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CelticPredator posted:Superman needed to save way more people, personally, and not like, punching a space laser spider to save millions... Like actually rescuing people during the Zod fight. Or showing close ups with him reacting to the people's safety. reminds me of how in age of ultron they spent a lot of time showing the avengers evacuating the area and then saving civilians during the fight. and then you get to civil war and it turns out it still wasn't enough
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Nov 20, 2017 16:35
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Serf posted:reminds me of how in age of ultron they spent a lot of time showing the avengers evacuating the area and then saving civilians during the fight. and then you get to civil war and it turns out it still wasn't enough More than that, they lied about the number of casualties, for some weird reason.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:38
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CelticPredator posted:Then stop doing this. It's like, everyone who hates these movies said things that bothered them clearly and it's completely thrown out. So
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Nov 20, 2017 16:39
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Al Borland Corp. posted:People wanted Batman to be the good guy and Superman to be the bad guy. They didn't get that. I said it earlier but Clark doesn't talk a whole lot in his films. Being a loner who wandered around for years before having his first meaningful connection with someone, besides his mom, when he met Lois, the film does rationalize why he's not a chatterbox. But I could see if he talked more about things the general audience would have been able to get to know him better and better empathize with him.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:39
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:More than that, they lied about the number of casualties, for some weird reason. carrying on a proud tradition, really
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Nov 20, 2017 16:40
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Serf posted:carrying on a proud tradition, really The New York Incident: 4, maybe 5 civilian deaths, tops.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:41
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Did Six Dozen Really Die?
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Nov 20, 2017 16:43
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Marvel isn't great about that saving stuff, but I was fine with AoU doing a little spiteful shot at the Snyder films. Too bad the movie wasn't very good at all, making the gesture almost pointless. Spider-Man was great though. I like they even had him save the villain who I was sure was going to off himself like the other Spider-Man movie villains.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:44
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HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:The New York Incident: 4, maybe 5 civilian deaths, tops. All those cabs and cars were empty when the aliens fired plasma grenades into deadlocked rush hour traffic
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Nov 20, 2017 16:44
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Guy A. Person posted:All those cabs and cars were empty when the aliens fired plasma grenades into deadlocked rush hour traffic They are, from what I remember, haha. While MoS makes it purposeful to show the gravity thing is actually killing people.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:46
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CelticPredator posted:Superman needed to save way more people, personally, and not like, punching a space laser spider to save millions... Like actually rescuing people during the Zod fight. Or showing close ups with him reacting to the people's safety. I'm glad of it
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Nov 20, 2017 16:47
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Vintersorg posted:Yeah, we got that in JL and it was loving garbage. Yeah, this is how I felt too - it was EXACTLY what people asked for in complaints of MoS and it was really distracting and annoying for me. Celtic, how did you feel about Superman smiling and saving people everywhere in Justice League in how it fit in with the situation on screen, as compared to how he was in MoS and how it fit that situation? Honest question.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:47
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CelticPredator posted:Spider-Man was great though. I like they even had him save the villain who I was sure was going to off himself like the other Spider-Man movie villains.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:50
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It was bad. They changed his character too much without a period where he's able to change. He's just a different character. You could've had him slowly get to where he ended up and have it work, but he'd have to be in the film more and the film should've been able to breathe for a second. And the mustache thing ruined every scene.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:51
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It was very weird for Avengers 2 to actively make its movie worse in order to take a swipe at a different film. I guess he was already taking swipes at other films with his Captain America characterization, so he may as well spread the love.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:52
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CelticPredator posted:Marvel isn't great about that saving stuff, but I was fine with AoU doing a little spiteful shot at the Snyder films. Too bad the movie wasn't very good at all, making the gesture almost pointless. "Marvel isn't great about that saving stuff" translates roughly to "before AoU they just whitewashed it constantly and never addressed it". Snyder's greatest film crime is that he literally went "hey what about all these people on the street during these big fights? Wouldn't they die horribly?" and then actually made it a point of the movie. Avengers cuts away from anything violent and then 10 minutes into an alien invasion Lower Manhattan is just magically mostly evacuated. If they were, in fact, taking a "spiteful shot at the Snyder films" then it's just dumb and hypocritical. I think it's more likely that they were scared shitless that people would start making the same complaints about MCU films next, so they did a 180 and doubled down on the saving and then sanitized the earlier films by saying "oh yeah like 10 people died, and they were mostly old anyway and were gonna die soon so..."
