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Annointed posted:I ain't suffering tech bro quirky 🤪 Lex Luthor Failson. That's just what every billionaire today acts like.
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Mar 23, 2022 18:00
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Ccs posted:Wait, what are people seeing in Batman v Superman? That's an almost unwatchable movie. There's literally nothing the Batman does better than BvS. The best part is BvS Superman is campaigning against Battinson, who starts the movie not knowing he's working with corrupt cops, to deliberately being a tool for them by the end. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snzSAsS_42s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Th3WcAVCaKo
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Mar 23, 2022 18:05
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Pirate Jet posted:That's just what every billionaire today acts like. There have been so many good/better versions of Lex. My favorite is probably the Alan Moore Lex Luthor who is literally bored to tears but the pedestrian problems of Gotham City, but I also really like Smallville’s Michael Rosenbaum a lot for his aloof chadly-playboy who is driven by solving the MUSTSRY of Smallville
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Mar 23, 2022 19:13
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The United States posted:I think pick one from each column is a more interesting choice here Rows TDK BVS Rises Forever Columns: Rises Masks TDK Bvs regulargonzalez posted:From pages back but McCloud, I just wanted you to know: I got the joke even if no one else did, so your post was not in vain. Thanks  bushisms.txt posted:There's literally nothing the Batman does better than BvS. The best part is BvS Superman is campaigning against Battinson, who starts the movie not knowing he's working with corrupt cops, to deliberately being a tool for them by the end. Agreed, the beats for Battinson are by and large the same as for Affleck in BvS, brutish batman realizing he’s gone off the deep end and vows to do better. It was just better done in BvS Bust Rodd posted:There have been so many good/better versions of Lex. My favorite is probably the Alan Moore Lex Luthor who is literally bored to tears but the pedestrian problems of Gotham City, but I also really like Smallville’s Michael Rosenbaum a lot for his aloof chadly-playboy who is driven by solving the MUSTSRY of Smallville  Updating Lex from Wall street mogul to a tech bro a la Musk/Zuckerberg was brilliant and prescient, considering t he damage they’ve ended up doing. As usual, Zack is ahead of the curve
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Mar 23, 2022 19:57
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McCloud posted:Agreed, the beats for Battinson are by and large the same as for Affleck in BvS, brutish batman realizing he’s gone off the deep end and vows to do better. It was just better done in BvS Batfleck is sentencing criminals to death and trying to kill Superman. Battinson's deep end is lot shallower.
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Mar 23, 2022 20:07
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McCloud posted:
Yeah I mean, obviously personal favorites will vary and I get preferring a more "classic" Lex, but given what Musk, Zuck and Bezos have gotten up to over the past few years it's incorrect to assume that Snyder just somehow hosed up and made Lex wrong (which was the prevailing idea at the time). He very clearly had a vision for Lex as a modern tech billionaire and he certainly was way closer to the bullseye than some other media which feature tech billionaires; i.e. that they are crazy fuckheads who just buy their way into more power/influence and aren't some kind of intellectual titans shaping the world around them through sheer genius.
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Mar 23, 2022 20:11
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theres only 1 good tech billionaire performance its tucci in age
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Mar 23, 2022 20:17
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It's very strange to me, this idea that certain directors make films by mistake. Like, Snyder tripped over a barbell and fell down the stairs and somehow had a complete film in his hands when he woke up in the stairwell. People don't have to like their creative decisions, but the idea that they somehow accidentally made Batman crazy or Lex a techbro is so weird.
