Cranappleberry posted:

It's more that the media gives an incomplete account. Much of the video, images amd explanation given by major media orgs or individual pundits lacks full context. The prosecution at also leaves out a lot (partially due to the judge not allowing things).

Also a good idea to read Wisconsin law on self-defense and it's limitations.

I believe that Rittenhouse is morally, factually and legally guilty but will be acquitted because of poor prosecution and the judge.

Oracle posted:

They need to stop using Celsius, no one in America who doesn't have a science degree knows from Celsius and they just go 'oh, 3-4 degree increase isn't bad, more warm summers for me!' because we all think in Fahrenheit.

STOP USING CELSIUS YOU loving EGGHEADS NOONE GETS IT BUT YOU

Oracle posted:

They need to stop using Celsius, no one in America who doesn't have a science degree knows from Celsius and they just go 'oh, 3-4 degree increase isn't bad, more warm summers for me!' because we all think in Fahrenheit.

STOP USING CELSIUS YOU loving EGGHEADS NOONE GETS IT BUT YOU

azflyboy posted:

Is there a chance that this ends up like the OJ Simpson case, where a jury lets Rittenhouse walk, but he's subsequently bankrupted by civil suit?

InsertPotPun posted:

rrrrriiiiight.
how so? what's the proper context? can you give an example?

Nottherealaborn posted:

Best case scenario at this point is Rittenhouse has a lovely life and is quickly forgotten by the right. If he’s actually remorseful (yeah loving right), he’ll hope to move on with his life and not get involved with politics or future riots/whatever. I doubt he’s remorseful, though, and will happily ride the right wing grift gravy train as far as it will take him.

Bedlam posted:

I'm worried a not guilty verdict would embolden similar behavior and other acts of right wing terrorism whenever any remotely left-leaning activities occur.

"Just run in fully armed and antagonize until you can argue you felt threatened, then murder them" could be the new right wing playbook.

Nottherealaborn posted:

azflyboy posted:

Is there a chance that this ends up like the OJ Simpson case, where a jury lets Rittenhouse walk, but he's subsequently bankrupted by civil suit?

Cranappleberry posted:

snip

Oracle posted:

They need to stop using Celsius, no one in America who doesn't have a science degree knows from Celsius and they just go 'oh, 3-4 degree increase isn't bad, more warm summers for me!' because we all think in Fahrenheit.

STOP USING CELSIUS YOU loving EGGHEADS NOONE GETS IT BUT YOU

Tactless Ogre posted:

Seriously.; yeah. Selling it in Celsius doesn't get through to those boneheads until you mention (Cx9/5)+32.

quote:

Nigel Goldenfeld, one of the physicists who was the butt of the comic strip, replied in good humor. “We enjoyed the joke,” he said. But, he noted, it was not a completely accurate portrayal of what happened.

For one, while he and a fellow physicist, Sergei Maslov, had devoted effort to an epidemiological model for all of Illinois, the more detailed university simulation, modeling the movements of some 46,000 students, professors and others like servers in coffee shops and bars who interact with students, was the effort of a larger group and led by Dr. Goldenfeld and Ahmed E. Elbanna, a professor of civil and environmental engineering. (It’s harder to make jokes about civil engineers.)

Second, they had indeed taken into account college partying and quite a bit of it — more than 7,000 students partying three times a week in their model.

What the scientists had not taken into account was that some students would continue partying after they received a positive test result. “It was willful noncompliance by a small group of people,” Dr. Goldenfeld said.

Those were the key ingredients for a few people infecting many others. “If you know you are positive,” Dr. Elbanna said, “and you go to a party, that’s not just a bad act. That’s very, very dangerous.”

Some of the students who tested positive even tried to circumvent the app so that they could enter buildings instead of staying isolated in their rooms, university administrators said in a letter to students.

Comprehensive testing of everyone on campus and prompt contact tracing showed the trouble spots — some fraternities and sororities, as well as some off-campus housing, that were throwing parties — as well as where the containment plans were working. There were few signs of the virus spreading in classrooms or from students to the people in the surrounding towns of Champaign and Urbana.

Peter Daou Zen posted:

These people think Mayor Pete is somebody to aspire to. A dead eyed, career climbing psychopath who has no original thoughts or feelings of his own and just mimics president Obama. Is there anybody in the Democratic Party that has even a shred of personality?

