|
The threat was having to face more top level players. While I'm sure they'd enjoy ganging up on Kirito, they're definitely not suicidal. It's clear they prey on weaker people.
|
#
¿
Aug 12, 2012 21:18
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 19, 2024 15:34 |
|
|
If I had to guess, it's just standard anime problem of having potential/promise and throwing it aside because Japan loves its tropes/stereotypes. It doesn't help that we've had several episodes in a row now that are side-stories rather than the main plot. This isn't outright bad, but due to how volume 1 was the main plot and volume 2 does the side-stories we've seen so far, the payoff isn't really felt immediately. Episode 3 helps establish Kirito's continued solo play despite being at the area where coordinated group play is essential. Episode 4 does a bit of character-building as well as showing how things are behind the front lines. 5-6 are largely for Kirito and Asuna, and there's a bit that was left out/excised from the anime because the foreshadowing in that side-story is really obvious. Episode 7 does reveal a bit about Kirito but felt like a waste.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 19, 2012 01:39
|
|
|
AnacondaHL posted:Whatever. Screw the main story line. I like how these episodes are being done. Well for me, this episode feels like it misses what the other sidestory episodes hit because of Kirito deciding he didn't need to explain that he knows what he's doing, fights on the front lines, or is a friend of Asuna. You'd think he'd have learned his lesson about keeping quiet about such things after what happened the last time he kept his mouth shut. The episode does score a hit when Liz realizes that she just did something dumb and in this game, death is real. Argas fucked around with this message at 03:24 on Aug 19, 2012 |
|
#
¿
Aug 19, 2012 03:11
|
|
episode devoted to tsun-'n-sour was made more interesting simply because they had to deal with the setting.
|
Also keep in mind how information spreads. There's no global, floor, or even town-based chat channels. Sending mail still works but there isn't exactly a /who option to just bring up a list of names. It's not really mentioned in the anime but there's a monument with the names of players (Or only dead players? Can't remember) so I guess there's that. Either way, information doesn't spread as easily as it does in current games. Crafting as a path to top-tier equipment tends to be more common these days if only just to offer an alternate/secondary path of advancement (And sometimes grind). That said, just one piece of dragon poop as well as randomized results is unusual. Then again, SAO doesn't come across as a MMO designed to cater to the masses. Even ignoring the death game aspect, it's definitely got elements that make it more akin to EVE and other non-mainstream MMOs in both challenge and system elements.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 19, 2012 18:48
|
|
|
Nalin posted:No. In the novel, Kirito remarks on the fact that nobody will need to kill the dragon anymore now that the location of the metal has been found. The metal is not limited in number. The book also talks about how the crafted items have a randomness to them (I don't know if this was mentioned as I haven't seen the episode yet). Other swords can be made. If any sword like his gets made is basically down to random luck and the skill (and maybe mood) of the craftsman. Reminds me of the complete lack of documentation in FFXI's crafting system. Are you facing the right direction? On the right day? Etc. Argas fucked around with this message at 08:05 on Aug 20, 2012 |
|
#
¿
Aug 20, 2012 00:32
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:Completely agreed, though you have to also consider the game "evolving" to reflect its own state of decay with WoW as a perfect example wherein they have 90% of the non raid content as solo-able now. Fixed it. SAO gets away with radical MMO concepts because it's fiction. If only real MMOs were that easy. While TERA is busy strangling itself with its RNG, I do adore the combat.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 20, 2012 08:11
|
|
|
I've been reading the novels. There's lots more detail to various things since it can just take the time to explain things. Furthermore, there's a few subplots in some of the episodes that the anime has avoided thus far (I haven't caught up entirely yet). The main advantage the anime has is how it's organized. The novels have the sidestories all over the place. Episodes 3-7 are in volume 2, episode 2 is in another set of sidestories, etc. The anime has done a good job of whittling the details down to what's necessary or good for the flow of an anime as opposed to a novel.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 21, 2012 18:11
|
|
|
ConanThe3rd posted:Yeah, there really needs to be an "English" editor on the fan translation team 'cause it's painfully clear that those books were not checked over to see if they made any sense from an English language point of view. Editing will always remain the unloved position in anything and everything. What's that? Someone needs go over my creative masterpiece/genius translation/life's work and then tell me that I did a less than stellar job because it's difficult to read? The nerve of some people.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 26, 2012 08:55
|
|
|
