|
WENTZ WAGON NUI posted:I've written and deleted like three posts trying to put into words why I like Suicide a lot in spite of its flaws without using the words "dark," "goofy," "texture," or "hip hop" and I can't do it Suicide Squad makes a whole mess of sense when you see it as building a movie from samples of the other contemporary superhero movies
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:34
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:07 |
|
|
Snowglobe of Doom posted:Dammit now I'm tempted to go back and watch Suicide Squad again. My preferred way of viewing it has been to have it on in the background while I'm doing other poo poo. I don't own the movie but noticed this when it came to premium cable: it's much better when I can be distracted and then look up when Deadshot is shooting all the targets or Joker is pushing Harley into the toxic vat, or basically anytime Joker's gang is doing stuff (I love those guys, I desperately want to see Batman fight them).
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:34
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:My preferred way of viewing it has been to have it on in the background while I'm doing other poo poo. I don't own the movie but noticed this when it came to premium cable: it's much better when I can be distracted and then look up when Deadshot is shooting all the targets or Joker is pushing Harley into the toxic vat, or basically anytime Joker's gang is doing stuff (I love those guys, I desperately want to see Batman fight them). The worst part of the mess WB has made of DC's films is that we'll never see BatAffleck and Leto's Joker properly interacting with each other 
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:37
|
|
|
Guy A. Person posted:My preferred way of viewing it has been to have it on in the background while I'm doing other poo poo. This sure seems like a ringing endorsement of the movie. "It's so good that I don't actively watch it when I watch it!"  For what it's worth, I put on SS on HBO one day and saw the loving worst edit, when Flagg tells Waller that Enchantress "bolted" over the radio and we literally don't see her leaving. It was loving puzzling as poo poo.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:43
|
|
|
FoldableHuman posted:FoldableHuman: This movie's editing is really bad, to the point that even people who like it have trouble sorting out what happens in what order
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:45
|
|
|
Al Borland Corp. posted:It's not like any of us are really big suicide Squad fans either. i loved the comics
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:46
|
|
|
Foldable is doing the familiar thing where he is working backwards from his conclusion using technical-sounding terms that he doesn’t understand. His conclusion is that the characters are supposed to feel really really bad about Diablo, but don’t. Therefore, the film is not what it is supposed to be. Therefore the editing must be bad. Nothing in his post actually has anything to do with editing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:54
|
|
|
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:"Flava" "Based" is another good one.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:54
|
|
|
that flash movie sounded nice.
|
|
#
?
Dec 4, 2017 23:54
|
|
|
FoldableHuman posted:Nolan I'd never thought about it much but I think the DCU might have been better served if they'd folded the Nolan trilogy in. You'd have an avenue of explanation for what happened to Joker (and make SS an Arkham Asylum thing), a way to bring Batman back in after faking his death and coming out of hiding in the wake of Superman 9/11. You could explain Lex as filling the power vacuum that Wayne's departure allowed and maybe weave in some of WayneTech's inventions to explain Cyborg and even some of the Kryptonite weaponization. Not even sure wtf Flash's origin is in JL but maybe you could tie that in too and basically make WayneTech into DC's version of Oscorp; leveraged, corrupted or even bought out by Lex in Bruce's absence so Bruce returns and goes full on underground crazy guy using what he can so he seeks out WW and Aquaman. Maybe have Lucious retired, dead or in hiding so no one is left to guard the hen house anymore. Batman goes into "what have I loving done by leaving?" mode and comes back from exile. Might have been a cool way to fold Robin into JL as well. I don't know. Just spitballing here.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:02
|
|
|
WampaLord posted:This sure seems like a ringing endorsement of the movie. I mean, it's not, I've repeatedly said I am not a fan of the movie
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:03
|
|
|
Edit: no not this time dammit
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:06
|
|
|
