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That is an extremely good thread title 
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Sep 1, 2019 00:10
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Darth Walrus posted:In this case, it's the domestic abuser getting into a relationship with someone who offers them detailed tips on how to hurt people, encourages them to do so, and then gives them a slow emotional workover for the next few decades before attempting a murder-suicide out of absolutely loving nowhere because they decided that they weren't fine with the domestic abuser having the family round after all despite repeatedly saying 'hey, we should invite your folks over'. I don't normally find things like this offputting but I will say I'm a bit leery of making extended metaphors rooted in domestic violence. (Not trying to have a go at you both, just a gentle comment) Huh. Finally found something the Tories are doing better than Labour.
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Sep 1, 2019 01:57
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OwlFancier posted:Also good luck getting new candidates if corbyn voncs you next week lol. Professional historians Paradox Interactive tell us that if Stalin didn't purge there'd be a Trot civil war 
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Sep 1, 2019 03:23
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Endjinneer posted:Newly elected MPs are dipped in a special acid bath which destroys their ability to feel any sensation other than pain. After a while they come to crave this last remaining feeling to the extent that taking the whip away becomes a punishment. Please do not imply, however obliquely, that I am a Member of Parliament.
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Sep 2, 2019 01:23
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It's a pretty bold move to be threatening to deselect people when your majority is one. Even though it's actually a little higher thanks to the one pervert that actually saw minor consequences and Hoey, Stringer, and Mann, that's a hell of a die roll. I'm not sure if Tories in Remain seats are going to appreciate being threatened this way, and if it was most people, I imagine the response would be either "Go on then" or "gently caress you, I'm DEFINITELY voting against you now!" And if someone does break ranks Boris has to either go through and deslect, meaning the government doesn't have a notional majority anymore, or not, and look (even more) pathetic.
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Sep 2, 2019 01:38
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In that case it hinges on whether and to what extent brexiteers accept that Johnson has done all he can. It's certainly going to be harder to say "Look, Johnson's not really a Brexiteer, vote for us instead." if he's trashed Parliament in pursuit of No Deal. Not that that will stop BXP necessarily, but in some respects I think this is a retread of Cameron calling the referendum in the first place; an attempt by a Tory leader to guard against being outflanked from the right. And it'll probably end just as well because this is Hell World.
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Sep 2, 2019 06:37
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Grey Hunter posted:This is a big play by Boris, and he's doing it fairly well to be honest, he knows he doesn't have a chance at the moment, and deselecting all his rebels and then replacing them with bojo loyalists is a smart move. I agree, but it's still a huge risk. They don't exactly have a big set of up-and-comers and if someone rebels because they are in a Remain constituency, and/or if the exiled person decides to stick it out and try to win as an independent (or joins another party), things could get mighty dicey for them. If they had a decent bench they could parachute in it might be another matter, but they have all the depth of the Windsor's gene pool. It's probably still his best play if he's going to keep on this path, but whether it works... (and God help them if the opposition can put together even a non-aggression pacts under an anti-NDB banner, even in just a couple of seats.)
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Sep 2, 2019 07:03
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Jose posted:Just got a guardian notification that a government source says the October 14th election will happen if the rebels win https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-49558596
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Sep 2, 2019 19:21
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Guavanaut posted:The Virgin Sun Tzu and the Chad von Clausewitz. The Virgin von Clausewitz and the Chad Sun Tzu t 
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Sep 3, 2019 03:40
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The problem with Sun Tzu is that people take it and, well, try to apply it to business and other fields. Like basically every other thinker, philosopher, or leader in history what he said has been misused and misquoted far more than it has been used accurately, but when you get to the work itself it turns out... Sun Tzu's famous for a reason! The standard thinking on my Strategic Studies MA was that von Clausewitz was the superior of the two (Though very few people had anyone else in their top two it should be noted), but I honestly think Big Sun the better. It's not that he necessarily said more that was insightful or useful, but that almost everything he says in The Art of War is of use, whilst von Clausewitz said an immense amount that was extremely good, and also quite a lot that was extremely centered in time and place or fell into minutiae. Not as bad as Machiavelli's The Art of War though, back then such manuals were almost entirely about minutiae like how your baggage train should be decorated and the precise distances your men should be apart from each other while marching. Not useless, as such, but not exactly enduring, nor the kind of thing generals and kings should need to worry much about.
