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MrYenko posted:80s Celicas are probably the most baffling for me. Pretty much anything with a Honda badge on it before (or after, [gently caress me the new NSX is a disappointment] for that matter) the NSX or the S2000. Any Toyota that isn’t a turbo Supra or MR2. Basically any Mazda road car ever built. Corvettes until the C4 ZR1 and LT1 C4s. Camaros generally from 1974-1992. You're quoting Cat Terrist aren't you? edit: holee poo poo he got a new avatar Maybe you need one too 
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Apr 23, 2019 04:15
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um excuse me posted:If Twitter is a priority to you then a car with it built in is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option older cars simply do not have. Another Person posted:If digital dashboards are a priority to you then a car with it built in is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option newer cars simply do not have. Another Person posted:If a bitchin' wedge shape is a priority to you then a car with it built in is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option newer cars simply do not have. Another Person posted:If suicide doors are a priority to you then a car with it built in is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option newer cars simply do not have. Another Person posted:If a manual transmission in a pickup truck is a priority to you then a truck with it is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option newer trucks simply do not have.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:24
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When I was a kid I thought the digital speedometer was the coolest thing. My last three cars from this decade all had a digital speedo readout and I love it. Even my 2011 Fords have the info display to tell me how the oil and tire pressure is and that's cool. Digital dashboards became more prevalent than not. Also I think sometimes things look more popular here than they really are due to those people being more prolific posters and even things like the time of day and random chance.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:30
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This conversation sounds like a room full of multi-generational grumpy old men arguing about when they stopped making good music.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:35
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Don't know what you mean by that, there are plenty of electronic/digital dashes Lamborghini Lincoln Continental 80th Anniversary Coach Door edition Colorado and Canyon, Frontier, and Tacoma. You're asking for features most people don't buy, as a result you get fringe cases for current cars. And you also have to realize there's a difference between what people want, and what people buy.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:36
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Finger Prince posted:This conversation sounds like a room full of multi-generational grumpy old men arguing about when they stopped making good music. exponential rise in the prevalence of autotune was a clear demarcation 
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Apr 23, 2019 04:37
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Here, since I've been sharing less popular opinions, have some interesting race cars I pulled from my Facebook group.     May it appease the angry mob.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:44
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drgitlin posted:You and me both. That's because you would go to E3 over Goodward. Goober Peas posted:You're quoting Cat Terrist aren't you? Dont look at me, if you want to like a certain car be my guest. Just be prepared for an opinion if I've driven it. I'd otherwise contend some 80's cars can still whale the absolute living poo poo out of new crap, Especially on the same tyres. And there's plenty that look a godawful load better. And even feel better to drive. quote:80s Celicas are probably the most baffling for me. Pretty much anything with a Honda badge on it before (or after, [gently caress me the new NSX is a disappointment] for that matter) the NSX or the S2000. Any Toyota that isn’t a turbo Supra or MR2. Basically any Mazda road car ever built. Corvettes until the C4 ZR1 and LT1 C4s. Camaros generally from 1974-1992. That's.... uhhhhh...... woooooow.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:52
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um excuse me posted:Don't know what you mean by that, there are plenty of electronic/digital dashes There are a bunch of digital dashboards because they are obviously the best, good thing you see the truth finally, the rest of automotive everything agrees, digital dashboards are obviously better Modern Lamborghini are freakin' huge I mean look at this poo poo:  New Frontiers are the same trucks they've been making for 20 years and the new Tacomas are the same trucks they've been making for 10 years. I'm not asking for features that people don't buy, I'm highlighting why people would like older stuff because people are emotional and it influences everything. Most people don't need the cars they buy and to me that makes every single one valid because it's all emotional. If someone wants a red car instead of a blue one that's just as valid as someone wanting a giant ultra-capable truck they'll drive to Costco and back (that isn't me I promise  ) rather than something smaller and more economical. The reason Jeep Wranglers sell so much is because of the emotional idea, not actual practicality or use. By all accounts they suck rear end to live with yet they sell em' all day every day even though most families would be served far better with a more capable, more comfortable, safer and more convenient minivan. Yet they don't. Apply that same idea to people jizzin' over old Celicas and it becomes quite easy to see why they keep cummin, must be something about it that can not be replicated with something new.
