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Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



EponymousMrYar posted:

Spoiler: kill the one with the CNJ cane :ssh:

I can't remember if there are any healer NPC's that are playable races that aren't CNJ based.
There's the guy in the HW AST quest, but he's not a recurring NPC. I imagine you'll run into some if we ever have to fight Sharlayan.

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WrightOfWay
Jul 24, 2010


SonicRulez posted:



I don't think there is any part of this game worse than when O7S starts the missile poo poo during Air Force. I just hold my breath and pray every time. It's so loving mean. I swore I was gonna eat wall or the side of a hitbox here.

The outside corner of the grate looking thing the add is sitting on is always safe from missles. It's also useful to stand there during the second Ultros.

SKULL.GIF
Jan 20, 2017


I really enjoy how the God Kefka fight is essentially an actual god figuring out different ways to just smear you like the insect mortal you are and laughing and moving onto the next total obliteration attack when you, improbably, survive. All the 1HP attacks and then different iterations on finishing you off after Fallen Angel-ing you are pretty neat.

I think the only "tricked you!" part of God Kefka is Futures Numbered/Pasts Forgotten, and if not for the Echo he probably would kill you all the time with that. Nice change-of-pace from Clown Kefka

Neo Exdeath in comparison just tried to repeatedly blast you with overpowered lasers. And, like, I'm not saying that it was boring -- it was really tense -- but NED definitely embraced the Void and just tried to erase you. God Kefka is clearly aware that he exists in the same reality you do, though, and the fight is him going "Okay, triangle spam didn't work. What about... BIG TRIANGLES???"

Reiterpallasch
Nov 3, 2010



Fun Shoe

SonicRulez posted:



I don't think there is any part of this game worse than when O7S starts the missile poo poo during Air Force. I just hold my breath and pray every time. It's so loving mean. I swore I was gonna eat wall or the side of a hitbox here.

Memorize which quarter of your assigned pool is safe, as well as the always safe east-west lines.

Cabbit
Jul 19, 2001

Is that everything you have?

Hi, I have a couple stupid questions:

1.) If I'm interested in playing a Samurai, which job should I play pre-50 to get the closest approximation of the experience?
2.) I'm sure this is subjective, but is there enough (enjoyable) playtime in the 50+ content to justify shelling out for Stormblood if I don't really plan on sticking around for much more than the story quests and maybe some extremely casual queue/LFR/duty finder/whatever that poo poo is called?

Kitfox88
Aug 21, 2007

Anybody lose their glasses?

Mr. Nice! posted:

You can get all three once you cap each branch out. I have a level 20 bird and I'll routinely put on whm head, drg body, and tank feet or some oddball combo.

Martman posted:

AFAIK you can get the others, but you have to rank your chocobo up past 10 to max multiple trees at once.

Guess I need to get an onion then. :smithicide:

Brainamp
Sep 4, 2011

More Zen than Zenyatta

Cabbit posted:

Hi, I have a couple stupid questions:

1.) If I'm interested in playing a Samurai, which job should I play pre-50 to get the closest approximation of the experience?
2.) I'm sure this is subjective, but is there enough (enjoyable) playtime in the 50+ content to justify shelling out for Stormblood if I don't really plan on sticking around for much more than the story quests and maybe some extremely casual queue/LFR/duty finder/whatever that poo poo is called?

Uh, monk maybe? And there's two expansions worth of stuff to do post 50.

Also you can't play samurai if you don't pick up Stormblood.

homeless snail
Mar 14, 2007

Cabbit posted:

Hi, I have a couple stupid questions:

1.) If I'm interested in playing a Samurai, which job should I play pre-50 to get the closest approximation of the experience?
2.) I'm sure this is subjective, but is there enough (enjoyable) playtime in the 50+ content to justify shelling out for Stormblood if I don't really plan on sticking around for much more than the story quests and maybe some extremely casual queue/LFR/duty finder/whatever that poo poo is called?
There's nothing really like Samurai, just pick a melee dps you like I guess. Monk maybe.

And also I think you're underestimating just how much story content there is between 50 and level cap. That's 2 years worth of ARR patches, Heavensward, 2 years worth of Heavensward patches, and then Stormblood. A lot of dang content

WrightOfWay
Jul 24, 2010


The only content prior to level 50 in Stormblood is a playable race, so unless you really want to play a dragon person you can put off buying it until you know whether you like the game.

NachtSieger
Apr 10, 2013


Even then, you can just use the Fantasia you get at the end of the ARR MSQ to turn yourself into a lizard dragon person :v:.