ConanThe3rd posted:Honestly, If I knew how (and time wasn't a factor) I'd jump in and take that weight on. It's a lot of work for not a lot of improvement when it's just a fan thing and not, say, a retail release, so I can see why editing tends to be so low priority. Raenir Salazar posted:It also does seem to be the case as the longer you survive in the game the more you sorta get attached and your personality subtly shifts like the girl from earlier. You can probably make the case with any persistent VR game. You begin to play a role and because it feels like you're controlling your own body, it's more difficult to separate you from your avatar. Factor in the sheer amount of time people have been playing SAO and it's no surprised that many of them are likely acting more like themselves. I wouldn't be surprised if, upon returning to reality, they'd try to use the VR UI or make sure they only sleep among people they trust, etc. Raenir Salazar posted:So everyone being on floors 50 to 55 or so is more or less because the housing is cheaper? Like the reverse of modern american white flight? It's probably a cost/convenience thing. Cheaper housing there than higher, and if that's where the rest of the market is, it hurts to be elsewhere unless you have the reputation to attract people. Daler Mehndi posted:I'm one of those weirdos that just spent time leveling up my cooking skills in World of Warcraft. Then I would mail food and drinks to other guild members instead of just tossing them to make space. I recall being pleasantly surprised when my skill was high enough to pick up a useful cooking recipe in the middle of a dungeon, of all places. Another thing to consider is just how you raise the skill. You have to use it a lot. Your weapon skills will naturally be very high if you're just actively playing the game simply because you use it all the time. But things like Kirito's tracking is probably a borefest.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 26, 2012 18:08
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:That presumes a more limited crafting system like WoW's though where your limited to about 2 crafting and two gathering was it? If its more like EVE's you could probably have the minimal combat skills to participate and avoid being one shotted while being an indispensable omnicrafter/industrialist who single handedly keeps the guild armed and armored. It's more that you have a limit on how many skills you can have and everything counts as a skill. Daggers, one-handed swords, two-handed swords, cooking, blacksmithing, tracking, hiding, etc. They're all skills. And yeah, Kirito's solo play definitely forces him to pick up a lot of skills that can be better split up amongst multiple players. He can track people as well as detect them (Not sure if it's rooted in the same skill). I can't exactly remember where it's noted, but Kirito's skills mean he can nap without being scared of someone sleep-PKing him because it'll wake him up if someone approaches. Obviously it won't thwart a really elaborate scheme but use of a passive skill shouldn't thwart player ingenuity. As for eating, it's not required to live but you will feel the hungry even if you aren't actually hungry. The LN notes that the bread in episode 2 cost only 1 col so it's pretty clear Kirito's expenses primarily go towards combat. Considering he has no one to back him up, his expenses are going to be even higher for an effective safety net.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 26, 2012 19:27
|
|
|
Sylvyfish posted:I'm really liking this show more than I should. I feel like it's completely ridiculous and unwatchable to anyone who doesn't play MMOs, and my favorite parts are when they show the game's systems. In that respect it's way more interesting than .hack was. Episode 8 was probably my favorite so far, simply because there was a lot of UI interaction and we got to see the cooking and duel systems. Some of my family (Non-gamers, all of them) are enjoying it. It's simple enough and engaging, though they haven't internalized all the terms yet. They also enjoy some of the gags that we're sick of because every single anime ever does it. Strangely, they also enjoyed Legend of Galactic Heroes (Having names for everyone and not suffering from sameface helped, and it also more closely resembles the Chinese period dramas they enjoy). I'd say the biggest draw thus far is that the setting reminds you that it's a game and all the limitations that entails. The show has been good about setting up and explaining rules, and then following them. Exploits like sleep-PKing make perfect sense as something that goes against the rules set forth by the game without being plothax. In comparison, .hack just kind of set itself in a game and then ran far, far away (The games more than the show). How does your mind remain in the game even though you've been removed from it? How does a purely visual interface suddenly shove you into the game? Etc.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 28, 2012 09:59
|
|
|
I think the menu is probably the most subtle yet ingenious aspect of them showing it's a game. It's too easy to depict a "we're in a game" situation without every depicting the menus. People just seem to stare off in the distance for a little bit or something and bam, they've done something. The menu makes perfect sense too. It's a VR game so you aren't interacting with a mouse and keyboard. It could be invisible like certain UI elements (Party display, your own HP bar, etc.) but it'd make interacting with the UI more awkward to look at. It's this great blend of show and tell.
