
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Tippis posted:You're right. That is a very compelling list of stuff that supports his case. Counterpoint: All those jpegs. Surely.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:43
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ManofManyAliases posted:Fact is, ToS are upheld in case law very regularly (Wireless providers, cable providers, etc) and there are cases where they are not. It's case law and up to interpretation by the presiding court. Even though CA has strong consumer protection, CA tends to favor the UCC and business (especially small business) to allow for the flow of transactions. Needed moar epics. https://brorlandi.github.io/StarWarsIntroCreator/#!/AKr6sjqxOQtYYc5UF7c4
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Aug 9, 2017 17:46
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Aug 9, 2017 17:47
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Sabreseven posted:You can always go back and refactor your post. Okay, done, thank you for giving me the confidence to do so
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Aug 9, 2017 17:51
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quote:(5201) is the total amount of available memory, 2798 is what's being used currently, and 4852 was the peak in a completely unoptimized in-editor environment with who knows what else off screen. quote:That's a prerendered cinematic trailer, not an actual game or gameplay. Prerendered means the quality can be orders of magnitude higher than an actual game because when its on the player's HD its pretty much a video.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:58
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Lol why does everyone think that getting a refund gets you perma'd? CIG reinstated my account - including all of my VB perks - at the drop of a hat lol.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:58
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Foods and drinks always been planned. Persistance already exists, but a new way to manage items comes with 3.0 as one of the main features. Economy is player driven, but there is no crafting. Checkmate goonies.
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Aug 9, 2017 17:59
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Sabreseven posted:Also, lol at suggesting goons have no game dev experience, there's quite a few former and current devs who post here. He did say 'half', presumably he wasn't talking to us at that point. Weirdly, the suggestion that CiG had _toned down_ the deadline speak is in the short run up to the, what, third deadline they've talked about this year? After that incident about laughingly not missing a deadline in December 2016. Oh, but it's not old 3.0, it's new 3.0. Pay no attention to the incredulous IT types pointing out that a incrementing number is traditionally a way to track advance, and they could have thrown something on the 2.x branch out if this was a legitimate piece of development. We're just the haters that will point out that they've changed direction so many loving times that apparently they're concentrating more on the FPS game that was/was not part of the base. I mean, poo poo like overlapping orbit lines has to physically hurt MoMa because that 'fidelity' thing is the excuse for creating the fiddly loving systems in the first place. And it's looking less and less like there is an 'investment' pay off because, and I'm going to use caps - OTHER SPACE GAMES HAVE COME AND GONE IN THE MEANTIME. It's a fast moving space. People move on. Mostly. The schadenfreude here isn't about the company failing or people losing their jobs, it's the sheer amount of enabling that is going on. This isn't transparent development, it's loving chaos. orcane posted:Checkmate goonies. That's a snake, back to square 15. Hav fucked around with this message at 18:02 on Aug 9, 2017 |
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Aug 9, 2017 17:59
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Oh I'm sorry I wanted to say We are kind of devolving into an uninformed mess here. Eating and drinking isn't required, remembering to do it will probably just make your health buffed. Comparing this to DayZ unfavorably is hilariously stupid. Even the crappy gameplay out now is better than dayZ's initial stuff or it's later alphas. I am pretty negative about CIG's management but let's not turn full retard either.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:00
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ManofManyAliases posted:Lol - more armchairing by OSC and/or Derek-alt (I don't know and I don't care either way). Fact is, ToS are upheld in case law very regularly (Wireless providers, cable providers, etc) and there are cases where they are not. It's case law and up to interpretation by the presiding court. Even though CA has strong consumer protection, CA tends to favor the UCC and business (especially small business) to allow for the flow of transactions. Cast Iron TOS moma is 2nd best moma. Put smug moma on during gamescom stream please.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:02
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No actually I wanted to talk about the player-driven economy. Player purchases will influence the available supply, as will other player actions remove piracy in an area increase trade in gods means more manufacturing but also means less munitions and ships will be purchased, some in the economy win some loose but it is still affected by players. That is one of CR's core design goals for all aspects of the game nothing is in isolation every aspect is influenced by changes around it. This is a big part of the reason it is taking so long to develop, rather than building a simple bit of code to deal with the direct requirements that code is also expanded to be able to react to non-related objects. I am happy to wait in fact if I had any spare spending money I would still occasionally be buying the odd ship (ie. the Nox). But the reason I am happy to wait is that there is demonstrable work in the direction i wish lots of other developers would look, all of what people term "feature creep" that i can see has not been because of ohh would this not be cool lets add it on top of everything else, but we have to build this system to do X in the backend having built that we can also do this for a 10th of the effort that it would have before when we scrapped the idea now it is feasible.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:02
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But let's be reasonably skeptic here. The original pitch was for a first person universe with systems to support that as fully as possible. Planetside was always the plan, now we just have more planet side than originally expected. Base building and food and all that being non required but maybe useful systems just add life to the game after you get bored of space trucking. Are these things we needed before releasing the god drat game to see if it's even fun in the first place? Absolutely not, but it's not out of no where or unexpected even if you listen to Roberts talking. He's going for a pretty in depth universe simulator. Remember when initially we were pitched over clocking individual parts of our ship? Bars and labs and shops with interactive holo interfaces for each of us? Sone kind of factional warfare universe? I do, that was stuff right off the bat. Feature creep is real, but it's not what I'm concerned about. I just want to know if flying and fighting will be fun. Gimme that and you can add more poo poo in the background as much as you want.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:03
