California Politics: Madame Senator, this is a morgue

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > California Politics: Madame Senator, this is a morgue

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FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

There's actually no place for that water to be stored - the central valley has settled several feet down in recent decades, as the hollow empty aquifers collapse. They can't be recharged because they're literally not there any more.

Still, totally worth it for those almond exports.

e: An article from 2015

quote:

The Central Valley is sinking at a record pace as drought-gripped farms pump out the groundwater beneath them, new satellite data show.

In some places the ground is dropping nearly two inches a month, according to measurements taken by the state and NASA, dragging roads, bridges and other infrastructure with it.

Last year, land near the community of Corcoran between Fresno and Bakersfield dropped 13 inches in eight months, according to the data released Wednesday. The town of Arbuckle north of Sacramento saw five inches of sinking over six months, and points along the California Aqueduct, which carries water beside Interstate 5 in the San Joaquin Valley, fell eight inches in four months.

Irrigation canals have begun to buckle, wells have fractured and even streets are cracking. State and federal officials fear that railroad lines and home foundations may be next.

�As extensive groundwater pumping continues the land is sinking more rapidly, and this puts nearby infrastructure at greater risk of costly damage,� said Mark Cowin, director of the Department of Water Resources, which worked with NASA to collect information from satellites and report on groundwater levels.

The findings are prompting California officials to reexamine restrictions on groundwater pumping that were approved last year but aren�t expected to be implemented until at least 2020. With farms getting less water from rivers and creeks during the drought, unregulated well water is being tapped in increasing quantities.

�We don�t believe we can sustain this kind of pumping and the effects that are occurring,� Cowin said. �What this new NASA report underscores for us is the need for more near-term measures.�

FMguru fucked around with this message at 01:23 on Feb 16, 2019

# ? Feb 16, 2019 00:46

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 10:08

Jaxyon: Mar 7, 2016; I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

Love to be destroying an entire ecosystem so the Resnicks can get a 33rd yacht

# ? Feb 16, 2019 00:48

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

Turtlicious posted:

I'm really glad you like to get pedantic when you're wrong, I've lost 120lbs seeing my Dietician, and the one thing she repeatedly said was that dieting wasn't work. But also, I know you don't like being told you're wrong even when you are so I can't engage with you. Since you're unwilling to ever change your mind, or do anything but be a dick to people. I'm not going to put myself through the mental anguish of debating you. Please don't take this personally, because I beliebe you can post better.

E: You also kind of proven you don't know the difference between eating a healthy diet and dieting.

I don't understand what you're trying to say here. I said "changing their diet"/"changes to their diet", which you seem to think is the same thing as "dieting," which you're saying is bad, as distinct from "healthy eating," which you think is good.

atelier morgan posted:

also wrong about rich people not sitting around asking each other how best to make the world worse...

Those aren't examples of people actively trying to make the world worse, they're people pursuing their own interest without regard to the consequences for others. That may seem like a pedantic distinction, but understanding why people do things is important if you want to change the systems that resulted in that behavior. Assuming that people do things out of spite or pique or "because they hate our freedoms" won't get you anywhere.

# ? Feb 16, 2019 03:39

xarph: Jun 18, 2001

FMguru posted:

There's actually no place for that water to be stored - the central valley has settled several feet down in recent decades, as the hollow empty aquifers collapse. They can't be recharged because they're literally not there any more.

Still, totally worth it for those almond exports.

But I keep hearing commercials about how almond farmers are the most ecologically friendly and scientifically advanced agricultural group around and are singlehandedly keeping California out of a drought! :pseudo:

# ? Feb 20, 2019 00:51

The Glumslinger: Sep 24, 2008; Coach Nagy, you want me to throw to WHAT side of the field?; Hair Elf

https://twitter.com/mattdpearce/status/1098733526973702144

God, CALPERS is just the loving worst

# ? Feb 22, 2019 02:18

Kobayashi: Aug 13, 2004; by Nyc_Tattoo

Surprise surprise, Dianne Feinstein won�t support the green new deal when it comes up for a vote.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 04:34

Shear Modulus: Jun 9, 2010

khanna endorsed bernie, which as far as I can tell makes him the only californian elected official to endorse anyone but harris

# ? Feb 22, 2019 04:44

Chichevache: Feb 17, 2010; One of the funniest posters in GIP.

Just not intentionally.