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Sep 3, 2019 04:50
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Going to sleep now, excited to see what madness tomorrow brings
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Sep 3, 2019 07:01
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AceOfFlames posted:I said it before and I'll say it again: replace government with a computer. Even Samaritan would be better than what we have now. Ah, an opportunity to bring back one of my favourite UKMT memes. DWP HAS FOUND YOU DWP HAS FOUND YOU DWP HAS FOUND YOU DWP HAS FOUND YOU DWP HAS FOUND YOU RUN WHILE YOU CAN RUN WHILE YOU CAN RUN WHILE YOU CAN RUN WHILE YOU CAN RUN WHILE YOU CAN
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Sep 3, 2019 08:47
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Pleased to see that Kate Hoey is as reliably shite as ever. Sometimes constancy can be comforting even as you get hosed over.
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Sep 3, 2019 13:25
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Feels a bit like, now that most of the Tories know it's absolutely hosed, they're finally feeling ready to let their true feelings show. Boris went "If you defy me I'll boot you out" and some people went "Go on then" and one bloke went "Can't fire me I quit" (Actual lol out loud) and now he's saying he won't do it after all, they can all see that the emperor has no clothes. Any of them who won't benefit from NDB whether because their investments would suck or they're from Remain constituencies or who are just really hacked off at being treated this way might finally be realizing there's no more sense in playing ball. Today's been loving wild and it's not even reached the climax yet lmao lmao e; I said the word "feel" and its derivates a lot
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Sep 3, 2019 19:55
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Whomst even knows anymore tbh, it's more likely than it was this morning now that the government is a minority, but it's such a mess and shambles that nobody sensible is going to try predicting what happens.Darth Walrus posted:Your regular reminder that the prime minister's top strategist has this guy as his intellectual hero. I really think it's time for a left-wing look at the idea of the Singularity. We've got FALGSC as a broad notion but someone's going to have to dig into it otherwise if it happens the Minds will be programmed by absolute dweebs who make Roko's Basilisk a real thing because they think it should be a real thing.
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Sep 3, 2019 20:00
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josh04 posted:Nice little sit-in down at Brighton Station: Tag urself I'm voting for Larry
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Sep 3, 2019 20:01
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Bercow's extremely sudden "DEHHRRRRR" gave me a loving heart attack there was this background mumbling and then suddenly he's yelling in my ear
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Sep 3, 2019 22:10
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Ayes - 328 Noes - 301 "Not a good start Boris!"
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Sep 3, 2019 22:11
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Did someone yell "Another Bercow fix!"?  God I can't believe this oval office is getting away is saying that the EU won't be open to negotiation unless we are willing to shoot ourselves in the dicks. TABLING A MOTION UNDER FTPA!
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Sep 3, 2019 22:13
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Holy poo poo Bercow just delivered an absolute shellacking to someone that's the most brutal attack on someone in Parliamentary speech I've ever heard "This Prime Minister has a 100% record of losing votes in the House of Commons"  This is the best loving telly
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Sep 3, 2019 22:16
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I just realized that a majority of 28 means that 30-odd Tories must have defied the PM, assuming a couple of Labs voted No. So it's even worse than the worst case guesses. Incredible. Oh my god the Tories have bungled so bad that Anna loving Soubry managed to get a pretty good dunk on their front bench. "Made the Leader of the House sit up" EvilHawk posted:It was on Michael Gove lmao Absolutely legendary.
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Sep 3, 2019 22:19
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feedmegin posted:More like 15? Niric posted:Half that: any rebels count as -1 Noes AND +1 to the Ayes, so it's around 14 or so rebels Okay well in my defence I'm a girl now and I have to live up to stereotypes like "bad at maths" if I'm going to be accepted  Even so 21 Tory rebels is far far more than I expected, I thought we'd be very lucky if we got 10 and I was crossing my fingers that we'd squeak this through with a majority of like three.
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Sep 3, 2019 22:29
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Watching the Beeb right now and every single headline tomorrow is how de Pfeffel has fully hosed it, lost control, been humiliated. Even the beeb are basically saying "Lmao he wanted to be PM and if he loses this election he's gonna be really sad.
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Sep 3, 2019 23:51
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Szmitten posted:Would it actually be good or suicide to have a Lab/SNP/Lib government formed, ask for an extension, make no-deal illegal, then have an election? Or does that just give Boris his momentum back? It'd be good because it's the only foreseeable way we actually get those things.