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Wake up in wank pod Do a 80%+ golf swing to open door Go to mess hall Do a 85%+ golf swing to get food AMAZING GAMEPLAY IGN 12/10 GOTY
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Aug 9, 2017 18:03
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orcane posted:all of what people term "feature creep" that i can see has not been because of ohh would this not be cool lets add it on top of everything else, but we have to build this system to do X in the backend having built that we can also do this for a 10th of the effort that it would have before when we scrapped the idea now it is feasible. What are you looking forward to the most in 3.0? AP posted:Cast Iron TOS moma is 2nd best moma. Put smug moma on during gamescom stream please. The belt is a solid investment for the man with the trouser heavy portfolio. All you dumb fuckers using the market and 'commerce' just don't grok the simple elegance of getting in on the ground floor in an MMO.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:05
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Showing off art assets is not being open about in development. It's just trying to market junk as actual development progress while the game has been in a state of liquid poo poo for 8 months and they keep regressing on progress on other systems because Chris is in the spectrum. And yeah, activison and EA and just about every loving publicly traded company is inherently more open than CIG. Because you see quarterly reports on finances and shareholder briefings on their direction you can get a pretty good idea on when they are releasing products. On the other hand CIG doesn't give a gently caress because Cristo Roberto is above all of us plebs and how dare we know how the company or the game is doing
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Aug 9, 2017 18:10
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I'm actually really glad there are still hardcore believers who talk about THE TECH that will save the game, and gaming, and their investments of course, that just has to be implemented slowly and with great care (since clearly CIG has finished revolutionizing the games industry ages ago and is just working on putting it all together).
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Aug 9, 2017 18:12
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I just want to know how if CIG is in "open development" WTF was Ninja Theory in during Hellblade's dev? because I know a HELL of a lot more about how that was made than I know about Star Citizen.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:13
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Cao Ni Ma posted:Showing off art assets is not being open about in development. It's just trying to market junk as actual development progress while the game has been in a state of liquid poo poo for 68 months and they keep regressing on progress on other systems because Chris is in the spectrum. Slightly more than 8 months.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:14
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orcane posted:Slightly more than 8 months. Well, if you will go rounding up, Guun.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:15
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ManofManyAliases posted:Hey Pal: I think I can continue to be as smug as I want in knowing that CIG is hard at work making the foundational systems that will carry the project for the next decade. 5 Years in (6, by some fuzzy math by resident non-accredited PhDs) is not a call for concern. I think a lot of the hurt and pain experienced by some of you stems from the fact that you have no insight into a private company's operations or financials and just bark at clouds because half of you don't understand the gaming business. CIG projected deadlines. CIG missed deadlines because of reasons (contractors leaving, internal structuring, whatever). CIG learned form mistakeNics and have toned-down deadline speak. Comparatively, the project is more open than the likes of EA or Activision, or any other gaming studio when it comes to systems, gameplay, art, etc. Nice Burndown  You're a little early though, that's supposed to be on Friday.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:25
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Jobbo_Fett posted:Nice Burndown Its a pre melt down. It prepares the SC body for further disappointment
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Aug 9, 2017 18:27
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AutismVaccine posted:Its a pre melt down. It prepares the SC body for further disappointment He's just prepping himself for the worst kind of electricity that trebles every second.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:28
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Daztek posted:https://www.reddit.com/r/starcitizen/comments/6slco7/so_does_render_to_texture_allow_us_to_have_the/ Sometimes I feel like the lines between pretend and reality are very blurred for some people. As if they believe Roberts is actually inventing real world stuff, like real ships, real do dads, real holograms. He's got people by the gonads of choice and it never stops being both funny and simultaneously alarming. I almost constantly have this look going on 
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Aug 9, 2017 18:30
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Hav posted:Well, if you will go rounding up, Guun. Why round when you have 64-bit precision?
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Aug 9, 2017 18:31
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LuiCypher posted:He's just prepping himself for the worst kind of electricity that trebles every second. We are truly blessed with the whole Stimperium fanfiction. The writer/s have provided more entertainment than CR and his 5$ game/s (games not included). Edit: Coutts and Co only bought SC to get the database containing all the backers information. You just can sell them anything
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Aug 9, 2017 18:32
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but it's an alphaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahaha
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Aug 9, 2017 18:33
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Mr.Tophat posted:As much it pains me, I'm forced to agree with MoMa for the following reasons: Wrongfully imprisoned, rightfully freed. I have to concede my earlier points and agree with this man
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Aug 9, 2017 18:33
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Maw posted:Wrongfully imprisoned, rightfully freed. I have to concede my earlier points and agree with this man You should have waited two weeks for that imo.
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Aug 9, 2017 18:35
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