Star Citizen: Death of a Space Thread?

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XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

There's hundreds of people looking at us right now, and they never post.

Creepy.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:05

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# ? May 22, 2024 00:26

Toops: Nov 5, 2015; -find mood stabilizers
-also,

iospace posted:

My catdog:

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:11

D_Smart: May 11, 2010; by FactsAreUseless; College Slice

ManofManyAliases posted:

If they are utilizing LY, and Amazon purchased a full license and right to sub license from CryTek, how is that a competing engine? I read that as UE4, Unity, etc...

loving

Because Lumberyard IS a different engine with different licensing terms, code base etc.

loving hell man, seriously?

----------------
This thread brought to you by a tremendous dickhead!

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:13

Colostomy Bag: Jan 11, 2016; C-Bangin' it

XK posted:

There's hundreds of people looking at us right now, and they never post.

Creepy.

Maybe they just like to watch?

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:13

Rad Russian: Aug 15, 2007; Soviet Power Supreme!

MOMA is the guy who just a few months ago was convinced that AWS runs on blade servers. So I wouldn't think he knows jack poo poo about technology, law or how licensing works. He sure likes to talk about many things like he does though.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:16

Ayn Marx: Dec 21, 2012

https://www.forbes.com/sites/erikkain/2018/01/11/42-video-game-predictions-for-2018/#2ade9f925b1f

9. Star Citizen won't launch in 2018. (See a list of games that will right here.) In fact, Star Citizen will continue to just be a weird meta-game that we're all supposed to puzzle out. Why are people paying thousands of dollars for digital ships that can't even be played yet? What's up with the feud between Chris Roberts and Derek Smart? How come a game that hasn't even released has its own convention already? These questions are all part of the puzzle---and that puzzle is the actual point of Star Citizen.

Shots fired.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:16

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

since I just hoovered up all the stellaris DLC, I realized I didn't get no space games for the thread for xmas this year

my fuckin bad

so here is the thread's Not-So-Secret Santa Streetroller Giveaway

no, no we ain't giving away streetroller. keep it in your pants ladies

what we are doing is gifting out some space games! please start your post like this

quote:

Not-So-Secret Santa Streetroller Giveaway
PO Box "That Star Citizen Thread"
Beverly Hills, CA
90210

Dear Streetroller,

and then add something nice to say about our friend to cheer him up! I mean we're already kinda doing that anyway but whatever shut up just let me have this. then please choose from ONE JUST ONE YOU GREEDY SONS OF BITCHES of the following gifts

1 x Origin key for Mass Effect: Andromeda
1 x Steam key for Space Engineers
1 x Origin key for Star Wars: Battlefront II
1 x Steam key for WARHAMMER 40K: Dawn of War III
1 x Steam key for STAR OCEAN: The Last Hope

I will then probably just randomly pick the winners or something

the only thing you have to have to play is PMs enabled. that's it! even moma can come out to play!

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:20

Toops: Nov 5, 2015; -find mood stabilizers
-also,

D_Smart posted:

loving Because Lumberyard IS a different engine with different licensing terms, code base etc.

loving hell man, seriously?

I mean to be fair, moma is just asking a question. I think if we punish people for trying to participate in a discussion of (imo) confusing and tangled legal matters with lots of unknowns, we diminish ourselves. Yeah, he talks mad poo poo to you constantly, but you know you like it.

At least, that�s the way I see it.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:20

Lladre: Jun 28, 2011; Soiled Meat

Toops posted:

My catdog:

Would pet.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:20

tuo: Jun 17, 2016

The VW Touareg, Porsche Cayenne and Audi Q7 never competed with each other, because they all share the same car underneath.

Or did they?

