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A Keeper whose name is The Principle, which manifests as a humanoid nebula obsessed with tardiness. They keep the Northern Lights in their kitchen.
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Nov 28, 2017 00:17
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I want to start naming things "the Principle" if only to force qashmallim into using horrifically twisted syntax, of which "the Principle is not the Principle" would be only the start.
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Nov 28, 2017 00:21
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Rand Brittain posted:I want to start naming things "the Principle" if only to force qashmallim into using horrifically twisted syntax, of which "the Principle is not the Principle" would be only the start. I like the jib of your cut.
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Nov 28, 2017 00:26
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Soonmot posted:
I see we play in the same group. I hope you enjoyed the last Vampire session where we spent the literal entire time tracking a guy who we were positive was a Hunter and only after the game were told by the GM 'I LITERALLY just threw that guy in for flavor off the top of my head, he didn't even have a name until you stole his wallet and I had to think of one on his ID'
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Nov 28, 2017 00:45
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sexpig by night posted:I see we play in the same group. I hope you enjoyed the last Vampire session where we spent the literal entire time tracking a guy who we were positive was a Hunter and only after the game were told by the GM 'I LITERALLY just threw that guy in for flavor off the top of my head, he didn't even have a name until you stole his wallet and I had to think of one on his ID' I repeat: Xinder posted:Help the party is running away from each other in the lamest car chase ever. Nobody has any points in drive so they're wiping out on every turn. This is the worst.
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Nov 28, 2017 00:53
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Soonmot posted:I'm going to run a werewolf game and I have some questions about some things I want my players to interact with. Memes would be more of an Astral thing. Going into the mind of a city's population, finding the infected imagery and prying it out. Using the Shadow, your depression spirit (or a group of them) would be Influencing people via the images, which would be resonant to them. But you would need some powerful as gently caress depression spirit to be able to really compete across an entire city with everything else that's going on. Your bootleg t-shirts are spawning Greed and the graffiti is spawning Art and both are spawning Crime spirits. So either have a real powerful depression spirit taking advantage of some other chaos, or a legion of them all acting (more or less) together. Claiming and riding people and using the Essence to blast others with Aggressive Meme: Sad and stuff. sexpig by night posted:yea remember a major theme of Werewolf is you're spirit world cops, not spirit world hit men. You really shouldn't be 'defeating' much unless it's actively preying on the mortal world. That was dropped in second edition, or at least the direction shifted enough that slasher makes more sense than spirit police. They are more about hunting now and literally have to go on a hunt every so often or they turn into a movie werewolf. Prime targets are those who cross the Gauntlet either way but different wolves do things differently, including focusing on humans, other werewolves, or just spirits. nofather fucked around with this message at 02:07 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 02:03
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ProfessorCirno posted:I legitimately appreciate that every other game has it's reasons and need to exist, and vampires continue to just be a big fat leech that could be completely excised with no overall loss. Even better, delete the actual Beast game line.
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Nov 28, 2017 02:05
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Warthur posted:Actually, if you got rid of all the Beasts things would be just fine - most people will live happier and fuller lives not learning any of those Lessons, thanks. A reminder that the game constantly implies that something bad will happen if Beasts weren't around, but don't actually elaborate. The antagonists supllement introduces the Insatiables, which are basically Beasts but Worse in every concievable way, except they're INEXPLICABLY undetectable by Heroes. Heroes can detect something loving up the local Dream, but can't actually find the Insatiables. And are thus quick to blame the nearest Beast they can find, also Insatiables can do... something.. to beasts (it's not actually mechanically complete) which allows them to steal bits of their lair or just take them over like cordyceps. Thus Beasts are encouraged to fight Insatiables... but only out of self interest, not out of any divine mission or something like that. But lord knows we need to keep Beasts around to fight Insatiables, otherwise they'll bring the gauntlet down to zero and populate the area entirely with murderghosts because Insatiables just do that. It's lazy and bad writing and I hate it.
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Nov 28, 2017 02:15
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Kurieg posted:A reminder that the game constantly implies that something bad will happen if Beasts weren't around, but don't actually elaborate. The antagonists supllement introduces the Insatiables, which are basically Beasts but Worse in every concievable way, except they're INEXPLICABLY undetectable by Heroes. Heroes can detect something loving up the local Dream, but can't actually find the Insatiables. And are thus quick to blame the nearest Beast they can find, also Insatiables can do... something.. to beasts (it's not actually mechanically complete) which allows them to steal bits of their lair or just take them over like cordyceps.