Kobayashi posted:

Surprise surprise, Dianne Feinstein won’t support the green new deal when it comes up for a vote.

gently caress that harridan.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 05:02

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

I mean, it's ostensibly an environmental plan that includes UBI but rejects nuclear power.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 07:25

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

Americans have a Thing about nuclear power so that's not surprising

# ? Feb 22, 2019 12:21

VideoGameVet: May 14, 2005; It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion. It is by the juice of Java that pedaling acquires speed, the teeth acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion.

Cup Runneth Over posted:

Americans have a Thing about nuclear power so that's not surprising

I'm furious about the SONGS plant (broken by Mitsubishi) and the poor management of wastes BUT I'd like to see investment into the non-pressurized liquid salt based reactors that can run on nuclear waste.

VideoGameVet fucked around with this message at 19:05 on Feb 22, 2019

# ? Feb 22, 2019 18:57

Family Values: Jun 26, 2007

Even if as a nation we reached consensus today (lol) and committed to building a whole fleet of new reactors, they wouldn't come online for what? 20 years? We can't wait that long to start addressing climate change.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:17

VideoGameVet: May 14, 2005; It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion. It is by the juice of Java that pedaling acquires speed, the teeth acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion.

Family Values posted:

Even if as a nation we reached consensus today (lol) and committed to building a whole fleet of new reactors, they wouldn't come online for what? 20 years? We can't wait that long to start addressing climate change.

This is a critical point. Stuff doesn't come online quickly.

My main interest in the salt stuff is the reduction of nuclear wastes, but I do not trust the US Industry to do it right anyway. It would have to be a government research project.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:30

Instant Sunrise: Apr 12, 2007; The manger babies don't have feelings. You said it yourself.

Family Values posted:

Even if as a nation we reached consensus today (lol) and committed to building a whole fleet of new reactors, they wouldn't come online for what? 20 years? We can't wait that long to start addressing climate change.

Thissssss.

Like I like Nuclear Power and all but:

it takes more time than we have available to build.
it can�t start and stop or throttle to match demand

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:31

Jaxyon: Mar 7, 2016; I’m just saying I would like to see a man beat a woman in a cage. Just to be sure.

Family Values posted:

Even if as a nation we reached consensus today (lol) and committed to building a whole fleet of new reactors, they wouldn't come online for what? 20 years? We can't wait that long to start addressing climate change.

This is correct.

Also the GND isn't currently legislation, it's a positioning document that is going to require a lot of legislation so being 100% on everything isn't required.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:38

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

Jaxyon posted:

This is correct.

Also the GND isn't currently legislation, it's a positioning document that is going to require a lot of legislation so being 100% on everything isn't required.

Also the GND itself isn�t anti-nuclear even. None of the document itself is antinuclear.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:48

Sydin: Oct 29, 2011; Another spring commute

Jaxyon posted:

This is correct.

Also the GND isn't currently legislation, it's a positioning document that is going to require a lot of legislation so being 100% on everything isn't required.

DR is basically "Let perfect become the enemy of good" incarnate.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:50

FMguru: Sep 10, 2003; peed on;
sexually

There was an effort, in the early 2000s, to kickstart construction of a bunch of next-gen nuclear power plants, in order to replace the coming wave of forced retirements of the wave of plants built in the 1970s. All of the plants that were attempted ended up running years behind schedule and billions of dollars over budget and most of them have been cancelled. The collective scale of the fuckup was so huge that Westinghouse Electric was forced into bankruptcy. The effort to extend the life of SONGS by repiping the reactors was a similar debacle.

And it's not just the US. There was a similar effort in Europe, with similar results
- The third reactor at Olkiluoto, Finland: opening date pushed back from 2010 to 2020, the cost has ballooned, and they've abandoned plans to build a fourth reactor at the site
- The third reactor at Flamanville, France: opening date pushed from 2012 to 2019, cost has tripled
- The third reactor at Hickley Point, UK: delays and cost overruns, the contracted price for electricity from the plant will be double the cost of wind power generated nearby (and that price is still too low to make the plant solvent, the government is going to have to massively subsidize it)

Asian countries (outside of Japan, natch) are building nuclear plants, seemingly on time and on budget. Maybe their way of doing things is better than The West's, maybe it's smoke and mirrors and falsified financial reports and clipped corners on safety.