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Mar 23, 2022 20:31
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live with fruit posted:Batfleck is sentencing criminals to death and trying to kill Superman. Battinson's deep end is lot shallower. You’re right, one really commits to the idea and the other just half-asses it
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Mar 23, 2022 20:39
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I feel like snyders gotham (what little we see of it) is far less interesting than pattinsons. The funeral scene where the place is crammed top to bottom with churchgoers looks like a huge dismal snapshot of victorian england and i loving love it,i think pattinsons batman has literally the best gotham since 89(and better)
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Mar 23, 2022 20:39
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:I feel like snyders gotham (what little we see of it) is far less interesting than pattinsons. Yeah I think this is fair. I do like some of the touches Snyder puts in BvS's Gotham -- at least what little we see of it -- like the cops bickering over Batman, the local sports stuff, etc. But it's definitely one meant to fit in with the existing tone of Man of Steel and because the movie is already so packed Gotham doesn't get a chance to become as much of a 'character' as it does in Batman solo films. (as a Chicago native I also loved how much stuff I recognized, I am easy to please like that)
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Mar 23, 2022 21:07
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McCloud posted:
Just wanna say, BvS lex is squarely Palmer Lucky who was blowing up at the time.  Let's not forget Lucky would go on to lead the digital charge for trumps election.
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Mar 23, 2022 21:24
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Snyder's problem is and always has been that he is incapable of telling a story in around 120 minutes when he could take 4 hours instead.
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Mar 23, 2022 21:34
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I don't like any of the versions of Blade Runner. I've given the movie several shots and I always just wind up bored to death. I'll show myself out.
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Mar 23, 2022 22:04
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BiggerBoat posted:I don't like any of the versions of Blade Runner. I've given the movie several shots and I always just wind up bored to death. I saw Br1 and i thought it was really good (can’t remember which version though,directors cut maybe) Br2 was so loving boring,the film equivalent of a videogame loading screen.
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Mar 23, 2022 22:24
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Blade Runner 2049 sounded amazing
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Mar 23, 2022 23:08
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I found Bladerunner 2049 to have such good visuals and sound design to keep me compelled the entire way through. As for BvS I hate the gods gods gods talk. Just spammed over and over. Also never got shots of Superman depicted as this boyscout everyone hypes him as. As for the v title it was never a question of who would win when the past several decades everyone has bent themselves towards Batman beating Superman as the default. Riddler was more fun to listen to from him being a liveleak to this accounting loser you can pick off the street. Annointed fucked around with this message at 23:15 on Mar 23, 2022 |
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Mar 23, 2022 23:12
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Annointed posted:
Having seen the film, I know for a fact there was a whole segment of him just helping people. 
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Mar 23, 2022 23:40
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Simply Simon posted:Tone is something that will work or won't work for the viewer, it's impossible to give a clear "oh no it was objectively well-done, and here's the reasons" answer. There's a bunch of movies where tone shifts irked me (The Last Jedi for example Some people like can like a toneless movie and that's fine, but just like with the Last Jedi, there are basic conventions in storytelling that a story that markets itself as a conventional story should at a bare minimum meet unless you're making an artsy film to break those conventions. I'm not talking about unconventional stories - this movie, for example, tried to highlight Batman's position as a privileged person - but how basic story structure is followed. quote:My argument, if you want to talk about it beyond "it's subjective", is that there's something inherently ridiculous about a guy dressed as a Bat fighting themed supervillains, the most prominent of which is successful because he marries jokes with crime and violence. The question is if you address that ridicule and how, and there's no right answer imo. The first few Batman movies (both Burton and Schumacher, actually) embraced the silliness and made everything super exaggerated, just more and more so as the latter ones rolled in. Nolan decided to instead treat everything super seriously, just never commenting on the concept's zany potential, literally spending an entire movie (Begins) to justify how it might work in the world he decided to build for it. Snyder didn't ask "wouldn't it be ridiculous", he asked "wouldn't it be hosed up" and rolled with that. And Reeves, at least judging from this one movie, decided to get back to the first idea: he thinks it's kinda silly, but he made a world that's just exaggerated enough that the level of silliness he goes for fits in. You completely misread my argument. I did not have a problem with the comedic elements on their own. Honestly, someone making a Batman comedy movie would be great. This movie had great comedy, from Penguin to the car chase to the cops to Batman