Al Borland Corp. posted:It's not like any of us are really big suicide Squad fans either. Hi. porfiria posted:Although I generally agree with the idea that you should double down on your strengths and not try to be a friend to all, Suicide Squad was hosed to death by the studio to make it more marketable and it was a wild box office success. I'm sure the mixed to negative reaction worried them but they probably hoped they could kind of get away with it again in Justice League. Ayer has always seemed pretty happy with his final cut. If he thinks his vision was hosed by the studio, he's keeping schtum. Snowglobe of Doom posted:Dammit now I'm tempted to go back and watch Suicide Squad again. IIRC the extended has more Harley backstory, so watch that. BiggerBoat posted:I'd never thought about it much but I think the DCU might have been better served if they'd folded the Nolan trilogy in. You'd have an avenue of explanation for what happened to Joker (and make SS an Arkham Asylum thing), a way to bring Batman back in after faking his death and coming out of hiding in the wake of Superman 9/11. You could explain Lex as filling the power vacuum that Wayne's departure allowed and maybe weave in some of WayneTech's inventions to explain Cyborg and even some of the Kryptonite weaponization. BvS follows on fairly cleanly from a version of Dark Knight Rises where Alfred is dreaming the ending with Wayne happy in Paris. Batman's just been circling the drain, constantly relapsing into nightmarish violence, slowly losing everyone and everything in his life until he's in a box hotel with a Batcave beneath it.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:08
|
|
|
BiggerBoat posted:I'd never thought about it much but I think the DCU might have been better served if they'd folded the Nolan trilogy in. You'd have an avenue of explanation for what happened to Joker (and make SS an Arkham Asylum thing), a way to bring Batman back in after faking his death and coming out of hiding in the wake of Superman 9/11. You could explain Lex as filling the power vacuum that Wayne's departure allowed and maybe weave in some of WayneTech's inventions to explain Cyborg and even some of the Kryptonite weaponization. are any of these movies actually enhanced in a notable way by doing this? cause i kinda like the self-contained trilogy where batman realizes that being batman is a terrible idea and grows up
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:09
|
|
|
ElNarez posted:The thing that irks me the most about Dan's arguments, and the view of the greater critical consensus in general, is the idea that these movies can just be dismissed out of hand, that any meaning one could pull from them is just "cloudwatching", and not something that was deliberately put there. The idea of "quality" as a threshold, that only select movies get to say something, reeks of the worst gatekeeping bullshit, and it's completely antithetical to my vision of what movie studies are. He said none of those things, what the gently caress are you even talking about. I mean, I agree with you, but no one is even arguing that right now.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:09
|
|
|
He may be getting his topics mixed up. I believe he posted something like that along with his Man of Steel video in the critics thread.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:11
|
|
|
Brother Entropy posted:are any of these movies actually enhanced in a notable way by doing this? cause i kinda like the self-contained trilogy where batman realizes that being batman is a terrible idea and grows up I honestly don't know. I was just envisioning ways to try in a manner that may have helped DC establish a more coherent shared universe and thinking about ways to make that work a little better. It probably wouldn't add much to MoS or WW but maybe SS and BvS. EDIT: For BvS, I think it might have helped since so much of what that film drew from (TDKR comic) worked in large part due to their shared history, the idea of Bruce getting so much older and him going into exile. Doesn't help the Superman side of the argument but whatever. So, yeah, I'd say it would have improved BvS and maybe SS. BiggerBoat fucked around with this message at 00:19 on Dec 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:16
|
|
|
BiggerBoat posted:I honestly don't know. I was just envisioning ways to try in a manner that may have helped DC establish a more coherent shared universe and thinking about ways to make that work a little better. It probably wouldn't add much to MoS or WW but maybe SS and BvS. i mean my take there is that any improvements on newer stories come at the expense of the character arc of nolan's batman and that's a bummer like how iron man 3 should've absolutely been the last movie with iron man in it but instead tony's just stuck spinning his wheels making the same mistakes he'd already gotten past over and over
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:28
|
|
|
Brother Entropy posted:i mean my take there is that any improvements on newer stories come at the expense of the character arc of nolan's batman and that's a bummer I'll concede all that. Not saying it would have worked but not saying it wouldn't have either and found myself contemplating ways to tie the Nolan trilogy in ways where it might have. josh04 posted:
Sort of along these lines only with more exposition.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:36