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:25

bandaid.friend: Apr 25, 2017; My first car was a stick

Streetroller posted:

You did make the video personal, but that doesn't sound like a bad thing? If someone tries to rob you, and you're seeking damages, of course it's personal. I've heard motivation sometimes factors into lawsuits, like where in a libel case if you go around saying poo poo like "I'm going to bankrupt them" or "I don't care about retractions or apologies" then someone's going to say 'well this person's not been harmed they just want money'. Your video makes it sound like you've really been affected by Star Citizen and you want to prevent them from lying to others? If motivation factors into it, yours appears honest

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:26

Golli: Jan 5, 2013

Apropos of nothing, I have a confession.

Blue cheese and yogurt tacos.

I like blue cheese, I like yogurt, I like tacos.

So having some leftover blue cheese from an evening of red wine (Chateauneuf du Pape), water crackers, and cheese with friends, I decided to give it a try the next day.

I used carne asada, soft corn tortillas, tomato, avocado and a little Cholula. I first placed a moderate dollop of yogurt and a sliver of blue cheese per the recipe before building the rest of the taco.

Result:

It wasn't bad. It wasn't spectacular either. The blue cheese didn't really cut through the other flavors to provide the expected counterpoint, and the yogurt was just there. Maybe I did the recipe wrong, but I didn't see enough potential to experiment with proportions.

2/5

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:28

G0RF: Mar 19, 2015; Some galactic defender you are, Space Cadet.

AP posted:

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/217678626?t=08h48m08s

Man, that Relay episode...

YOUTUBE: Relay outlines CIG�s Plans for 2018

They discuss the fact that CIG is now fast-tracking their Land Claim in-game protection racket scheme. In fact, it�s expected to be brought online before Stanton itself is complete. Erris, confronted by a gigantic flashing warning sign that reads �PAY-TO-LIVE MECHANICS ARE NOW MORE IMPORTANT TO CHRIS THAN BASIC KICKSTARTER PROMISES�, seems briefly troubled. As does Nekhara, who expresses his surprise and that of many others.

But the moment passes, the outrage prompts not anger or despair, just a moment of hopeful bargaining, which then leads to Erris concluding Beta by 2019 because they�ll surely get so much other work done this year.

Did you guys not see and transcribe Tony Z�s ATV appearance yesterday, Relay? With Tony saying Mining was slotted for 3.2 in 6 to 9 months, and even that was described conditionally so as to create a fallback position when they miss it? (Because they always miss it?)

Relay? More like �Delay�, amirite?

Seriously just rename your show and discuss this week�s news in CIG Delays, Historical Revisions, Outrages, and Warning Signs. Stop apologizing for CIG and start demanding them from Chris for playing the community like chumps and marks. Get on the right side of History and off the wrong side of His Story. The view is so much clearer from over here, Erris. (Read my letter again and see just how reasonable it was along all!)

G0RF fucked around with this message at 18:32 on Jan 12, 2018

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:29

Timby: Dec 23, 2006; Your mother!

D_Smart posted:

GTFO. There was no termination or it would have been in the CIG response.

And CIG never - ever - claimed anything of the sort. They basically said they stopped using the engine. That's it. The End.

That aside from the fact that NOTHING in the GLA gives CIG or Crytek ANY "at will" termination option.

Jeez man, don't you ever get anything right?

I'm not a lawyer but I've dealt with contracts extensively throughout my career, and Crytek undergoing extensive restructuring in 2014 because of inability to pay its debt ... that seems to me as a strong contender to qualify the conditions of 8.2(b)(ii).

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:29

Toops: Nov 5, 2015; -find mood stabilizers
-also,

Lladre posted:

Would pet.

When he was a pup:

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:30

Beet Wagon: Oct 19, 2015

TheAgent posted:

since I just hoovered up all the stellaris DLC, I realized I didn't get no space games for the thread for xmas this year

my fuckin bad

so here is the thread's Not-So-Secret Santa Streetroller Giveaway

no, no we ain't giving away streetroller. keep it in your pants ladies

what we are doing is gifting out some space games! please start your post like this

and then add something nice to say about our friend to cheer him up! I mean we're already kinda doing that anyway but whatever shut up just let me have this. then please choose from ONE JUST ONE YOU GREEDY SONS OF BITCHES of the following gifts

1 x Origin key for Mass Effect: Andromeda
1 x Steam key for Space Engineers
1 x Origin key for Star Wars: Battlefront II
1 x Steam key for WARHAMMER 40K: Dawn of War III
1 x Steam key for STAR OCEAN: The Last Hope

I will then probably just randomly pick the winners or something

the only thing you have to have to play is PMs enabled. that's it! even moma can come out to play!