himself. But what you just can't dispute are the dramatic elements. The dark and sad and hosed up ones. Riddler's entire backstory and murders. The state of Gotham. Political and police corruption. Mob bastards raised in a brothel/bar, with all the implied abuse. Orphanages with not implied abuse but literal babies dying of starvation. The initial narration and fight. Batman was a complete recluse, his relationship with Alfred was uncomfortable at best, and his relationship with his father is laid to ruin... And again, that is loving GREAT. Make that movie and follow it to it's logical conclusion with a third act that doesn't entirely invalidate the goals, purpose and sympathy behind the great villain you have created. quote:I'm not a comic reader, but I did read a few Batman comics, mostly waiting for a bus in a comic store, which happened about once a month and I didn't always read a Batman comic. What I got from this disjointed reading (aka not following a full storyline, just picking out single issues on display and leafing through them) is that many authors in many eras of the character have always played around with how silly they want to make the setting and Batman himself. I own a few from the 80s where everything is Nolanesquely serious. I've read some awful edgy 90s stuff which we thankfully haven't seen in movies yet.* And there's more modern takes which I mostly see as funny panel excerpts posted on SA, where they have a lot of jokes about lol he's dressed as a bat and a loner weirdo. Again, no problem with the comedy. Just when it exists with starving babies and a mob guy having the hots for his kid even if he doesn't know it, because of the age difference. Was I...was I supposed to laugh at those? quote:I like to take those things at face value. It works for me if it seems consistent, character and world. Gotham in this movie is a silly place but everyone in it treats its issues with the seriousness required from living in it. As the watcher, I laugh at the running gag of the twin bouncers, but Batman/Bruce don't find it ridiculous because that's just how the world is for them. And I think that's a perfectly fine discrepancy between how I watch the movie and how the characters themselves "live" in it. The disrepancy has nothing to do with if you are a comic fan or not, the person I watched the movie with came out of it just as confused. There is no consistency in HOW Gotham is presented to the viewer. At one minute it's LOL Batman doesn't understand Spanish? And at the next it is Bruce Wayne despite all of his personal tragedy was nonetheless privileged enough to escape the true horrors of Gotham City. The former is funny, and fitting for the really low-rent street level Batman we had, and him getting hosed up by a shotgun blast at close range was hilarious after being literally bulletproof. Was the latter funny to you? To anyone else? It really wasn't to me. Both are well-written IF it had been a purely comedic or purely dramatic movie. But it tried to be both, which was a bizarre choice by the most basic conventions of storytelling. You can say that you liked it and there is no problem with that. You can't deny the actual fault in making a coherent story. I love the Room. It is a bad movie. I love bad movies so much I listen to podcasts making fun of them for longer than the actual movie in question. Most Batman movies are legendary for being pretty terrible, and even of the last trilogy the first and last are pretty mocked, because they deserve it. I have watched every Batman movie a minimum of three times and will watch them again. Except this one, because there is nothing as frustrating as watching a movie that could be good but constantly gets in its own way for no good reason. Hell, this movie has two movies that could be good. Most movies that could be good have lovely elements but this one is a funny movie and a movie that makes you think at the same time, except because they exist as one movie both the purposes of comedy and drama are invalidated by the other. I can't find joy in excellent acting performances detailing the horrible conditions of a poverty-ridden system, where Batman realizes not giving a poo poo about his family business has resulted into more horror then anything he has prevented by beating up the poors...if half a hour ago he and Penguin manslaughtered a dozen loving people in a completely ridicolous car chase after which Batman let Penguin go. I don't give a gently caress if that guy has issues with his dad or whatever, he's a piece of poo poo, if you want me to laugh at him don't insert in things that really aren't funny if you don't make them funny somehow. Like you can totally find a comedic angle to Batman being a lovely trust fund baby beating up drug addicts, but if you do, present it as such And again, if you found the dramatic aspects funny, okay, but I don't think it is out of the line to expect that most people wouldn't, with how they were presented. epsilon posted:Anytime you have to use caps lock to make some point in an attempt to be funny means this garbage is automatically dismissed Again, stop getting offended on behalf of bad movies. It's ok to like bad movies, this was one, I like many terrible, horrible movies too while acknowledging the very present areas where they have been found lacking. I love how a personal attack against a movie leads into you making personal attacks, that's really healthy of you. I wish there had been an internet during Batman and Robin and I hadn't been basically a toddler because the flamewars from people liking a movie that is clearly bad but not being able to reconcile liking a bad movie with their identity for some weird reason, and trying To retroactively justify it's failures would have been something epic. I love Batman and Robin, btw. DarkCrawler fucked around with this message at 00:20 on Mar 24, 2022 |
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Mar 24, 2022 00:16
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) and a lot of people were perfectly fine with it, and conversely, The Batman nailed the tone for me.