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Sep 4, 2019 00:35
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OwlFancier posted:I just caught up. Ah, someone with true taste in waking hours 
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Sep 4, 2019 02:43
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AceClown posted:Not a single person seriously expected 21 conservatives to actually grow a loving spine and put their jobs on the line. It's truly, truly amazing. Most people were expecting that if we won this vote at all, it would be by a margin of like, one. If one wished to be very optimistic, you'd push that as high as five! Everyone was convinced that we'd be lucky to see more than one Tory do this, half a dozen would be at the very wildest bounds of plausibility; 21 was bonkeys Looney Tunes talk. As to what actaully caused it, the government essentially issued a blanket threat to their entire set of MPs that disobeying would be punished with withdrawal of the whip, i.e. expulsion from the Tory party. The rebels promptly turned around and said "gently caress you I won't do what you tell me". There are Tories who think No Deal Brexit is a terrible idea and want to stop it, some who think it's okay in itself but only as a last resort and see that de Pfeffel was making no effort at all to avert it, and some who don't really care about that but do care about the methods he's trying to use to get it. Combine all those with him being an unbelievably unlikable wanker who is advised by a couple of the only people in town who are even less pleasant than he is, all of them convinced of their own genius and capability, and they've managed to gently caress off enough of their own people to cause an absolutely huge (And hilarious) rebellion. In short, Boris Johnson is so incompetent, so stupid, and so hated that he may have actually caused irreperable damage to the Conservative Party.
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Sep 4, 2019 03:43
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AceClown posted:Not only that, but Ken Clarke, KENNETH loving CLARKE, father of the house, served under 6 different conservative prime ministers, arguably the most liked and respected Tory across all parties, has fantastic approval ratings and considered by many to be "alright for a tory". Yeah, the fact that they actually went through with booting Ken Clarke is BUCKWILD. If there's anyone in that party who can command any measure of cross-party respect and as you say at least some level of "Alright for a tory", it's him. And they've given their greatest Commons grandee the boot. It's truly, truly apocalyptic scenes for the Tories this week, tbh. I'm trying not to get my hopes up but I'm genuinely, genuinely not seeing how they come back from this. They'd need someone with the charisma of Obama to even try, and... well. Ken Clarke is, hilariously, perhaps the sole politician in their ranks who could have made a credible go of reuniting them and dividing the opposition with a sensible Brexit approach that people trusted him to attempt. Ms Adequate fucked around with this message at 05:11 on Sep 4, 2019 |
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Sep 4, 2019 05:08
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Beefeater1980 posted:That works so long as the losers accept the validity of an election result. The more times in a row that happens the better. There’s a lot of evidence now from our and the US’s various post-colonial I don't know if that's a condemnation of democracy so much as nation-building. I think pretty much by definition anything imposed from outside will be seen as illegitimate, and whilst that probably could be overcome, it would require decades of work (Meaning it's a no-no because politicians want to sell quick, easy wars, and something like this would need a coherent strategy from the beginning that says "We're going to be there for 50 years minimum" and would probably constitute cultural genocide to some extent. It can be done more quickly but it requires fairly unusual circumstances, cf. post-WW2 Germany and Japan (And Japan isn't exactly the most flourishing, hundred-schools-of-thought democracy around even by Liberal Democracy standards)
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Sep 4, 2019 06:31
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gently caress those assholes up!
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Sep 4, 2019 06:59
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Enallyniv posted:Has everyone accusing MPs of "blocking Brexit" collectively forgotten that there's like 10 different ways to leave the EU that aren't No Deal or are they just quietly hoping nobody remembers at this point? Leaving the EU has never been, in the main, about enacting a policy. It's come about because charlatans have used it as a scapegoat for decades, and fascists have hated it for decades. The former primed a big chunk of the population to be open to leaving because they filled everyone's heads with nonsense about what the EU did and why - but the fash are the ones who are the ideological leaders and true believers. Brexit is an article of faith. The more extreme it is, the better, because it puts more distance between us and hated Brussels. Combined with the usual right wing bollocks about how great $MYCOUNTRY is and it's a potent combination. EU both bad and duplicitous - UK both strong and Blitz Spirit. There's no way we'll be worse off that's Project Fear and even if we are it's worth it for Sovereignty. And the one attempt at a deal was by Theresa and it was terrible so surely all other deals must be too! Brexit is the realm of fanatics and fabulists, and there are few remaining voices to say that we must Brexit carefully and thoughtfully. Each seeks to prove themselves more devoted to Brexit than the last, each accuses others of betrayal and treason and propounds their own purity and zeal. No Deal Brexit has become the shibboleth of Brexiteers, and anything less is proof of secret Remain sympathies. E; hahaha for gently caress sake, Kinnock you twat
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Sep 4, 2019 19:37
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Rust Martialis posted:Are the ones who don't know what second and third reading of a bill mean all American or are so many Brits uninformed about Parliament? I went to uni for politics and I don't understand half the shite that goes on there, not surprising that folks might be unclear.