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Apr 23, 2019 04:54
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um excuse me posted:If frickin' rocket differentials are a priority to you then a car with them built in is a better car than one without. Does it make the car better? Who's to say. For that person it is. Its an option sane cars simply do not have.
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Apr 23, 2019 05:14
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I was born in 87. By the time I even started noticing cars the only folks who had 80s models were poor people and olds. So that's what I associate the styling with. Like, even I can tell the Celica is something different from the econoboxes, and I'm not talking about the really exotic stuff, but visually the Celica does literally nothing for me. I don't hate it or anything, it just never would have occurred to me it's someone's dream car. Also:Finger Prince posted:This conversation sounds like a room full of multi-generational grumpy old men arguing about when they stopped making good music.
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Apr 23, 2019 05:17
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It's a race car and not legal even if it did exist today. It's banned from both public driving and racing. It's not, nor ever was, relevant to the point I'm making. If you want to keep perpetuating this discussion feel free. But I was ready to move on.
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Apr 23, 2019 05:18
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I feel like that was less an adversarial continuation of the derail than an opportunistic punchline that was left wide open. I lol'd, anyway.
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Apr 23, 2019 05:34
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um excuse me posted:You can get all of that subjective emotion now. There are all sort of cars that can do things better than the cars they replaced in almost every single way. Engines have gotten more powerful, brakes have gotten stronger, tires have mountains of traction, suspension has gotten very advanced from track to pure comfort to tackling the toughest terrain. You can basically buy a car that makes you feel however you want dramatically better than any car did back then. Don't mistake nostalgia for a past that wasn't all that great. Virtually every modern car is objectively better than my mk3 Supra. Dudes in TDI Golfs often try to race my car and I just let them do it because I know their car is faster. Their car is also cheaper to run, probably more comfortable, more reliable, all the markers of what make a car objectively good. ...but my car is infinitely cooler and sometimes that's all it is. I can guarantee that nobody looks at that TDI Golf and points and smiles like they do at an older, 'shittier' car. Olympic Mathlete fucked around with this message at 11:02 on Apr 23, 2019 |
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Apr 23, 2019 10:57
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Powershift posted:And be very careful  um excuse me posted:Cars get better as we move forward. I'm not all that old so 60s 70s and 80s stuff isn't all that familiar with me, but someone who is can complain about the poo poo we just forgot we had to do. Sure there is garbage sold right now just as there was during your favorite decade. Starting a carbureted car on a cold day, leaded gas, manual windows and locks, optional A/C, garbage safety like lap belts and no head restraints, cabin based crumple zones, terrible mileage, rust, bias ply tires, drum brakes all around, pleather interiors, monocolor dash, being scary as poo poo over 80 mph, the list goes on and on and on. Cars kick rear end now more than they ever have. They really don't. The only thing most modern cars have on older ones is gas mileage and crash safety.... and in service of that crash safety, everything outside of $housepayment midlife crisis mobiles looks the same and runs the same fuel-econonomy focused engines, questionable electronics, and transmissions that grenade a lot more regularly than they have any right to given the powerplants they're leashed to. I don't think as many people would be grumpy if it wasn't for the terrible, wearying sameness of modern auto design. Liquid Communism fucked around with this message at 12:48 on Apr 23, 2019 |
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Apr 23, 2019 12:40
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Liquid Communism posted:
If there was an internet in the 90s, you could have posted that verbatim with the same sentiment. Wait, you aren't one of those guys who thinks the 90s constitutes "modern", are you?
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Apr 23, 2019 13:07
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Speaking of modern poo poo, god I love adaptive cruise control when there is any sign of highway fuckery. As much as a like manual transmissions and doing my thing, when you're on a road trip and traffic turns into stop and go, its so loving nice. Even when it's not stop and go, and traffic just blips slower. I can't wait until it's mature enough to be backported as a module to older cars. /pipedream And I haven't even gotten to try SuperCruise yet either, which I hear is doubly amazing.
