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district 12 posted:Hello thread, Is your current salary also 20k less than your desired salary? If so, it sounds like you have terrible BATNA and need to go out and get multiple offers that corroborate your desired salary. If not, then use your current salary as well as your research.
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Mar 26, 2016 02:15
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| # ¿ Apr 29, 2024 10:46 |
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If you are willing to take the other offer than you can ask for a 30% raise to stay. I wouldn't mention cost of living as the company doesn't care.
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May 10, 2016 14:48
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Pryor on Fire posted:Companies need to pay appropriately for the cost of living where they are located, this is why even entry level work in San Francisco is often over $100K. While you're correct that it's not strictly their problem it's totally reasonable to ask for a 30% raise if that's how much more it costs to live there. No, they don't. Companies in high cost of living areas do generally pay more, but the driver behind that is competition to acquire and retain talent. People want to living in high CoL areas and thus a company may not need to cover the full difference. If you have access to your companies pay bands at different locations, you could check for yourself, but I can almost guarantee that the difference is less than the cost of living difference. One other factor as Dwight pointer out, is that CoL has less of an impact as your income grows as well. I don't see any issue asking for a large raise to stay if you're willing to leave and have an offer in hand with the normal caveats. The one thing that isn't entirely clear is if the large raise would put him above the expected salary in Boston, if so then I would expect some push back as that is going to be a large factor in determining if it's reasonable and you probably don't have a lot of leverage with an offer in a different city that is substantially lower in absolute terms.
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May 10, 2016 15:27
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Are there any guidelines for negotiating if you have multiple offers without a strong preference between them? I'm assuming you want to mention that you have a better offer to improve your BATNA and get them to offer more. Is there a limit to how many times you can come back to the company asking for more because of a better offer? It seems like people would get annoyed or is this just expected?
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May 26, 2016 01:46
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Remove the biweekly part and it would be better to focus on value you add as the manager doesn't care about cost of living if he can get someone for that salary.
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May 28, 2016 04:57
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You should talk to a lawyer before you quit or in any way communicate that you are quitting. Edit: is there some confusion over who gives a recommendation? I just don't see you're boss giving a good rec if you quit with zero notice without a compelling reason that he would accept. A hostile work environment is a legitimate reason to quite with no notice, but you're boss probably won't see it that way and reporting him to HR would kill any chance whatsoever. I don't want this to come across as that you shouldn't report him, but I think you need to weigh the consequences against potentially helping other people in the office. asur fucked around with this message at 15:59 on Jul 29, 2016 |
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Jul 29, 2016 15:49
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SmellOfPetroleum posted:Company A gave me an offer! Hurrah! Ask company A for more time and tell company B that you need a response asap because you have an offer from another company but would prefer them. You can pretty much give any reason to A but a common one is that you need to discuss it with your family.
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Aug 27, 2016 20:13
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Total compensation has been calculated differently by all three companies I've worked at. The first pretty much didn't calculate it, the second included everything (insurance, 401k match, vacation, etc), and the third calculates it as salary + bonus + equity. The second companies method seems the most useful, but some benefits are not easily quantifiable such as health insurance so even with that you'd have a hard time comparing between companies.
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Sep 30, 2016 23:06
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You need to sell why the EMBA is more efficient and worth $36k to them. The proposal you wrote doesn't do that and in fact sounds really odd that you've finished an 1/8 of the degree and are just now realizing that it's more efficient. Also, don't put quotes around your day job, I wouldnt even call it a day job. I wouldn't offer alternatives that lower the cost to the hospital as it's self defeating.
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Oct 13, 2016 22:52
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CarForumPoster posted:My chief engineer shot down me moving saying I was critical to the program. My current group manager was slightly annoyed as they were trying to get a promotion for me already through the convoluted mess and don't like that continuing to do that looks like they're responding to me making a threat. Negotiating subverted :/ I realize this it too late for you, but for everyone else. Threatening to leave for an internal position will backfire on you in 90%+ of companies as your manager can block the transfer, has no reason to give you anything and will probably take it personally. Pretty much the only time it works is if they can't and for the same reason as an external offer I would generically recommend against taking a counter offer. As someone else said, you should leave.