Cephas
May 11, 2009

Humanity's real enemy is me!
Hya hya foowah!

Cabbit posted:

Hi, I have a couple stupid questions:

1.) If I'm interested in playing a Samurai, which job should I play pre-50 to get the closest approximation of the experience?
2.) I'm sure this is subjective, but is there enough (enjoyable) playtime in the 50+ content to justify shelling out for Stormblood if I don't really plan on sticking around for much more than the story quests and maybe some extremely casual queue/LFR/duty finder/whatever that poo poo is called?

monk shares a lot of gear with samurai, so that wouldn't be a bad bet. They don't really play too similarly, though; monk is about frantically keeping a huge self-buff rolling and a variety of smaller buffs/debuffs active, while samurai (at around level 50 at least) has really generous timers for its buffs and debuffs and is more about managing the order in which you do attacks so that you can perform the right iaijutsu at the right time. i'm not sure which class is mechanically the closest to samurai. maybe pick a class that sounds like your second preference after samurai and look forward to having both of them leveled up once you hit 50?

stormblood gets you heavensward as well, and heavensward is where the game's storyline and dungeons get noticeably a lot better. i'm taking a break from the game right now and I haven't played any of stormblood, but heavenward's dungeons are pretty much all fun and cool.

Tenik
Jun 23, 2010


Kitfox88 posted:

Guess I need to get an onion then. :smithicide:

If you are in DGKK, we keep some in the FC chest. If you aren't in DGKK but you are on excal, send a /tell to me and I'll hook you up. My in game name is Your Buddy. If I'm not online, you can also try to send a /tell to Altruizine Altruizine, and ask for one. Just make sure to mention that Your Buddy offered to help in the SA thread.

Kitfox88
Aug 21, 2007

Anybody lose their glasses?

Tenik posted:

If you are in DGKK, we keep some in the FC chest. If you aren't in DGKK but you are on excal, send a /tell to me and I'll hook you up. My in game name is Your Buddy. If I'm not online, you can also try to send a /tell to Altruizine Altruizine, and ask for one. Just make sure to mention that Your Buddy offered to help in the SA thread.

Naw, I have plenty of gil, I'm just a skinflint, no worries.

HackensackBackpack
Aug 20, 2007

Who needs a house out in Hackensack? Is that all you get for your money?

Kitfox88 posted:

Guess I need to get an onion then. :smithicide:

If your bird is at rank 10 in one category, you'll get the second barding at rank 15 by going down the next one exclusively. The final barding comes at rank 20.

There are two free onions you can get, too, by the way, both in HW. One is from a quick level 50 quest in Ishgard, in the Jeweled Crozier, and the other is at the end of a lengthy chain in Tailfeather.

Hra Mormo
Mar 6, 2008

The Internet Man
There's not a single instance of Missile Simulation where you're actually in a hurry to go anywhere. Just calm the gently caress down, check the pattern and leisurely make your way to where-ever you need to be taking all the time in the world to plot your route. Just whatever you do don't try to rush past the front of a missile, always go around the back.

SonicRulez
Aug 6, 2013

GOTTA GO FIST
I appreciate the solutions to the problem. I actually realized how long you can wait to get to the Air Force when I accidentally Shukuchi'd from roughly half way there back to the boss and didn't wipe the raid. With my dps and health it's a lil bit of a gamble though.

Being on the northeast side of Guardian for an Armor Crush and then being tethered to the southwest add still feels like poo poo. It just reminds me of the Mindjack mechanic from O3S that I was also bad at. The place you need to stand is obvious and making it there isn't always a challenge, but sometimes the RNG is easy and sometimes it's not. It's just one of very few mechanics where there isn't a designated spot to stand or route to run in 100% of pulls. It requires some improv.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


Hra Mormo posted:

There's not a single instance of Missile Simulation where you're actually in a hurry to go anywhere. Just calm the gently caress down, check the pattern and leisurely make your way to where-ever you need to be taking all the time in the world to plot your route. Just whatever you do don't try to rush past the front of a missile, always go around the back.

The closest you get to needing to hurry is the missiles + atomic rays + chakras pattern late in the fight. If you have to place an atomic ray and then move to an inside chakra while dodging multiple missiles it can get a little tight. You don't need to drop the atomic all the way in the corner though, just far enough out that the center of the map stays clear.

Otherwise, the best thing to do is learn which spots are always safe and stick to them until the missiles pass.

