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What do we know about Duckworth and why should we hate her?
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Nov 12, 2016 18:15
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Groovelord Neato posted:you don't seem to grasp that sanders would have won. and pretty easily. that's why these moves are occurring. Actually he would have lost badly
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Nov 12, 2016 18:43
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Trying to appeal to disaffected republicans was a mistake from the get-go, especially with Hillary Clinton. If you have evangelicals voting by 50 point margins for a thrice married sexual predator just because of his (R), there's no reason to believe actual issues could change a dedicated republican's mind. Sanders as VP would have been a much better idea. Or maybe some dark horse populist from one of the states she lost, but that'd require way more hindsight than literally anyone had prior to Wednesday morning.
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Nov 12, 2016 19:04
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Groovelord Neato posted:how can you be sarcastic or smug when you just loving lost. and people told you we had a winning candidate way before. Sanders has been in Washington for just as long as Clinton and yet accomplished less. His history puts him squarely into "literal communist" territory. He is a Jew in a pro-racism election whose closing argument consisted of "these global interests are bleeding you dry!" to shots of Jews. He would have lost the populist message to Trump easily while bring out an even lower share of black voters than Clinton.
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Nov 12, 2016 19:50
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Cerebral Bore posted:Yes, I suppose this is why he was crushing Trump in the polls. Thanks for your received wisdom, duder. Theoretical matchup polls are useless, everyone loves someone that isn't actually running for president. e: do you think the people in those polls knew about his soviet honeymoon? Or his pro-rape essays? You better believe they'd know about that stuff if he were in the general. Plus I'm sure the Russians had all sorts of files they could leak.
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Nov 12, 2016 20:01
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So who's charismatic and young that can be trotted out now regardless of how poo poo their policies actually are?
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Nov 12, 2016 20:33
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MiddleOne posted:You do realize that in two months the sitting president will be someone who has not only confessed to sexual assault on tape but that is also possibly a rapist? Trump's actions are irrelevant, nothing he did mattered and he was a unique case. Clinton's Deplorables comment was more damaging long term than his on-tape admission of sexual assault. Bernie's poo poo would have mattered because he didn't have the Trump immunity bubble. It's the same reason Biden would still be considered foot-in-mouth gaffetronic 5000 if he had run, in spite of Trump being the same way.
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Nov 13, 2016 00:17
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theflyingorc posted:she specifically did that during one of the debates yeah it took her forever to just swallow her pride and say "yep what I did was wrong" without having to add "but seriously this isn't that big of a deal" to the end of it.
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Dec 1, 2016 16:34
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override367 posted:But she *did* carry multiple devices around, that was another lie she told to justify her fuckup lol At any given moment she had a blackberry and an ipad. She went through multiple blackberries because they keep coming out with new models. An ipad is not something you keep in your pocket. Claiming that having a smartphone and a tablet as "having multiple mobile devices" and therefore contradictory to wanting to keep one device on your person at all times doesn't reflect the reality of technology.
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Dec 1, 2016 16:36
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Vince for president because he's clearly way better at selling things.
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Dec 2, 2016 20:56
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I could see Sanders winning the white voters that Clinton took for granted, but whose to say he wouldn't lose the black voters that didn't like him in the primaries and would take THAT vote for granted and lose?
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Dec 5, 2016 21:51
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Kilroy posted:Good lord, Pelosi's even worse than I thought. Why the gently caress is this idiot in charge still The only person that ran against her was Joe Lieberman 2.0, would you have preferred that?
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Dec 12, 2016 20:06
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Kilroy posted:Pelosi herself should have resigned; you have no business leading a party after suffering defeat after defeat like this. The fact that she ran, that no one seemed to have a problem with her running, and that she in fact won handily, speaks to a disease in the Democratic leadership that is likely not curable. She's not the DNC chair. What's wrong with her specifically? She seems to be reasonably leftist, keeps her caucus voting correctly, and does a superb job gumming up congress as much as the house is capable of being gummed up.
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Dec 12, 2016 20:15
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Maybe we could set up a Oujia board in Lenin's tomb to run the DNC?
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Dec 12, 2016 20:25
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Maybe Obama would have lost to Trump, too, since he didn't do poo poo in WI/MI either during his campaigns.