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Sep 4, 2019 19:39
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Pochoclo posted:No Recall or Intervention can work in this place Come, Black Rod. Friend or traitor, come. Come and look upon the Speaker's Chair, and St. Edward's Crown. And bring the Mace... I have need of it." e; What a lovely snipe lmao de Pfeffy did nothing to distance himself from implications that 80 million Turks would come to the UK if we stay in the EU except tell lies about what he said. Ms Adequate fucked around with this message at 22:39 on Sep 4, 2019 |
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Sep 4, 2019 22:35
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jabby posted:https://twitter.com/alexwickham/status/1169366112884207616 This was a very good error though, I could absolutely see Pfeffy trying to get Erdogan to veto it and not realize he's making a few major errors
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Sep 4, 2019 22:55
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bessantj posted:I'd love to be able to jump forward in time 200 years just to see how they teach Brexit in history class. "And that was just one of the countless examples of human stupidity and mania in the dying years of their species. Planets like Earth are commemorated for a reason - we must never become like them."
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Sep 4, 2019 22:57
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MSDOS KAPITAL posted:Solid Culture reference and context-appropriate user name - I give this post 9.5 / 10.  jabby posted:https://twitter.com/samlove8888/status/1169371941289037824 If he wasn't already finished he is now that the Sun's making jokes like this on their front page Jezza's gonna get exactly the No Deal block and extension he wants followed by an election. Until this week I'd have said that could end badly but the Tory party is in an absolute state and I don't know how they recover in just a few weeks/months. 2020 could have a bright start lassies, but don't get complacent.
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Sep 4, 2019 23:30
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PST posted:Has an PM ever lost their first two votes? Not to my knowledge, I've seen some conflicting stuff but as far as I can tell the only other PM to lose his first vote was Pitt the Younger. And he lasted seventeen years after that! Guavanaut posted:Must be at least two bands for the rest to follow. Or they don't care about Xennials. Ah shite I didn't even spot that!
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Sep 4, 2019 23:46
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Delthalaz posted:What happens if the queen doesn’t give her assent to a law? Constitutional crisis of a degree not seen since the 17th century. Probably, Parliament passes some emergency measure stripping the need for her to do so (Likely by some fiction like "Actually the Queen HAS given permission, as proven by the presence of The Mace in this House" or something equally wild) and we're on course for abolition
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Sep 5, 2019 01:48
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Sapozhnik posted:Are these old fuckers really still awake and debating poo poo at 5 AM UK time Nah they came to some sort of deal a few hours ago and wrapped up, something like 1:30 or 2am. Not sure what that deal was but wouldn't have been agreed to if Lab wasn't mostly okay with it. Plus of course the Lords as a whole don't have to give a gently caress about re-election so if they think Boris is a wanker and/or No Deal Brexit is a doubleplusungood idea they can pretty much just tell the Brexiteers to do one. Probably helped sway some Tory Lords a bit.
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Sep 5, 2019 05:07
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Necrothatcher posted:Apparently the latest galaxy brain idea out of Cummings is that Johnson proposes and supports a VONC on himself. You... you what m8 Ah wait I think I get it. If he gets a bangin' VONC put on him then deliberately doesn't put together a new government (And assumes Jezza can't which is one big assumption even from Cummies lol) it winds the clock down by two weeks and then gives us an election. Can't see fifty five different ways THAT could blow up in their faces goomsnarr posted:Hope is the pathway to disappointment. The quote is "Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment."  :40ksay:
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Sep 5, 2019 08:14
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Just grab a random sampling of say 20 people from each region every few years and make 'em do it like jury duty.
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Sep 5, 2019 08:21
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