Nuclear power, at least in The West, is just a non-starter. Not because a bunch of hippies spread a bunch of lies, but because there's just no way to build these plants in way that makes economic sense.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:55

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

I have a paper model of Olkiluoto and it is still possible I will finish the paper plant before they finish the real one.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 19:59

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

Cup Runneth Over posted:

Americans have a Thing about nuclear power so that's not surprising

Come on, it's a document that plans to mobilize and reorganize the entire economy while convincing people to change the way they consume and accept privation on the level of a total war forever, but convincing them to accept nuclear plants is too big an ask?

Trabisnikof posted:

Also the GND itself isn’t anti-nuclear even. None of the document itself is antinuclear.

The document itself isn't anti-nuclear, because the document itself is scant on concrete details, but the FAQ put out by its most prominent proponent explicitly rejects nuclear power.

Family Values posted:

Even if as a nation we reached consensus today (lol) and committed to building a whole fleet of new reactors, they wouldn't come online for what? 20 years? We can't wait that long to start addressing climate change.

Sydin posted:

DR is basically "Let perfect become the enemy of good" incarnate.

LMAO at these two posts together. "We can do more than one thing at a time!"

New nuclear plants will take a long time to come online, but they absolutely should be a part of our energy mix if we're serious about low or no carbon production.

FMguru posted:

Nuclear power, at least in The West, is just a non-starter. Not because a bunch of hippies spread a bunch of lies, but because there's just no way to build these plants in way that makes economic sense.

Part of the reason why it is so hard to bring new US nuclear plants online in a timely and economic manner is because of the extremely complex and rigorous regulatory environment around them, and the inevitable attempts to defeat them either at the ballot box or via lawsuits... Which are in fact driven by voters' irrational fear of the risks of nuclear power relative to other sources.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 21:55

FRINGE: May 23, 2003; title stolen for lf posting

VideoGameVet posted:

I'd like to see investment into the non-pressurized liquid salt based reactors that can run on nuclear waste.

That would be great, but until LFTRs are more politically known, rejecting light water reactors is the stance that will at least keep more of them from being "built" (handouts to the various DoE and DoD pet companies).

# ? Feb 22, 2019 23:08

Trabisnikof: Dec 24, 2005

Sure, anything that isn�t a massive new handout to nuclear power and no one else is �anti-nuclear� for the same reasons that the status quo economics are �anti-nuclear.�

But concern trolling about nuclear is even more blatant coming from people who�d reject strict emissions limits and the consequences there-of to society.

No one cares about if you love nuclear a lot if you�re going to resist banning internal combustion personal and commercial vehicles in the state within the next few decades.

# ? Feb 22, 2019 23:16

SeANMcBAY: Jun 28, 2006; Look on the bright side.

https://twitter.com/_waleedshahid/status/1099076130089459712?s=21
She needs to resign. What a piece of poo poo.

We deserve better than a grumpy old goblin that�s barely a Democrat and a loving cop.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 00:48

cheese: Jan 7, 2004; Shop around for doctors! Always fucking shop for doctors. Doctors are stupid assholes. And they get by because people are cowed by their mystical bullshit quality of being able to maintain a 3.0 GPA at some Guatemalan medical college for 3 semesters. Find one that makes sense.

Shear Modulus posted:

khanna endorsed bernie, which as far as I can tell makes him the only californian elected official to endorse anyone but harris

I was super skeptical of Ro Khanna, given that he ran to Mike Honda's right before coming around 2 years later and running to his left, but he has been pretty loving good so far and seemingly way more progressive than I thought for a Silicon Valley funded dude.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 00:57

VideoGameVet: May 14, 2005; It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion. It is by the juice of Java that pedaling acquires speed, the teeth acquire stains, stains become a warning. It is by caffeine alone I set my bike in motion.

FRINGE posted:

That would be great, but until LFTRs are more politically known, rejecting light water reactors is the stance that will at least keep more of them from being "built" (handouts to the various DoE and DoD pet companies).

But you can't run those off of the existing nuclear waste.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 01:50

Dead Reckoning: Sep 13, 2011

Trabisnikof posted:

But concern trolling about nuclear is even more blatant coming from people who�d reject strict emissions limits and the consequences there-of to society.

I'm down with strict emissions limits, but I know they'll never happen, because Russia and emerging economies won't allow themselves to be de-industrialized.

SeANMcBAY posted:

She needs to resign. What a piece of poo poo.

We deserve better than a grumpy old goblin that’s barely a Democrat and a loving cop.