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


a crisp refreshing Moxie posted:

IIRC you get enough skill pints at rank 16 for a second barding, and then enough for the third exactly at 20.

How hard is it leveling the chocobo past 10? I finally got mine to 10 the other day and it feel like it took forever to just get it there.

Solanumai
Mar 26, 2006

It's shrine maiden, not shrine maid!
Do the companion challenge log entries every week, both together are good for about 35-40% of a level. Otherwise shove the thing in a stable and feed it (as often as once per hour). Each feeding is about 1% of exp to level (less as you get closer to level 20). Also, it can be fed once per hour by someone else, too.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.

Oxyclean posted:

How hard is it leveling the chocobo past 10? I finally got mine to 10 the other day and it feel like it took forever to just get it there.

It’s not bad at all if you do any sort of overworld leveling. Have your chocobo out while you do any beast tribes, fates, levequests, etc. That will get you both experience for individual kills (400xp per fate mob in dravanian hinterlands years ago when i hit rank 20) plus hourly feeding in the stable means you could get a rank a week easy or more.

Mr. Nice!
Oct 13, 2005

bone shaking.
soul baking.
Also if you’re feeding please feed other birds and ask fc mates to feed yours as well.

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe

Shere posted:

Do the companion challenge log entries every week, both together are good for about 35-40% of a level. Otherwise shove the thing in a stable and feed it (as often as once per hour). Each feeding is about 1% of exp to level (less as you get closer to level 20). Also, it can be fed once per hour by someone else, too.

Mr. Nice! posted:

It’s not bad at all if you do any sort of overworld leveling. Have your chocobo out while you do any beast tribes, fates, levequests, etc. That will get you both experience for individual kills (400xp per fate mob in dravanian hinterlands years ago when i hit rank 20) plus hourly feeding in the stable means you could get a rank a week easy or more.

Companion challenges are about 15% for me at bird level 10 and XP from mob kills is very low. Unless you're doing the hourly feeding very regularly, a level a week is completely unrealistic in my experience.

Saint Freak
Apr 16, 2007

Regretting is an insult to oneself
Buglord
I believe it's 5% for the 20 kills and 10% for the 100 kills exactly.

ChaseSP
Mar 25, 2013



Last I checked killing level 70 mobs gave the most exp. Could veg out and kill a shitton of Griffins and sell the hides

Emberfox
Jan 15, 2005

~rero rero rero rero rero
Leveling another character on a server with the XP bonus, and I really think my issue with the 2.0/2.X story is the various filler arcs and backtracking. The story itself is fine, but it really could be abridged. Also the Company of Heroes stuff is still terrible.

Also SMN having their 35 stuff gated behind doing Titan really hurts when you're leveling faster than the story can keep up.

Solanumai
Mar 26, 2006

It's shrine maiden, not shrine maid!
Sorry, I must have misremembered or counted all the extra exp I was getting from kills, it's been a while since I did it.

Challenge log is still be best, easiest, most consistent exp source.

For the record, I was lousy at keeping on top of chocobo stuff and it took me several months to cap it out. Definitely take it as a long-term goal.

Solanumai fucked around with this message at 17:18 on May 2, 2018

The Grimace
Sep 18, 2005

Are you a BigMac of imbeciles!?

Colgate posted:

Leveling another character on a server with the XP bonus, and I really think my issue with the 2.0/2.X story is the various filler arcs and backtracking. The story itself is fine, but it really could be abridged. Also the Company of Heroes stuff is still terrible.

Also SMN having their 35 stuff gated behind doing Titan really hurts when you're leveling faster than the story can keep up.

Pretty much, yeah. The 2.x content was made with the mind of keeping players busy for as long as possible to tide people over between patches. Nowadays that's not a problem and people would like to rush through the chaff to get to the real meat in Ishgard. Unfortunately now there are 100 quests between ARR and HW, and even if the content is interesting, it's prolonged by things like finding perfume for F'lhaminn or dispersing rations to Domans.

It could use pruning, but they have already pruned parts of the 2.x storyline once to my memory to remove guildhests from the 2.1 content, and again to add experience and equipment to the quest rewards. I don't think they want to revisit it anymore due to artistic integrity or laziness or whatever have you.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



Colgate posted:

Leveling another character on a server with the XP bonus, and I really think my issue with the 2.0/2.X story is the various filler arcs and backtracking. The story itself is fine, but it really could be abridged. Also the Company of Heroes stuff is still terrible.