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Nov 28, 2017 02:27
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Hmm, I wonder what kind of quintessence it would take to Excise Beasts from existence.
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Nov 28, 2017 02:29
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ProfessorCirno posted:I legitimately appreciate that every other game has it's reasons and need to exist, and vampires continue to just be a big fat leech that could be completely excised with no overall loss. I'm currently reading through Demon and every blurb involving vampires is "wow look at these useless loving nerds trying to act important." The total lack of respect that vampires have from other game lines is hilarious and I love it.
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Nov 28, 2017 02:36
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@Promethean players/STs: The book tells me in a lot of places to figure out what roles a player needs to go through on their personal path, and also tells me to make sure I know all milestones ahead of time so I can urge players along to the next one. But this seems really forced to me. I'd rather figure out maybe the first one or two and let the game organically take us to the next important lesson, only relying on an Elpis Vision to push the players if I think we're gonna stall out somewhere. Is there something I'm not understanding or is this a reasonable style with which to run my game? I've never run or played Promethean before.
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Nov 28, 2017 03:06
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Warthur posted:Wow, I hadn't kept up with what was in the antagonists supplement so I hadn't heard of that. It sounds like a total asspull on the level of "Oh, yeah, BTW Vicissitude is an alien parasite". One of them excretes infectious caviar from his dick that causes you to also excrete caviar from your genitals until you're driven insane and rip your genitalia off. He does this because he thinks it'll bring the insatiable's creator back.
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Nov 28, 2017 03:18
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Slimnoid posted:I'm currently reading through Demon and every blurb involving vampires is "wow look at these useless loving nerds trying to act important." yea the 'stereotypes' bits are almost always forgettable but the fact that literally all of them involve 'ugh, vampires? Assholes, all of em. Just try not to be their snack and let them do their dumb poo poo alone.' is a great running goof.
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Nov 28, 2017 03:18
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Another angle for the Werewolves versus the big rear end negative spirit is, if I remember the Oaths of the Moon correctly, it's ranges from faux pas to bringing the entire spirit ecology down on you for eating a spirit's essence completely. So your pack of wolves just going after the primary antagonist and gobbling it up can complicate their entire situation if said spirit made friends with other powerful spirits in the area. And if they don't do it, then it's just a matter of time until it gains enough essence and pops back up if they don't address the situation generate essence that resonates with it. Also, from what I remember of Autumn Nightmares, I think some Fae can actually make their own rifts in the Hedge to exit it. They typically last long enough for the Fae to snatch someone and escape back, but it still means closing all gates into the Hedge cuts off your ability to intercept or pursue Fae and potentially save a victim before it's too late.
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Nov 28, 2017 03:21
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Xinder posted:@Promethean players/STs: Nah, you're doing it the right way, you don't want to make it a railroad. Personally when I ran Promethean I wrote down a few Milestones to nudge players towards, but the rest was pretty improvised or based on the goals players had set for themselves, sometimes I even declared a spontaneous Milestone had been reached when an event in the game felt significant enough to warrant it.
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Nov 28, 2017 04:05
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Maybe what vampires are bringing to the table is being the only splat with any serious competence at keeping the masses ignorant. Vampires disappear and bam, Prometheans on the front page of the New York Times within 72 hours.
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Nov 28, 2017 04:32
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Luna's got things handled for the Werewolves, though. Just pray to god you don't botch your willpower roll.
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Nov 28, 2017 04:41
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nofather posted:Memes would be more of an Astral thing. Going into the mind of a city's population, finding the infected imagery and prying it out. That's a great point, by making it so this meme and the choir of depression spirits associated with it are actually attracting an entire ecosystem of negative spirits, fleshes things out a bit.
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Nov 28, 2017 05:19
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ZearothK posted:Nah, you're doing it the right way, you don't want to make it a railroad. Personally when I ran Promethean I wrote down a few Milestones to nudge players towards, but the rest was pretty improvised or based on the goals players had set for themselves, sometimes I even declared a spontaneous Milestone had been reached when an event in the game felt significant enough to warrant it. I agree with this approach, but I'd also add that as a player, it's satisfying to know that the ST has thought about your PC and written out some milestones for their specific path ahead of time. It's like "oh, my character exists in the world and has traits outside of my character sheet." It's fun to do an elpis vision and be surprised by what the next milestone is.