Using kids as a political prop isn't some moral authority win button. She could have been nicer about it though.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 03:10

FilthyImp: Sep 30, 2002; Anime Deviant

SeANMcBAY posted:

https://twitter.com/_waleedshahid/status/1099076130089459712?s=21
She needs to resign. What a piece of poo poo.

We deserve better than a grumpy old goblin that’s barely a Democrat and a loving cop.

Jesus gently caress she literally says "you didnt vote for me".

gently caress de leon for tanking his run against her and gently caress her.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 03:10

Shear Modulus: Jun 9, 2010

Dead Reckoning posted:

Using kids as a political prop isn't some moral authority win button. She could have been nicer about it though.

perhaps, and this is just a thought, kids are able to come up with their own opinions on whether they want to live in a livable world or in a mad max hellhole

# ? Feb 23, 2019 03:48

Shear Modulus: Jun 9, 2010

what does feinstein have to gain by supporting the green new deal? she obviously doesnt give the slightest poo poo about the opinions of her constituents or the public in general

# ? Feb 23, 2019 03:49

Cup Runneth Over: Aug 8, 2009; She said life's
Too short to worry
Life's too long to wait
It's too short
Not to love everybody
Life's too long to hate

Plus she'll be dead in 12 years

# ? Feb 23, 2019 03:57

Sydin: Oct 29, 2011; Another spring commute

Plus she's funded by big oil. four of her top five campaign contributors over the last five years are energy companies and defense contractors.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 04:10

FilthyImp: Sep 30, 2002; Anime Deviant

Cup Runneth Over posted:

Plus she'll be dead in 12 years

I really, really, REALLY loving WISH one of the kids had shot back with that when she started on her "too young to vote" bullshit.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 06:22

Punkin Spunkin: Jan 1, 2010

FilthyImp posted:

I really, really, REALLY loving WISH one of the kids had shot back

# ? Feb 23, 2019 07:06

FRINGE: May 23, 2003; title stolen for lf posting

VideoGameVet posted:

But you can't run those off of the existing nuclear waste.

https://articles.thmsr.nl/the-flibe-energy-lftr49-the-triple-ace-in-nuclear-gen-iv-design-ea9bffcd71dd

quote:

Waste burning MSR designs

Several start-ups are developing waste burning MSR technology, which allows the spent fuel pellets to be dissolved in the molten salt, and burn the actinides, the remaining U235 and U236, and even the large fraction of U238 that remained in the spent fuel rods.

(Theres a lot more info in there, including discussions of neutron deficits and possible ways to address that.)

# ? Feb 23, 2019 07:07

WAR CRIME GIGOLO: Oct 3, 2012; The Hague
tryna get me
for these glutes

Yes mein feinstein the children should have voted for you because getting 51%without campaigning wasnt enough of a state self own

# ? Feb 23, 2019 07:15

SeANMcBAY: Jun 28, 2006; Look on the bright side.

Dead Reckoning posted:

Using kids as a political prop isn't some moral authority win button. She could have been nicer about it though.

It should with an issue like this. The planet is loving dying and she doesn�t give a poo poo. Those kids are going to have to live to see the world turn into Mad Max if we don�t do anything.

SeANMcBAY fucked around with this message at 07:48 on Feb 23, 2019

# ? Feb 23, 2019 07:29

Shear Modulus: Jun 9, 2010

https://twitter.com/SenFeinstein/status/1097912551038439430?s=20

# ? Feb 23, 2019 08:20

dont be mean to me: May 2, 2007; I'm interplanetary, bitch
Let's go to Mars

Shear Modulus posted:

https://twitter.com/SenFeinstein/status/1097912551038439430?s=20

yaaaas kween kick that can into the boiling oceans :peanut:

go home feinstein

# ? Feb 23, 2019 08:57

Class Warcraft: Apr 27, 2006

Shear Modulus posted:

https://twitter.com/SenFeinstein/status/1097912551038439430?s=20

lmao, classic neoliberal trash policy in a nutshell - pathetically attempting to plaster over the real issues with wonky feel-good bullshit.

Love this plan: manages not to address climate change or broken education funding, and also manages to push teachers onto the frontline of the issue so they get savaged by the hordes of insane climate change deniers

great plan, A+

# ? Feb 23, 2019 10:16

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# ? Jun 9, 2024 10:08

Lycus: Aug 5, 2008; Half the posters in this forum have been made up. This website is a goddamn ghost town.

If these kids were more educated, they'd know not to bother a senator that just won an election.

# ? Feb 23, 2019 10:33

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > California Politics: Madame Senator, this is a morgue

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