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Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



If a person can't handle a nippy baby puppy without smacking it in the face they shouldn't be working with puppies. I would be livid if that was my dog. Contact that store's manager and corporate, explain what happened, and send them the video.

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Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



The puppy is 11 weeks old. He probably has those terrible puppy needle teeth that hurt like poo poo when they bite you and draw blood super easily. Getting bit by a mouthy little puppy all the time makes you want to smack it, but you don't because its a baby. Especially if you are a professional and its not your puppy!

This is not the puppy's fault. If the manager or corporate or whatever makes a fuss and claims the puppy was viciously mauling the trainer let them know that you'll be happy to share the video with the media and let the public decide.

Don't assume your pup is completely traumatized yet. A lot of dogs bounce right back after scary things. If he starts being afraid of hands you can work on things like nose-palm touches to get him to like hands near his face again. Just keep up positive socialization and maybe find a good puppy playgroup that doesn't have lovely people running it.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Chin Strap posted:

Thanks all. He's going to the vet today so they'll tell us about weight. He isn't pure chihuahua but some sort of chihuahua terrier mutt so not on the extremely toy end of things. But still we'll just watch closely.

One more question: we are trying to train him and do NILIF, so we give him kibble one at a time for training. We are currently feeding Fromm, and we like the quality of the company (it is also what we feed our cats), but the dog kibble is just so big for training. It is like 4x the size of what I would normally use for treats for him. It is way to much of a pain to be breaking it up into smaller pieces, so we just use it as is. Does anyone know another high-end brand with smaller kibble sizes? (Incidentally, the Fromm cat food has like the perfect size kibble, but of course it isn't formulated right for dogs so that won't work).

Are you using the regular Fromm? Because the Fromm grain free kibbles are ridiculously tiny. I always buy a small bag of salmon tunalinni for training when I pick up a bag of fromm gold for my dog's regular meals because its teeny and fishy and works well for training.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



If they love pb you might want to try putting it in something like this that they can lick without you getting all sticky and gross. Kong stuff'n comes in a pb flavor and has a squeeze tube too.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I have no idea, I personally haven't used it before but I know people in training classes that use it. Personally I feel a treat is a treat and if it is only used sparingly I'm not super concerned about weird ingredients now and then unless they're known to be toxic like the terrible death jerky going around.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



ALL said everything I would say much better than I would have said it.

Just so you know its not just you, this all (except the resource guarding) sounds like very normal obnoxious teen corgi stuff. I could have written the exact same post 9 years ago about my parents' corgi complete with carpet destroying and floor pissing. They are truly awful puppies and you really have to micro-manage them or they will drive you nuts. Crating and tethering saved our sanity but there were still many, many days where we wanted to strangle her. She still barks (she's a corgi) and will pee on the floor if you don't crate her but consistent training and time have made her a much easier dog to live with.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



They seem to be a typical BYB just be breeding to produce pet puppies without any health testing or outside evaluation. Some of their bitches look kind of rough in the puppy photos too.

Be really careful where you get a dane because when they have problems they have really really big problems. If someone says their dogs don't have any genetic problems ask for proof. If they say their dogs love everybody and have rock steady temperaments go see them and find out for yourself. Take the time to really shop around and get an awesome puppy or you're going to have a lot of heartache.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



If the pup won't eat even if you cram it in his mouth he's just too overwhelmed to eat and you might need some distance or barriers while you work on focus around other dogs. It's not necessarily that the treats aren't good enough, his mind is just totally bonkers about all the other puppies and he can't do what you're asking him to do in that state. You might ask the trainer if there is a place you can work a bit further away or if you can put a chair or something to block his view until he is capable of thinking in that environment.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I dug around for a few more places that might at least have a decent puppy class and be able to refer you to more extensive help. They don't have amazing credentials but it will help you at least get started while you find a real behaviorist.

http://www.pawsitivecaninetraining.com/Home_Page.php

http://www.htdogtraining.com/

Instead of day care can you find a dog walker to take her out during the day? You'll still have to work on socialization but you won't have to fix problems he's developing in "thunderdome" style daycare.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Sharzak posted:

I'm trying to get a handle on what it is going to cost day one to bring a rescue doggie home. Would like to hear about anything I'm missing as far as initial cost outlay--

Pet deposit
Adoption Fee (includes neuter, vaccinations)
Crate
Doggy bed
Food
Leash and collar
Pet insurance
Bowl
Brush
Clicker
Maybe a training book? There seem to be so many online resources that seems a little superfluous. Anyway estimating the cost at around 700 total, that seems cheap considering other estimates I've seen. Am I missing anything

?

