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Are there any good statistical post-mortem analyses that break down the catastrophic electoral implosion that happened yesterday? I assume they've got to be coming soon if there aren't any yet.
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Nov 9, 2016 16:45
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NYT breakdown of the exit polling: http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/11/08/us/politics/election-exit-polls.html?smid=fb-nytimes&smtyp=cur White college grads broke in favor of Trump 45%/49%. How.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:42
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Looking back at Obama's success, it's obvious that democrats need to run candidates that can successfully appeal to liberals on issues of both race and class. If dems can't deliver on both, they're truly sunk.
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Nov 9, 2016 17:52
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I have a dim, vain hope that the sheer backlash from a ruinous four years of the Trump administration will bring a wave election in 2020 that will allow democrats a shot at favorable redistricting.
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Nov 9, 2016 18:09
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it's almost like you can't win as a democrat without inspiring voter trust on issues of both race AND class a profound revelation
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Nov 10, 2016 00:39
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Why are issues of race and class mutually exclusive Why does this thread always go around and around, insisting there can only be room for good opinions on either social politics or economic politics, but not both Why
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Nov 10, 2016 14:19
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Make this the thread title pls:Squashing Machine posted:Saying "we needed to offer the white voters who went with Obama in the previous elections an incentive to come out for Hillary" is not the same as saying "we need to make nice with racists." Squashing Machine posted:Saying "we needed to offer the white voters who went with Obama in the previous elections an incentive to come out for Hillary" is not the same as saying "we need to make nice with racists." Squashing Machine posted:Saying "we needed to offer the white voters who went with Obama in the previous elections an incentive to come out for Hillary" is not the same as saying "we need to make nice with racists."
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Nov 10, 2016 20:04
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The democrats will have a perfect opportunity to frame the 2020 presidential election as "fake populist vs. real populist" if they play their cards correctly. Trump ain't gonna do poo poo for working class people with the GOP in all three branches.
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Nov 11, 2016 18:02
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Thoughts about Hillary Clinton and white working class voters, from a working class white male who lives in rural PA: Back in 2008, in addition to being really charismatic, campaign Obama also talked a big game about economic issues, and he did his due diligence to try and win over working class whites outside of the major cities. I remember when he came to my lovely little Pennsylvanian rustbelt hometown (which has voted straight republican for decades) in '08 and gave a speech and talked to people. It was great. The town didn't flip to Obama on election day - but he shaved off about 15% from the usual republican lead there and didn't get completely blown away in the vote tally. And Obama won the state very comfortably in part due to his efforts to try to sell the party platform in places like my hometown in a way that working class white people would like and understand. He legitimately tried, and most importantly, Obama came across as being genuine. The bottom line was that Obama had a kind of credibility that Hillary simply couldn't achieve, for whatever reasons. Working class whites were suffering under the status quo, and Obama was giving them a real sense of hope and "yes we can" and talking about new bold ideas that he was going to fight for. To those same people in 2016, Hillary represented nothing but the status quo, and lots of them stayed home. And she lost PA. I personally still went out and voted for Clinton, pls don't burn me alive In my view, democrats do not need to reinvent the wheel or switch to being the party of Full Communism Now (although going a bit further left wouldn't hurt - blue dog democrats giving us stuff like the ACA over something more bold loving hurt us, imo), nor do they need to hush up about minority issues one bit. They just need to improve on 1) Communicating the merits of the party platform to white working class people, and 2) Building and maintaining trustworthiness and credibility concerning economic issues. Obama had this stuff down pat. Build relations with working class whites like Obama did. That's it.
