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Majorian posted:"Trump would make everything worse in Gaza" is a strong-but-vague claim. I wanted to know what Kchama's logic was in making that claim, given how badly I feel Biden has handled the situation, and to what degree they thought Trump would make things worse. I asked Kchama and socialsecurity because they were the ones making the claim most directly. (that I saw, anyway) I am immensely frustrated by this conversation because it involves issues I don't have good answers to myself, and so reading reasoned disagreements could be (and has been) very helpful to me, but very frequently gets derailed by seemingly irrelevant points-scoring. I understand you believe Biden is doing a very bad job (to put it mildly), which is reasonable. I agree. I think the question of whether to support/vote for someone whose actions have abhorrent consequences is a difficult one. I believe that Biden's actions are historically atrocious. I believe he is one of the few people in the world who can materially stop or at least slow down a genocide and he does not have the disposition or the political will to do so. That's truly revolting to me. It's completely unconscionable. And I think it is obvious that Trump would be worse. And even you seem to agree. I think a discussion that accepts these facts would be much more interesting than one that seeks to undermine or deny the pretty obvious reality of the situation. Pressing people on the specifics of what Trump will do is a great way to score points against them because their answer is necessarily going to be vague, because Trump himself is vague. But I do not think you are uncovering any revelatory truth by asking people to go through with that exercise. You seem to be saying it in response to a perception that they don't think Biden's actions are bad. But what they are actually saying is true even if Biden is terrible. Which, I agree, he is. So that's where I'm coming from. I would rather read a debate about what to do in the face of two evils. As circular as it's been, it's been helpful for me to read. Challenging someone to establish that one of the evils is in fact evil, when you yourself do not doubt that it is evil, is incredibly frustrating, even if I now better understand your reasons for doing so.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:10
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Eiba posted:Thank you for answering my direct questions. I appreciate this. To be clear, I'm not challenging anyone to establish that one of the evils is in fact evil - we're all on the same page that Trump is evil. It's just a question of, "Is he more evil than Biden on this very fraught, life-or-death-for-millions-of-people issue, and if so, by how much, in material terms?" I get that that may come off as asking how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, but again, it's a life-or-death issue for millions of people, and folks here and elsewhere are doing a lot of important soul-searching to decide how they're going to vote in November (I have the luxury of not having to do that, because again, deep blue state and all that). So I think it's a valid thing to discuss, but I'm sorry if anything I posted came off as points-scoring, because that's not at all what I intended.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:15
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Majorian posted:I don't think anyone here is going to deny that Trump was a terrible president. "Uniquely terrible," though? That's the part that seems like hyperbole to me. Considering the GWB, Obama, and Biden Admin's policies towards the broader MENA region, his foreign policy was unfortunately pretty in line with the trend: GWB had Iraq and Afghanistan and everything else, Obama had Libya, Trump had his drone war, etc. Trump's rhetoric is certainly more inflammatory than his predecessors' or successor's, but in material terms there doesn't seem to have been much that was "unique" about this part of his foreign policy. Trump declared he'd invade Gaza himself. That's definitely uniquely terrible, especially if you think this one genocide is a uniquely bad one.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:15
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KillHour posted:Being angry and being rational are generally not well correlated. "they were angry so their racism is excusable" what the gently caress is wrong with you?