You'll probably want to plan for a visit with your vet after adoption even though the dog has already been vaccinated. Its a good chance to start a relationship with your vet and make sure your new dog doesn't have any major health problems the rescue might have missed. My dog ended up having a massive yeast infection all over himself and because I got him to the vet right away after adopting him the rescue offered to help pay for the treatment.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Good luck! Lab puppies should really just come with a zipper installed, they pretty much all need something removed at some point.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Downhome posted:

Haven't spoken to the breeder. It was from a couple who both just happened to own a Boston and they had one litter of pups before they had them fixed. Not a puppy farm by any means, but not a registered breeder or anything. We wouldn't take her back or anything like that regardless, we are far too attached and love her way too much. Whatever happens we're in it for the long haul. I'm almost glad we got her and not someone else. I hate to imagine what some people would have done as a result of such news.

At very least you should tell them so they can let the other puppy owners know so they can discuss it with their vets. It wouldn't be the worst thing in the world for a pup to be returned to a caring breeder (or caring couple with some dogs they bred) if the owner feels they aren't prepared a dog with heart problems.

You may want to ask to be referred to a veterinary cardiologist for a more thorough diagnosis and to discuss what the murmur may mean long term for your pup.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Definitely make a new thread about her. Especially since I know you're going to post puppy potato pictures, right?

Good on you for making the best out of a lovely situation.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Downhome posted:

We have yet another issue with Betty, our Boston Terrier pup. We noticed some scratching and small patches of hair loss and long story short the vet diagnosed her with demodex mange. He gave us a shampoo to use once a week, a pill to fight infection, and a liquid to give her directly by mouth using a small syringe.

What else can I do outside of the instructions fro our vet? She is on a diet of lean raw beef supplemented with BLUE Wilderness Salmon Recipe. What can I do to help boost her immune system? Have any of you guys ever dealt with this before?

I used to think only filthy strays got this sort of thing, not a little puppy that we completely and totally baby. I'm sure it's because of the idiot Joe-blow breeder we bought her from. Our vet said she was likely born with a weakened immune system which has triggered this now.

Are you feeding her just beef from the grocery store or a premade raw food? I would be really careful to make sure the pup is eating a well balanced food while growing because its really important to get all those nutrients as puppies.

Lots of dogs get demodex so don't feel bad! It seems like bully sorts of dogs are more prone to it than others too. Hopefully it will clear up just fine for you.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Maybe go to a dog show and look at all the breeds and talk to breeders/owners of ones that appeal to you. Make a list of things you absolutely need and can not deal with and see what meshes. I think a smaller sporting breed like a spaniel would work. From some brief reading the farmdog sounds like it would fit but you should find some breeders and owners and talk to them and visit their dogs if its a breed you want to explore further. A lot of dogs sound good on paper but its different when they're in your home!

If you have animal shelters in your area go bring your list to them too and see if they have anything that fits. Some adult small-ish labby sort of mix would be great for your situation.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Downhome posted:

That is what we were doing before, but when this new issue came up I was under the impression we needed something more with a bit more of a boost to really nail this down to take care of it.

The Nutrition Thread might be a good place to start. Pick a brand you are comfortable with and make sure that the formula says that it is formulated for either puppies or all life stages. If you like raw food there are premade options that have been properly balanced to meet with AAFCO standards. Bravo has a frozen option and there are a number of freeze dried raw versions like Stella and Chewy's and some of the Honest Kitchen varieties.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



My parents' corgi didn't start developing issues until this year and she's 11 now :colbert:

She's a total bitch to other dogs, barks nonstop, still pees on the floor regularly and was the worst puppy in the universe though so I'm not sure I can ever recommend them for apartments. At least pems, I don't know any cardis personally.

Instant Jellyfish fucked around with this message at 15:19 on Jul 17, 2014

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Nosework and scent games!

You can do something simple like hiding treats or favorite toys and getting him to find it or go nuts and teach him actual nosework. It's not that hard to get started, dogs seem to really enjoy it, and it wears them out mentally so fast. A hound should really excel with some practice.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Except they don't come with eyebrows. I desperately wanted this field spaniel pup. EYEBROWS!


I like english cockers too though, especially the field bred ones :3:


(Clumbers do have freckles though and freckles are always a Good Dog trait.)

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I would much rather someone tell me all about why a certain dog I'm interested in isn't a good fit and talk up one I hadn't considered who might be perfect than let me take one home without question and then have to return it later or spend thousands of dollars and years of work to treat its issues. You might be disappointed right now but it takes so much work to deal with a dog with separation anxiety or that escapes all the time, no matter how cute or sweet or awesome the dog seems to be on paper.

If you aren't feeling good about the organization though there's no reason you can't find somewhere else. Plenty of places to get dogs in the world.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Peanut butter + spoon + pills= easy daily pilling for 4+ years now. I used to spend a fortune on pill pockets then I tried making my own but peanut butter spoon works every time.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



BigPaddy posted:

The insurance is cheap enough that I will keep it ticking over as it all helps, thanks for the input.