You're a good man, Charlie Brown.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:30

XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

Golli posted:

It wasn't bad. It wasn't spectacular either. The blue cheese didn't really cut through the other flavors to provide the expected counterpoint, and the yogurt was just there. Maybe I did the recipe wrong, but I didn't see enough potential to experiment with proportions.

2/5

The hot sauce can drown out the blue cheese. It works best when you use a lot of lettuce and tomato, and directly spice the beef when you cook it, like frying it up with some jalapenos. You lay the yogurt and blue cheese in the bottom of the taco, then put the meat directly into it, then top off with lettuce and tomato.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:35

Hav: Dec 11, 2009; Fun Shoe

TheAgent posted:

sushi

no this isn't a joke, it was p good

How was the day shift?

XK posted:

Don't be willfully dumb.

You're not my real Dad.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:35

Golli: Jan 5, 2013

Not-So-Secret Santa Streetroller Giveaway
PO Box "That Star Citizen Thread"
Beverly Hills, CA
90210

Dear Streetroller,

You don't seem like the type to ordinarily need outside affirmation, but these are not ordinary circumstances.

I applaud your refusal to meekly take the poor treatment handed to you by Chris and his band of thieves. There are many people out there who have had the same experience, but don't have the courage to publicly take a stand and say what's on your mind.

Going online as yourself, and telling your story the way you did is commendable. If more people who have had the same customer experience as you did something similar, the world would be a better place.

PS internet commenters are shitheels. ignore them

e: Dealer's choice - I don't have any consoles if that matters.

Golli fucked around with this message at 18:41 on Jan 12, 2018

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:37

Hav: Dec 11, 2009; Fun Shoe

TheAgent posted:

and then add something nice to say about our friend to cheer him up! I mean we're already kinda doing that anyway but whatever shut up just let me have this. then please choose from ONE JUST ONE YOU GREEDY SONS OF BITCHES of the following gifts

He's a sexual tyrannosaur that can outdistance all goons on a slight downward incline.

I need no incentives, so keep your geegaws.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:37

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

Hav posted:

How was the day shift?

it was for a private party, usually they don't open until 6. several gals were specifically requested. I sat upstairs in one of the glass VIP rooms. center pole goes up almost 30 feet, some very, very hardcore ladies on that thing. pretty impressive

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:40

The Titanic: Sep 15, 2016; Unsinkable

Streetroller posted:

Man I gotta be honest.
I don't even think I can take the hate of this poo poo.

It's not that it surprises me or that I can't handle it on a personal level, but it's that those sick individuals are a surrounded by the disabled in their real lives.

This is how they really think? It's disgusting to think about because I've met angels and saints compared to me with disabilities -- and I've seen those people get taken advantage of by assholes like that.

I dropped literal tears for those people. Not trolling, it makes me want to vomit.

I�m sorry.

You should just disable comments and let them shake their fists on reddit uselessly.

Nobody should have to endure this sort of crap over a dumbass video game. Not you, not the guy who ultimately passed away from cancer recently, and the health or disability shouldn�t even be a factor.

People just shouldn�t do this, period, regardless of who it is.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:40

Brazilianpeanutwar: Aug 27, 2015; Spent my walletfull, on a jpeg, desolate, will croberts make a whale of me yet?

Golli posted:

Apropos of nothing, I have a confession.

Blue cheese and yogurt tacos.

I like blue cheese, I like yogurt, I like tacos.

So having some leftover blue cheese from an evening of red wine (Chateauneuf du Pape), water crackers, and cheese with friends, I decided to give it a try the next day.