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Feb 12, 2024 00:27
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Voting for Biden is voting for genocide. Bloue MAGA dot txt in this thread.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:39
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Acebuckeye13 posted:"they were angry so their racism is excusable" what the gently caress is wrong with you? Not everything has to be a maximalist "you're either completely in agreement with me or something is loving wrong with you." I didn't say racism is acceptable*; I said the response to call for a perma was over the top, especially since it called out the avatar and not specifically the title. It frankly immediately reminded me of how Israeli mouthpieces immediately accuse everything critical of Israel of being anti-semitic. I realize due to the rest of the conversation that followed that this isn't what kchama was doing, but without that context, it could easily be taken that way. *You said excusable, not acceptable, but I want to be careful with words because yes I'm making excuses for the person, and I want to make it clear that I understand why they said it, even if I also think they shouldn't have said it, but I also think a perma is a ridiculous punsihment and kchama was wrong to call for one.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:40
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MonsieurChoc posted:Voting for Biden is voting for genocide. Dog you've gone so far to claim that you think in the worst of all possible worlds, Trump would only be as bad as Biden and no worse MonsieurChoc posted:At worst Trump will be as bad on Gaza as Biden, while most likely he'd gently caress it up. Nobody's going to listen to anything you have to say if you just drop turds like this and then shitpost
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Feb 12, 2024 00:49
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Majorian posted:It's just a question of, "Is he more evil than Biden on this very fraught, life-or-death-for-millions-of-people issue, and if so, by how much, in material terms?" I think the essence of this question comes down to another set of related questions. Is fascism worse than conservatism (GOP before trump) and is fascism worse than bourgeoisie liberal democracy eroded from social democracy. There are a range of responses in general here that fall into a couple of categories: 1. No it’s all fascism and has always been. It’s it’s the same picture. 2. The GOP was always fascist, the Dems were not and while terrible are preferable. 3. Only Trumpism is fascist. The Dems are preferable but still terrible. The conflict is between 1 and 2/3. What can be done about it is determinable from those different categories. 1. Leads to revolutionary conclusions, 2/3 don’t have to. The thing is what can be done about it should also be informed by good class analysis. Even a quick look at American society makes it obvious we only have right revolutionary potential here. So 1) ends up materially benefiting a right revolutionary movement. The way out of this is for folks in 2/3 to recognize that power has to be met with power, that those actions must be informed by good current and realistic class analysis. This case can be made to democrats because they have already internalized the ideas and concepts that this conclusion can be reached from. This is concepts from the foundations of the civil rights movement. This can be said in both religious terms and in secular critical terms.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:50
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KillHour posted:Not everything has to be a maximalist "you're either completely in agreement with me or something is loving wrong with you." I didn't say racism is acceptable*; I said the response to call for a perma was over the top, especially since it called out the avatar and not specifically the title. It frankly immediately reminded me of how Israeli mouthpieces immediately accuse everything critical of Israel of being anti-semitic. I realize due to the rest of the conversation that followed that this isn't what kchama was doing, but without that context, it could easily be taken that way. The text is part of the avatar. That's why it's called a RTA, Red-Text Avatar. And I think saying that Main Painframe should die painfully for being a Jew is extremely permaban worthy. Calling for the death of other posters has traditionally been that.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:50
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Lemming posted:Dog you've gone so far to claim that you think in the worst of all possible worlds, Trump would only be as bad as Biden and no worse Yes, because Biden is already going 100%. You can't go higher than 100%.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:52
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Kchama posted:The text is part of the avatar. That's why it's called a RTA, Red-Text Avatar. And I think saying that Main Painframe should die painfully for being a Jew is extremely permaban worthy. Calling for the death of other posters has traditionally been that. I disagree both with your characterization and conclusion, but I don't really have anything else to add to the conversation, so I'm not really sure what you want. Edit: Also, if you're phone-posting, which I was, you don't see the red text. KillHour fucked around with this message at 00:56 on Feb 12, 2024 |
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Feb 12, 2024 00:54
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Bar Ran Dun posted:I think the essence of this question comes down to another set of related questions. Is fascism worse than conservatism (GOP before trump) and is fascism worse than bourgeoisie liberal democracy eroded from social democracy. I don't necessarily disagree with this, but bear in mind, I was talking specifically about Gaza, and comparing Biden and Trump's stances (and likely material impacts) on the crisis.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:54
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MonsieurChoc posted:Yes, because Biden is already going 100%. You can't go higher than 100%. Sorry, I don't want to cast aspersions on your position, so let me just clarify: you do not think it is possible for the actions of any theoretical president to be worse than what Biden is doing with respect to Israel right now? Even Biden himself couldn't, tomorrow, do anything more harmful than what he's already doing?
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Feb 12, 2024 00:56
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MonsieurChoc posted:Yes, because Biden is already going 100%. You can't go higher than 100%. Bold stance to take when the opposition has an itchy nuke finger.
