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Mar 3, 2021 14:21
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lol at how badly boris bodies forensic kieth at PMQs https://twitter.com/ShehabKhan/status/1367086819205070849?s=20
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Mar 3, 2021 14:21
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Nah asking about Yemen is good.
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Mar 3, 2021 14:22
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Chubby Henparty posted:Apparently happens more than you think
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Mar 3, 2021 14:22
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If Megan's interview gets crashed by live coverage of Phil's death it will be funnier than Obama timing the OBL announcement to gently caress with The Apprentice
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Mar 3, 2021 14:22
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Failed Imagineer posted:If Megan's interview gets crashed by live coverage of Phil's death it will be funnier than Obama timing the OBL announcement to gently caress with The Apprentice funnier than 9/11 derailing the congressional investigation into the US military having trillions of dollars it couldn't account for?
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Mar 3, 2021 14:24
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I am suddenly reminded of pratchett referring to the discipline of [reflected sound of underground spirits] and posit that it makes more sense than actual economists.
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Mar 3, 2021 14:24
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peanut- posted:Nah asking about Yemen is good. the labour right gave corbyn an incredible amount of grief about this the entire time he was leader so having it thrown back in their faces is an expected result
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Mar 3, 2021 14:25
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Jose posted:funnier than 9/11 derailing the congressional investigation into the US military having trillions of dollars it couldn't account for? That was good too. Little did they realise how many more trillions were coming their way (or did they?)
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Mar 3, 2021 14:28
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keith alwys sounds like he's about to cry
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Mar 3, 2021 14:29
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Failed Imagineer posted:That was good too. Little did they realise how many more trillions were coming their way (or did they?) there are so many good conspiracies around 9/10 anyway lol https://twitter.com/EliotHiggins/status/1367030164501241858
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Mar 3, 2021 14:29
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Is Keith responding to the budget personally normal? Or does it imply Dodds is toast?
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Mar 3, 2021 14:32
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peanut- posted:Is Keith responding to the budget personally normal? Or does it imply Dodds is toast? It's normal for the leader of the opposition to respond
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Mar 3, 2021 14:34
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Looke posted:keith alwys sounds like he's about to cry I find him really difficult to listen to, tbh.
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Mar 3, 2021 14:40
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The country has absorbed this into its soul, it's a message that's constantly reinforced. https://twitter.com/BBCSimonJack/status/1367096773609684993?s=20 The literal IMF says it's nonsense at this point, but nothing will ever shake the conviction of our political and media class that the nation's finances work like their credit card bill.
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Mar 3, 2021 14:42
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It's a very useful political fiction that our ruling class immediately forgot was fiction after making it up, as is their wont
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Mar 3, 2021 14:56
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Oh dear me posted:It's not regressive, whether or not it's good. Tax thresholds apply to all people above them. The very poorest do not benefit from tax threshold rises at all, which is why those are the Tory/LD preferred tax changes. Inflation exists.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:02
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peanut- posted:Nah asking about Yemen is good. Sensible questioning about a policy the British public care about, not like the pointless questioning about some Arab backwater like that Joromy Cobbin would do.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:02
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peanut- posted:The country has absorbed this into its soul, it's a message that's constantly reinforced. The political class don't believe it at all. It's a convenient fiction to support the narrative they want. And the media, well, it's in the air as to whether the tail wags the dog. But if they're not complicit they're compliant.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:17
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Has anyone else received a REACT COVID-19 Testing Research study letter? I got one that asks me to get a covid test to take a snapshot of the country. I'm assuming they're using it to harvest my incredible DNA in order to clone an army of extremely lovely posters but I'll volunteer regardless.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:18
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Doctor_Fruitbat posted:The personal allowance is going to be frozen at £12,570, unless you think that anyone earning over £13k is living the high life then it is absolutely and definitely regressive, because it affects the poor in a way that richer people won't notice. I'm not sure I'm reading you right, but it seems like you're saying freezing the tax allowance is regressive and raising the allowance is progressive? Which isn't true. Raising the tax allowance is regressive, because it benefits the person earning £100,000 as much as anyone earning the personal allowance + £1, and benefits them more than the person earning personal allowance - £1. If the tax allowance went up to £13k then someone earning £12,900 would stop paying tax on that £330, but someone earning x100k will stop paying tax on £430, so gets more of a benefit. "Being taken out of tax" is not a good way of tackling inequalities and benefits many, many more relatively wealthy people than those it claims to help the most.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:19
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peanut- posted:The country has absorbed this into its soul, it's a message that's constantly reinforced. Well, he does appear to at least be getting poo poo on by everyone for this comment. I guess people are starting to figure it out?