|
|
#
¿
Aug 29, 2012 05:18
|
|
|
Sindai posted:It's okay, you're not the only one. I can't remember where it's noted but he's transmuted the coat four or so times to keep the appearance over armor upgrades. Dexo posted:The dude is overleveled enough to solo a boss on level 74. Well, he didn't quite solo the boss entirely. Goes to show how different the game would be if it wasn't a death game. The reason they progress slowly and do boss fights with tons of people is minimize risk.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 2, 2012 20:32
|
|
|
The best time to take a break would probably be that lull between getting acquainted with a new floor and actively training towards the boss battle. Too bad they ruined that for themselves.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 6, 2012 08:07
|
|
|
Rivers posted:I don't remember if this has been explained, but is there a pvp duel mode where players are exempt from dying? There's first-to-hit, down to 50%, and to the death. The first is obviously the safest if a bit of a mindgame because of how direct the objective is. Think of how in many fighting games, it's possible to just smash someone into the ground just by getting the first hit and carrying out the following moves perfectly, and giving them almost no window to recover. Setting up such a thing requires mindgames. Minor LN spoilers but during the duel, it's noted that Kuradeel would've won (By getting the first hit) had Kirito not specifically targeted his sword. Damage mechanics are elaborated upon in the murder mystery sidestory and why even a duel to 50% is risky. While the duel ends once someone hits 50%, you can still have inflicted more damage and it takes time for all the damage to apply. You can suffer 6000 damage but your health doesn't drain instantly, so there's even a risk of dying in a 50% duel because someone is drastically more powerful or someone got a lucky crit.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 7, 2012 21:27
|
|
|
Not only did the duel feel rushed but they messed up the mechanics probably for the sake of making it more visually interesting. First-to-hit and then they proceed to hurt each other without the duel ending.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 8, 2012 23:02
|
|
|
RyuujinBlueZ posted:Yeah. That duel should have been the majority of the episode, and it felt like they should have spent a bit more time on his being in the guild. Maybe half the episode on the duel, then half on him loving around in the guild and end on a cliffhanger. Make it a two-parter. You'd still get that ending bit they obviously wanted, and the pacing would have felt better. I'm not sure if the fight has enough material to go on that much longer. Certainly they can space it out more with scenes before and after, but the actual fight itself would require using a lot of the inner monologue that the anime has been prone to leaving out. Alectai posted:Spoilery bit Yes
|
|
#
¿
Sep 8, 2012 23:59
|
|
|
Dan7el posted:I don't think first-strike is quite what we expect. I think you can get minor hits in these duels that don't really count. It's the first really big strike. Sort of like a solid hit in martial arts or even a point in boxing. Boxes hit on each other for up to even a round or two before a point is scored. This is text directly from the baka-tsuki translation, chapter 13 of volume 1:. I misremembered then. A bit misleading though. Fairy Dance was kind of bleh to me initially because of what it did to certain characters but it was rather  in the end. Phantom Bullet has kind of an interesting story to it but how Kirito gets involved and what he does is kind of silly to me, even if there's still some cool and interesting moments.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 9, 2012 05:00
|
|
|
I wonder if you can still access the menu if you have your hand chopped off.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 9, 2012 20:34
|
|
|
ConanThe3rd posted:You still have your other hand, right? Besides that, the game seems to work on Namekian rules. Well, both hands then. Does lack of a hand impair one's ability to use the interface? It sounds like a hilarious potential grief were it a normal MMO.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 10, 2012 00:56
|
|
|