There's an enormous amount of cruft they could pare down without affecting the overall arc or any of the (very thin) character development moments that occur. I suspect that's going to be a part of the next expansion, because the current situation isn't really tenable: you either gate new players behind multiple months of working through the story, or you start offering a free jump potion with the latest expansion and create a very confusing story for people just jumping in.

What I'd do for the next expansion is:
  • Dramatically cut down on the number of MSQs in 2.X. They need to be utterly ruthless with this: if it doesn't advance the plot or provide decent characterization, junk it. Compress every Primal arc into maybe 4-5 quests of prep work. Get rid of any quest that's just "run over here and talk to this guy"; don't waste the time of new players. Be a bit more lenient with Heavensward, but there's still a few areas you could trim without losing much. The only thing I think you could bother to trim in Stormblood are some of the Ruby Sea quests, but the story's put together coherently enough that cutting would probably damage it more than it would help it.
  • Revamp the Heavensward aether currents so that they're all present in single quests without requiring chains, and possibly cut down on the number of currents required in general.
  • Increase MSQ EXP across the board to require few to no sidequests or additional roulettes to be done by the player to stay on curve. Level syncing on major content pieces means that overleveling concerns aren't an issue.
The first point is what'll take them the most time, and I suspect it's why they've been hesitant to do it. You don't have quite the same number of issues to solve as WoW did with Cataclysm, but you've still got to make the new player experience more bearable and quicker to complete, and that'll eat up into a significant chunk of narrative development time.

orcane
Jun 13, 2012

Fun Shoe

Vermain posted:

There's an enormous amount of cruft they could pare down without affecting the overall arc or any of the (very thin) character development moments that occur. I suspect that's going to be a part of the next expansion, because the current situation isn't really tenable: you either gate new players behind multiple months of working through the story, or you start offering a free jump potion with the latest expansion and create a very confusing story for people just jumping in.

What I'd do for the next expansion is:
  • Dramatically cut down on the number of MSQs in 2.X. They need to be utterly ruthless with this: if it doesn't advance the plot or provide decent characterization, junk it. Compress every Primal arc into maybe 4-5 quests of prep work. Get rid of any quest that's just "run over here and talk to this guy"; don't waste the time of new players. Be a bit more lenient with Heavensward, but there's still a few areas you could trim without losing much. The only thing I think you could bother to trim in Stormblood are some of the Ruby Sea quests, but the story's put together coherently enough that cutting would probably damage it more than it would help it.
  • Revamp the Heavensward aether currents so that they're all present in single quests without requiring chains, and possibly cut down on the number of currents required in general.
  • Increase MSQ EXP across the board to require few to no sidequests or additional roulettes to be done by the player to stay on curve. Level syncing on major content pieces means that overleveling concerns aren't an issue.
The first point is what'll take them the most time, and I suspect it's why they've been hesitant to do it. You don't have quite the same number of issues to solve as WoW did with Cataclysm, but you've still got to make the new player experience more bearable and quicker to complete, and that'll eat up into a significant chunk of narrative development time.

Realistic alternative: Sell more MSQ skip "potions".

Solo Wing Pixy
Aug 5, 2008

It's an amanojaku!
And it hates you so much!

orcane posted:

Realistic alternative: Sell more MSQ skip "potions".

This is the most likely solution given how obsessed SE is with monetizing everything they can to bankroll more XV expansions. That said, Stormblood is definitely building up to a Cataclysm-esque ending, so I half expect them to just blow the world up (again) and start fresh.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



orcane posted:

Realistic alternative: Sell more MSQ skip "potions".

What's realistic or not depends on the value SE puts on the story as a selling point of the game. I think it's fair to say that experiencing the story is one of the big selling points of FFXIV, and it's also one of the key things that distinguishes it from the other big name MMOs on the market. Suffering through 2.X to get to Heavensward might've been more realistic when it was the only expansion, but we're two expansions deep, now, and that's a large hill to expect new players to climb. You either bite the development cost bullet and revamp the story to be more digestible and retain it as a selling point, or you offer jump potions ala WoW with each new expansion and carve away a major selling point of the game by plopping new people into the middle of a story they're expected to have played through already.

Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


Solo Wing Pixy posted:

That said, Stormblood is definitely building up to a Cataclysm-esque ending

What's hinted towards this?

I can't see them throwing away HW/SB zones - old zones would be nice to do something with now that they've dropped PS3 limitations and can make bigger zones, but I'd still be surprised to see them do a revamp.