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Nov 12, 2016 18:30
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Main Paineframe posted:Doesn't this just boil down to "if your party's been in office for eight years and the economy still sucks everyone will vote for the other guy"? I mean, McCain had an economic message too but for some reason no one really bought it. There wasn't really anything stopping Clinton from batting for the fences in her rhetoric, and talking about taking back the house and pushing through all the various things in the platform that really would have been a substantial improvement over the status quo. All the stuff Obama wanted, but couldn't get through. Democrats in 2016 were too concerned with being realistic and thinking too small, imo. Trump promised them the loving world, and they voted for him because of it. Why wasn't Clinton talking a big game too? She would still look downright reasonable next to the insanity of Donald J. Trump and his loving border wall and all the rest. It doesn't matter that the odds were stacked against her in Congress. Tell people "yes we can" again. UV_Catastrophe fucked around with this message at 18:58 on Nov 12, 2016 |
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Nov 12, 2016 18:55
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Democrats won't be able to even sniff the reins of power unless they can satisfy voters on both social issues and economic issues. Don't you worry about democrats with the Wrong Opinion coming to dominate the party. The party will continue to hold 0 power until they find candidates that unite the entire coalition. Until then, we can enjoy Trump.
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Nov 12, 2016 19:27
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People need to chill the gently caress out. Everybody will heard and represented within the party. Mostly because there's nowhere near enough votes without any one of the major voting blocs. Both sides have a big, red veto button here.
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Nov 12, 2016 20:11
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:I don't think you can push economic reforms and have the message be believed by poor whites without racism attached to it. I think it was Trump's fairly open racism that convinced those voters that he was genuine and that he really meant it when he said that he would bring the jobs back. I mean, I hope I'm wrong but that's the way I see it. Dems can push economic reform as a part of their platform but I don't think those poor, rust belt whites will be swayed away from economic populism plus racism by economic populism plus equality. Poor whites believed in Obama's economic message to a large enough extent that it put him in the White House. No reason we can't make it happen again. These people didn't vote for Trump, even with his racism. They just stayed home. UV_Catastrophe fucked around with this message at 20:18 on Nov 12, 2016 |
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Nov 12, 2016 20:15
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AVeryLargeRadish posted:Who ran against Obama with the message of economic reform plus extremely open racism? Obama ran against an ancient Washington insider & war vet and a technocratic corporate CEO, the latter of which is exactly the sort of shithead who shipped away all the jobs in the rust belt. You really are not making a valid comparison. Pre-Trump republicans were plenty racist, although they preferred the dog whistle. The most telling detail is that the former Obama-voting white working class chose to stay home - they didn't vote Trump. They were simply left cold by Hillary.
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Nov 12, 2016 20:28
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From reading USPOL over past few days, it's incredibly apparent that lots of people within the social/economic factions of the democratic coalition do not trust one another one bit. It is blindingly obvious that the only way forward is to put up leadership that is able to gain trust simultaneously from both sides.
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Nov 14, 2016 17:15
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1-800-DOCTORB posted:I guess Vince McMahon's murderer goes free.  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1lfhNju084&t=94s
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Nov 15, 2016 06:01
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Dead Cosmonaut posted:I'll show those liberals! This is exactly right. Bernie and senate dems are not going to go along with any Trump/GOP legislation, people need to calm down.
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Nov 17, 2016 20:54
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Furnaceface posted:Call me crazy but I think jettisoning Sanders would probably make the Dems even more unelectable. He is taking a huge gamble on Trump falling face first on his promises to the poor and disenfranchised while reinforcing his commitments to stand up to wall street and put people back to work via government spending. Being that the good old GOP controls Congress independently of Donald, I am extremely confident that exactly nothing will be passed which will help the poor whatsoever.
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Nov 17, 2016 21:00
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lol if you think the current GOP will ever, under any circumstances, back something like student loan forgiveness
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Nov 17, 2016 21:09
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Trabisnikof posted:If they use federal education funds to pay the banks off for 100% of the value, that's a win for the banks and an excuse to cut education funding for real programs while being smug about not cutting a dime of education funding. Yeah, that's fair. I guess the question is whether or not they're smart and disciplined enough to do things like this. I could see the freedom caucus people trying to torpedo legislation like this to try and score points with republican primary voters who think it sounds just too darn liberal. Similar to how the tea party faction snatched defeat from the jaws of victory after rejecting an offer that included social security cuts during the debt ceiling thing. Who knows 
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Nov 17, 2016 21:20
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american history's greatest socialist hero, Donald J. Trump
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Nov 17, 2016 21:29
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The truth is that everyone's real scared right now, and nobody trusts anybody to actually stand up for what's right. Distrust among democrats is running real deep.