Storgar posted:In my opinion, .hack//SIGN was the high point of the franchise. (I like .hack//SIGN but, think of it as in the same way a tree is the highest point of a desert.) All of the games are absolute rubbish, even though .hack//GU is slightly better than the first 4 games. The second (legend of the twilight) anime is standard uguu moe stuff that has almost no plot, and a lot of the side material (.hack//Liminality, .hack novels) touches on the "main mystery" of The World, but are devoid of substance and ultimately unsatisfying. I haven't played the psp game. Actually, I heard .hack//ZERO or .hack//CELL (novels/manga, I think) are somewhat interesting. I don't remember why, though... Legend of the Twilight manga is substantially less annoying obligatory-cute poo poo but it's fairly minor in the scheme of things. There's a still a fair bit of sidestory material that's untranslated. These aren't from any of the LNs but just published on the net or something. Episode 2 is one of these. It cut a informative foreshadowy subplot out, cut out most of Kirito and Asuna being in a party outside of doing the dungeon, and cut out the information broker who appears in episode 3. There's a short story where Kirito acquires the Unarmed Combat skill and some other things. Thus far, these bits and pieces have largely been exploring Kirito's early days of SAO (The original LN covers episode one, then eight). They've done a good job incorporating the bits that felt necessary (Clearing the first floor, why Kirito avoids guilds, some Kirito and Asuna bonding) while cutting things to keep the flow. Going from "Kirito leaves Klein behind" to "Kirito and Asuna eat ragout rabbit" would be too jarring. The anime is clearly aiming to end at the conclusion of the second arc so there's not a lot of room for too much extra stuff at this point.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 11, 2012 04:40
|
|
|
Xythar posted:In other words, editors. You'll always get translation "purists" who believe there's no way one can capture the essence of certain words or phrases. It's pretty silly. The argument can be made for anime or manga translations simply because of the lack of space/time. Text-wise though, you pretty much have all the room in the world to capture the essence of things. Phoenix Wright went further than just translation and into the realm of localization and it did an amazing job of managing to stay relatively close despite changing the setting. Hell, it did an amazing job at the humor and even managed to keep some jokes and gags parallel to the originals. It just takes more effort than most people are willing to put into it, especially if they're not paid.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 14, 2012 04:48
|
|
|
Dexo posted:You can knock players back in safe zones Old MMOs, huzzah. Then again, since it's VR, I can see how having difficult elements would have an actual appeal beyond catering to people who like this level of difficulty.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 15, 2012 23:33
|
|
|
.Clash posted:The anime seems intent on skipping all the little things that made me like the LN. Whats the point of the setting if you ignore all the details of the setting. Eh. They're on fairly tight constraints and are mostly keeping the must-haves at this point, such as how safe-zone combat works. I'll miss that scene that would've been in this episode. The one ofthe man being so proud of earning just enough to live by from selling fruit that falls off a tree in town.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 16, 2012 09:32
|
|
|
cooldude2.0 posted:(later novels, not plot related)Later, they always seem to treat it like an important secret that they played SAO and I have yet to understand that because it goes beyond being humble. (Later novel spoilers, not plot related) It's probably because for two years, they've gone through various ordeals. They've suffered, lost, degenerated, etc. And for that third that's stayed in the Town of Beginnings, it's not all that great a time. I mean, it's not all that bad either but it's two years of a dreary existence as they pass the time. Those who ventured out experienced more of the highs and lows, and those trying to clear the game are under the most stress. If you look at Kirito and Asuna, they're victims of SAO but they also gained a lot from it. For them and others like them, it's not a one-sided experience in which they are victims and nothing more, and that's probably not the common conception of the whole SAO disaster. Also, it's unwanted attention. Considering how much Kirito tries to avoid the spotlight, that sort of admission would draw attention.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 16, 2012 18:08
|
|
|
Considering most e-celebrities, I think his reaction is the better response.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 00:51
|
|
|