Saxophone
Sep 19, 2006


Honestly if they'd break the MSQ up into expansion chunks gated by level rather than progress it'd go a long way toward helping. When I hit 50, let me go do HW. Same for SB. Let me play the content my friends are interested in and haven't done 194737 times already.

I'm on one of the good FCs and they're beyond helpful as far as doing trials and dungeons with me goes, but man, it's a bummer to be locked out of a bunch of content because I'm not far enough in the MSQ.

Hell, at the moment I'm 56 and doing level 51 MSQs. I realized that in all likelihood, the idyllshire weapons I want to get will easily be outclasses by crafted weapons by the time I unlock that area, given that I'll probably be 63-64 by then.

I LIKE that leveling is much easier, but the feeling of slog is real. That said, HW is so much nicer MSQ-wise. Generally, if I'm doing something, there's plot attached. I could accept the argument that other is important for how FF14 flows in 2.x if literally half or more MSQs weren't "go here, meet me, ok we meet, now go meet me back at the Sands!"

I'm super engaged and having fun now. But it took 2 years for me to get through the 2.x MSQs because I'd get reeeeaaalllly bored within a few days and quit.

Thundarr
Dec 24, 2002


Oxyclean posted:

What's hinted towards this?

I can't see them throwing away HW/SB zones - old zones would be nice to do something with now that they've dropped PS3 limitations and can make bigger zones, but I'd still be surprised to see them do a revamp.

Given the linear narrative, they basically *can't* get rid of the old zones entirely. If they have some sort of cataclysm that blows up the world and changes how areas look, they still need to keep the old zones because newbies aren't far enough in the story for the cataclysm to have happened yet and throwing them directly into the new versions of the zones would break the narrative.

Unless they say gently caress it and do another 1.x -> 2.0 rework. The game is not remotely in as dire a position now so I don't see them doing something that drastic again.

Sade
Aug 3, 2009

Can't touch this.
No really, you can't
They pushed a 5-year process into 18 months, and the first year of that 18 months was with half a development team, since the other half was still running around trying to put out fires in the 1.x series.

I'm 1000% confident that no one who was involved with the development of 2.x will ever want to do something like that again. The higher-ups would never go for it anyway; it was a huge gamble the first time.

Nessus
Dec 22, 2003

After a Speaker vote, you may be entitled to a valuable coupon or voucher!



I wouldn't be shocked if they go and revise the old zones now but at the moment I figure their focus is on the bleeding edge. What I think would be a better cash shop thing is if they gave you an option to hit the button and skip ahead to the end of ARR or something, or a cheaper version for skipping that.

I mean if you forfeit the story AND ALSO the free Fantasia potion, that's a value proposition.

Saxophone
Sep 19, 2006


None of that would even be an issue if they just detached MSQ advancement from content unlocking. Let content unlock with levels rather than story progression and so much corrects itself.

unseenlibrarian
Jun 4, 2012

There's only one thing in the mountains that leaves a track like this. The creature of legend that roams the Timberline. My people named him Sasquatch. You call him... Bigfoot.

Vermain posted:

[*]Revamp the Heavensward aether currents so that they're all present in single quests without requiring chains, and possibly cut down on the number of currents required in general.


This has already been done, though. They also moved the in-the-world currents to locations closer to where you'd be sent during quests. The only heavensward aethercurrent quests at the end of chains are ones where they're part of the MSQ. The actual currents in side quests are rewarded in the first quest in the chain, like in Stormblood.

Vermain
Sep 5, 2006



unseenlibrarian posted:

This has already been done, though. They also moved the in-the-world currents to locations closer to where you'd be sent during quests. The only heavensward aethercurrent quests at the end of chains are ones where they're part of the MSQ. The actual currents in side quests are rewarded in the first quest in the chain, like in Stormblood.

Good to know, thanks for the correction. They were still stuck in chains back when I leveled a new character through Heavensward before Stormblood came out.

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Oxyclean
Sep 23, 2007


Saxophone posted:

None of that would even be an issue if they just detached MSQ advancement from content unlocking. Let content unlock with levels rather than story progression and so much corrects itself.
The only problem with that I could see certain dungeons or areas unlocking posing spoiler problems? Or at least tipping the hand of where things might be going.

That said I think they could stand to maybe let people at least go things like Ishgard at 50 regardless of story progression, even if it's a big plot point being locked to outsiders. (And it might break the DRK storyline since npcs reference some stuff you do in 2.x)

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