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As much as i love The Batman i’d really like to see how cutting 20-30 minutes off the end does for it. Like literally just end the movie at the diner just as Riddler is about to turn around.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:28
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:As much as i love The Batman i’d really like to see how cutting 20-30 minutes off the end does for it. That completely changes Batman's character arc. If you end the movie when the Riddler is arrested, Batman doesn't learn anything.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:29
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live with fruit posted:That completely changes Batman's character arc. If you end the movie when the Riddler is arrested, Batman doesn't learn anything. Good point.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:33
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:As much as i love The Batman i’d really like to see how cutting 20-30 minutes off the end does for it. You could probably shorten the film by 20 minutes just by trimming the fat in a lot of scenes. Like the bit with the bat cage, or the bikes at the end, or the reeeeallly slow walk towards penguins car with the peekaboo at the end
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Mar 24, 2022 00:39
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Also i’ve never had a Blu ray player but i think i might get one just for this,wanna see what it’s like in black and white as well.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:42
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McCloud posted:You could probably shorten the film by 20 minutes just by trimming the fat in a lot of scenes. Like the bit with the bat cage, or the bikes at the end, or the reeeeallly slow walk towards penguins car with the peekaboo at the end You could do that, but I suspect doing so kills the mood of the film.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:44
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McCloud posted:Having seen the film, I know for a fact there was a whole segment of him just helping people. I too have seen the film. I said him being a boyscout of "saving cats from trees", not him not saving people and constantly framing it as him being sad about it. EDIT: I keep thinking the multiple endings was too much, but I have trouble figuring out which scenes cut there would be fitting. Maybe the catgirl and bruce departure? But it kind of solidifies catgirl being a proletariat antihero. I guess the extra scene with maybe joker could be cut and leave Riddler crying in his cell. Annointed fucked around with this message at 01:18 on Mar 24, 2022 |
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Mar 24, 2022 00:44
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You're extremely invested in proving that this movie was objectively bad and I don't know why
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Mar 24, 2022 00:48
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Deffo cut the joker scene,gimme the scissors i’ll do it myself.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:52
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Brazilianpeanutwar posted:Deffo cut the joker scene,gimme the scissors i’ll do it myself. Be our guest good mate.
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Mar 24, 2022 00:52
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Annointed posted:I too have seen the film. I said him being a boyscout of "saving cats from treets", not him not saving people and constantly framing it as him being sad about it. So if the scene was identical but with a cat instead of an 8 year old girl, that would be an improvement?
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Mar 24, 2022 01:13
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The Dark Knight also had a really tacked on action ending with the doctors dressed up like henchmen scene but that one actually felt more like a video game level the studio forced in.
