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Cyflan posted:5's a solid game too. It is but it's also a spin-off 
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Nov 1, 2023 18:37
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fridge corn posted:It is but it's also a spin-off Suikoden 5 happens in the same world, plays the same way as the first two games, and shares some characters so how is it a spin-off?
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Nov 1, 2023 18:41
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Cyflan posted:Suikoden 5 happens in the same world, plays the same way as the first two games, and shares some characters so how is it a spin-off? It's a prequel
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Nov 1, 2023 18:44
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fridge corn posted:It's a prequel uh, how are prequels spin-offs? People usually use those terms to mean dramatically different things. Like is Tales of Berseria a spin-off in your calculation because its a prequel to Zesteria?
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Nov 1, 2023 18:48
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fridge corn posted:It's a prequel That... doesn't mean it's a spin-off, though? Like, Tactics is a spin-off because it isn't a numbered title, and also plays very differently. But Suikoden V just happens before the first game, that doesn't mean it's a spin-off.
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Nov 1, 2023 18:48
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Inspector Gesicht posted:There's a spitting chance of Eiyuden Chronicle being the sequel to Suikoden II people wanted. AU-den
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Nov 1, 2023 18:52
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fridge corn posted:It's a prequel So by your logic Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater is a spinoff of Metal Gear Solid?
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Nov 1, 2023 19:01
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Schwarzwald posted:AU-den Eh-eee-you-den?
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Nov 1, 2023 19:19
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Suikoden V isn't a spinoff, but because it's a prequel it fails to advance the storyline set up by 1-3.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:19
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Wild Arms 4 is great, Wild Arms 5 sucks.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:24
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That makes me wonder if there is a prequel that "advances the main plot" without being partially set in the present day. I guess there are prequels that set up things for later installments like Birth By Sleep.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:24
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ImpAtom posted:So by your logic Metal Gear Solid 3: Snake Eater is a spinoff of Metal Gear Solid? That actually makes some sense. It has a different main character and a whole hoard of different game mechanics. Even the stealth mechanics - the key game mechanic of Metal Gear - are completely different from all previous Metal Gear games. It doesn't ultimately feel like a spinoff, mainly because of how strongly it ties into the main MGS story. Metal Gear Ac!d and Ghost Babel do feel like spinoffs - even though GB plays more like traditional Metal Gear than MGS3 does - because they don't affect the main story. But it's an interesting example to focus on.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:25
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Clarste posted:Wild Arms 4 is great, Wild Arms 5 sucks. Wild Arms 4 has someone jump out of a plane to shoot down missiles and then he punches the last missile cause he ran out of ammo.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:26
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Tequila Bob posted:That actually makes some sense. It has a different main character and a whole hoard of different game mechanics. Even the stealth mechanics - the key game mechanic of Metal Gear - are completely different from all previous Metal Gear games. Most of those game mechanics are transferred over in some way to Metal Gear Solid 4 which is a direct sequel to MGS2.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:26
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OddObserver posted:Suikoden V isn't a spinoff, but because it's a prequel it fails to advance the storyline set up by 1-3. This is what I meant but the added caveat that a suikoden game that doesn't take place in the "present time" is inherently a spin off cuz imo the "now-ness" of Suikoden is one of its defining qualities as a series
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Nov 1, 2023 19:34
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Anyway, I got my copy of Star Ocean 2 early. Is Dexterity just called Nimble Fingers now? Or is that something else
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Nov 1, 2023 19:35
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fridge corn posted:This is what I meant but the added caveat that a suikoden game that doesn't take place in the "present time" is inherently a spin off cuz imo the "now-ness" of Suikoden is one of its defining qualities as a series Suikoden is literally a series that opens with with the reveals of events happening long before the current time impacting the current time to the point where you time travel in the very first game and the third game features a nonlinear overlapping series of stories. I can't say 'nowness' is particularly important to its DNA in any way, shape or form and if anything the presence of immortals and ancestors and such is a much bigger factor.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:39
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the only sense in which you could say mgs3 isn't any kind of evolution on the mechanics of mgs2 is because you can play it with a third person camera. i think people forget often that, the third person camera was an option, and not the default way of playing that the game originally released with
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Nov 1, 2023 19:49
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ape escape 3 is a spinoff of ape escape because you dont play as prior ape escape characters and you use superpowers more than you use gadgets. checkmate
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Nov 1, 2023 19:51
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a spinoff has the word gaiden in it
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Nov 1, 2023 19:55
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The Colonel posted:the only sense in which you could say mgs3 isn't any kind of evolution on the mechanics of mgs2 is because you can play it with a third person camera. i think people forget often that, the third person camera was an option, and not the default way of playing that the game originally released with Nobody even mentioned the camera. It was the same camera as MGS2 on release, mostly. I'm talking about stuff like all the food mechanics, specific injuries and treatments, the entire camo system, guards no longer having vision cones (they can spot you from all the way across the map if your camo is bad), ambient hazardous wildlife, and the interrogation mini-game. None of those were in MGS2.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:55
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fridge corn posted:Anyway, I got my copy of Star Ocean 2 early. Is Dexterity just called Nimble Fingers now? Or is that something else Ya, Nimble Fingers is Dexterity.