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Mar 3, 2021 15:19
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Jedit posted:The political class don't believe it at all. It's a convenient fiction to support the narrative they want. And the media, well, it's in the air as to whether the tail wags the dog. But if they're not complicit they're compliant. See I don't think this is the case at all any more. I think this... Communist Thoughts posted:It's a very useful political fiction that our ruling class immediately forgot was fiction after making it up, as is their wont ...is more like it. Thatcher's generation were the ideologues; her children are rubes as much as anyone else, who don't realise they're high on their own inherited supply.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:22
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Yeah most politicians do not know much about finance or economics. The credit card analogy is easy and comfortable and superficially makes sense so they just stick with that model of how things must work in their heads.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:28
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Niric posted:I'm not sure I'm reading you right, but it seems like you're saying freezing the tax allowance is regressive and raising the allowance is progressive? Which isn't true. Raising the tax allowance is regressive, because it benefits the person earning £100,000 as much as anyone earning the personal allowance + £1, and benefits them more than the person earning personal allowance - £1. But giving £330 to someone who earns £12,900 makes a bigger difference to them than giving £430 to someone over £100k. I think you're right though, in that the proper way to make it progressive would be to simultaneously raise the top rate?
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Mar 3, 2021 15:33
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peanut- posted:I have some sympathy for Labour in that even if Sunak is trying to raise taxes, he’s not doing it to drive public spending and investment.
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Mar 3, 2021 15:34
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Weasling Weasel posted:This is the question I wantes to ask after reading that big old thread on MMT on the back of the bbc pundits credit card debt. Under MMT wouldn't tax increases of any type, including corp tax, be bad at the moment for expansion during a poor economic climate and with low inflation? Provided that not doing it it isnt used a pretense to cut government spending? Corporation tax is only levied against profit, so in theory raising it incentivises reinvestment
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Mar 3, 2021 15:51
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Answers Me posted:See I don't think this is the case at all any more. I think this... yeah though i would also say its not just the kids, the people themselves who make this poo poo up often almost immediately forget they made it up and become convinced its real since they are even more deeply entrenched in the media propaganda echo chamber than us
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Mar 3, 2021 16:02
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Tesseraction posted:Has anyone else received a REACT COVID-19 Testing Research study letter? I got one that asks me to get a covid test to take a snapshot of the country. If that's what they wanted to do it's perfectly possible to DNA fingerprint poo poo, as long as it's fresh. (This was a much funnier joke in my head, I promise)
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Mar 3, 2021 16:12
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Weasling Weasel posted:This is the question I wantes to ask after reading that big old thread on MMT on the back of the bbc pundits credit card debt. Under MMT wouldn't tax increases of any type, including corp tax, be bad at the moment for expansion during a poor economic climate and with low inflation? Provided that not doing it it isnt used a pretense to cut government spending? At the moment you've got a risk of companies hoarding cash which stifles inflation and growth. As mentioned before corporation tax is on profit, so taxing that should discourage them from boosting cash profits and make them invest that money elsewhere. Increasing tax on bigger companies and higher earners should also help reduce inequality which has been accelerating under covid and is generally seen as a bad thing for the continued healthy functioning of a society. However as its the tories I imagine the growth concern is the bigger one driving this.