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Apr 23, 2019 13:32
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My old cars get me from A to B with infinitely more style and character than modern ones. They might cost more in fuel but that seems like a good trade considering I'm buying it for probably 10% of what I'd pay for a new one, and that's not even factoring in the freedom of not being tied to a payment plan. I've got GPS on my phone, and I can fit an aftermarket radio if needed, why the hell would I need expensive, unreliable infotainment shite in my car? Certainly nothing else of real value has been added to cars other than gadgetry that allows you to pay less attention to driving them, and hey, I like driving my cars so I don't need that.Liquid Communism posted:They really don't. The only thing most modern cars have on older ones is gas mileage and crash safety.... and in service of that crash safety, everything outside of $housepayment midlife crisis mobiles looks the same and runs the same fuel-econonomy focused engines, questionable electronics, and transmissions that grenade a lot more regularly than they have any right to given the powerplants they're leashed to.
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Apr 23, 2019 14:28
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The old mechanic's tale I've always heard is that an old car is more environmentally friendly than a new one because the old car already exists. So the extra gas you buy (and burn) is, in theory, offset by not having to run factories or make more plastic or pay an ocean freighter to deliver the car. Not sure the concept scales (if every car from the 1970's was still on the road pollution would be an even bigger issue) but it does seem like there's a good argument for enthusiasts to continue to run whatever they want.
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Apr 23, 2019 14:34
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xzzy posted:The old mechanic's tale I've always heard is that an old car is more environmentally friendly than a new one because the old car already exists. So the extra gas you buy (and burn) is, in theory, offset by not having to run factories or make more plastic or pay an ocean freighter to deliver the car. Yeah, imagine the environmental impacts if they did some tax deal trading in your perfectly good old car and then destroying them.
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Apr 23, 2019 14:44
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C-Bangin' it 
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Apr 23, 2019 14:49
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Battlebots went big.
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Apr 23, 2019 14:59
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That movie was loving great and I will fight anyone suggesting otherwise.
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Apr 23, 2019 15:54
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um excuse me posted:You're asking for features most people don't buy, as a result you get fringe cases for current cars. And you also have to realize there's a difference between what people want, and what people buy. Honestly, it's really hard to judge what is and isn't a "fringe" feature on cars. Dealers don't like having cars sit on their lots for ages, and that means they aren't ordering large numbers of cars with features that don't have wide appeal. If they aren't ordering those cars, then manufacturers are going to eventually eliminate them to streamline the manufacturing process. It's technically a response to demand, but it's not a direct response to consumer demand. A lot of feature demand in the automotive industry is an artifact of dealer purchasing habits.
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Apr 23, 2019 17:06
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Olympic Mathlete posted:Virtually every modern car is objectively better than my mk3 Supra. Dudes in TDI Golfs often try to race my car and I just let them do it because I know their car is faster. Their car is also cheaper to run, probably more comfortable, more reliable, all the markers of what make a car objectively good. I have stoplight conversations almost every day I drive the C2. Last night it was a guy in a late model Mustang who misses his 67 302. Last week it was a guy in a GT3 who misses his 68 Camaro. Ten minutes before that, it was a guy who misses his dad's 60-something Riviera. Nobody wants to talk to someone in a late model Accord.
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Apr 23, 2019 18:18
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Third gen? Check. Mullet? Check. Destroked 8500rpm-shifting LS7? Check.  https://youtu.be/lgMoTQLebTs
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Apr 23, 2019 18:29
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Godholio posted:I have stoplight conversations almost every day I drive the C2. Last night it was a guy in a late model Mustang who misses his 67 302. Last week it was a guy in a GT3 who misses his 68 Camaro. Ten minutes before that, it was a guy who misses his dad's 60-something Riviera. It's because kids are too busy looking at their phones these days to make random conversation with strangers in cars, right?
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Apr 23, 2019 18:50
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I think AI's weird car fetish is less what's good or bad but more what's interesting to talk about. I can read and watch as much as I want about a new 911 or spend 100 hours on YouTube for brz vs miata. The only question is what you pick and what you can afford. The engineering is interesting but that's about it. Weird and stupid has character.