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Feb 12, 2024 00:58
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Lemming posted:Sorry, I don't want to cast aspersions on your position, so let me just clarify: you do not think it is possible for the actions of any theoretical president to be worse than what Biden is doing with respect to Israel right now? Even Biden himself couldn't, tomorrow, do anything more harmful than what he's already doing? Yes. He's giving them all the money and all the weapon and all the support. He has sent over squads of operators to help. He's 100% behind the genocide, to the point he will blow up the UN and global shipping to ensure it continues. For what it's worth Biden isn't the only one. Trudeau and many others are also 100% behind this genocide. Everyone who decided the answer to the ICJ ruling was to cut funding to the only thing keeping the lights on in Gaza should be hanged at the Hague for genocide.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:00
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KillHour posted:I disagree both with your characterization and conclusion, but I don't really have anything else to add to the conversation, so I'm not really sure what you want. So the reason why everyone is screaming at you is that the text was literally "The soul of my race is already in hell, may the rest of my time on this earth short and painful. "
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Feb 12, 2024 01:00
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MonsieurChoc posted:HOW!? It's not even close to the worst it can possibly be. Trump was going to let Israel start officially annexing chunks of the West Bank whether the Palestinians agreed to it or not. The only reason he backed down was that Israeli domestic politics poo poo themselves and delayed the annexation bill long enough for Kushner to get spooked by the blowback, decide he didn't want to be personally associated with it, and convince Trump to cancel the blank check he'd offered Israel. And that's just on the US side of things. On the Israel side of things, Ben-Gvir wants to expel all Palestinians from Gaza and annex it to Israel, and then he wants to do the same things in the West Bank that Israel has been doing in Gaza. He's also been fighting to arm settler death squads in the West Bank to roam around doing pogroms on their own initiative, and just about the only reason that hasn't happened yet is that Biden is conditioning small arms supplies to Israel on that not happening. If you think that this is the worst a genocide can possibly be, I don't even know what to say. It's so obviously wrong that I have a hard time taking it seriously at all. Majorian posted:I can make and understand inferences perfectly well. I'm sorry I don't find your argument convincing, but right now, if Trump's rhetoric reminds me of anything, it's John Kerry's position on the Iraq War during the '04 election, ie: "We're going to keep doing the war, but we'll do it better than Bush and win it faster." Biden's been delaying (some specific kinds of) aid to Israel for a little while now, attaching conditions to it and implying strongly that he'll withhold the aid altogether if Israel doesn't convince him it's going to meet those conditions. He's also issued some sanctions against West Bank people and organizations, and has been threatening that Israel itself could be hit by sanctions if they don't rein in the right-wing brutality there. He's not doing that in regards to Israel's conduct in Gaza, true, but he's taken a strong interest in Israeli policy in the West Bank lately and has been putting some unprecedented levels of pressure on Israel to cut down on its aggressive policies there (particularly when it comes reining in the settlers who go engage in terrorism and brutality with the implicit support of the IDF). Putting aside the question of whether that's enough, it's certainly a whole lot more than Trump would do. Majorian posted:Thank you, I appreciate it. Those are vague threats, though - they remind me of Trump promising to kill all of ISIS' families, something that he didn't follow through on. It's a bloodthirsty and insane post, but it's also in-keeping with his long pattern of offering tough talk on foreign policy and then not following through. None of us have crystal balls to look into the future and tell us with full certainty exactly what he will do in the future. All we can do is look at his past words and his past actions. His past words promise "starting wars" to shed "gallons [of blood]", and his past actions demonstrate unprecedented levels of support for Israel and unprecedented levels of "gently caress you" for Palestinians. You're going to have to be satisfied with the predictions we can make from that, and those predictions don't promise good news for Gazans. Majorian posted:I appreciate this. To be clear, I'm not challenging anyone to establish that one of the evils is in fact evil - we're all on the same page that Trump is evil. It's just a question of, "Is he more evil than Biden on this very fraught, life-or-death-for-millions-of-people issue, and if so, by how much, in material terms?" I get that that may come off as asking how many angels can dance on the head of a pin, but again, it's a life-or-death issue for millions of people, and folks here and elsewhere are doing a lot of important soul-searching to decide how they're going to vote in November (I have the luxury of not having to do that, because again, deep blue state and all that). So I think it's a valid thing to discuss, but I'm sorry if anything I posted came off as points-scoring, because that's not at all what I intended. Yes, he is. He's also much more evil than Biden on a number of other very fraught, life-or-death-for-millions-of-people issues, in ways that are a lot worse in material terms. For example, Ukraine!