Doctor Butts posted:

He'll flame out, because even though he's a hate filled individual, he's dumb as poo poo and if he's a minor while getting his payouts, his parents will probably blow it all.

A big flaming stink posted:

speaking of, lowtax just died

Cranappleberry posted:

can't claim self-defense if you are in the process of committing a crime in Wisconsin*:

https://docs.legis.wisconsin.gov/statutes/statutes/939/iii/48

Also, its not a stand-your-ground state so if he could have kept going, he should have kept going. Also, he aimed at Rosenbaum after Rosenbaum threw the plastic bag which is threatening deadly force.

Now, case law matters a great deal, too, so it's not as cut and dry as I am making it seem. Plus then you have what the judge allows, what the prosecution chooses to use, the witnesses answering things in ways that hurt the case and etc. The devil is in the details.

*there is an exception to this but it doesn't necessarily apple

Kraftwerk posted:

This is a global problem.

I work in a role that has me managing basic raw chemical materials that go into everything from household cleaners, paints, plastics, packaging to pharma applications and in the last year due to supply shortages I have sold over 1500 Metric tons less material than 2022 but I made 3.5 million dollars more than last year in margin.
So I'm selling less product for exponentially more money per unit to a gigantic payout for my company of which I will see maybe $5000 in bonuses for despite being stressed out and overworked trying to keep up with this demand.

You want to know where the inflation is, it starts there. Then for every less unit of product my customers get, which they pay incrementally more for, they then increase their own unit costs and it cascades exponentially until it reaches your shopping cart. This has nothing to do with printing money and government policy and everything to do with COVID shocking the JIT business model and overloading the logistics system. People are stressed and overworked. They're less willing to put up with bullshit so they're quitting their jobs or refusing to do them which in turn further makes the situation worse. Yet no one wants to pay more due to even greater fears of inflation.

For my industry I'm still dealing with the consequences of the freezing weather in Houston back in Feb 2021 which we're still reeling from. Everyone is back online now but there's so many back orders and pent up demand that chemical factories are working full time and unable to meet demand. Then there was hurricane Ida which made things lovely again. Pandemic demand for Chinese goods has caused Amazon, Wal-Mart and other major companies to monopolize global freight logistics which also has ripple effects. Meanwhile the semiconductor market is locked down by big players like Apple who pre-purchased production capacity from TSMC years in advance.

You've got some big players who've secured all their demand while the rest of us are in what amounts to a permanent ongoing auction for cargo space and limited products.


The government isn't fixing this unless they launch a giant public works program where they start building nationally owned chemical plants, port expansion projects and wage subsidy programs for truckers and others. They have to step in and make investments that the private sector is too cowardly to invest in despite sitting on gigantic piles of cash that theyd rather invest in the stock market and shareholders than in their plants and employees.

Like seriously most major private sector companies are very flush with cash. They just aren't spending any of it and choosing to wait all this out hoping that we private citizens will run out of money first and go back to begging for our jobs.

Even a public works program like this won't solve things because as those workers jump in for huge salaries to help rebuild the economy and expand logistics, you still have a short-run supply problem and those extra dollars will start chasing increasingly scarcer goods. I can imagine your average construction worker landing an 80k/yr job helping expand the port of los angeles would immediately turn around and buy a fully loaded car brand new for 72 months financing and then prices start skyrocketing again.

Crosby B. Alfred posted:

Throwing a bag is deadly force?

The two things I don't understand are why wasn't Rittenhouse charge with something like manslaughter as opposed to murder in the first degree and why is the judge refusing to allow evidence such as his conduct after the shooting? To me, someone actions after this event are entirely relevant to the case at hand - his actions with White Supremacists to wearing a "Free as gently caress" t-shirt.

Bar Ran Dun posted:

We need a National Port Authority patterned after Georgia Ports Authority.

BalloonFish posted:

Not exactly the same, but this reminded me of a guy I worked with. He wasn't a libertarian - in fact he had no avowed political positions or interests at all. But he was an excellent example of how growing up in our current society and education system removes your ability to see some things in the round...things like capitalism.

A discussion about austerity and its effects had cropped up, and then someone brought up the New Deal and how, after Hoover's laissez-faire approach, FDR just threw money at people, created jobs to build infrastructure and set up both the USA as the arsenal of WW2 and the conditions for the mythologised golden age in the 50s etc. etc.

