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That's a neat Kozilek art. So looking at Kozilek's cost and the Waste, the Waste is producing a special Kozilek mana. This flies in the face of it being basic, because it's literally just a 6th color at that point. On the other hand it does seem pretty much the way they've been doing the return to zendikar thus far - a super boring revamp of eldrazi is very fitting. Sigma-X fucked around with this message at 02:06 on Nov 18, 2015 |
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Nov 18, 2015 01:58
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Angry Grimace posted:The reason this isn't getting dismissed out of hand is because its not easy for fakers to source high-quality fake art and this one isn't even blurry, from a weird angle or anything. The cards also aren't obviously under or overpowered either. Yeah I am coming around to the idea that this is just as loving lame enough to be real. Phyrexian mana was cool but this seems way gimmicky. Phyrexian mana was both flavorful and powerful and I can't yet see how this is in any way providing a different power vector, only a flavor vector, and I'm not feeling the flavor yet. If Eldrazi are turning basic lands into wastes throughout the gatekeeper block, like if that becomes a mechanic, that would be pretty sweet and actually make the flavor resonate really well. I would actually love to see a series of cards like: Kozilek's Defiler 2Z When ~this ETB, target land you control and target land you don't control become Wastes (they are basic lands that read: tap to produce Z) 2/2 e: if <> mana or however we're going to write it is it's own type of mana, it's just snow mana again, just more parasitic. This seems more and more real by the moment.
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Nov 18, 2015 02:11
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:The earliest we've gotten small set spoilers before was on Christmas. Kiora and Ugin were revealed this way, for example. I actually know a guy who knows a guy kind of deal but the manufacturer+distro is like 2 months prior to the launch even when padding, so having printed material this early seems unlikely except for the purposes of marketing. I'm not sure when this set is supposed to come out off the top of my head. e: based off of my workings in the (video)games industry, a really great source for leaks is file distribution. The art could have been on an unsecured FTP or website somewhere and got sniped there, and then the fakers would have real art to work with. When I say unsecured, I don't mean like completely loving blind, I mean something like there's a folder in the FTP structure that people are only supposed to have write access to (a drop box) but someone got read access to it. I've seen this happen before IRL. Sigma-X fucked around with this message at 02:23 on Nov 18, 2015 |
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Nov 18, 2015 02:21
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Terrible Horse posted:The wastes seem insane mostly because how would that work at a prerelease; you can add as many wastes as you want in deckbuilding? or no, and you have to specifically draft Wastes, and they have the bonus of being fetchable with Evolving Wilds? Pre-releases have special pre-release materials, remember? Your little "commemorative deck box" paper piece of poo poo with a sticker holding it together has room for 6 packs plus a pack of SPECIAL PRE-RELEASE WASTES and a D20 in 7 different color(less)s
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Nov 18, 2015 02:25
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Ramos posted:I'm surprised no one is making a big deal about waste lands being printed in standard again. Is there a MaRo tumblr about Waste Land reprints where he is coy? that would pretty much seal these as real Terrible Horse posted:True, but what about regular draft? What about modo prerelease? Maybe every Oath pack will have a waste instead of a regular basic. The Land Stations that they sell to stores will have Wastes and adding Wastes to modo is just adding another basic land to the "add basics" button.
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Nov 18, 2015 02:27
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suicidesteve posted:Kozilek proves it's fake. They don't print colorless counterspells. Look at this colorless Eldrazi Counterspell: http://magiccards.info/roe/en/8.html efb so hard
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Nov 18, 2015 02:39
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All rules get added when the set is launched, there not being rules for Wastes already in the game does not mean that they can't exist. There was no notion of two sides of a card before flip cards and that didn't stop them from making it a mechanic. I still don't actually believe that these are real yet but all of the reasons they aren't real aren't great reasons yet. Also the most important indicator towards these being fake - they don't seem playable outside of limited / standard / EDH and fakes typically excite me because they are powerful enough to warrant play outside those formats (like the fake R/W land) e: they have specifically added new basics the sets to indicate the changes to the environment before - having new "wasting" arts of existing full art lands would be both sick and awesome. Scars / MBS did this with their land art. Also worldwake had like 12-13 different lands that weren't basics.