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Feb 12, 2024 01:05
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Failboattootoot posted:Bold stance to take when the opposition has an itchy nuke finger. I mean, Trump nuking Palestine due to being pro-Israel is darkly funny to anyone that has seen a map of the area.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:05
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MonsieurChoc posted:Yes. He's giving them all the money and all the weapon and all the support. He has sent over squads of operators to help. He's 100% behind the genocide, to the point he will blow up the UN and global shipping to ensure it continues. Bro you are claiming that Biden is doing all the worst things that could conceivably be done, right now, already, today. He could give them one more dollar and he would be worse. Can you make some reasonable arguments here instead of hyperbolic garbage? Like, nobody is going to disagree that Biden is doing horrible things, but to claim he's doing every single maximally evil thing that could even theoretically be done in all possible universes is just loving stupid, man.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:07
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Kchama posted:So the reason why everyone is screaming at you is that the text was literally "The soul of my race is already in hell, may the rest of my time on this earth short and painful. " That is insane, why is there even a discussion about this poo poo and not a shutdown while Jeffrey permabans whatever freak bought that?
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Feb 12, 2024 01:07
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Kchama posted:So the reason why everyone is screaming at you is that the text was literally "The soul of my race is already in hell, may the rest of my time on this earth short and painful. " It's still there - I read it after your first response. I'm not trying to hide behind "I didn't know what we were talking about  ." I still disagree that it's perma-worthy, but I'm also not a mod. I assume someone will blank it out.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:08
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MonsieurChoc posted:Yes, because Biden is already going 100%. You can't go higher than 100%. If you think Biden is going 100%, you haven't even begun to think about what 100% actually looks like. Biden is insufficiently reigning in Israel and refusing to use any hard measures much beyond telling Bibi off camera that killing kids isn't cool. He is complicit as gently caress and moronic to think handing out munitions, blocking UN votes, and publicly supporting Israel while quietly asking them to pull it back a bit might work. However Trump not only would do all the actively supportive bullshit Biden is doing, he'll also publicly and privately be encouraging Bibi to stop being such a pussy. Even if we assume he's too stupid and lazy to actually increase US aid and direct support, which he claims to want to do, having the President of the United States screaming that Israel isn't genocide hard enough is worse than current status. Biden is fine with "acceptable" collateral damage but longs for at least trying to look like killing babies is an actual whoopsie. A monstrous position worthy of condemnation. Trump loves collateral damage and thinks war crimes are super cool if they're done on mission. A demonic position that is even worse.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:09
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Main Paineframe posted:Biden's been delaying (some specific kinds of) aid to Israel for a little while now, attaching conditions to it and implying strongly that he'll withhold the aid altogether if Israel doesn't convince him it's going to meet those conditions. He's not doing that in regards to Israel's conduct in Gaza, true, but he's taken a strong interest in Israeli policy in the West Bank lately and has been putting some unprecedented levels of pressure on Israel to cut down on its aggressive policies there (particularly when it comes reining in the settlers who go engage in terrorism and brutality with the implicit support of the IDF). Putting aside the question of whether that's enough, it's certainly a whole lot more than Trump would do. None of this is remotely true, btw. You're just bald-faced lying to protect, I repeat, a rapist racist genocidaire. Biden has UPPED the aid to Israel, attached ZERO conditions and has supported all the way, including declaring illegal war on the only parties trying to stop the genocide. It is amazing the lengths to which Biden supporters will lie to themselves and others. HE CUT FUNDING TO UNRWA UNDER BLATANTLY FALSE PRETENSES THE DAY AFTER THE ICJ RULING.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:09
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koolkal posted:I mean, Trump nuking Palestine due to being pro-Israel is darkly funny to anyone that has seen a map of the area. I dunno if the guy that brags at campaign rallies multiple times per rally about how good he is at identifying animals will consider that!