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Dec 12, 2016 22:40
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Mister Fister posted:He voted FOR bailing out the auto industry in a separate bill, however TARP was used to bail out the auto industry and he voted against TARP because the majority of the money was used to bailout banks. I'm sure this nuance would be easily messaged. Maybe he should say "He was for the bailouts before he was against it"
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Dec 12, 2016 22:53
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A Wizard of Goatse posted:Obama energized huge demographics that lean D but generally don't turn up to vote like no other candidate in recent history; he was the first Presidential candidate (if not President) for progressives since Carter and the first Presidential candidate for black voters ever. Yet Clinton may eclipse his vote total for 2012.
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Dec 12, 2016 22:57
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theflyingorc posted:Out of all the things charged against Clinton, it seemed to get the least traction. Mainly because black voters aren't idiots and are well aware that this was only brought up to concern troll about how democrats are the real racists. The crime bill was a mistake, but the situations in the 90s were very rough and they got credit in the community for at least trying, and then owning up to the mistake.
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Dec 13, 2016 05:34
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Shageletic posted:
Millennials got their candidate in 08 and 12, and didn't in 16, so they took their ball and went home. This election has made me rethink a lot of millennial hit-pieces that I once dismissed.
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Dec 13, 2016 17:31
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Dead Cosmonaut posted:In many ways Obama, not Bernie Sanders, was most responsible for progressivism becoming a thing in the Democratic Party. Mostly because very few people knew who Bernie Sanders was until about January of the current year.
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Dec 13, 2016 17:53
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Fiction posted:The only thing making me "dispassionate" about politics are the useless milquetoast liberals (clinton huffers) dragging us all down into the Trump cavern by way of utter political ineptitude. What type of primary process would allow you to support the eventual winning candidate, assuming it isn't your first choice?
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Dec 13, 2016 17:58
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Who exactly could have run to compete with Clinton, that didn't, because the DNC "cleared the way"? Also, claiming that her massive vote advantage was just "rigging" minimizes the massive minority support she received, because it implies their votes didn't matter.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:04
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Radish posted:"I mean we have no choice but to nominate this 70 year old that is hated more than anyone in the world by the other party, has twenty years of character assassination against her, and is under a potential FBI investigation. There's literally no one else we can try." A political party that is serious about running a candidate for President. So, who was prevented from running as an alternative? It's not like there weren't primary elections.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:12
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daydrinking is fun posted:Ugh you lefties need to nut up and vote for this uninspiring candidate that will continue to hold Chelsea Manning in foreverjail, support the Saudis while they obliterate starving peasants with our missiles, etc etc So now you have all that plus an AG who thinks weed is worse than the Klan.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:23
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daydrinking is fun posted:When given those two options, most people on the left aren't going to vote for someone who is 12% less terrible, they're going to stay home. If you don't play ball with them, you're going to keep losing. Yet True Believer conservatives don't have this issue, which is why we lose. They're willing to hold their nose when they don't get their way, instead of running for the fire escape and then barring the exit.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:26
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daydrinking is fun posted:They sure do. Now, back to what we were talking about; you need to reach out to the left or they won't vote for you. What reaching out is required? It seems the only option to get the left back this year was to declare Black primary voters worth 3/5ths and readjust the primary so that St. Bernard was victorious.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:29
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A Buttery Pastry posted:Considering the difference in ideology between Hillary and leftists, the equivalent of voting for her as a leftist is conservatives voting for a Republican who gets paid by LGBT organizations and Iran to hold speeches for abortion doctors, where he tells them he thinks abortion doctors should be the ones making abortion laws. His husband would of course be a former president that had signed a major crime bill that decriminalized drugs and instituted a great drug rehabilitation program. Small government religious conservatives voted for an areligious philander who ran on a platform of tariffs and being best buds with Russia, so... in spite of your amazing strawmanning of Clinton's positions, you're kinda right. They did vote for that type of person.