Yasser Arafatwa posted:Also interesting seeing this side of the ALF army, since they didn't really seem like that sort of group from the first run in we saw of them. I think their current state decently foreshadowed. From what we know, they used to be a frontline guild but sustained too many losses on the 25th floor. They're a group with many strong members and are also well-organized, considering the name and their participation in dungeon clearing. Since the 25th floor, they've stuck back and tried to recover. The Knights of Blood don't really try to rule but it's fairly clear they could if they tried. A large enough membership, hierarchy, strong leadership, etc. Main difference is that the ALF suffered a crushing loss and clearly took a blow to their confidence that they've been trying to cover up. I wonder how long it took for them to clear 25 to 75, considering that's how long it took for the Army to feel they were up for another boss.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 02:24
|
|
|
The Knights are only about 30 players? That really seems to be too few to not have all its members undergo a more extensive process for joining. And too few to start having the manpower for bodyguards.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 03:00
|
|
|
Raenir Salazar posted:In fairness, wasn't the problem with 74 being the Army being overconfident/careless? They note that the bosses of recent floors (70+) are becoming less and less predictable. They also couldn't use any crystals with The Gleameyes. Beyond having some unique effects such as teleportation, crystals also seem to be more powerful than potions and are more easily used on yourself and others. Bosses don't exactly let players escape very easily once combat starts. Disengaging and running leaves them open, and a fighting retreat still leaves people to face the boss. The recent bosses are more difficult because they can't assume they have thorough knowledge of the boss' mechanics, and that's not counting whatever surprise (No crystals, no healing, etc.) each one may have. The way the frontline fighters have been dealing with bosses for a long time now is practice. Individual skill helps but they've been taking things slowly and cautiously. The recent fights are shifting things towards just being a good fighter. Obviously, preparation always works but learning and adapting fast are now more important than before. Furthermore, given the every 25th floor trend, 75 will likely be a massive jump in difficulty.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 06:20
|
|
|
cooldude2.0 posted:Crystals heal you instantly, so unless you're oneshot you can safely get through the fight as long as you stock up. Potions heal over time. Coupled with the lack of healers in SAO, not having crystals available is a big deal. It's probably similar to housing. Gear, particularly weapons, tend to pay for itself. A new weapon means you'll be killing monsters faster. Crystals probably suffer from typical gamer behavior and item hoarding. Unless it's absolutely necessary, they don't use it. Exceptions being teleport crystals because of the unique role they serve. Regarding the type of teleport crystal used to take Titan's Hand to the player prison, I imagine the guild leader had enough pooled to buy it. He had a definite use for it so it made sense. It's a very open-ended item so just how you use it determines its worth. Going from A to B instantly and bypassing everything inbetween is helpful but probably not worth whatever it costs. Now, using it in the arrest of orange players who would have plenty of opportunities to run away if they are personally escorted to the prison justifies the cost. Using it to sneak into someone's room to PK them in what is otherwise a safe and secure area is also a rather smart use of it. Frontline players don't really have much use for it. Solo players like Kirito are the exception, so going around in a dungeon is relatively safe.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 10:23
|
|
|
Gearhead posted:Crystals seem to break on use, or at least, I'm pretty sure I've seen them break before. They do. Asuna uses one on Kirito and it crumbles afterwards. The training is probably intended to have them in situations where they may be tempted to use crystals. It'd have them in situations where they'd be tempted to use a crystal but be able to rely on their teammates to cover them while the potion takes effect.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 17:01
|
|
|
Nathilus posted:That bit sort of got to me. In a game where a crystal can literally save your life, would you voluntarily hand them over because some random guildie asshat tells you to? gently caress him. Yeah, really. You don't take away their lifeline, you just fail them if they panic and use it. He was just a stupid fool after all.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 17, 2012 18:12
|
|
|