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Nov 20, 2017 16:53
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He was rescuing people personally during the first Zod fight in Smallville, before the kryptonians powers had fully developed. As well as on the oil rig, on the Antarctic ship, and on the bus. The second Zod fight was an all out attempt at containment, and he consistently tried to move Zod away from population centers. And all of the above was to some extent a struggle. In Justice League he was just this guy who could do anything and be anywhere and he wasn't a character at all.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:55
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CelticPredator posted:It was bad. They changed his character too much without a period where he's able to change. He's just a different character. You could've had him slowly get to where he ended up and have it work, but he'd have to be in the film more and the film should've been able to breathe for a second. I agree with this, for the most part. I LIKED the more introverted Superman because, well I'm an introvert and can relate more, and it reminded me of the few good parts of Birthright, etc., but I do understand not preferring that take on him. However, this complete 180 shouldn't appease anyone (although I see comments from a bunch of people who are all "thats MY Superman" now).
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Nov 20, 2017 16:55
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Darko posted:Yeah, this is how I felt too - it was EXACTLY what people asked for in complaints of MoS and it was really distracting and annoying for me. Justice League is basically a case study in why the complaints about Man of Steel and BvS were wrongheaded. It wasn't worth losing another actually-good Superman movie, and the brief glimpses of Snyder's work are haunting, but that's the silver lining of that particular dumpster fire.
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Nov 20, 2017 16:58
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it's really funny that civil war, the movie that acknowledges that thousands/millions died in sokovia and hundreds/thousands died in new york has its big fight scene take place in a totally-abandoned airport. just lol. same with how bvs had newscasters saying obvious bullshit like "its past 5 in the financial district, clearly no one is there" and stuff
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Nov 20, 2017 16:59
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Serf posted:it's really funny that civil war, the movie that acknowledges that thousands/millions died in sokovia and hundreds/thousands died in new york has its big fight scene take place in a totally-abandoned airport. just lol. same with how bvs had newscasters saying obvious bullshit like "its past 5 in the financial district, clearly no one is there" and stuff Yeah, none of this is a coincidence or one studio taking the piss. Everyone got mad spooked by the backlash from MoS so now for the next decade or so we are going to have the obligatory scene of Goku politely asking the villain if they could have their DBZ fight in the abandoned canyon.
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Nov 20, 2017 17:08
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Sir Kodiak posted:Justice League is basically a case study in why the complaints about Man of Steel and BvS were wrongheaded. It wasn't worth losing another actually-good Superman movie, and the brief glimpses of Snyder's work are haunting, but that's the silver lining of that particular dumpster fire. It doesn't prove the complaints were wrongheaded just because it took such a heavy-handed, pandering approach to addressing them.
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Nov 20, 2017 18:06
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Barry Convex posted:It doesn't prove the complaints were wrongheaded just because it took such a heavy-handed, pandering approach to addressing them. There's simply no way to have a light touch when it comes to a constantly-grinning Daddy Superman who fixes all the problems and prevents all the consequences. To expound: The reason that he worked in the Donner movies is because they aren't ensembles. This is what a lot of us have been saying from the get go: Apple Pie and Chevrolet Superman is a dead end. Nothing interesting happens with him, the formula of "he always wins and there are no consequences" is thin and yields extremely diminishing returns, and he's reduced to a stupid cornball when put in any other context but his own broad, idealized movies. A cartoonish Superman is a great folk hero for Truth Justice and the American way but a total dud for people, you know, actually wanting to see his movies. Megaman's Jockstrap fucked around with this message at 18:27 on Nov 20, 2017 |
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Nov 20, 2017 18:22
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Less than $100M opening for JL is really bad, isn't it?
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Nov 20, 2017 18:35
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Crackbone posted:Less than $100M opening for JL is really bad, isn't it? If you own stock in Time Warner, I suppose.
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Nov 20, 2017 18:37
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Megaman's Jockstrap posted:If you own stock in Time Warner, I suppose. Well yeah, that's what I meant. That's a disastrous opening for a mega-budget superhero movie, especially considering this is the "avengers" of the DCEU. I'd have to imagine the fallout will be big at WB.