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Nov 12, 2016 05:17
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It sounds to me like you got screwed and are trying to convince yourself that you didn't and thus don't need to leave. Your list of reasons to stay isn't very persuasive as you could potentially get everything you are getting and more at another company and this is ignoring that your manager torpedoed a transfer and promotion and also appears to have reduced the possibility that he'll promote you. Finally you being critical isn't your loving problem. I doubt you are, but if you were then the company should be compensating you accordingly and if an offer to transfer is compelling then they aren't and you should leave.
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Nov 21, 2016 04:42
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William Munny posted:So I'm posting this for my g/f relating to a pay increase discussion that should be happening March. She currently makes 15.25/hr with an hour minimum of 44 and a hour maximum of 47.5 hours per week. She's been with her company 1yr on 1/4 with 9 months in a different role. When she left her old position she was making more as she was required to work 50-60 hours a week at the same hourly rate, so she was doing a lot more overtime. Her current position is less stressful, but obviously pays less so she was hoping to get an increase to at least her old pay if not more. The only compelling argument here is based on performace. If she can show that she performs better than someone that is paid more then she has a chance to get a raise to at least what that person is making. I think it's highly unlikely that she gets an increase that makes her the highest paid in the division though as she's only been there three months and 20% is a huge increase. This is all entirely dependent on the boss being able and willing to fight for her as he's probably going to get pushback. She's basically negotiating at the wrong time as she had BATNA when she accepted the job and switched roles. As a side note, I would not bring up the difference in pay between the current role and the role with overtime as you can't compare a role that works more hours to one that doesn't.
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Jan 1, 2017 19:20
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Hughlander posted:Looks like this was well timed. I was catching up on the thread with the intent to post this: I don't think that adage works even at 10% - 15% as that's still a substantial amount of your total compensation. It's a risk though so you have to discount the value based on your expectation of receiving it. I think the same thing applies to a cliff in an equity grants, reduce the value by the chance you won't receive it which should hopefully be pretty low. I'm not certain what you're talking about with starting over within RSUs other than the cliff. You have a total compensation number and I'm assuming you would take a new job if they offered a lower total comp number unless you're leaving for reasons other than money. As a note my perspective is from an individual contributor that receives a fairly large bonus and RSUs if that matters.
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Jan 30, 2017 05:39
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Caustic posted:Thanks to this thread, I managed to NOT reveal my salary requirements for an initial call with a recruiter. I held firm until the recruiter eventually revealed their own target salary number. I told the recruiter I wanted to learn more about the position before I talked more about salary. Since then I've been proceeding along in the interview process with the hiring manager and have inside word that I'm a top candidate and am pretty sure an offer is forthcoming. I would start by asking for 15% - 20% more without revealing your salary and if needed for leverage then reveal it. Try to steer the conversation away from total compensation as that comparison is not favorable to you. You can make the argument about take home pay or something similar.
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Feb 15, 2017 22:57
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Gin_Rummy posted:Alright, just got my official offer after reviewing the benefits over the last few days. When I last spoke to the recruiter she said that the way they make offers is by weighing past experience, education, etc and then making what they consider to be a final number. She made it a point to say that "there won't really be much negotiation from this number." Signing bonuses are generally easier to negotiate than salary as they're a one time payment, but if they've already said no to relocation I don't know how much luck you'll have. Generally the worst that can happen is they'll say no.
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Mar 29, 2017 00:40
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If they gave you a range in an interview and then an offer below that range I would definitely come back with an ask within the range.
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Apr 11, 2017 22:49
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bolind posted:We have very little inflation in my locale currently - about 1%. He's trying to set expectations though his way of communicating it was pretty bad. Advice here is going to have to be company specific. I'd say in general your raise is tied to your performance review and there is probably very little leeway for your manager without pulling the money from someone else on the team. Also based on the conversation snippet it sounds like he already knows what you're going to get.
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Jun 7, 2017 17:13
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Johnny Truant posted:So what's the best way to delay definitively accepting a position? Ask for time to consider it and drag out negotiations. At the same time tell the company that you have an offer and that will speed up their timeline.
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Jul 18, 2017 23:17
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tesilential posted:This thread has excellent advise, but is extremely risk adverse with regards to counter offers. They want you to stay because you leaving makes their life more difficult. This doesn't mean they want you to stay long term or won't hold it against you for being 'disloyal'. There are exceptions, but in general the generic position should be no as it's a bad sign that you had to go find another job to get a justified raise and is almost certainly going to come up again.