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Feb 12, 2024 01:10
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KillHour posted:I still disagree that it's perma-worthy, but I'm also not a mod. I assume someone will blank it out. "jewish people deserve to die because of the Israeli government's actions," hell yeah that's the quality kind of post we want on the
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Feb 12, 2024 01:11
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was skimming Biden admin news and well I guess he's reading this thread, phone call with Netanyahu https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing...u-of-israel-11/ quote:President Joseph R. Biden, Jr. spoke this morning with Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu of Israel. The President reaffirmed our shared goal to see Hamas defeated and to ensure the long-term security of Israel and its people. The President and the Prime Minister discussed ongoing efforts to secure the release of all remaining hostages held by Hamas. The President emphasized the need to capitalize on progress made in the negotiations to secure the release of all hostages as soon as possible. He also called for urgent and specific steps to increase the throughput and consistency of humanitarian assistance to innocent Palestinian civilians. And he reaffirmed his view that a military operation in Rafah should not proceed without a credible and executable plan for ensuring the safety of and support for the more than one million people sheltering there. The two leaders agreed to remain in close contact. in not entirely other news, meeting with the German chancellor https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing...z-of-germany-2/ mostly Ukraine chat and Israel chat in actual other news https://www.uscis.gov/EOY2023 "Completing an unprecedented 10 million immigration cases, the agency reduced its immigration backlog for the first time in more than a decade", sad lol edited to improve blurbs Goatse James Bond fucked around with this message at 01:29 on Feb 12, 2024 |
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Feb 12, 2024 01:19
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MonsieurChoc posted:None of this is remotely true, btw. You're just bald-faced lying to protect, I repeat, a rapist racist genocidaire. Biden has UPPED the aid to Israel, attached ZERO conditions and has supported all the way, including declaring illegal war on the only parties trying to stop the genocide. I'm talking about something specific, because in the real world there's nuances where people can do some bad things (sometimes a lot of bad things) while also doing some good things. For example, a president can send some kinds of aid to a country while blocking other kinds of aid. In this case, I'm talking about how the Biden administration has blocked sales of small arms to Israel. The administration demanded substantial assurances that those guns wouldn't make their way into the hands of settlers, and when they weren't satisfied with those assurances, they buried the request in paperwork and reviews. As far as I can tell, those gun sales have been on hold for two months with no progress, as the administration gets increasingly annoyed with Israeli conduct in the West Bank. https://www.axios.com/2023/12/13/us-israel-rifle-sale-delay-west-bank-violence quote:Scoop: U.S. delaying sale of M16 rifles to Israel over settler violence Yes, the administration is doing this even as it continues to send other weaponry to Israel. But there's no way Trump would block these sales. He doesn't give a poo poo about Palestinian civilians, and many members of his circles have strong ties to the settlers. So lifting this block is one way in which things could very well get worse for Palestinians under Trump.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:21
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Google Jeb Bush posted:was skimming Biden admin news and well I guess he's reading this thread More important than any of this, he has politely asked companies that produce ultra-processed foods to stop skimming our treats: https://twitter.com/POTUS/status/1756713597864988940
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Feb 12, 2024 01:25
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Acebuckeye13 posted:"jewish people deserve to die because of the Israeli government's actions," hell yeah that's the quality kind of post we want on the You literally have a gang tag that implies the south should be burned to the ground again. It's tongue in cheek, but it's clearly celebrating violence where a lot of civilians died. I even remember the thread had an argument about it when it was first made. I'm not saying the title should stay (it should not), nor am I saying your gang tag is as clearly in bad taste as that title (it is not), but it's not just a literal link to Mein Kompf either. Anyways, this is why I'm not a mod (thank gently caress)
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Feb 12, 2024 01:29
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You know that’s bullshit to make you feel better. The arms shipments to Israel have only gotten bigger, and the « nuance « here is that you don’t want to feel bad voting for literal genocide. Speaking of, the concentration camps at the border are still full and we never did find the thousands of children ICE lost. In fact, Genocide Joe upped their funding too. Genocide away and at home, what a guy. History will not be kind to America, and the American Empire. And the hardest pill to swallow is that both parties are 100% complicit in the crimes of empire. And are also united in quashing any kind of leftist movement to change things. You won’t get civil rights protections or a stop to imperialism or an end to genocide or even a living wage under Biden. What did he do to protect minorities during his term? Nothing except words he didn’t back up with acts. This is gonna be my last post in the thread cause I’m just getting angrier and that’s not gonna be helpful to anyone. Just please stop supporting genocide. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 12, 2024 01:30
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B B posted:More important than any of this, he has politely asked companies that produce ultra-processed foods to stop skimming our treats: Are you saying this is actually bad or what
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Feb 12, 2024 01:30
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MonsieurChoc posted:You know that’s bullshit to make you feel better. The arms shipments to Israel have only gotten bigger, and the « nuance « here is that you don’t want to feel bad voting for literal genocide. I would love to live in your delusional world, rather than this much more grim one. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 12, 2024 01:34
