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Maybe I have bad taste in movies but I really enjoyed WW. It's the first movie in a very long time where I actually cared about the characters and what happens to them. I don't know why; maybe it was the fantastic chemistry between Gadot and Pine. I wonder if part of the reason Diana withdrew from the world of man is that she saw that Steve's death was in vain. He gave his life to save London so she could stop "The War to End All Wars" yet 20 years later human kind was at it again and even more violent and evil. Never mind all the other wars, insurgencies, and militarized stand offs that marked the 20th century.
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Jun 17, 2017 01:09
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Snowman_McK posted:Well, one of the themes of the movie is that war is a bigger problem than any one man. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 02:35 on Jun 17, 2017 |
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Jun 17, 2017 02:00
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teagone posted:[edit] What was the name of town Diana and co liberated again? Was it Veldt? hooah posted:Popping in with a small, stupid question. Where/how did Diana's Amazon outfit change into her Wonder Woman one? I just saw the movie last night and it seemed like the first time we see the WW one is when she comes out of the trench, but I don't remember any mention of it previously. You also see her outfit in the streets on London. She starts to take over her hooded overcoat and Steve saying something like "What are you doing?! You're not wearing anything!" and wraps her back up and takes her to the dress shop where they meet Etta. CelticPredator posted:Steve Trevor's death is sad. I was surprised how good that relationship was.     Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 22:35 on Jun 17, 2017 |
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Jun 17, 2017 22:27
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teagone posted:Reading this and remember the scene is making me all   BravestOfTheLamps posted:That prose sucks. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 06:06 on Jun 18, 2017 |
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Jun 18, 2017 00:37
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"I can save today. You can save the world." Steeeeve!
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I'm not a comic book nerd so maybe my take is completely wrong, but the way I see it was that Diana was brought up her entire life in a warrior culture and was was taught that he people's sole purpose is to be warriors and to defend human kind so it would make sense that she enjoys battle. Superman was forced into his role as a protector of humanity in a "with great power comes great responsibility sense". His parents were scientists, not warriors. Also, I came across these posters for WW online. I don't know if the were made by Warner Bros. or fan made stuff but I thought they were pretty cool.    
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Jun 18, 2017 19:58
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DeimosRising posted:I believe you'll find his parents were farmers  Still, my overall point was that he wasn't raised as a warrior like Diana was.
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Jun 18, 2017 20:10
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Toady posted:Diana, whose name is similar to Adonai, initially appears to represent a neo Old Testament war god. As Yahweh and Zeus were storm gods, Diana inherits lightning powers. In the final battle, she embraces the New Testament view that love will save everyone, and she forms an electric cross in the sky, yet her actions are hypocritically full of bloodshed. Her superhero uniform is battle armor. Her link with humanity is a dead man whose imagery she cherishes. She leads humanity in modern-day wars for alleged humanitarian reasons. She shrugs her shoulders and accepts that mankind will do whatever it wants instead of educating humanity through character refinement (Da'at Torah). The film effectively acts as a Jewish critique of Christianity.
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Jun 19, 2017 00:46
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Equeen posted:real lovely, yeah Speaking of the script, one of the things I liked about WW was how even though she was naive and innocent to the real world she wasn't portrayed as being dumb. I find that naive characters can sometimes being annoying because their naïveté becomes stupidity and weakness. I guess that's why I like the "fish out of water" description a bit more and it doesn't carry the same implications to me when someone is described as naive or innocent. Another thing I liked was how quickly Steve stepped back and realized his role was to support Diana. There was none of the usual tropes of "I'm not going to be lead by a woman" from anyone on the team. They all quickly realized that she was an absolute badass and could handle things herself. The "terrified and aroused" line was dumb though.
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Jun 19, 2017 01:27
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But snipers would often hide in church steeples and destroying the steeple or entire church was sometimes the only way to stop them.
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Jun 19, 2017 03:33
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Schwarzwald posted:Diana is the God Killer. I'm happy to be proven wrong though. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 06:03 on Jun 19, 2017 |
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Jun 19, 2017 05:52
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BrianWilly posted:I mean I thought the woman in Jurassic World was a little one-dimensional but I'm pretty sure her nephews and Chris Pratt would notice if they were interacting with a lamp all this time.
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Jun 19, 2017 05:56
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I think the point of making the Brit the big baddie was to just reinforce the idea that all of humanity has evil inside of it. Steve says at the beginning on the island "I'm a good guy, they're the bad guys" when the Germans are landing. Later, when leaving on the boat Diana says that once she kills Ares the Germans will be free from his influence and will go back to being good again. Chief later tells her that it was Steve's people that took his people's land and left them with nothing during the last war. Maybe the good guys aren't so good after all. Also, I saw it a second time and I picked up a few spots where people talk and "deserving" and belief. When they teat is toasting around the campfire the say "may we get what we want, what we need, but never what we deserve" and on the journey to the gala when Steve is telling them about Diana and Themyscira, Chief says "I think it's true. I believe it's true." I suppose that ties into the concept of faith as all that matters is belief.