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Nov 28, 2017 07:21
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Pope Guilty posted:Maybe what vampires are bringing to the table is being the only splat with any serious competence at keeping the masses ignorant. Vampires disappear and bam, Prometheans on the front page of the New York Times within 72 hours. Please have more respect for the Seers and all their hard work. They're way more competent than vampires.
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Nov 28, 2017 07:26
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Soonmot posted:How do you defeat a meme? Especially when your main weapon is extreme violence instead of Magic? You take out your degree in semiotics and calmly tell people that memes aren't real, and then you beat the poo poo out of anyone that disagrees. Always remember that if violence isn't solving your problem you are hitting the wrong things.
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Nov 28, 2017 09:19
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Warthur posted:Actually, if you got rid of all the Beasts things would be just fine - most people will live happier and fuller lives not learning any of those Lessons, thanks. Oh, I ignore it's existence entirely.
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Nov 28, 2017 09:37
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Kurieg posted:One of them excretes infectious caviar from his dick that causes you to also excrete caviar from your genitals until you're driven insane and rip your genitalia off. You made that up. There is no way that is real and in a published book. Tell me it's not real... 
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Nov 28, 2017 10:57
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RBA-Wintrow posted:You made that up. Hell yeah it is real. The very next paragraph uses the words "yonic monstrosity" to describe the true form of the creature.
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Nov 28, 2017 11:46
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RBA-Wintrow posted:You made that up. Sorry man. The writer had some serious issues he needs to work out.  Also, don't forget the sexy snake monster man who exists in a part of the world 99 percent of all PC's will never visit, can probably shrug off tank shells for some reason no one can figure out, is basically impervious to harm from most PC's outside certain lines that aren't Beast, has no reason to interact with the outside world, and basically would read like either a self-parodying 3e Exalted antagonist or something a fanfic writer would come up with if it had the words "ORIGINAL CHARACTER DO NOT STEAL" tacked onto the end of his bio. Beast is a good advertisement for CofD's/NWoD's "It's only canon if you want it to be!" toolkit setup. Archonex fucked around with this message at 13:42 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 13:13
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The basic idea of some sort of creature that lays eggs inside you and drives you mad as you realize what happens is good and squicky. As with everything with beast though, the actual execution lends itself better to mockery than horror.
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Nov 28, 2017 13:18
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Slimnoid posted:I'm currently reading through Demon and every blurb involving vampires is "wow look at these useless loving nerds trying to act important." And honestly, Demon is one of the games that has fairly amiable stereotypes for other lines.
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Nov 28, 2017 13:23
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Slimnoid posted:I'm currently reading through Demon and every blurb involving vampires is "wow look at these useless loving nerds trying to act important." Hey now, to be fair they do have one extremely useful purpose. Being a hate sink for the Strix so they keep most of their attention focused on them instead of humanity is a hefty job, after all. Edit: More amusing to me is how ignorant a bunch of multi-centennial/millenial covenants are to the way the rest of the world is. For how many of the covenants claim to be superior to all human and supernatural life they're actually the supernatural equivalent of your usual human bystander that freaks out and panics when the monster of the week gets choke slammed through a wall by one of the actual protagonists. Which sort of makes sense. The goal of a vampire isn't to take out some monolithic entity or to uphold some primordial balance in the world. The goal of a vampire is to have one more day. Which means they're usually the sort of people who want to get their poo poo done while keeping their head down, get back home without having to deal with some weird supernatural bullshit, have a nice drink while enjoying the evening's entertainment, and prepare for the next day. Archonex fucked around with this message at 13:57 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 13:26
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ZearothK posted:Nah, you're doing it the right way, you don't want to make it a railroad. Personally when I ran Promethean I wrote down a few Milestones to nudge players towards, but the rest was pretty improvised or based on the goals players had set for themselves, sometimes I even declared a spontaneous Milestone had been reached when an event in the game felt significant enough to warrant it. Yeah, that's pretty much exactly what I was planning on doing, thanks. I was just worried since I've never run it before and the book was acting like I would be making a big mistake by running it like that. Kellsterik posted:I agree with this approach, but I'd also add that as a player, it's satisfying to know that the ST has thought about your PC and written out some milestones for their specific path ahead of time. It's like "oh, my character exists in the world and has traits outside of my character sheet." It's fun to do an elpis vision and be surprised by what the next milestone is. Oh yeah, I'm not just flying by the seat of my pants here. I do need to be somewhat prepared. I just don't like the idea of being like "good job completing that role and learning about another important aspect of humanity. But it's not a superlative milestone because it wasn't one of the important lessons for you." As I get to know these characters I'll be writing down ideas, as well as writing down anything interesting the players off-handedly mention. In fact, one of my players already has been talking during character creation and gave me some good stuff. "Learning that you can be wrong, but feel right and that's enough sometimes" is my favorite milestone idea she's given me. Not sure yet how I'll turn that into a learning situation, but I'm sure I'll find a way as the game gets going.