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Mar 3, 2021 16:38
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Jedit posted:The political class don't believe it at all. It's a convenient fiction to support the narrative they want. And the media, well, it's in the air as to whether the tail wags the dog. But if they're not complicit they're compliant. Simon Jack might. He is after all an independent school educated PPE doer at Oxford and we all know the PPE is basically brain poison that teaches more about bluffing it than understanding anything.
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Mar 3, 2021 16:43
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Niric posted:I'm not sure I'm reading you right, but it seems like you're saying freezing the tax allowance is regressive and raising the allowance is progressive? Which isn't true. Raising the tax allowance is regressive, because it benefits the person earning £100,000 as much as anyone earning the personal allowance + £1, and benefits them more than the person earning personal allowance - £1.
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Mar 3, 2021 16:47
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Tarnop posted:Corporation tax is only levied against profit, so in theory raising it incentivises reinvestment there will be some serious Hollywood Accounting going on for sure. Yes we made £100 million after other overheads but there's a March 31st working lunch prawn sandwich bill of £99,999,999 which I'm afraid simply means there's no profit for you to tax this year. Sorry!
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Mar 3, 2021 16:49
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kecske posted:there will be some serious Hollywood Accounting going on for sure. Yes we made £100 million after other overheads but there's a March 31st working lunch prawn sandwich bill of £99,999,999 which I'm afraid simply means there's no profit for you to tax this year. Sorry! That’s not how Hollywood accounting works.
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Mar 3, 2021 16:53
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Ah, bollocks. https://twitter.com/ravenscimaven/status/1367045604166279169
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Mar 3, 2021 16:55
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There's also the fact that the economic downside to raising taxes could be a hit on consumer confidence, but the government could do fiscal stimulation to drive that up (and there is in fact a lot of scope for that right now due to the huge number of underemployed people and decaying infrastructure)
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Mar 3, 2021 16:55
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Hasn't New Scientist been a bit poo poo for years?
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Mar 3, 2021 17:01
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Payndz posted:Doesn't the personal allowance get clawed back from earnings over a certain amount, so once you earn over £125k or something like that you end up paying the basic rate on all of the PA's £12k+? It tails from £100k to £125k - for every £2 over £100k you earn, you lose £1 of allowance. The thing is it's silly to play around with that sort of taxation once you get into 6+ figures because the majority of people getting paid that much - certainly everyone apart from athletes once you get into the millions - isn't being paid a salary direct from an employer, they're being paid in dividends, share options, and all the other fun ways that the rich use to avoid paying their share. Any government that genuinely wanted to claim to be progressive on taxation would be taxing all income equally, but JOB CREATORS. kecske posted:there will be some serious Hollywood Accounting going on for sure. Yes we made £100 million after other overheads but there's a March 31st working lunch prawn sandwich bill of £99,999,999 which I'm afraid simply means there's no profit for you to tax this year. Sorry! As regressive as it is, that *is* one thing to be said for VAT. Amazon et. al. get away with paying basically zero tax in the UK by having to pay loans, dividends, licensing fees, and all sorts of other definitely real and not made up liabilities to a parent company tucked away somewhere with lower corporate tax rates. As corporate tax is based purely on profit, they can - completely legally (mostly) - claim to make no profit in the UK and so not have to pay tax. VAT and other sales taxes are basically impossible to avoid in this way (although there *are* ways of reducing the amount you have to pay but they come much, much closer to fraud).
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Mar 3, 2021 17:03
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forkboy84 posted:Hasn't New Scientist been a bit poo poo for years? It has
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Mar 3, 2021 17:05
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forkboy84 posted:Hasn't New Scientist been a bit poo poo for years? I thought it had been variable, with some good/interesting stuff.
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Mar 3, 2021 17:08
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