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Nov 18, 2015 03:08
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Twiddy posted:God if these actually exist I'm gonna have to buy a 100 of these aren't I. You only need like 20 for a commander deck maximum and fewer for any constructed deck. This is WotC's way to ensure that everyone buys 20 packs
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Nov 18, 2015 03:14
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Some Numbers posted:Your hypothesis is that they're printing an Eldrazi Mythic that will actually be literally unplayable in 99% of formats after the prerelease? They did it once in BFZ, so there's precedent. (I kid, newlamog is actually playable) Northjayhawk posted:I could see them using this "mechanic" in future sets, could even be evergreen. Its general enough that it doesn't have to be a Kozilek thing, and it might solve a problem with artifacts. Artifacts have color pie issues, but if you can require colorless, then you can make stronger pie-infringing artifacts since you'd have to weaken your mana base to gain access to it. that just makes it a 6th color, I doubt it will extend beyond this set / eldrazi, but when we Return Yet Again To Ravnica because Emrakul is rolling in for end-game, they will totally show up again to ruin Ravnica's duals. Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:(This card is fake.) Reminder text is often left off rares and mythics for space considerations. I still think there is a high likelihood of these being fake but the cards and ideas are trite enough that they feel very in line with wotc. The typo on "alleksi" and the timing are the only things that really make me think "fake."
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Nov 18, 2015 20:21
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Zemyla posted:Something occurs to me. Why didn't they reprint Vindicate in the BW commander deck? I mean, Vindicate is literally the perfect BW card, and one of the few perfect Magic cards in general. Did they fear including a $15 card would overbalance its value compared to the other decks? They are really, really concerned about making the deck values uneven, because it causes huge issues with wholesale sales. Unfortunately their solution this time seems to have been to print zero interesting cards.
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Nov 20, 2015 19:27
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Twiddy posted:You'd think the easier solution would be having one guaranteed money reprint per expansion to help equalize any price disparity that would come from an unbalance in the original cards, but what do I know. I think this is the easy solution on the surface, but finding 5 cards that are equal in street value, that will depreciate due to the reprinting evenly and have even desire across the player base would require a tremendous amount of data to even start making reasonable guesses, and those guesses wouldn't have a high certainty. In the Vindicate case - Vindicate and Abrupt Decay are both $15 cards, and would fit into the current design of the decks. But Vindicate has much less demand and much less supply, which leads to its $15, whereas Abrupt Decay has much more demand and supply, so reprinting both of them would provide an imbalance despite the fact that they're similar cards in power level with similar prices. I'm reading the latest M-Files: http://magic.wizards.com/en/articles/archive/latest-developments/m-files-original-zendikar-block-2015-11-20 Amulet of Vigor's discussion is really useful in illustrating how design uses Psychographics - The designers are very conflicted on whether this card is good/bad/etc, and they've done enough of these to know that when a card polls like that, it has Johnny appeal. This is why the psychographics exist - to ensure that design is building for people that aren't just themselves but instead a wider audience. e: haha they called out the "nonbo" with Eldrazi Conscription because you don't get the annihilator trigger the first time you attack. Sigma-X fucked around with this message at 20:56 on Nov 20, 2015 |
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Nov 20, 2015 20:49
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I fee like either of the cards in Amulet Bloom's name would be good ban targets to kill the deck without touching the rest of the environment, and banning hive mind would weaken the deck and make it vulnerable to the same things that the other combo decks are all vulnerable to (cheap point removal) with the Pact loop giving it a resiliency that allows it to function on a different vector than twin, making it a viable "combo" deck alongside twin.
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Nov 22, 2015 22:34
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My favorite thing about Joe Lossett is having to ask him what phase we're supposed to be in while he tops because when we played because he had an aversion to talking (and to drawing business cards so I took the match).
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Nov 24, 2015 01:59
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CrosspostingSigma-X posted:Would anyone have any interest in a Goon League for a format that involves only using "Command Zone" Products and Conspiracy? No banlist, planes and conspiracies themselves are not allowed, however. I don't think there's a reason for a banlist because there isn't enough affinity to make the artifact lands problematic and I don't think TNN will be oppressive in a format that has a million sweepers.
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Nov 24, 2015 02:55
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for rules clarifications: No planes or conspiracies. 60 card decks, 4 copies of a card, 15 card sideboard. It's regular constructed magic, just with a cardpool people haven't used before so you can't netdeck. Outside of those card types, there is no other banlist, we aren't importing the legacy/modern/etc banlists. This means you get to play with 3 legacy banned cards, Sol Ring, Skull Clamp, and Windfall, and you can run 4 of these in your decks. If these break the format we will ban them for future tournaments but I want to see brews. There's probably some broke-rear end poo poo you can do with Skull Clamp, veteran explorers, two llanowar elves, and two doomed travelers in the pool. I'd rather find out than preemptively cut it out.