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Jun 20, 2017 00:41
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He told Diana that he had been the guiding force behind all the wars that humans have fought. He gets them to sign an armistice, not a peace treaty, that he knows cannot hold. The humans then resume fighting and are therefore in an almost eternal state of war. He said that there had never been a war before with the capability to wipe out man kind until now. It think he wants the armistice as a momentary breather so both sides can rearm themselves. He doesn't want a clear victor and loser. He wants humanity to destroy itself through attrition and the conditions brought about by war.
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Jun 20, 2017 11:51
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Well it's not like she decided to kill the other soldiers for fun. They're standing in her way of a goal, be it the liberation of the village or her pursuit of Ares. The only time she needlessly kills soldiers is at the end when she is acting out of blind rage.
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Jun 20, 2017 15:56
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Which then leads into the Cold War and all the proxy wars associated with it.
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Jun 20, 2017 16:38
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Tenzarin posted:Rambo 3 was dedicated the freedom fighters of Afghanistan.
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Jun 20, 2017 17:54
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BrianWilly posted:Another thing I liked is that when Diana sees the German army continuing to make war even after she killed Ludendorff, she doesn't immediately then think "So, it's just the Germans who are actually bad people!" but immediately associates this warmongering nature with all of mankind.
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Jun 20, 2017 20:28
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BrianWilly posted:I think that's kind of different. She thought, at that point in time, that Ares had corrupted Steve, like he did with the Germans. So then when she learns that no one had been corrupted by Ares, she immediately understands that everyone is capable of what the Germans are capable of, regardless of nationality. teagone posted:I wish someone would name and shame the execs or whoever that were confused about the No Man's Land scene and wanted it cut out of the film/replaced with something dumb. I want to revel in the schadenfreude of the internet burning them down into ash because of how goddamn stupid they were for even suggesting to remove that iconic (imo) setpiece.
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Jun 21, 2017 01:29
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Speaking of Battlefield 1 I was reading that apparently some players are complaining that it isn't fun since it just seems to be a pointless slog in the mud with no real objectives or goals. 
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Jun 21, 2017 01:33
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On the topic of WW1 the campfire scene where Diana makes the comment about "strange thunder" and Chief tells her it's German guns reminded of a story my grandparents told me. They grew up on the Eastern Front and left for North America after the war. They said that it sounded like a constant thunderstorm in the distance from the guns. They said they knew the war had ended when one day the thunder stopped and there was silence.
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Jun 21, 2017 03:42
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BrianWilly posted:Something else I liked was that the sniper Charlie was depicted with PTSD and ended up not being able to snipe people in the heat of the moment...and then the film never "fixes" him. There's no magical moment where Diana or anyone else is like "You have to believe in yourself! You can do it!" and then the guy magically regains his leet skillz and saves the day by...doing the exact same thing that enforced his trauma in the first place. edit - That was also one of the sad parts for me anyway. In BvS and the trailer for JL we see her as very stoic and you realize that over the years she seems to have lost her sunny disposition and it all started with the death of Steve. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 11:40 on Jun 21, 2017 |
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Jun 21, 2017 10:37
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spacetoaster posted:Are we allowed to talk about spoiler stuff now? Pine was originally signed for a single movie but he confirmed that he signed a multi movie deal. I don't think he escaped the explosion as it would have undermined the gravity of his actions and also the "breaking" of Diana was necessary for this story. If he was still alive then she wouldn't be the person we see in BvS and JL. Plus the official novelization I linked earlier makes it pretty clear that he died (it does a weird "psychic connection" thing between the two of them before he died and that's how she realizes what he was saying to her before he ran to the plane. I don't know the comics but someone said earlier in the thread that Artemis has reincarnated Steve before and he comes back as a different person each time but he always has the same face.
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Jun 21, 2017 16:12
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I just want Diana and Steve to be happy together. 
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Jun 21, 2017 16:34
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spacetoaster posted:Are there any comic book people like this? I mean, in comics there are a ton of people who are either immortal, or very long lived. I'd imagine it'd be pretty comical for a 90 year old guy to be trotting around town with a literal 30 year old looking goddess on his arm. I guess that ties into what the earlier person was saying about Steve being reincarnated multiple times by Artemis. Maybe she keeps bringing him back after he dies or something.
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Jun 21, 2017 17:10
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spacetoaster posted:I'd also like to think that CPT America would have stayed by what's her face til she died of old age (had he not been frozen and they got married). I wonder if he would be subject to the normal aging process. Diana is a demigodess where as Steve is "just" an enhanced human. edit - One other thing I was wondering, in BvS and in he JL trailer Diana has a different shield. It has a plain front as opposed to the "star burst" pattern in WW. This is obviously deliberate but any ideas why? Would the new shield and sword still be "made by the gods"? Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 17:51 on Jun 21, 2017 |
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Jun 21, 2017 17:32
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I missed this because I've been desensitized to the blue-orange movie poster aesthetic but it was pointed out to me that the orange on the Wonder Woman posters is Dr. Poison's gas.   