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B B posted:More important than any of this, he has politely asked companies that produce ultra-processed foods to stop skimming our treats: God it’s not bad until you realize that there is a cut after every line
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Feb 12, 2024 01:35
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Tatsuta Age posted:Are you saying this is actually bad or what we deserve our treats today more than ever (super bowl sunday)
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Feb 12, 2024 01:35
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Tatsuta Age posted:Are you saying this is actually bad or what No, I--like every red-blooded American--want the full quantity of treats for which I have paid. E: He's got terrible choice in ice cream, though, if those are for him.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:37
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just dropping some completely unsubstantiated immigration statements on the way out, nbd Afaict and based on cbp and ice data i posted a couple weeks ago to the resounding chirp of crickets, the "concentration camps on the border" are not still full in either literal terms (numbers, length of stay) or in colloquial terms (Mayorkas has been pushing alternatives to detention which explicitly annoys both the GOP and the worse ICE officers, and while the increased auto-removals in cbp encounters are bad and the pseudo-refugee camps in Mexico are worse they're explicitly to keep from having to blow resources on detaining people). I'm not going to buy the assertion that all the misplaced / loss-of-communication with sponsor children are still unaccounted for either. Not without proof, and I'm apparently the only goddamn person posting on this topic who actually digs into Office of Refugee Resettlement data and releases. As an aside, this particular thing was a topic of very interesting and infuriating intra-left discourse. One side asserted that sponsors not reporting to ORR was good actually, because what if the Trumo administration deports or reimprisons the children. The other correct side asserted that while the sponsors' reasons were largely understandable, there are very good reasons for ORR to want to keep track of the kids' situations and treatment, and so the loss of contact was at best unfortunate and troubling. At worst, it abets child trafficking. The claim that ORR was completely unable to establish or reestablish contact with sponsors and with separated children whose paperwork ICE hosed up should require at least a little evidence, I think.
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Feb 12, 2024 01:47
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Hell, let me google it for monsieurchoc. First result: https://www.pbs.org/newshour/show/hundreds-of-migrant-children-remain-separated-from-families-despite-push-to-reunite-them A thousand or so children identified but still unreturned, which is very bad and also considerably improved. Biden admin still trying to fix it. Immigration advocates estimate the number is rather higher (so "thousands" is in fact plausible) in large part because the parents are having difficulty coming forward (often because they're back in Central America). Interview is very interesting and a bummer, and suggests that the Biden admin / bureaucracy is making a credible effort. as opposed to the Trump administration which separated the families in the first place
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Feb 12, 2024 01:56
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MonsieurChoc posted:This is gonna be my last post in the thread cause I’m just getting angrier and that’s not gonna be helpful to anyone. Just please stop supporting genocide. Poor you thinks that you can absolve yourself by burying your head in the sand. Just because the trolley can only be diverted after one group of people has already been killed doesn't mean that you shouldn't do anything about the two other groups after them.
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Feb 12, 2024 02:05
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So who else was convinced to vote Kennedy by the super bowl ad?
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Feb 12, 2024 02:14
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Google Jeb Bush posted:Hell, let me google it for monsieurchoc. First result: Hey ti's the pro-rape guy here to lie again. I really wanted to be gone but your ugly pro-rape mug got me even angrier. Why aren't you perma'd you loving piece of poo poo? Also the link you posted is "we know this is happening,w e're doing nothing, and we're gonna blame the rpevious admin despite us aprticipating." You're a proven liar who's all in for all the horrible poo poo the republicans are doing the moment Team Blue is doing. Or am I the only one who remembers what you did when the rape accusations against Biden came out? Eiba posted:The most comfortable position is actually that things are the worst they can be so you don't need to worry about your vote/lack of vote making things worse. That's way more comforting than the idea that you might be morally obligated to support a genocider to prevent a worse genocider from gaining power. Ah yes, voting for genocide in the vain hope if we give it enoguh support will end is the realist option, while working hard outside of the rotten systme to try and change thingds for real is the delusional comfortable position. There is nothing more priviliged and comfortable than continuing to vote for the genocidal party while inventing theories of how things are theoritecally not as bad as they provably are. You are comforting yourself in your delusion that, somehow, by giving all your support to the democrats they will magically stop to be what they are. small butter posted:Poor you thinks that you can absolve yourself by burying your head in the sand. Just because the trolley can only be diverted after one group of people has already been killed doesn't mean that you shouldn't do anything about the two other groups after them. You're the ones burying your head in the sand as you powerslide the trolley to murder as many people as possible, while I'm the one going hey, the trolley has brakes, we should stop it. All of you would pat yourself on the back for voting Hindenburg as he then gives power to Hitler. Edit: probably gonna get a sixer for this meltdown but jesus christ you people are vile, trotting out excel spreadsheet to explain how genocide is okay if we cna imagine a theoritecal worse genocide that can't possible exist. Re-examine your moral compasses. (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Feb 12, 2024 02:16
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