Having moved now and can start setting up for dogge invasion I am not sure on having the day time area with a crate for sleeping setup in the living room but at night having her sleep in the bedroom so she is close by again in a crate so she in theory won't pee and poop without letting us know and we are close enough to get up and take her outside. Is it worth it or just keep her crate in her pen I will setup in the living room?

I am also planning to go on a bit of a socialisation crusade the first few days we get her so she is used to travel, people and other dogs. Is this sensible or give her that weekend to settle in?

Bonus 3 week old pic



Is that an english bulldog? A lot of insurances don't cover breed specific or genetic conditions and just being brachycephalic might count as a pre-existing condition. Also I think a cat owning goon used VPI and they didn't pay poo poo towards her cat's extensive cancer treatment. Make sure you have a good emergency vet bill account set up for that little trainwreck!

Fake edit: Here's the explanation of benefits they sent her.

ChickenOfTomorrow posted:



code:
Status  	Submitted Amount 		 Reimbursement Amount
Complete	$1,111.08	 	  	 $472.58
Complete	$5,080.90	 	  	 $0.00	 
Complete	$1,478.25	 	  	 $285.00
Complete	$1,018.57	 	  	 $0.00
Cabot's cancer cost us $8,689. His insurance finally reimburses us... $758.

They did end up losing money on him though because we only paid $527 to get him insured.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



toplitzin posted:

I just adopted a cutie of an older dog (6.5 years), to join the 2 cat party already in my house. She's already house-trained, are there any reasons to crate train as well?

And if so, any tips for an older dog?


Picture tax:



She is a cutie and good job adopting an older, less adoptable dog! Crate training is a useful skill to have even if they don't need to be crated when you're not supervising like a puppy. It's much easier for everyone if they need to be boarded someplace that uses kennels or needs to be on crate rest for an injury or something if they are already comfortable hanging out in a crate.

Patricia McConnell has a book about adopting an adult dog that's supposed to be good. When I adopted my adult dog I mostly just made sure to start reinforcing behavior I wanted right away and let him guide me about how much new stuff he could handle at a time.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



toplitzin posted:

Will do. They only gave me a 5 Lb bag, so I assume if she eats, I'd burn through the bag in a day or two. I'll start mixing them slowly once she starts eating.

I've been offering it twice a day and if she spurns it/ignores it i just put it away since the cat will go gorge herself on it and then the dog gets territorial over food she doesn't have interest in.

For what its worth my dog wouldn't eat the rescue's garbage food at all when I brought him home so I just switched him to what I was going to be feeding him right away. He's got an iron stomach so it wasn't a big deal but your mileage may vary. Just don't let them get used to getting fancy add ins or treats when they're being picky.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



You can also run them through the dishwasher. It's really not a big deal.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I might try canned food if you've tried a bunch of different kibbles and she won't touch them. Maybe she has an ouchie mouth even if her teeth looked alright.

A trick I've seen work on dogs who are just fussy (and I'm not sure she's just being fussy) is that dog gets a measured amount of food and 5 minutes to eat it. If it's finished they get a really great treat in their bowl and if it's not the food gets picked up and they get half as much next time. If they finish that amount next time they get an amazing treat in their bowl and you can try increasing the amount of food following time, and if not it goes down by half again. Eventually you might get down to them only getting a few kibbles but if they finish those kibbles they get a super rad treat and you can start adding more food.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



My parents' corgi went through the same thing when she was that age and stayed pretty lanky for a while. When she wasn't a crazy teen she started eating normally again and now that she's an old lady she's back to being picky. The breeder said it was pretty normal.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



daslog posted:

My wife decided we are going to be dog owners again. Or last Shitzu died at age 14 and she's decided on a half poodle half bernise? Mountain dog.

Apparently these guys can get up to 90 pounds. Any idea what sized crate would be right? I'm going to get one with a metal one with a divider as recommended on the op.

That's the dumbest mix I've ever heard of, I hope you aren't spending $2000 or whatever BYBs are charging for that monstrosity.

It sounds like it will be about the size of my dog so a 42" or 48" would be the right size as an adult.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



a life less posted:

I used to give my dogs lots of smoked bones. She recently chipped a canine on them and now I'm all pissed that I let her. I'd heard that dogs chipped teeth on weight bearing bones like this, but figured it wasn't too likely. Now I wish I hadn't.