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Nov 24, 2015 03:30
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Threads up for the Command Zone brew tournament: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3752950
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Nov 25, 2015 00:06
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Angry Grimace posted:I really wonder what that lawsuit settled for. WOTC's case was absurdly meritless and Maro's article on it was pretty gross. I can't even fathom what they expected some random dude to pay them (he couldn't even really afford a lawyer, he literally got another MTGS member to just sort of defend him for free). If they don't make it into a huge hassle for the guy, even if they don't make money off it, they basically encourage people to do it. If the internet points do not have a significant cost to the leaker, then they'll leak all day errday.
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Dec 1, 2015 00:18
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Fiend Computer posted:New card got spoiled today. This is awesome, the holiday cards are always awesome.
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Dec 1, 2015 19:00
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And then people poorly butcher them and they look gross as hell most of the time.
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Dec 2, 2015 02:25
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Rinkles posted:I believe you, I'm just surprised. They're given away as cool one-off collectible type things, not so idiots can poorly chop them up and sell them at a premium. e: your cuts look fine, I've seen some gross as hell ones though. I don't particularly care for the off-center aesthetic, it looks bad to me, but vertically displaced miscuts (ie the ones that naturally occur) can look neat.
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Dec 2, 2015 02:26
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Mezzanon posted:Insane local magic drama: the local high level judge got To-catch-a-predator'd last night and relinquished his drat self to police custody today.   
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Dec 3, 2015 07:01
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I really don't get the joke? Those look like completely random cards to me. e: oh, I think I figured it out. Magical jokes are often harder for the man.
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Dec 3, 2015 12:32
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Banning terminus fixes miracles. It was never a t1 deck until miracles were printed and not having access to a 1 mana instant speed wrath opens up the format for more fair decks that aren't relying on cascade creatures and hymn to overpower the card advantage that terminus + counter/top + snapcaster represents. Terminus is only played in that deck and it will injure but not destroy the deck and open up the meta. Killing Miracles isn't actually healthy for the format because as the premier (and really only) hard control deck its existence keeps combo in check enough that every deck doesn't need to run blue.
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Dec 4, 2015 23:55
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Pussy Snorkel posted:Wait, are people under some idea that Miracles is a dominant deck in the meta? It's annoying, I guess, but it's far from oppressive. it's a lot less oppressive now that Dig is gone. I don't think it is actually oppressive, and didn't think it it needed to be kneecapped, but I still think terminus is the card to kill over top. there's a hundred bad decks that want to run top, plus one good deck. there's zero bad decks that want to run terminus, and one good deck. I don't think killing top adds variety to the meta.
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Dec 5, 2015 00:03
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C-Euro posted:I'd even go so far as to argue that there wasn't a deck called Miracles before the Miracles mechanic was printed Counterbalance existed in several forms beforehand, which is what I was referring to, obviously. RUG Counterbalance: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=36628 http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=36246 Standstill Variants like this Dreadstill: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=35554 Thopters: http://sales.starcitygames.com//deckdatabase/displaydeck.php?DeckID=37839 I had also seen less successful U/W control variants with Wrath of God and the like, although for a long time Firespout was pretty much a wrath that didn't hit your goyfs.