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Apr 23, 2019 19:47
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Finger Prince posted:It's because kids are too busy looking at their phones these days to make random conversation with strangers in cars, right? Only when they're driving. I've had kids (little kids even) ask about the car too.
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Apr 23, 2019 20:06
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um excuse me posted:You can get all of that subjective emotion now. There are all sort of cars that can do things better than the cars they replaced in almost every single way. Engines have gotten more powerful, brakes have gotten stronger, tires have mountains of traction, suspension has gotten very advanced from track to pure comfort to tackling the toughest terrain. You can basically buy a car that makes you feel however you want dramatically better than any car did back then. Don't mistake nostalgia for a past that wasn't all that great. If you can just buy a thing, what makes it special? Anyone with money can buy a Focus RS or whatever. Buying an '80s Celica, for example, you've got to *find* one first. Then, you likely will need to wrench on it. Then, you can make it your own, improving the things the really need improving. You've got to know what you're doing, or learn. There's more to it than just driving. I have an '87 Corolla. It's OK, I like it a bit because Initial D, et al, and generally like the lines of that generation, but I don't really have an emotional investment in it. In fact, because of that, I'm trying to sell it, because it's taking time and money away from my true love, my '79 Mazda RX-7, and I will fight you if you try to take the FrankenRex away from me. It's not stock, it will never be stock again, but it will be improved. That's part of it. You work on them, you invest time in them, you grow up with them, you love them. Things might have been different if the Corolla GT-S I spotted in the Auto Trader a week after I bought an '81 Regal in the early '90s as a daily would have come up sooner. I might have a half-dozen AE86s rather than that many rotary disasters. New or old, if it doesn't move you, make you feel just a bit better about everything, it's just an appliance. My AE86, and my RX-7s are shitboxes, but they're fun shitboxes. Hell, my wife's Kia Spectra5 manages to be fun due to a 5-speed, a torquey 4-pot, decent suspension, and a thirst for abuse. There is indeed an insanity to it, just like everything we prefer over what would actually be best for practicality and our needs. At least the Kia is a hatchback and gets decent gas mileage, unlike, well, everything else I own. Objectively, yes, a new car, generally speaking, pretty much does "car" better than almost any older car. A new Camry, will walk all over my '70 Cutlass in terms of performance in every direction, and very much so in safety. I even like the styling, God help me, of the last batch of Camrys, but it would never really be my "fun" car. Comfortable commute machine, sure, but not the car you take to the drive-in, or a Sunday drive. It's very much an intangible thing, a feeling, a preference for the styling. The sound, unrestricted by modern manufacturer constraints. And I can make the Cutlass almost as comfortable, maybe even approach the efficiency with EFI and such. That's the part I like, really, making a car that I like in its raw form better (in my eyes) and more suited to my needs. Stock is neat in a survivor, time capsule way, but I much prefer tastefully modified and improved. Restomods are definitely my bag. So maybe I agree with you, a little, about the love of bone stock '80s commuter cars? FWD cars kinda suck for "fun" in general, so that really puts me off a lot of newer cars. I can live with it (see aforementioned Kia) but it's not my first choice. All the above said, I still want a Kia Stinger, and an affordable Tesla. One thing I do hate about older cars is how absolute garbage AC systems were. I'm old, and lie in Texas. AC is life, much like water on Arrakis.
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Apr 23, 2019 20:28
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Finger Prince posted:It's because kids are too busy looking at their phones these days to make random conversation with strangers in cars, right? Kids with their faces smooshed against the window of their parent's cars as they slowly pass on the motorway looking intently at what the gently caress they're passing will absolutely lose their poo poo if your car has pop ups and you flash them. It's the best. 
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Apr 23, 2019 20:29
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honda whisperer posted:I think AI's weird car fetish is less what's good or bad but more what's interesting to talk about. I can read and watch as much as I want about a new 911 or spend 100 hours on YouTube for brz vs miata. The only question is what you pick and what you can afford. The engineering is interesting but that's about it. You said it way better than I did. Someone in a pristine 1984 Honda is driving something interesting, regardless of whether it’s my jam or not.