|
|
|
Jimbot posted:He may be getting his topics mixed up. I believe he posted something like that along with his Man of Steel video in the critics thread. Yeah, the discussion kinda moved back and forth from there to here, and I thought the point would be better off in this thread, considering it was a derail of the critics thread. In my defense, it's not like the line of thought would change based on where the posts are.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:39
|
|
|
Brother Entropy posted:
Iron Man 3 is not about the ending of iron Man, it's a closed character arc where he grows out of the need to rely solely on himself. If the mcu were to take anything piper should've been way more active in Tony's choices instead of still just the ceo. Her spitballing about but eventually trying to talk Tony out of creating vision would've gone along way.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:40
|
|
|
Suicide Squad is more rewatchable than Batman v Superman. They are both bad movies.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:41
|
|
|
Brother Entropy posted:are any of these movies actually enhanced in a notable way by doing this? cause i kinda like the self-contained trilogy where batman realizes that being batman is a terrible idea and grows up Does he ever grow up? The note it ends on is so corny that it has to be a joke. Amazing Spiderman 2 has a much better take on mourning, the ending of DKR makes Bruce look like a shithead.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:50
|
|
|
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:Does he ever grow up? The note it ends on is so corny that it has to be a joke. Amazing Spiderman 2 has a much better take on mourning, the ending of DKR makes Bruce look like a shithead. 'grows up' might've been a little too charitable to tkdr bruce, yeah i think i've just gotten tired of comic book movies taking on so much of the worst aspects of their source material that got me to stop reading them in the first place in the time since nolan's trilogy that i now have a further appreciation that nolan's batman actually gets to have a drat ending
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:56
|
|
|
Spacebump posted:Suicide Squad is more rewatchable than Batman v Superman. They are both bad movies. Have you seen the Ultimate Edition of BvS? It's pretty good.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 00:58
|
|
|
teagone posted:Have you seen the Ultimate Edition of BvS? It's pretty good. Why would 30 minutes of redundant information somehow make a movie more "watchable?"
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:04
|
|
|
Its become cliche at this point to point out the classist implications of Batman given that hes a rich dude who beats up on poor dudes, but its pretty fun when you look at the Nolan trilogy as a whole and realise that pretty much all of the conflicts are brought about by Bruce being a complete idiot about the structural causes of crime. Had he just continued his fathers work then the trilogy wouldn't even happen. I love em from top to finish though. Each one has at least one thing outstanding about it and theres so many beautiful shots in each one. I think I speak for everyone when I say that its obvious that the worst thing about the trilogy is that Eric Roberts didn't get more screen time.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:05
|
|
|
bushisms.txt posted:Why would 30 minutes of redundant information somehow make a movie more "watchable?" It's not all redundant, it changes some context, clarifies a few ambiguities, and adds some nice characters scenes which I personally enjoyed (can't get enough of Cavill's Clark Kent, best the character has ever been IMO) and also relaxes the pacing, the TC has a much more staccato rhythm.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:06
|
|
|
Gorn Myson posted:I think I speak for everyone when I say that its obvious that the worst thing about the trilogy is that Eric Roberts didn't get more screen time. Maybe, but Nolan casts and uses bit parts really well, and for that I can't be one of the people who thinks he's bad or overrated.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:10
|
|
|
Megaman's Jockstrap posted:It's not all redundant, it changes some context, clarifies a few ambiguities, and adds some nice characters scenes which I personally enjoyed (can't get enough of Cavill's Clark Kent, best the character has ever been IMO) and also relaxes the pacing, the TC has a much more staccato rhythm. It's redundant because nothing changes in the movie from Lois knowing about lead, the actor talking to Holly Hunter, you as the audience are supposed to believe Superman can be both fallible but still good. Those scenes spoon feed you an emotion you should've already held.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:13
|
|
|
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:Maybe, but Nolan casts and uses bit parts really well, and for that I can't be one of the people who thinks he's bad or overrated. Are you talking about the SWAT guy who says he didn't sign up for this?