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Dec 5, 2015 00:19
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Friendly reminder that Craig Wescoe doesn't wash his hands after he poops at events
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Dec 6, 2015 03:19
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Count Bleck posted:
He might have changed, I've certainly posted this enough to the point where he's probably been made fun of for it in real life (I know some goon here was friends with Drew Levin? and had passed on the story after the Wescoe Check), but at my first SCG event way, way back, back when ggslive was doing coverage long before anyone else knew what coverage was, Karnegal from these very forums goes into the bathroom, I wait outside for him, and a dude walks out, and then Karnegal walks out. "Was that guy Craig Wescoe?" "I have no idea who that is, Karnegal" (I had just gotten back into magic a few months ago and this was my first time playing constructed, whereas Karnegal was a hardcore magic scenester nerd. "Well he took a horrific poo poo, like he was really doing work in there, and then he didn't wash his hands. that's fuckin' gross" "ewww" And then when we went into the event he pointed him out again, and that was the first time I saw Craig Wescoe. He was at a lot of the events we'd go to on account of us all living in the midwest where everyone drives 3-5 hours a weekend to go play magic. He may have learned basic hygiene in like the 7 years since but I generally don't trust magic players to improve their hygiene. sidenote: I think Rashad Miller is loving awesome and really deserves more recognition for creating the notion of streaming magic than he gets. I have my R 
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Dec 6, 2015 03:44
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This change is completely non-functional except for the BRAND NEW SUPER COLORLESS CARDS which will be gimmick that will never affect anyone who isn't playing Tron / 12 Post or possibly the terrible format that is standard right now. It only has functional realizations for the future of the game, it affects no previous cards, and all cards that add {X} mana now add {D} and this conversion only goes one way ({X} in costs does not become {D} in costs) so it will be trivial to remember for the people playing Tron / 12 Post. I think it's a stupid gimmick, plays poorly with the first sets "coloredless" cards, and is marginal design space that is effectively just a lovely 6th color retcon, but I doubt they'll use it much in the future because they hopefully realize that it's a crap 6th color replacement, when artifacts are designed to play with all colors, so we won't start seeing random artifacts or Ugin-related poo poo costed like that. e: wasteland would destroy the three color format of modern. The current trade off for 3 colors vs fewer colors is that you start the game at 15-17 life and sometimes a turn behind, you don't need wasteland loving poo poo up even more. Wasteland is useful in Legacy to punish those three color manabases because they aren't shocking themselves repeatedly. The lands that are truly problematic get hit by GQ and Tec Edge just fine in modern. The desire to make modern into lovely legacy instead of keeping it a format that is unique is something I don't get - it's as bad as tiny leaders (which is also lovely legacy). Sigma-X fucked around with this message at 07:21 on Dec 7, 2015 |
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Dec 7, 2015 07:18
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So the Mul Daya twins let you do the following: Get double landfall in any turn. Get an extra two mana out of two untapped lands, pushing you from 4 to 6 (return the land, replay it, tap for mana) without needing a 5th/6th land in your hand. Are on curve as a 4/4 for 4 Double dip on spell lands I don't think they're going to set the world on fire but they do A LOT for a single card, and that flexibility is a bit of value in an of itself.
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Dec 7, 2015 23:34
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Count Bleck posted:You have to pay RG to bounce the land. oh poo poo, nevermind, card is trash
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Dec 8, 2015 00:36
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Gareth Gobulcoque posted:New phyrexia, Nagle wants a splashy mechanic and naturally turns to the stupid 2 card 99/99 creature from loving unglued because of course he does. Everybody is like "absolutely not", but Nagle keeps pushing it. Has to get cut for phyrexian mana. See, I think this is a very flavorful take on splicing together creatures to make phyrexian compleations and horrors in the spirit of Yawgmoth's original tinkering. Compleation is a great flavor for Phyrexia and one of the things that consistently drives their horror aspect. Except Bestow, creature enchantments, and equipment all do this better, because Ken Nagle doesn't know how to design within the existing mechanics.
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Dec 8, 2015 04:23
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Angry Grimace posted:Wouldn't it just say "When you cast this spell, no other spells can be cast until it resolves" or something? no player may cast spells or activate abilities.
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Dec 8, 2015 08:31
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Some Numbers posted:^^^^^: It's not a color! I think it's really stupid because it's a backdoor 6th color for bullshit reasons and fucks with templating with zero actual designspace gain that isn't a parasitic 6th color, and furthermore their marquee 6th color card is something that historically has not been a 6th color thing and that was the whole point of them. They're really loving up the "eldrazi are colorless in a land of colors!" theme with BFZ and now with new Kozilek.
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Dec 8, 2015 22:58
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Niton posted:How does it feel to be the old man that hates all change? ♦BG is not cost-wise different than WBG, which is why I'm calling it a backdoor 6th color. It's exactly the same functionality as another color, and it's being done for bad reasons (supporting their bad colorless flavor for eldrazi this go around). A ♦BG card does not work better in a 2 color strategy than a 3 color strategy, it works in a different 3 color strategy. I don't think they're going to warp the game forever by making ♦ costs an evergreen and oft-used mechanic, because that just further cements it as a bad 6th color, but they're doing it for flavor reasons here and it is dumb as hell. Differentiating between colorless mana and generic mana costs is the sort of thing that bothers designers but not players because the difference has never once mattered until now.