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Jun 21, 2017 19:43
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Sounds like those kids need to learn about the great darkness simmering within all of us.
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Jun 21, 2017 20:50
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Sir Kodiak posted:From what I recall, studio push back against the scene was in the drafting stage, prior to filming.
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Jun 21, 2017 21:02
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Sir Kodiak posted:Yeah, that's what I heard too. I'm not defending the executives, just clarifying that it wasn't that they were trying to cut it because they were seeing footage without music or CGI.
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Jun 21, 2017 21:22
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Snowglobe of Doom posted:A lot can happen in 100 years, anything could have happened. She's also been working in the antiquities department of at least one museum during all that so who knows what historical artifacts she would have access to. mllaneza posted:That really didn't work on film, it's one of my gripes with the third act. Continuing with the Christ role, I don't think it's a coincidence that Steve's death results in Diana being "reborn" into her divine form. She even rises up in a cruciform position. The final message of "Humans may not deserve redemption but thy are redeemable with the power of love." meshes up with stuff like John 15:12-13 “My command is this: Love each other as I have loved you. Greater love has no one than this: to lay down one’s life for one’s friends.” Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Jun 22, 2017 |
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Jun 22, 2017 03:56
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Well yeah, I mean if you find an ancient shield on an archeological dig you're probably not going to test to see if it's imbued with any magical properties. However, Diana would recognize it for what it is
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Jun 22, 2017 12:21
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BrianWilly posted:I mean...I admit, I don't really know what people actually do when they discover priceless historical relics, but I'm like ~40% sure they don't shoot them with bullets and try to chop rocks with them. 
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Jun 22, 2017 12:26
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In the movie Themyscria supposed to be located somewhere in the North Sea. That means that Steve flew his plane all the way across Europe. I don't think WW1 planes would have had the range to fly from the Ottoman Empire to the North Sea. I suppose he could have landed and refuelled while maintaining his German disguise but you'd think a message would have gone out to everyone warning of a spy dressed as a German pilot and flying a stolen German plane. As for the questions she's asking, they can all be answered by "Your preconceived notions of humankind are wrong. Yes we're capable of beautiful dreams but also horrible nightmares." and the "why" portion of that answer is pretty complicated. However, Diana is so firm in her beliefs that she really needs to be see it all for herself before it really sinks in. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 13:39 on Jun 22, 2017 |
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Jun 22, 2017 13:28
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I don't remember, the map that Steve is looking at when he's trying to use the compass, what area does it show?
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Jun 22, 2017 13:56
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I was just rewatching the Doomsday fight scene in BvS and when Lois Lane runs up after the battle to discover Superman is dead it's Diana who turns and looks at her. Diana understood.
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Jun 22, 2017 16:01
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Equeen posted:In the Ultimate edition there's an extra shot of Diana's face to further show her emphathy for Lois. I didn't pick up on it at the time other then "oh she's feels bad for her that Clark is dead" but after seeing WW it now has additional meaning. Mr. Apollo fucked around with this message at 16:47 on Jun 22, 2017 |
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Jun 22, 2017 16:42
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I've read a few reviews where people expressed disappointment that batman wasn't in the movie even as a cameo role. 
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Jun 22, 2017 18:03
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wyoming posted:Diana is literally a god, I don't think it's a big concern.
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Jun 22, 2017 18:19
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I was watching BvS: UE some more and I noticed during the Doomsday fight scene there's a part where Diana gets punched and she goes sliding along the ground and loses her shield and sword. She picks herself up and before she grabs her equipment she looks at Doomsday and has a smirking smile on her face. Almost like "Finally!" Was this something new for the Ultimate Edition or was it in the theatrical cut? A I thought it was an interesting was of enforcing the notion of her being trained as a warrior her entire life. Also, when she says the bit about "I've killed things from other worlds before" is she talking about Ares? I mean she seems to have completely disappeared after WW1 (Bruce Wayne's note to her asks "Where have you been?") so it doesn't seem like she was doing any kind of even limited intervention. I can sort of see how Aquaman, The Flash, and Cyborg were discovered by Lex since them using heir powers were all captured on camera but is there any explanation as to how he found out about Diana? The picture is the proof but without that how would he know? I'm thinking maybe it was passed down through a family of one of the squad members or villagers along with the story of her actions but her saying it was stolen seems to suggest that she had it in her possession.
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Jun 23, 2017 05:25
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VAGENDA OF MANOCIDE posted:I'm 95% sure that grin/smirk was in theatrical. I wonder if JL will give any additional insight into Luthor's motivations and how it started. There was a scene in BvS: UE where he's on the Kryptonian ship and he's communicating with one of the aliens. Maybe they guided him in the direction of the metahumans. Otherwise, like you said, Diana's file is basically just creepy stalker material and then the WW1 photo.
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Jun 23, 2017 11:52
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