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Nov 20, 2017 18:43
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They’re take away will probably be that they didn’t meddle enough in the production. 
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Nov 20, 2017 18:53
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They didn’t hit the already lowered (three times) projections of $96M. Actuals are out and it’s only $94M. DC
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Nov 20, 2017 19:02
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i suppose its too much to hope that this is the beginning of the comic book movie crash
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Nov 20, 2017 19:04
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Serf posted:i suppose its too much to hope that this is the beginning of the comic book movie crash It'll happen after Infinity War 2. Once that's done we will see a decline in general. Marvel may chug out movies but I think it's going to wane after that.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:06
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Serf posted:i suppose its too much to hope that this is the beginning of the comic book movie crash
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Nov 20, 2017 19:07
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Happy Noodle Boy posted:They didn’t hit the already lowered (three times) projections of $96M. Actuals are out and it’s only $94M.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:09
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Serf posted:i suppose its too much to hope that this is the beginning of the comic book movie crash no, it's a DC film
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Nov 20, 2017 19:11
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There is literally zero chance that WB will want Snyder involved with a DC superhero film again, so we'll get better films like Wonder Woman and the the inane arguments we've been having for four and a half years now should just die down over time.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:12
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Barry Convex posted:There is literally zero chance that WB will want Snyder involved with a DC superhero film again, so we'll get better films like Wonder Woman and the the inane arguments we've been having for four and a half years now should just die down over time. Not as long as someone says "You know, I didn't really care for MoS/BvS"
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Nov 20, 2017 19:13
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Serf posted:i suppose its too much to hope that this is the beginning of the comic book movie crash Yeah, don't get your hopes up on that score. "Comic book movie" has turned out to be a pretty inclusive category. Compare Guardians of the Galaxy (science fiction action/comedy), Captain America Winter Soldier (spy film), Ant-Man (heist film), Logan (mutant western), and Deadpool (R-rated violent comedy), all of which are "comic book movies" but none of them are tonally similar to each other or to mainline comic book movies like The Avengers. The ability of comic book characters to adapt into different genres by simply adding "...but with superheroes" makes the whole thing a lot less likely to crash out quickly or at once.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:14
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As long as Marvel's brand is intact they'll keep making money, and the brand will be fine as long as people continue to exit the movies feeling the goodtimechildhoodfunfeelings. JL just looked like an absolute drag in the trailers without even the grandeur and majesty suggested by BvS and MoS or the clean power fantasy of WW. It looked like a beer commercial at halftime honestly.Barry Convex posted:There is literally zero chance that WB will want Snyder involved with a DC superhero film again, so we'll get better films like Wonder Woman and the the inane arguments we've been having for four and a half years now should just die down over time. Snyder was involved in WW heh heh. I also don't really buy the "Marvel movies are different genres" angle. Like yeah they all have different directors with different sensibilities but I'd say there's a pretty clear house style as far as look and tone are concerned. They're generally very lighthearted, the sex is kept to a middle school level, everything is evenly lit in medium wide shots or whatever. They're built to appeal to eight year olds and/or the parents of eight year olds. You feel okay bringing your kids to them, there's no weirdo Snyder Superman getting in a bath tub with an older woman or Bruce Wayne loving escorts or Martha Wayne getting her jaw blown off. Even though Snyder has only had sex seven times in his life he seems to have a relatively healthy erotic sensibility whereas the Marvel movies are extremely repressed; I think that aspect has been underdiscussed in their success. porfiria fucked around with this message at 19:21 on Nov 20, 2017 |
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Nov 20, 2017 19:14
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Barry Convex posted:There is literally zero chance that WB will want Snyder involved with a DC superhero film again, so we'll get better films like Wonder Woman and the the inane arguments we've been having for four and a half years now should just die down over time. Arguments will never die, friend. We’ll find some other stupid poo poo to argue about until the heat death of the universe.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:14
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Wonder Woman was just fine, and it's still baffling to me that people don't hate it the way they do Man of Steel, considering it's a movie in which Wonder Woman is all too eager to kill a dude who, turns out, wasn't even Ares.
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Nov 20, 2017 19:16
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DC isnt going anywhere until they poo poo out that property Dwayne Johnson is attached to. I bet they scrap it and reboot after even The Rock cant draw a crowd
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Nov 20, 2017 19:16
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