I used carne asada, soft corn tortillas, tomato, avocado and a little Cholula. I first placed a moderate dollop of yogurt and a sliver of blue cheese per the recipe before building the rest of the taco.

Result:

It wasn't bad. It wasn't spectacular either. The blue cheese didn't really cut through the other flavors to provide the expected counterpoint, and the yogurt was just there. Maybe I did the recipe wrong, but I didn't see enough potential to experiment with proportions.

2/5

Now do pineapple on pizza

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:41

Golli: Jan 5, 2013

TheAgent posted:

it was for a private party, usually they don't open until 6. several gals were specifically requested. I sat upstairs in one of the glass VIP rooms. center pole goes up almost 30 feet, some very, very hardcore ladies on that thing. pretty impressive

Are you Corrado "Junior" Soprano?

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:42

Phi230: Feb 2, 2016; by Fluffdaddy

Nothing personnel, kid, as streetroller bludgeons croberts with lawsuit paperwork

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:43

Lladre: Jun 28, 2011; Soiled Meat

All kidding aside, please probate people who start making GBS threads up the recap thread.
_{Also probate Derek every time he links his own tweets}
^{Never not probate Derek.}

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:43

Golli: Jan 5, 2013

Brazilianpeanutwar posted:

Now do pineapple on pizza

If my dog won't eat it, then I won't.

Dogs wouldn't eat it. I feel bad for such inhumane treatment. I gave them turkey jerky and belly rubs by way of apology.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:44

Phi230: Feb 2, 2016; by Fluffdaddy

Strip Club sushi is one way to commit suicide I guess

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:44

XK: Jul 9, 2001; Star Citizen is everywhere. It is all around us. Even now, in this very room. You can see it's fidelity when you look out your window or when you watch youtube

The Titanic posted:

I�m sorry.

You should just disable comments and let them shake their fists on reddit uselessly.

Nobody should have to endure this sort of crap over a dumbass video game. Not you, not the guy who ultimately passed away from cancer recently, and the health or disability shouldn�t even be a factor.

People just shouldn�t do this, period, regardless of who it is.

Nah, leave comments open. Just post "wrong" on any dissenting comment.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:46

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

Golli posted:

Are you Corrado "Junior" Soprano?

I'm actually a 1 to 1 copy of big pussy without the style, cash or mobster tude but deffo with the weight/hair

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:47

Zzr: Oct 6, 2016

Brazilianpeanutwar posted:

fun fact - dogs can't look up.

True. Evidence :

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:49

Hav: Dec 11, 2009; Fun Shoe

Zzr posted:

True. Evidence :

That dog is merely choosing not to look up.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:52

Tippis: Mar 21, 2008; It's yet another day in the wasteland.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T4HPTs-j3Mk
:proof:

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:53

TheAgent: Feb 16, 2002; The call is coming from inside Dr. House; Grimey Drawer

TheAgent posted:

I'm actually a 1 to 1 copy of big pussy without the style, cash or mobster tude but deffo with the weight/hair

also me:

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:53

DapperDon: Sep 7, 2016

Lladre posted:

All kidding aside, please probate people who start making GBS threads up the recap thread.
_{Also probate Derek every time he links his own tweets}
^{Never not probate Derek.}

Start by probating this thread shitlord.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:53

Bofast: Feb 21, 2011; Grimey Drawer

Dusty Lens posted:

Ortwin negotiating the Crytek GLA, 2011.

Which one of them is Ortwin, though?

TheAgent posted:

"I plead the 4th"

"the 4th? you mean the fifth right?"

"nope. the 4th. as in 4th stimpire"

*deskeletonization teams burst into the room*

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:59

DapperDon: Sep 7, 2016

Beet Wagon posted:

Street, I love you buddy, but you're coming dangerously close to appearing to care about something on the internet. Abandon the youtube comments, there are only ghouls there.