Gearhead posted:I'd say yes. The translation reads a little stiff at times, but there ARE things the animated series is skipping over due to time constraints. Pretty much. It can be a small hassle if you want to read things in chronological order. You can generally match the episode names to the short story aside from the second episode, which is the side story Aria in the Starless Night.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 19, 2012 19:34
|
|
|
It just strikes me as a standard attempt to do something cool without doing the research. SAO isn't really too full of those since the MMO aspects tend to fit together well. Still an instance of "why would someone program this?" in action.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 23, 2012 09:21
|
|
|
I've put together a quick list of what episode corresponds to what chapter/sidestory for those interested in reading in chronological order. There's a few sidestories that have happened chronologically but aren't featured in the anime. This isn't an exhaustive list because I haven't read everything yet. Episode 1: Volume 1, Chapter 1-3 Sidestory: Volume 8, First Day Episode 2: Aria in the Starless Night Material Editions: Continuation: Aria in the Starless Night Sidestory: Rondo of the Transient Sword (Not fully translated) Episode 3: Volume 2, Red-nosed Reindeer Episode 4: Volume 2, The Black Swordsman Episode 5-6: Volume 8, A Murder Case in the Area Episode 7: Volume 2, Warmth of the Heart Episode 8-10: Volume 1, Chapter 4-18 Episode 11-12: Volume 2, Morning Dew Girl Generally, the LN fits in more stuff than the anime but with some side stories written far far later, some things aren't foreshadowed, some things are reverse-foreshadowed, etc. For instance, in Episode 8 during the duel, the Laughing Coffin member isn't mentioned in the LN. I'd recommend against reading A Murder Case in the Area because there's a certain scene in it that heavily foreshadows things that have yet to appear in the anime. The anime cut out that scene while retaining most of the information featured. A lot of the differences, both in details and explanations, are due to the first-person viewpoint of the LN compared to the anime. Aria in the Starless Night has a few scenes and a subplot that didn't make it into the anime, for instance. The subplot is largely unimportant but the missing scenes help flesh out the world and has a fair bit of character interaction.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 24, 2012 04:53
|
|
|
Doctor w-rw-rw- posted:According to the launch calendar, it should be continuous. Is it though? I'm seeing episode 13, but not 14 yet. Checking ANN though, we have a title for episode 14 and it sounds like the sort to continue from where 13 may leave off.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 26, 2012 10:32
|
|
|
Hey Kirito, don't tell the head honcho of your guild that you're not a team player. It's a rather rude thing to say, even with their circumstances. I can't recall when the moving-people-to-the-hospitals thing was mentioned in the LN. If it was this chapter, it is kind of jarring to mention it now than way earlier. Oh well.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 29, 2012 21:26
|
|
|
Gearhead posted:Kirito's greatest malfunction is that he has a hard time imagining how people besides himself think. To be fair, it is somewhat acceptable for him to declare such a thing when it's a death game. Better to know now than find out later. Course, he charging into the thick of things to save other people's lives. He's not a jerk.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 29, 2012 22:51
|
|
|
Gearhead posted:Asuna and Kirito's relationship is always interesting to watch. They aren't a normal couple, in such that any couple can be considered normal, but they help to keep each other sane. I was never too fond of it because of the stereotypewhere the girl needs the guy to save her. It still works out well enough and just goes to show how much those two years meant for them. It's not bad but I can see why it can be off-putting for people when compared to the SAO arc.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 30, 2012 04:10
|
|
|
|
| # ¿ May 19, 2024 15:34 |
|
|
Gearhead posted:I guess that I just pinged more off the idea that Kirito was the one who was actually in distress. He's about half way to coming completely apart at the seams by the time it's done. Only his duel with Lyfa seems to have grounded him long enough to see it through. It definitely gets better once your expectations shift. It's mostly the initial Kirito and Asuna are split up and he has to rescue her that got me. They earned their happy ending, drat it. Of course, they go and earn it again.
|
|
#
¿
Sep 30, 2012 09:20
|
|