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Jul 19, 2017 17:45
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Either highest or lowest with the caveat that if you really want the job you may want to change to selecting the highest reasonable range for the position.
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Jul 27, 2017 20:43
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I don't agree with the above posters. Negotiation isn't a single step process and if you've been open about interviewing at multiple companies then it shouldn't be a surprise that you received a higher offer from another company and want them to match or exceed it.
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Aug 1, 2017 19:02
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Ask for like 5% over their max and align the what do you make to be 20% - 25% under that.
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Sep 3, 2017 21:06
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Yeonik posted:I have some questions about calculating total compensation. How should I value vacation/sick time? Should I put a number on it, or is it kinda separate when talking about the whole package? If I get 2 weeks right now and somebody offers me 3 weeks, is there a price value on that, or does it strictly come down to personal preference? You can calculate the value of vacation and holiday as there are 2080 working hours in a year, however there is a personal valuation component as most employers won’t allow you to take more and won’t payout if you take less. I would value overtime as a function of how much your paid minus how much you value that time as you’re giving the company more time that you could use elsewhere in exchange for higher pay. I’d probably also add a risk factor if you’re comparing jobs as overtime generally is not guaranteed. A simplistic valuation of a pension would be to value it at what you’d have to save to match it. You’re probably going to have to make a ton of assumptions, but that should at least give you a ballpark figure.
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Oct 14, 2017 07:50
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Ultimate Mango posted:That’s good perspective. I honestly hadn’t considered it that way. Why can't you just tell the potential employee the range you're willing to pay and let them decide if they want to move forward in the process? Employers already hold most of the cards in a salary negotiation. They know how much they pay similar positions, have market research for similar positions externally, and know the expected value of the employee. Given that they should have all the information they need to adequately price the position I don't see a reason to allow them to strongarm people into giving up their current salary so they can underpay them.
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Jan 9, 2018 10:21
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sim posted:Well, I chickened out and lowered my ask to $160K. They countered with $155K but lowered the stock options from 1,000 shares to just 100 (currently valued at $6/share). So overall that's about $10K below what I asked for and significantly lowers my upside. Of course they talk big about potentially growing from a Director of Engineering to VP and associated salary/equity increases in the future, but much like private stock I don't put much value in that. Maybe I'm.missing something, but what's the point of taking on all the risks a startup entails if you aren't going to be rewarded when it succeeds. That amount of options is insultingly low for pretty much any position.
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Mar 28, 2018 20:55
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SEKCobra posted:I'm going for an interview for a job I don't really intend to take. I am fairly sure that they will never offer (significantly) more than the publically posted salary, which is way below what I make now. I want to be upfront about the fact that I have no interest in the job if they don't match my current pay, but obviously I don't want to give that. You could just ask for what you want upfront. If you're way above the posted salary you're going to have to do so at some point. The only downside to this is you don't have the impression, hopefully good, from the interview backing your ask.
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May 5, 2018 00:14
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I would put zero over doubling a value you'd accept. Zero is likely to be interpreted as I don't want to say while double may be excluded cause they set a cap.
asur fucked around with this message at 04:42 on May 11, 2018 |
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May 11, 2018 04:29
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Something Offal posted:I love that your clipboard snippet got caught in this post I think. I bet because ctrl+v is next to ctrl+b. Were you buying something (hard drugs) from Craigslist? There are a ton of stipulations around matching to prevent companies from giving more money to management. I don't know if the match percentage is controlled, but there are tests around actual deferral, contribution, and top heaviness of the plan that effectively mean no employer is going to touch matching percentages.