Seriously, just post videos and never read the comments - it'll make them furious to know their shots didn't land.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 18:59

Maldoror: Oct 5, 2003; by R. Guyovich; Nap Ghost

Does anyone know why Binky ATX / Bootcha / Michael Moorland stopped uploading Sunk Cost Galaxy episodes? He didn't get threatened or anything did he? :ohdear:

# ? Jan 12, 2018 19:00

Combat Theory: Jul 16, 2017

Toops posted:

Nice post, and I'll just add this: Even if your feature design is simple, such as
code:
{"air": 1.0}
Instead of
code:
 {"nitrogen": 0.7809, "oxygen": 0.2095, "argon": 0.0093, "carbonDioxide": 0.0004}
that in itself doesn't automatically make the code simple. See folks, the hard part of programming isn't writing code that does a thing, it's the code that glues them all together, sends messages between all the different systems, and generally makes them work in concert to form a cohesive system, so that every function knows what to do, when to do it, and has the information it needs when they get called on.

It doesn't take programming experience to know that SC's code is a colossal goat-gently caress in this regard. You can feel it. Your intuition knows something is wrong down in the guts. Overall low framerates, massive game locks on the order of seconds, ridiculous collision/clipping issues, unresponsive UI, unresponsive actions (ahem doors, ramps), poor maintenance of state (doors and ramps again), etc. The engine is choking and sputtering like an old lawnmower that sat out in the yard naked all winter, because the information is poorly manicured, and the inter-system messaging is hosed.

If you're interacting with a system in SC, chances are 1 of 2 things are true:
1. That system doesn't have the info it needs and locks up waiting for someone to kindly send it along
2. The opposite; That system gets loving HADOKEN'd with a poo poo-heap of data, most of it totally superfluous, and has to dig through it with a fine-toothed comb to pull out a couple params

In my experience writing game code, this is much harder to get right than most other types of applications, for two reasons, which form a deadly binity:
1. Game code is inherently stateful
2. That state needs to be analyzed, compared with player input, altered, and bundled up into a frame that the video card won't choke on, as fast as loving possible.

You can't wait. If you do, you block the main update loop and boom, the game locks up, chugs, and the hapless player thinks "the gently caress is this poo poo?" Every compute cycle is precious.

A good SC example is when a ship spawns on the pad I'm standing on. Literal megabytes of unfathomably complex data structures describing every nuance of every component of the overdesigned fidelity chariot blast into your game client like the loving Kool-Aid Man, sending waves of panic and abject terror through every corner of your operating system.

Now, let's think about what happens here. This is massively over-simplified, and I added some details to help explain how this data is used, but when some rear end in a top hat spawns an Idris, the server will send you a hulking data structure that looks something like this:
code:
{
  entityType: ship,
  name: Idris,
  model: models\ships\idris\chassis\idrisChassisModel.dat,
  position: {x: 2910, y: 99, z: 194729},
  positionType: world,
  components: [
    {
      entityType: mainEngine,
      name: idrisMainEngine01,
      model: models\ships\idris\engines\idrisMainEngineModel.dat,
      position: {x: -20, y: 0, z: -500},
      positionType: rel
    },
    {
      entityType: rcsThruster,
      name: idrisMainEngine,
      model: models\ships\idris\engines\idrisMainEngineModel.dat,
      position: {x: 20, y: 0, z: -500},
      positionType: rel
    },
    {
      entityType: outerDoor,
      name: idrisOuterDoor001,
      model: models\ships\doors\idris\idrisOuterDoorModel.dat,
      position: {x: -150, y: 20, z: 200},
      positionType: rel
    },
    {
      entityType: outerDoor,
      name: idrisOuterDoor002,
      model: models\ships\idris\doors\idrisOuterDoorModel.dat,
      position: {x: 150, y: 20, z: 200},
      positionType: rel
    },
    {
      entityType: ramp,
      name: idrisMainRamp,
      model: models\ships\idris\ramps\idrisMainRamp.dat,
      position: {x: 150, y: 20, z: 200},
      positionType: rel
    },
... etc
Every one of those "components" are separate entities with their own 3d model. Each one has to be unraveled and loaded into objects (unmarshalled), their 3d model information retrieved from disk and loaded into ram/videoram, assembled according to their relative position, and plonked down into the game world at so-and-so position. As you can imagine, the more poo poo you have to unravel and load, the longer it takes. This is what pisses me off so much about Chris Roberts and his "FIDELETY" obsession. There is a very clear point where there's just too much information to process and your game locks up, the servers poo poo themselves, and the whole thing collapses under its own weight.