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Nov 1, 2023 19:55
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Snooze Cruise posted:a spinoff has the word gaiden in it this
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Nov 1, 2023 19:55
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ImpAtom posted:Suikoden is literally a series that opens with with the reveals of events happening long before the current time impacting the current time to the point where you time travel in the very first game and the third game features a nonlinear overlapping series of stories. What I'm talking about is how from the second game references the events of the first and the third game references the events of the first two gives weight to your actions through the story, as if you are making history in real time and that you are actually affecting change in the world because you get to see glimpses of your efforts in subsequent titles. Not so with Suikoden 4 and 5 since they are set in the past - the outcomes of narratives are already determined. You are witnessing history rather than living it. I feel its an important distinction. Suikoden 5 was a good effort to turn the series back on track after the disaster of 4 but it merely imitates a suikoden game imo. 5 fixes what 4 got wrong mechanically, but fails to grasp what made the series so unique and captivating in the first place. Suikoden 5 is a good game in a vacuum but a disappointing entry to the series
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Nov 1, 2023 19:58
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TurnipFritter posted:Ya, Nimble Fingers is Dexterity. Nice I'm good to go then, don't have to replay the first 3 hours 👍👍
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Nov 1, 2023 19:59
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what is the defining feature of mgs' core design if not the piles of weird ambient mechanics each successive game adds
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Nov 1, 2023 19:59
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if you really want to bait people into an mgs mainline argument you need to talk about whether peace walker is a spinoff and, if so, whether v is one by extension because it's a peace walker sequel but also half of v's story is the entire extended cast of peace walker getting brutally killed or turning into massive psychopaths off screen
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Nov 1, 2023 20:00
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Cyflan posted:Man, I am so hyped to play SO2 again tomorrow.  What are people doing for their parties? I'm thinking: Claude, Rena, Ashton, Leon, Celine, Precis, Welch, Noel for the 1st playthrough. You get all the casters. Ashton, Precis and Welch so you can get all their killer moves. Leon, Celine, Ashton and Welch are there so you can open every single treasure chest in the game, if you care about cheevos. Rena, Claude, Dias, Opera, Ernest, Bowman, Noel, Chisato as the 2nd party. Replace Noel with Celine or something if he sucks real bad(or if you want to get the ending with Rena and Celine from the psp version).
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Nov 1, 2023 20:00
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MGS2 had ambient wildlife hazards (birds poop on the floor and you slip in it)
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Nov 1, 2023 20:01
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metal gear solid 2 had foreshadowing for future series plot events in the form of raiden's first arch rival, pisstream sam
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Nov 1, 2023 20:04
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anyway if we follow this train of logic we have to enter a discussion about whether silent hill 1 and 3 are the only mainline silent hill games and every other silent hill game in existence is a spinoff except for i guess homecoming somehow and i'm not ready to have conversations about the insanity of silent hill as a franchise this many times in one year
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Nov 1, 2023 20:05
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Snooze Cruise posted:a spinoff has the word gaiden in it The secret game NES Ninja that Ninja Gaiden is a spinoff of....
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Nov 1, 2023 20:07
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The Colonel posted:anyway if we follow this train of logic we have to enter a discussion about whether silent hill 1 and 3 are the only mainline silent hill games and every other silent hill game in existence is a spinoff except for i guess homecoming somehow and i'm not ready to have conversations about the insanity of silent hill as a franchise this many times in one year and thats not even getting into cut content.
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Nov 1, 2023 20:08
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Every Silent Hill after 4 has been completely unnecessary. Devs: "We're going to return to what made Silent Hill 2 great!" Fans: "Horror rooted in the characters' psychology?" Devs: "Absolutely!" ... Devs: "So the Cult of Samael is back.." I'll grant an exception to Shattered Memories, since it was a very ambitious experiment - and pretty fun to play too.
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Nov 1, 2023 20:09
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you're giving them too much credit. even when they try to focus on the psychological aspect none of them know how to write a human being and read silent hill 2's plot as "silent hill is for bad people who did a bad thing and feel bad about it" and ignore the part where a major character was a sexual abuse victim who didn't really do anything bad and that james' character is more about he's just kind of a pathetic person who was put into a situation he had no idea how to handle and did something awful because he was incapable of thinking of a way out
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Nov 1, 2023 20:10
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it is dumb conversations like these that makes the rpg thread the best game thread on the forums 🫡
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Nov 1, 2023 20:11
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the hack i'm playing cuts out the entire prologue so it took me a while to notice but, dang the starter town of golden sun 1 is by far the largest and most geographically complex in the game. i suppose that's because it's the only town to really have much action occurring in it but still, struck me as a bit odd. the only town that comes close is the flooded mining town. the layout is cool though
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Nov 1, 2023 20:12
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Tequila Bob posted:Every Silent Hill after 4 has been completely unnecessary.
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Nov 1, 2023 20:12
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i dont really like shattered memories at all either because it weirds me out that the only conception sam barlow has of lisa garland is that she's a drug addict when that was one line of her diary that was more there to illustrate the abuse and manipulation she was subjected to
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Nov 1, 2023 20:13
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Clarste posted:Wild Arms 4 is great, Wild Arms 5 sucks. wild arms 5 directly led to symphogear so its pretty good
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Nov 1, 2023 20:13
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