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Mar 24, 2022 01:15
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McCloud posted:So if the scene was identical but with a cat instead of an 8 year old girl, that would be an improvement? He should have also smiled and winked at the camera
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Mar 24, 2022 01:38
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Annointed posted:...I hate the gods gods gods talk. Just spammed over and over. Also never got shots of Superman depicted as this boyscout everyone hypes him as. It's almost like the innocuous boyscout image of the character isn't what the movie's going for, vs. Superman as a force of nature that people deify or demonize, all to Clark's extreme discomfort. Maybe having him save a cat from a tree wouldn't serve the movie's themes as well as a scene where he "looks sad" because a crowd starts to worship him like divinity when he just wants to be regarded as a person. McCloud posted:You could probably shorten the film by 20 minutes just by trimming the fat in a lot of scenes. Like the bit with the bat cage, or the bikes at the end, or the reeeeallly slow walk towards penguins car with the peekaboo at the end I had a similar thought, but have no idea where they'd cut. The thing this movie nails the most is its atmosphere. It's probably the most textured, visceral take on Gotham as a setting, and the moments you point out are all ones I liked because they speak to that feeling. Except the bikes. I agree about that. Whoever described it as the end of a Fast & Furious movie kind of nailed it, it seems...I don't know, it's way more cute than I was expecting.
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Mar 24, 2022 01:55
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The problem with deconstructing Superman is that we haven't had a good Superman movie in 40 years.
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Mar 24, 2022 02:06
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Xealot posted:It's almost like the innocuous boyscout image of the character isn't what the movie's going for, vs. Superman as a force of nature that people deify or demonize, all to Clark's extreme discomfort. Maybe having him save a cat from a tree wouldn't serve the movie's themes as well as a scene where he "looks sad" because a crowd starts to worship him like divinity when he just wants to be regarded as a person. You might be right. I'm gonna rewatch it when it's out on HBO and see if I like it more on a second viewing. live with fruit posted:The problem with deconstructing Superman is that we haven't had a good Superman movie in 40 years. We had an excellent one just 9 years ago, you should check it out.
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Mar 24, 2022 02:20
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Xealot posted:It's almost like the innocuous boyscout image of the character isn't what the movie's going for, vs. Superman as a force of nature that people deify or demonize, all to Clark's extreme discomfort. Maybe having him save a cat from a tree wouldn't serve the movie's themes as well as a scene where he "looks sad" because a crowd starts to worship him like divinity when he just wants to be regarded as a person. How would showing base humanity of people treating or liking superman's minor acts not work with the idea of alienation? Wouldn't that help the theme espoused show he has things that remind of being superman to contrast the hero worship being put in? As for the bikes. I'm of two minds. It helped Catwoman's part in exiting the film and what she wanted to do, as her storyline mattered in dealing with Falcone. I think I can be fine with cutting most of the bike riding and having them part ways. After they said their piece. I think one scene I keep wondering should be cut would be the opening scene of the Riddler voyeur shot of the kids and the parents playing pretend. It does matter thematically, but in terms of the overall story, it doesn't seem to come up in the background scenes or dialog.
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Mar 24, 2022 02:32
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All the scenes with the kid looking sad and Batman empathizing would feel lesser if it felt like the kid came out of nowhere, with the opening you get that this dude's got a kid he's got a good relationship with
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Mar 24, 2022 02:35
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McCloud posted:We had an excellent one just 9 years ago, you should check it out. I did. Another one of the worst movies I've ever seen.
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Mar 24, 2022 02:36
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Annointed posted:As for the bikes. I'm of two minds. It helped Catwoman's part in exiting the film and what she wanted to do, as her storyline mattered in dealing with Falcone. I think I can be fine with cutting most of the bike riding and having them part ways. After they said their piece. It also sets up a Catwoman spinoff.
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Mar 24, 2022 02:37
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live with fruit posted:I did. Another one of the worst movies I've ever seen. Maybe CW's show is more your speed then  Annointed posted:How would showing base humanity of people treating or liking superman's minor acts not work with the idea of alienation? Wouldn't that help the theme espoused show he has things that remind of being superman to contrast the hero worship being put in? He's constantly showing base humanity, both as Clark Kent, Journalist, and Superman. The whole segment of him rescuing people was about him showing base humanity and people projecting their own ideas onto that. What exactly would adding a sappy scene of him rescuing a cat accomplish that isn't already by him rescuing a girl from a building on fire? Like, do you think a problem with the film is that Superman isn't being human enough?
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Mar 24, 2022 02:49
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