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Apr 23, 2019 20:33
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Olympic Mathlete posted:That movie was loving great and I will fight anyone suggesting otherwise. I suggest it was actually fantastic, what now There's a guy near me who drives a well-kept steel blue first-gen Ford Tempo. Objectively it's a hunk of crap. I know this for a fact because my parents bought a Mercury Topaz after our Taurus got smushed, and that was a hunk of crap. I still smile every time I see the Tempo, because a. despite being a hunk of crap, our Topaz handled the worst that living in a little poo poo town accessible by gravel road in northern BC could throw at it - a hunk of crap car for a hunk of crap town - and b. who the gently caress sees a Tempo and thinks, there, that's the car I will carry forward into the new century That kind of thinking is alien to me but I have to respect it
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Apr 23, 2019 20:33
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Finger Prince posted:It's because kids are too busy looking at their phones these days to make random conversation with strangers in cars, right? I saw a response to something like that the other day, some picture of everyone in frame on a subway platform staring at their phones. The responding pictures were images from the 30s, 40s, 50s, etc. if everyone at a bus station, or terminal, etc. reading a newspaper. The format has changed, but not the act. At least for adults. Kids, maybe? I spent most of my time with my nose buried in a book or TV when I was a kid, so, again, when my daughter stares into her phone or the internet all day, there's no real change. The biggest change may be the accessibility or portability. I do get annoyed with her when she wanders around the into the kitchen trying to simultaneously make something to eat and watch an idiotic (yes, I'm yelling at clouds. Whatever) video and inevitably making a mess because she's not paying attention.
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Apr 23, 2019 20:34
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EDIT: ^^^^ three weeks ago I watched a groups of adults, probably in their 40s/late30s, come into the pub with a girl or probably around 6 or 7 years. The girl spent the entire time we were there staring at a tablet. When the adults tried to engage her in conversation/ask her a question, she ignored them until they yelled at her (which is another topic entirely); when yelled at she replied non-verbally or with one-word answers, just enough to get the adults to let her go back to her tablet.Darchangel posted:If you can just buy a thing, what makes it special? Scarcity shouldn't be confused with quality/value. Just because something is scarce, doesn't meant it's not poo poo. Just because any old slob can go down and buy [item x] doesn't mean [item x] is trash, or that [item y] which is hard to find is better. The Prong Song fucked around with this message at 20:42 on Apr 23, 2019 |
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Apr 23, 2019 20:38
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Phy posted:I suggest it was actually fantastic, what now We become best friends and watch the movie together... 
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Apr 23, 2019 20:39
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I'm starting to see GM J, W, early N, other godawful GM cars and even Simca/Iacocca Chrysler starting to get mentioned in a nostalgic context. None of those were ever good cars, passable was a stretch even at the time. The worst is the 80s Charger/Daytona, a milerable pile with the only higher powered trims being sold with poorly turbocharged engines that have been blown since grunge came out.
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Apr 23, 2019 20:46
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I've been getting a lot of responses that can be loosely summarized as "but my old car has character!" as a response to new cars do it better. I mean don't get me wrong, I'm wrenching on a 96 Miata right now and want to get something older, so I "get" old cars. But I also bought my WRX new and I've pretty much made it perfectly suit what I want a car to be. Compared to what it is not everything was muted, it was lacking the charm everyone is claiming only old cars have. I brought it out. Its the perfect track slayer and yet I can drive it for 8 hours at a time. With the wide range it offers, it's hard to think of an older can that can suit those needs as well. A lot of the things that make it great on that car didnt exist as little as 10 years ago. I guess I should say that I'm not saying older cars are bad, just that newer cars are better. um excuse me fucked around with this message at 22:16 on Apr 23, 2019 |
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Apr 23, 2019 22:04
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Everyone is a weirdo. There was a dude at VIR's charity laps a couple times who was happily driving a SVT Contour.
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Apr 23, 2019 22:30
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gently caress all you guys. I want a v16 caddy.
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Apr 23, 2019 22:53
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