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:13
|
|
|
HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:Maybe, but Nolan casts and uses bit parts really well, and for that I can't be one of the people who thinks he's bad or overrated.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:17
|
|
|
hiddenriverninja posted:Are you talking about the SWAT guy who says he didn't sign up for this? That dude's OK, but Nolan has always had a Hitchcockian eye for frankly grotesque looking character actors.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:21
|
|
|
bushisms.txt posted:It's redundant because nothing changes in the movie from Lois knowing about lead, the actor talking to Holly Hunter, you as the audience are supposed to believe Superman can be both fallible but still good. Those scenes spoon feed you an emotion you should've already held. You're acting like a prick. Pacing matters. You could cut the first 10 minutes of Once Upon A Time in the West down to 30 seconds and not lose an iota of plot but pacing matters, those long languid shots of the gang goofing off at the train station are not "redundant". Has nothing to do about spoonfeeding or what emotions the audience "should" have (LOL)
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:24
|
|
|
bushisms.txt posted:Why would 30 minutes of redundant information somehow make a movie more "watchable?" You've already been told why the added Ultimate Edition scenes aren't redundant and why they make the film more "watchable" than the theatrical cut in this thread. Several times now. You don't agree, and that's fine. But you've also watched the Ultimate Edition to make that call. I'm recommending it to someone who hasn't potentially seen the Ultimate Edition to judge it for themselves instead of having some random internet goon potentially deny them a better viewing experience. The thing about opinions and tastes is they're different. That's how that poo poo works.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:30
|
|
|
Megaman's Jockstrap posted:You're acting like a prick. Pacing matters. You could cut the first 10 minutes of Once Upon A Time in the West down to 30 seconds and not lose an iota of plot but pacing matters, those long languid shots of the gang goofing off at the train station are not "redundant". Has nothing to do about spoonfeeding or what emotions the audience "should" have (LOL) The pacing is fine, the added scenes are nice but aren't some game changer, especially on rewatches. All the best parts, except the extra football stuff, are in the movie as is. Why are you talking about another movie? Are you really trying to argue that every thing cut in every movie is objectively better to be put back in and that some how equates to this one also being better? That's cool if you need to know that the senator believed superman had been setup, but you were always supposed to believe that he had been, so it wouldn't have mattered. Him walking in calmly and allowing her to speak first was him doing what you should've wanted from your Superman. teagone posted:You've already been told why the added Ultimate Edition scenes aren't redundant and why they make the film more "watchable" than the theatrical cut in this thread. Several times now. You don't agree, and that's fine. But you've also watched the Ultimate Edition to make that call. I'm recommending it to someone who hasn't potentially seen the Ultimate Edition to judge it for themselves instead of having some random internet goon potentially deny them a better viewing experience. The thing about opinions and tastes is they're different. That's how that poo poo works. I like the ultimate cut, i don't think it's better than the theatrical version, but don't mistake my question for some slight. I'm seriously asking, why would someone who deemed the original "unwatchable" want another 30 minutes, including horsemen out of nowhere? bushisms.txt fucked around with this message at 01:49 on Dec 5, 2017 |
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:44
|
|
|
Of course not, whether a cut is "better" or not is in the eye of the viewer, I'm talking about your continuing categorization of it as "nothing but redundant poo poo" that only "bad faith viewers" needed. That's simply not true.bushisms.txt posted:[The UC] is redundant scenes put back in so nerds could have the plot spelled out for them. The theatrical cut had faith the viewer could concentrate on a movie past costume designs. The additional scenes that show more aspects of Clark and Bruce push the mythic feel of the movie forward IMO, and that does matter and is a game-changer.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:47
|
|
|
Megaman's Jockstrap posted:Of course not, whether a cut is "better" or not is in the eye of the viewer, I'm talking about your continuing categorization of it as "nothing but redundant poo poo" that only "bad faith viewers" needed. That's simply not true. We already see Clark doing journalism and presenting his full case to Perry about Batman preying on the poor. And Clark goes from fallible being to just outright tricked beyond his powers. I'll take the original.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:56
|
|
|
The only bad part of Suicide Squad is when they sandwich Fortunate Son and Slim Shady and another pop song immediately one after the other in the everybody suit up scene. I love both the score and soundtrack of SS but that part is awkward. Totally redeemed by Croc licking his jacket clean alone, but still, a weak spot. That's all I can think of in terms of "bad editing", everything else slaps.josh04 posted:IIRC the extended has more Harley backstory, so watch that. And the rest of the Skwad get some more lines too!  Except Slipknot  woman-hating rope guyWampaLord posted:For what it's worth, I put on SS on HBO one day and saw the loving worst edit, when Flagg tells Waller that Enchantress "bolted" over the radio and we literally don't see her leaving. It was loving puzzling as poo poo. What a plot hole! how will we figure out what happened she teleported away
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 01:57
|
|
|
|
| # ? May 26, 2024 20:07 |
|
|
bushisms.txt posted:I'm seriously asking, why would someone who deemed the original "unwatchable" want another 30 minutes, including horsemen out of nowhere? Because I'm dumb and I found the theatrical cut confusing.
|
|
#
?
Dec 5, 2017 02:37
|
|