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Nov 28, 2017 14:22
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Archonex posted:above post This but replace the word "day" with "night".
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Nov 28, 2017 14:24
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I kind of hope your prometheans bumble like your civil servants. Being well-meaning bumblers is the epitome of humanity.
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Nov 28, 2017 14:31
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I ordered Geist after I got roped into playing one by friends in a CofD (non-M.E.T) larp trilogy for its last game and I really like it. The krewes and the concept of a sin-eater don't really mean anything here in Finland, but I really like the way it contrasts with Wraith and other old WoD stuff. The way you balance between the mortal world and the Underworld, and the whole "I am not yet done" - theme that allows for playing abnormal people hiding in a normal society. I will propably run a Geist/Mage WW1 crossover sometime in the spring.
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Nov 28, 2017 14:34
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Am I understanding spirits correctly? ( says no)They exist primarily in the Shadow, in which they run around and eat their Essence, fight other spirits and defend territory. Sometimes, especially if there's an Iris or a Locus, they cross over into Twlight to...do the same thing, but with marginally less spirits over here, and it's easier to hit humans with Numina? If the rules say that Spirits suffer Essence bleed even if they're in the Shadow, why stay in the shadow at all? The only thing I can think of is that it costs one Essence a day to stay active over in Twilight, but isn't there also much more food over here? Is the answer Werewolves? Spector29 fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 15:40
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RBA-Wintrow posted:You made that up. quote:The Blind Man’s blotted clothing is as result of a thick trail of what resemble fish eggs progressively leaking from his navel, urethra, and anus. Particularly around his navel area, a coagulated mass of pink and black eggs comes forth when the Blind Man strains his abdominal muscles. Horrifyingly, the Blind Man has from time to time passed these eggs off as salmon roe or sturgeon caviar, as they bear a sour, fishy odor. Those who consume his “produce” have their fertility dramatically increased, and gradually produce their own eggs in a similar fashion to the Blind Man, the only difference being that mortal-produced eggs possess a coat of thin white fur. This invariably drives the afflicted unfortunates insane, as they cannot stop the egg production, resulting in self-destructive harm. The Blind Man believes that by participating in the birthing, they increase the speed at which the Primogenitor will be reborn. And most of their Esurients inflict conditions that there aren't actually rules for, like Sickened, Staggered, and Paralyzed. And there's one Esurient that just gives them a flat +2 dice bonus "in any situation where being able to alter the laws of physics would be helpful".
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Nov 28, 2017 15:51
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Spector29 posted:Am I understanding spirits correctly? ( The twilight is a less harsh place for spirits to reside in. Manifesting in the material realm is very taxing and they can't stay there for long thanks to the Gauntlet, but the twilight is a place they can hang around in for longer once they've crossed the barrier. That is, based on my readings of it anyway. The Shadow is to the Black Lodge as the Twilight is to the Red Room. PCs are Agent Cooper: FBI Werewolf. Edit: I see the Shadow and Spirits as being more a Werewolf and/or Mage thing, so if you don't want to include the hairy bikers or virgin nerds in your chronicle but want to use a spirit then they can hang around in the Twilight and harass the PCs that way. Slimnoid fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 16:22
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Shadow is a place - the spirit world. Twilight isn't. Twilight is the state of being incorporeal in the world of flesh. The reason to stay in Shadow is that it's safer in the sense of no werewolf will be trying to murder you, and you can make friends there, and if you're good at hunting other spirits, food is plentiful. Essence is somewhat rarer in the world of flesh, you gotta find a resonant area rather than chowing down on another spirit, but it is also much less competition, as you note. That said, a lot of spirits can't hack It in the world of flesh because they lack a way to anchor themselves and properly manifest, so you typically won't find weak spirits hanging out there for long.