Yeah there are definitely risks to weight bearing bones and thick beef soup bones. My dog was always a very careful chewer and I wasn't really worried about feeding them. Until he cracked a tooth and I had to spend $600 to have it pulled. He still gets bones but I'm a lot more careful about them now.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Verisimilidude posted:

Hey, where do y'all get your puppy food from? The closest reliable pet store is a Petco, and they're pretty expensive and far away. I'm looking for a service that delivers, and the food I get is very expensive or difficult to find on Amazon.

I live way out in the boonies so I have my food delivered from Chewy.com. I usually have a giant box of food on my doorstep within 2 days of ordering even with the free shipping, they have a huge variety of different foods, and the prices are as reasonable as I've seen anywhere else. I find it much more convenient than driving 45 minutes to the pet store and hoping they have what I need.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Sirbloody posted:

I think I might have a problem... Meet Ozara my 3rd (Yes 3rd) Tibetan Mastiff...



RIP ur dog food bills. Also anything that sets foot on your property uninvited.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Having worked at a dog daycare, someone did bring their dog in the day she got spayed and expected us to give her meds while she boarded with us for the next week so they wouldn't have to deal with it. She was a 5 month old GSD and frankly I'm surprised none of us lost fingers with that encounter. Never underestimate how terrible dog owners can be.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Triangulum posted:

one of the things that really owns about having dog-aggressive dogs acreage is not ever going to a dog park ever

ftfy

Oh your dog park is a whole acre, that's cute :allears:

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



You know this is a BYB. It is very obviously a BYB. They have 5 litters due in the next month and none of the parents have had legitimate health testing. You are taking a huge gamble on buying (you don't adopt a dog from a breeder for $1,300) a puppy with serious genetic health and temperament problems. Both newfoundlands and poodles have some serious, common health problems that aren't going to go away just by crossbreeding untested stock.

If you are going to take the risk of getting a mutt puppy just rescue something poodley that doesn't make you wheeze at a shelter.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I'm sorry that wasn't very helpful. Here are some questions to ask yourself/the breeder while considering them.

What qualities do you hope the parents will bring to this litter? (color is not a good answer)
What health testing has been done on the parents? Can I see the result/are they published on OFFA?
How do you prove these dogs have an appropriate temperament? Have any of them been involved in service work or been certified to do therapy work? Can I talk to the owners who are doing those things?
What sort of early socialization and temperament testing do you do with the puppies before they are placed? What happens if a puppy does not have an appropriate temperament?
What temperament or health issues have been seen in the lines you breed? At what age have they occurred? How are you breeding away from them?

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Guava posted:

I will just say for the record that it sort of bothers me when people are always pushing me/others to get poodles when we aren't particularly interested. I've known many poodles personally and they are great dogs... For someone else. Their personality is not at all what I personally like in a dog, though, and people never seem to be able to comprehend that? Also, I would never ever recommend a standard to someone living in an apartment (not that I'd particularly recommend a newf either, but at least they're lower energy comparatively).

I guess I just assume that if someone is actively looking to drop 2 grand on a poodle mix, with a high likelihood of having various poodle traits, that they don't hate poodles.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I guess I don't really care if someone gets a doodle or a newfypoo or a shihpoo or whatever. If everyone had a dog that was the right fit for them there would be way fewer dogs being given up and if a saint bernoodle is what fits so be it. What I care about is that they go to a good breeder that does appropriate health testing, produces temperamentally stable dogs and can prove it, makes well thought out breeding plans and takes great care in raising their puppies, and is honest with their puppy buyers.

As much as I personally am not a fan of the various poodle mixes there are breeders that do those things and anyone who buys pups from them has my blessing. Otherwise I think people should stick with rescuing/rehoming adult, taking a gamble with a rescue/rehomed puppy or buying purebred puppies from good breeders.

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



I would make a list of everything you absolutely need in a dog, everything you absolutely can not have in a dog, and things you might like but are flexible about. Go into it with that list in mind or actually written out and talk to the volunteers about what dogs might fit instead of falling for the cutest, freckliest, craziest one there. Also keep in mind that big events can be crazy and stressful for dogs so you might overlook a dog that would actually be perfect for you just because it's not feeling super comfortable about being there. Another reason to talk to the folks who really know the dogs, volunteers or even better foster owners.

Good luck, enjoy patting some dogs :3:

Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Why do some people ride motorcycles? Or do extreme sports? People like different things.

Plus once you've had a murderdog the stockholm syndrome sets in and you just keep getting them. If a dog doesn't think biting me in the face is the bestest thing ever why would I even want it???

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Instant Jellyfish
Jul 3, 2007

Actually not a fish.



Verman posted:

Went to the vet to clear up some issues with Stanley ... mostly his soft poop.

The verdict was an eye infection, ear infection in both ears, and giardia.

That was a quick and unexpected $300.

Welcome to dog ownership. I'm so pumped when I spend less than $300 at the vet's office. It's a loving miracle every time.

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