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Dec 13, 2016 18:46
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mcmagic posted:Pretty much that. Also relying too much on Clinton running up the primary score in states democrats had no chance of winning in the general and doing horribly in the states that ended up costing her the election. It's pretty annoying how those black people that liked her don't live in the correct states but were allowed to vote regardless and derail St. Bernard.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:14
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coathat posted:Well no Hillary supporter would think ill of bombing Iran. Yes, Hillary Clinton, supporter of the Iran Nuclear Deal, was the real war monger running for president.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:19
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KomradeX posted:Hiliary Clinton cared so much about Black people that she gave Mike "Stop and Frisk" Bloomberg a prime time speaking slot at the loving convention! Or how she was so embracing of BLM and talking about how we need pumice reform or talked about the constant shame that is the Flint water crisis. Or how she came to the defence of the Native protesters at the DAPL. Yup that was quite a social justice campaign she ran So are you saying black people were just too ignorant of the issues to know how to vote right? Anyway, they had the moms of a half-dozen black men that were lynched by the police speak at the convention, so there's that.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:24
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Radish posted:You'll see. After four years of Trump moderate Republicans will be itching to vote for Corey Booker in 2020 instead of falling in line like they do every year. I fully expect the 2020 dem platform to call for a complete legalization of weed, free college, and medicare for all and this forum will find a reason to hate the candidate (if it is anyone other than the one supported in the primaries) because ~reasons~ SimonCat posted:Considering her Syria policy seemed tailored to provoking a war with the Russians, yes, she was the real war monger running for president. I, too, form my opinions on Hillary Clinton's policies from Breitbart.com, am also a committed leftist. KomradeX posted:No, I'm calling bullshit on your insistence that Hiliary was beloved by black people. That I know plenty of black people that hated her for poo poo like "super predators" and didn't believe an ounce of the words she said on anything. And me, as the white guy trying to get them to vote for her anyway, repeating the same arguments I heard all summer from people like you on why they should support her feel on deaf ears. Maybe the take away is maybe she should have actually ran on social justice instead of trying to appeal to loving Republicans! When Democrats try and get Republicans to vote for them, the Republicans still vote republican and DEMOCRATS STAY HOME BECAUSE THEY DON'T WANT TO VOTE FOR REPUBLICANS! Will you loving get that all goddamn ready. Counterpoint to your anecdote: she won more black votes than any other white person in history.
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Dec 13, 2016 20:52
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Really it's a lot like the 1980 election where the republican sells snake oil and feel good promises, except this time the democrat didn't even try to offer a heartfelt message of struggle and perseverance for the greater good.
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Dec 13, 2016 21:33
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mcmagic posted:That turnout in the primary had no effect on the general. That is just a fact. Which states should be allowed to vote in the primary? Or should we include some sort of fraction modifier to correct for people living incorrectly?
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Dec 13, 2016 22:49
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Jesus, that article. It's somehow worse than the Romney ORCA-related post-mortems.
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Dec 14, 2016 16:48
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Radish posted:Considering how he treated the Russian interference issue before the election he isn't blameless. Honestly I don't think those two are going to want to be in the same room for a long time. Also, appointing J. Edgar Comey in a spirit of bipartisanship. To be honest the right weren't wrong when they screamed about Obama's naivete in 2008.
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Dec 14, 2016 17:27
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Maybe Obama isn't a pussy and he actually is just a centrist who's happy with how things turned out.
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Dec 14, 2016 17:48
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:Ellison doesn't have the 20 years of baggage that Hillary had even before the hacks started. 20 years ago was the 90s, when Ellison was Farrakhan's buddy.
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Dec 15, 2016 06:28
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Square this circle: Clinton was a horrible campaigner and candidate who didn't know poo poo about poo poo. She also beat Sanders handily. How does this imply Sanders would be a better campaigner?Cerebral Bore posted:Bernie had people loving lit, much like Trump fired up his own supporters. And guess how people who are super motivated about their candidate react when somebody tries to tell them that this figure they've invested so much into is actually bad? Except Trump's voters actually voted for him, instead of deciding to show up late to caucuses to get that last bowl in and then started throwing chairs and c-words.
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Dec 15, 2016 15:56
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MiddleOne posted:She won due to institutional inertia, not good campaigning. That and the millions upon millions of minority voters.
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Dec 15, 2016 15:59
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NewForumSoftware posted:Notably in states she had no chance of winning in the general. So their votes don't count? You realize they're stuck in those states because, even 150 years later, the lasting effects of slavery, right? Maybe we should just have the primary consist of voters in the rust belt with evergreen-shaped family trees, so we can finally get a winning candidate again. Also maybe include posters of a dead comedy forum. It seems we're concentration on a very specific subset of voters that cost us the election this time, while ignoring that other types of voters exist - and that an overreaction towards billy ray cletus may end up alienating them.
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Dec 15, 2016 16:07
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