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Nov 28, 2017 16:39
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Spector29 posted:They exist primarily in the Shadow, in which they run around and eat their Essence, fight other spirits and defend territory. Sometimes, especially if there's an Iris or a Locus, they cross over into Twlight to...do the same thing, but with marginally less spirits over here, and it's easier to hit humans with Numina? Everything of impact in the real world has Resonance. This Resonance emits Essence, which is like a form of energy. The Essence seeps through the Gauntlet, and wells up in the Shadow. There, it becomes spirits, and occasionally loci. So if you look around your room, note some things you use a lot or have a big impact on you, and they're emitting a constant stream of energy to the Shadow, forming reflective spirits. If there's a bed there there's likely a bed spirit, urging more 'active' spirits to get onto it and go dormant and get eaten and eating Essence when it seeps over after people use it as a bed. If there's a computer there's a computer spirit associated with information and maybe emotions (depending on what you use it for mostly) that gets 'fed' when it's of import to you or whomever else. It's a predator's playground, however, these spirits don't just wait for you to feed them, and eat other spirits appropriate for them (computer might eat your bed/sleep/dream spirits if you're the type that stays up at night and doesn't get a lot of sleep due to the computer, or the bed might eat everything else in the room and command your attention). Odds are, your room doesn't have anything fantastically powerful, but lets switch over to a small town. It likely is centered around something, maybe a business, a church or other place of worship, it could just be a mall. Most everyone in the town goes there, their entire lives revolve around it, which causes more Essence to build up, and the reflective spirit is appropriately powerful, a spirit god that can easily devour other spirits in the town, but instead is offered up tithes of Essence (for 'protection') that keep it fed and keep lower spirits alive, though they still hunt among each other. Some good books to read for the concept of the Shadow are Predators or the Book of the Spirits. Now, a spirit might decide that the status quo is too tough to break into in the Shadow. Fire and heat spirits don't want to die off during the cold winter, but when massive cold and snow spirits come by every year there's nothing they can do. Or they might have lucked into a power that lets them escape this rat race, like Gauntlet Breach or Shadow Gate. Or maybe they had a locus and were fat and happy and something caused it to go away (a werewolf draining it dry or its earthly reflection being altered). One option is to make that reach across the Gauntlet. It's harder to live, but the Essence is bountiful, and much easier to make yourself. Spirits can reach across and influence things in the 'real' world, but it's tough to get the right conditions. Once you're there, just latch onto someone (or possess them) and you can make all the appropriate Essence you want, and the only real danger are werewolves (who are deadly, but at least far rarer than spirits). quote:If the rules say that Spirits suffer Essence bleed even if they're in the Shadow, why stay in the shadow at all? The only thing I can think of is that it costs one Essence a day to stay active over in Twilight, but isn't there also much more food over here? I really wouldn't call it Essence bleed. It's just one Essence to not go dormant (hibernation) a day. On the other side of the Gauntlet, they do bleed, 1 Essence per hour, or they take damage and get pulled back over. As others have noted, Twilight isn't a place. It's a state of being. When spirits cross the Gauntlet, they usually end up in Twilight form, this being a sort of 'out of phase' with reality state where they can see and hear things (it's supposed to be murky or blurry, I think) related to them like other spirits, but for the most part can't affect the real world. Like in a ghost movie where the ghost can't be seen and touches things but their hand moves right through it. It's arguably a safer way to deal with the real world, but first requires getting over the Gauntlet and finding an appropriate thing to fetter yourself to. The problem is that werewolves can see you in Twilight just fine and it can still cost a lot of Essence to do things. Which is why it usually leads to Claiming, where a spirit is 'one' with a being of flesh and not just hovering there in the Twilight waiting to be ganked or run out of Essence. So yes, werewolves. But also it costs more Essence in the physical world and not every spirit has access to it in a way that makes it a feasible alternative, while some spirits may already have it good where they are. nofather fucked around with this message at 17:14 on Nov 28, 2017 |
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Nov 28, 2017 17:11
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nofather posted:If there's a bed there there's likely a bed spirit, urging more 'active' spirits to get onto it and go dormant and get eaten 
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Nov 28, 2017 17:18
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You can't mention that without the sequel, Rape Stove: The Stove That Rapes People
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Nov 28, 2017 17:40
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