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Oct 16, 2018 17:45
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The new company sounds like it better aligns with your goals specifically with education assistance which is at least $5k in year two. Ask for 37k+ from the new company and leave regardless. It also sounds more stable. If you stay, do not train a replacement. Doing so will put you in a pretty bad spot if they need to get rid of people due to lack of clients, etc. asur fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Oct 18, 2018 |
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Oct 18, 2018 16:40
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Why are you considering staying at a company that knew they were underpaying you and wouldn't give you either the raise or title equivalent to your responsibilities? They've clearly demonstrated that they have zero loyalty to you and are only giving you an increase now because it hurts them if they dont. Stop being loyal to them for no reason and go with the company that is willing to pay you what you're worth and with a manager who appears to actually care about your personal development. Just to be clear, if you want to stay for the extra 5k then that's one thing, but your posts are conveying that you feel guilty for leaving because they can't replace you and gently caress that. That's not your problem and you shouldn't feel bad about leaving, that's on them. asur fucked around with this message at 16:57 on Oct 18, 2018 |
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Oct 18, 2018 16:53
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teardrop posted:I've been a QC Chemist (MSc) for 7 years at a large company. Looking for a new job because my manager won't promote me yet will never let me go to another department either. Just started interviewing and my first few interviews have gone very well. Really appreciate all advice, because I have never negotiated before. If any of this would change your decision to take the job you should get it in writing in the offer letter. It should be specific on both the criteria for promotion and the increase in pay. Verbal promises might happen, but it's very easy for either party to have a different interpretation on what was said, forget, or just straight up lie about it. For salary specifically, getting it written down should require that it go through the same channels and approvals that would be required when you get promoted. This should help nail down what you get and limits the potential for the any sort of confusion.
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Oct 25, 2018 03:27
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teardrop posted:How can I specify promotion criteria, when my “readiness” is a matter of their opinion? Saying “if satisfactory” waters it down a lot but I don’t know what else to say. And if I wasn’t satisfactory, they could fire me the day before promotion even if everything was written in stone. If they have a specific annual review system you could use that. In most it's rare that you get below average unless you're in the process of being fired. Another option would be the promotion is automatic upon completion of the training. At the end of the day if they want to screw you they can, but having things in writing requires that mutliple parties be onboard, HR, the guy above whoever is promising you this, etc. It also reduces the possibility of misunderstandings. asur fucked around with this message at 04:35 on Oct 25, 2018 |
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Oct 25, 2018 04:32
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If you have the 30% in writing I'd just take that. It sounds like if you try to leverage that number for the other position that it might decrease instead of the other position increasing.
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Oct 26, 2018 21:22
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I would always start with clarifying the offer and then saying you need to discuss it with your family. It not only allows you time to think, but changes the dynamic as now the decision maker is someone the company doesn't have direct access to which removes most pressure tactics.
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Oct 27, 2018 19:43
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Sock The Great posted:This could be the wrong thread, but since PTO keeps coming up I think this question is relevant. A large fortune 500 corporation I worked for mandated taking PTO, or unpaid if you didn't have any left, for the week of Christmas except for Christmas day. They gave a years notice though.
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Nov 19, 2018 18:17
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There is no way that company lets you take six months off and I'd be very surprised if you got your PTO paid out when they fire you.
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Nov 20, 2018 03:03
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SEKCobra posted:Since my current job, which has decent work/life balance and a great commute keeps restructuring (and my manager is being replaced by an as of yet undetermined outsider) I started considering a move. I am also underpaid for what I do by quite some margin, and they keep putting off any customary negotiation opportunity. I am now interviewing for a job that has my 'want' price as the absolute minimum, but a somewhat shittier commute (gotta pass a backed up bridge at rush hour every day). I'd consider the total time as your workday and evaluate based on that at minimum. Commutes are terrible and I wouldn't go over 15 minutes now though I've done 45 in the past.
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Dec 19, 2018 16:54
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I would wear a step above what managers wear for an interview, so probably slacks, collared shirt, and a jacket. On compensation, use the 95k to gague where you should end up. If you'd have more responsibilities then shoot higher.
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Jan 16, 2019 06:02
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Comrade Gritty posted:I'm in a fairly strong position, and trying to double check my plan for the best way to leverage that. Do you just want a higher salary but the same total comp? That seems like a waste of time to me. I'd ask for higher on both TC and salary.
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Jan 25, 2019 18:22
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Comrade Gritty posted:Sorry, no I meant to mention the current compensation to anchor the discussion that they'd need to be above that to make it worthwhile to leave my current position, to make sure that they don't come in under my current compensation. Anchor to what you want, not where you are at. You can always bring your current company into the discussion later, but once you mention it they know they only need to beat that number.
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Jan 25, 2019 19:30
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