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Nov 17, 2016 21:41
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New vote-winning dem policy proposal for 2020: literally bulldoze rural america
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Nov 22, 2016 19:31
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The thread spends a lot of time talking about re-organizing the democratic party, but I'm increasingly not even hopeful for a time when democrats retake the government. If we've learned anything from the past 8 years, it's that republicans will do everything they can to sabotage and obstruct while they're the opposition party, then get rewarded for it, and then put a wrecking ball through anything that democrats may have achieved after conservatives recapture the government. Republicans have apparently mastered the art of taking credit for any and all failures of government as proof that their ideology is correct and that further republican government is needed. Even if Trump is a total disaster, and dems retake the presidency in 2020, the republicans will simply return to their obstruction strategy. They'll successfully achieve their goals of crippling government during the periods when they have power, and then continue to hold democrats back from meaningfully improving the situation while they're in the role of the opposition party. Over the long term, they'll achieve their goals and successfully prevent/roll back progressive change. I don't see how we break out of this depressing cycle without some kind of massive systemic change that I just don't see coming.
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Nov 22, 2016 20:37
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Condiv posted:it would be really cool for once to see dems who acted like they weren't interested in economic or social justice, but once they got power passed the most progressive policies ever. kinda like an inverse scott walker that promises to deport tons of immigrants but then opens the borders and implements mincome Ladies and gentlemen, it's time for...dog-whistle equality.
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Nov 22, 2016 23:56
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Is there any good news lately? Every single thing tangentially related to politics has been a swirling vortex of despair and doom since Nov 8. Literally everything seems to be burning down around us.
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Nov 24, 2016 18:04
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Does anyone have any national statistics from this election that could be put into a nice visual format to illustrate "Number of people who voted Democrat vs. Republican" on one chart, and "Number of government seats that went to Democrats vs. Republicans" on another chart right beside it? I have a feeling that data might tell quite a loving story.
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Nov 26, 2016 18:38
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truly, this election is proof that overt bigotry within the hearts of millions can vanquish the forces of money and corruption  god bless america
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Nov 26, 2016 20:20
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MattD1zzl3 posted:Youre all about diversity until its working against you. Not to say the current EC is perfect, but i dont want my president creating her whole platform for NY, CHI and LA and saying "everyone else can suck it". Instead, the candidate who panders to the less populous rural states wins lmao
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Nov 26, 2016 20:44
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The Chinese government has a national parliamentary body with like 3000 representatives, so it's not impossible to do e: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_People%27s_Congress
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Nov 26, 2016 22:07
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readingatwork posted:Not sure if it's been talked about yet but apparently the top 0.1% of American households now hold the same amount of wealth as the bottom 90%.  The next big financial crash is going to be spectacular, I bet 
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Nov 30, 2016 04:33
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:it is entirely possible that the reincarnation of FDR is not in this country and instead we get a reichstag fire I've been wondering lately what the best tactics for survival were for somebody living through massive economic depression and fascism. No reason, really. Just wondering.
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Nov 30, 2016 04:40
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http://www.nytimes.com/2016/11/29/world/americas/western-liberal-democracy.html 
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Nov 30, 2016 05:07
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USPOL December: Full Nihilism Now
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Nov 30, 2016 06:14
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| # ¿ May 16, 2024 10:20 |
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Obama's been playing a careful game of chess for the past eight years while the GOP has been busy sawing the legs off the table, not giving a single gently caress.
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Dec 1, 2016 04:55
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