So what do you do? Well, you can make the ships simpler, which ain't gonna happen in a million hand-waving lifetimes, or you can defer the processing in order to unblock the main update loop. But that adds complexity, and now you have a state problem. Is the ship there or isn't it? Do I load each entity in its own thread? Well, how do I know when the ship is "assembled?" Surely some will load faster than others which means each ship component will "pop in" when it's good and god drat ready. And do you really think that'll fly in The Chris Robert Fidelity Funhouse? OK, so do I wait for every component's model to load in memory before it's allowed to visually spawn? Well if so, now every component has to report its state to some main-brain statekeeper who stands there with a clipboard checking boxes, then says yep, everyone is present and accounted for, let's glue all these 3d models together and start rendering it. What if we need to add a Hairy Roberts Drinkblaster 8000 to the bridge? How many lines of code will that touch?

This is why SC is getting worse, not better. They barely know what each system will do, and they' haven't even considered how they will communicate. Chris and his ramshackle crew of "game designers" are jamming panicky, poorly-conceived features down the devs' throats, who are forced to plop brittle, rushed //TODO: Fix This code into this witch's steaming poo poo cauldron. And man, I don't need to tell you, it's boiling over.

And so Star Citizen the computer program is just getting worse, and worse, and slower, and buggier, and choppier, and crashier as the bloated, abominable kludge slowly grinds to a halt and eats itself like Pizza the Hut.

This all happened because CIG did it full-on gently caress backwards. Your game designers need to have a really solid idea of not only what the systems are, but how the systems logically interact in order to build a gamified, cohesive logical flow that results in a fluid, contiguous causal map that resembles a game. You need to strip your features of all fluff, avoid details like the plague, keeping them simple, stark, and easy to understand. You need to build and assemble them as quickly as possible so you can prove your concept, and adjust the design when your assumptions don't all come true. Then you iterate, redesign, re-write, and hopefully, if you kept things simple, this isn't a massive undertaking. Code has to be designed to be flexible, but only flexible in the right ways. Too much flexibility kills your code because it's easier/cleaner to write something concrete. Death by a thousand ifs. And it really, really helps when you can do this without having to waste time on premature minutiae, trillions of polygons, sizzle-reel polish, drink machines, jacket layering, loving ARGON, etc.

Now the final coup-de-grace, which brings it home to my original point: Even if you do all this right and keep it simple, things that look simple on paper often blow up when you start coding. Simple components (in this case, "game systems") can fall apart at the seams when they have to start playing with others. But CIG doesn't have this problem, because they've never done anything simple. They still don't even know what their game systems are supposed to do, let alone how to code them individually, let alone how to assemble them into a working game, let alone how to make that game fun.

In closing, Star Citizen is not good, it's not bad. It's nothing. A huge. loving. Nothingburger.

An excellent post. Pizza the Hut approves.

# ? Jan 12, 2018 19:02

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# ? May 22, 2024 00:26

Jobbo_Fett: Mar 7, 2014; Slava Ukrayini; Clapping Larry

Not-So-Secret Santa Streetroller Giveaway
PO Box "That Star Citizen Thread"
Beverly Hills, CA
90210

Dear Streetroller,

You seem like a pretty chill dude. Wanna Netflix and chill?

Yours Truly,

Jobbo "Dreamboat" Fett

# ? Jan 12, 2018 19:03

The Something Awful Forums > Archives > Comedy Goldmine > The Goodmine > Star Citizen: Death of a Space Thread?

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