"But they weren't real jobs, were they?" he replied.

"What do you mean?"

"Like, if Roosevelt just paid people to build an airport, it's sort of fake, isn't it?"

"How so? It was a real airport. There were hundreds of them. They're still there."

"But it's not like anyone wanted an airport. Or there'd have been one there already, or at least a company trying to build one."

"The point was that private companies couldn't afford to build infrastructure but there was a massive demand for it. So FDR had the government pay for it to give people jobs and the US as a whole got the benefit of more people with money to spend and a load of new infrastructure which itself helped the economy grow."

"It just seems phony to me - the government just going around creating jobs from thin air and building stuff. It's not real. When the economy grows it's because businesses do well, not because the government decided to randomly pay people to build stuff."

"It wasn't random. Those big dams in the Rockies don't exist just so they could pay people to pour concrete. There was a demand for hydroelectric power and flood control, and there were loads of people looking for work, but no business had the money to spend, so the government paid."

"It just doesn't seem right..."

As I said, he wasn't being (conciously) ideological or argumentative, he'd just never had to think about this stuff before and had been brought up to see any sort of government spending as 'not real'. If a private company pays people to build an airport to satisfy a demand, that's fine. But if the government builds it it's not genuine economic activity and the result is some sort of phoney Potemkin Airport that goes against the natural order because it wasn't willed into existence by private capital.

He just couldn't grasp the idea that all these roads, airports, dams, pipes, bridges, schools, houses, theatres, tunnels etc. that the PWA/CWA built were fulfilling an actual demand or need... because if they were they wouldn't need the government to build them. It gave me this image of FDR just throwing darts at a map and - bam - a couple of houses and a gas station next to a grain elevator in South Dakota are going to get a 3000-seat symphonic concert hall whether they need one or not.

It was like an instinctual version of the "The government can't just give people jobs..." argument you get from neolibs.

Ghost Leviathan posted:

There's a quote somewhere in the Libertarian thread about how public infrastructure is literally unthinkable to most Americans. Lemme find it.

Cranappleberry posted:

aiming the rifle is threatening deadly force and a disproportionate response to someone throwing a plastic bag

CommieGIR posted:

So a memo justifying Trump's firing of Defense Secretary Esper dropped and....wow, its a read

https://twitter.com/jonkarl/status/1458449906176245763?s=20

CommieGIR posted:

So a memo justifying Trump's firing of Defense Secretary Esper dropped and....wow, its a read

https://twitter.com/jonkarl/status/1458449906176245763?s=20

CommieGIR posted:

So a memo justifying Trump's firing of Defense Secretary Esper dropped and....wow, its a read

https://twitter.com/jonkarl/status/1458449906176245763?s=20

FlamingLiberal posted:

This isn’t good

https://twitter.com/morningbrew/status/1458505156576829442?s=21

I don’t know if China bailing them out or whatever will fix it

VorpalBunny posted:

I feel like this is a Big Deal, didn't China already sink a bunch of gov't cheese trying to prop them up? I couldn't find a market reaction to this anywhere, but it's been a mess of a news day. And now Lowtax news will take over all the channels, side by side with the Rittenhouse trial!

And the other trial in GA isn't being televised because those klansmen are clearly guilty, and their judge isn't nuts. That doesn't make for good tv.

Youth Decay posted:

The prosecutor also sucks, doesn't make Rittenhouse any less guilty but does make it easier for the judge/defense (who are essentially the same at this point) to muddy the waters.

Kalit posted:

Basically this. I'm so grateful that my state didn't have this lovely of a prosecution team during the trial against Chauvin. I feel like Binger was asking a number of questions to Rittenhouse on cross examination that he [Binger] didn't even know the answer to. Not to mention all of the issues that others ITT had brought up.

I feel like the ineptness of the prosecution team is going to be why Rittenhouse is found not guilty.....

Bel Shazar posted:

The silver lining here is that more people will realize that the judicial system is a corrupt joke and they have no protection from an ever more imperial state and its capitalist keys to power.

FlamingLiberal posted:

This isn’t good

https://twitter.com/morningbrew/status/1458505156576829442?s=21

I don’t know if China bailing them out or whatever will fix it