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Dec 8, 2015 23:28
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jassi007 posted:The weird thing is, if they did everything but print a card that required colorless to cast, it would just be a rules clarification. We already produce colorless mana in the game. It just has the same, obviously confusing symbols as generic mana payments. It should have its own symbol because sometimes (2) means one thing, and sometimes it means another. Urza's Tower and Cranial Plating the (2) means different things. There should be a good way to distinguish and ♦ is a perfectly logical idea. Every other mana that is generated has a simple symbol, why not colorless? Also colorless has always been the 6th color. Legacy MUD, Modern Affinity, Tron decks. This is the biggest clarification that changes nothing that people are having a hard time with. There is no colorless identity to those decks, though. Affinity is heavily colored, and is artifact themed. MUD is artifact themed primarily (although they keep printing good colorless planeswalkers so it's less that). Tron is GIANT FUCKIN MANA themed, not colorless themed - frequently you're using that colorless themed mana to GSZ for 6G. All of those decks abuse lands that produce multiple colorless instead of a single color, but there isn't an identity like they're trying to establish with eldrazi. I don't think ♦♦ on Kozilek is going to break the game or make it less fun (I think it's a dumb mechanic and unexciting but I feel that way about every card in standard right now except Tasigur) but it's adding a lot of change that accomplishes very little for the amount of disruption it adds to existing templating. About the only justification I will be satisified with is if, in a year from now, they can point to some survey / user research data that indicates that adding a colorless mana symbol to lands that produce colorless mana has made teaching the game easier. The ♦♦ cost bullshit is super boring and combined with devoid is indicative of their failure to recapture what made the eldrazi interesting the last time around. e: it does not require errata at all. From all designery perspectives it is very elegant. From a user standpoint it's just dumb, and the marquee card they made to demonstrate how cool it is is loving terrible, and it easily invites a lot of bad design in the future if they go full retard on this.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:11
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Allstone posted:Quantify this please. A WBG card can have double strike, or cheap flying, or be a life-based alt wincon. What can a DBG card do that a BG card can't? The problem with a sixth colour is that it would need to take design space from the other colours, which this doesn't do. At most it does the things that colourless already does. I have no idea, that's why I'm saying it's loving retarded, and the notion of taking design space from other colors to build a future "colorless" identity is garbage, but that's about all the design space that ♦ as a cost adds.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:19
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Allstone posted:Artifacts, but cheaper and less splashable is already a gigantic design space. yeah they're called other colors
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Dec 9, 2015 00:27
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stinkles1112 posted:Your objections seem to be based entirely on what wizards may or may not choose to do in the future Everyone's excitement seems to be based entirely on the notion that WotC will go full retard on this, and I think that would be the worst thing they can do. I assume that people are excited by them going full retard because Kozilek's implementation is dumb as poo poo.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:57
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e:^^ my bad, I saw Tron and my head turned that into 12-post because I haven't played modern in like 6 months.Allstone posted:No as in literally: modular, equip, mana rocks, indestructible, living weapon, artifacts/colourless matters, affinity (Incidentally a great way to put a minimum cost on colourless affinity cards), charge counters, etc. The mechanics that artifacts are currently using. They can already do this with the 5 previous colors, adding a 6th magic bullshit color does not open this design space up.
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Dec 9, 2015 01:21
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Allstone posted:Black, red, and blue explicitly don't get indestructible as often as colourless does. Apart from green, there are exceedingly few nonland nonartifact permanents that unconditionally tap for mana. I don't think there are any coloured cards with modular? There are 7 coloured equipment cards to about 200 colourless ones. So no, they can't just use colourless mechanics on coloured cards. Why do you need to make these colorless lifegain artifacts into colorless-matters cards to make them harder to splash? Why not just run a white card at that point if you want a difficult to cast lifegain card? Making a colorless-required card is no more restrictive than adding a different color splash. stinkles1112 posted:It looks better and makes more sense. It's not in any way a "pseudo sixth color" unless you consider artifacts to be the sixth color. If anything it helps RESTRICT color bleed by allowing WOTC to print disincentives for dummy 4c and 5c goodstuffs decks What is a disincentive to running 5 colors that adding colorless mana as a requirement skirts around? It is literally as restrictive as colored mana. The deck build costs are pretty much identical between WUB♦ and WUBR, either way you have 4 restrictions. Artifacts aren't a 6th color because they're intended to be shared among colors and be used by any color deck, that's their entire original design goal. Adding a colorless restriction is not functionally different than a 6th color, and is fundamentally different than artifacts.
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Dec 9, 2015 02:33
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