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Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Asuron posted:

She is literally Eren 2.0, except Eren had a really good life before Reiner and co came knocking on his door.

Eren had a better life, but it's not he didn't also grow up in a violent ghetto.

Gantolandon posted:

Being on the side of the protagonists of a story is entirely normal. If people started to dislike them and cheer on their opponents, either they stopped being protagonists or the author hosed up.

I get what you're saying but I think that's too broad a conclusion. People can (and have) absolutely write compelling story with a protagonist the audience can be expected to hate. Richard III and Othello are easy examples.

Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 18:33 on Feb 3, 2021

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Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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Freakazoid_ posted:

There was a time when novels could write about two dudes who went through some poo poo and came out appreciative of each other without it being gay, especially in a war setting.

And then Homer wrote the Iliad.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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mightygerm posted:

I'm pretty sure Eren lives at the jail now, we haven't seen him live in a house since he was a kid.

When you think about it the whole world is a prison.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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"We waited ten years to get to the basement for it to be a photograph?"

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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It really cannot be overstated how "german coded" and "jewish coded" are not in any way contradictory.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Toxic Fart Syndrome posted:

He absolutely did not grow up in a violent ghetto. The standard of living in Paradis, pre-RBA, is obviously much higher than in the rest of the world. If they could unwind the clock, I'm sure most of the Scouts would choose to live in isolated peace.

Ehh?

Paradis might not technically be ghetto on account of its size, but it is a single ethnicity walled community you can't leave without being killed. It's also a technologically impoverished nation only maintained by propaganda and the threat of secret police. The scouts are singularly made up by those who either reject the isolation or reject the peace.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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Eustace posted:

drat thats wild. I wonder what Isayama means by that?

Truly, it's impossible to say.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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Blaze Dragon posted:

He's free. If you think he's a dick, maybe it's because you are not free and your posts are affected by your genetics gravity.

/

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

QuarkJets posted:

That said, from the jump it seems very clear to me that the series glorifies fascism, at least a little bit at first and then pretty strongly later on. It's something that's easily ignorable in season 1 because that's a lot of military training and titan fighting, but as the show goes on it that becomes harder to do. The series begins with "Our race (humanity) are besieged by an extremely powerful but incompetent enemy (titans)", a core tenet of fascist ideology. Sometimes aspects of this ideology are portrayed in a negative light (the military police). But by season 3 the survey corps (e.g. the army) are being glorified by the people and the goal of the series pivots to Lebensraum, and the protagonists accomplish that goal (yay Lebensraum!)

While the series does begin with "humanity is besieged by an extremely powerful but incompetent inhuman enemy," it almost immediately pivots to "they're almost certainly actual humans" and then "yes, they're human" and finally "more over, they're explicitly kin."

That is an important thing to note.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Vanderdeath posted:

I remember Japanese fans doing the math to estimate the number of Wall Titans and they came to the conclusion of there being around 500 to 600 thousand Wall Titans given the size of Paradis (since it's literally Not Madagascar). We got to see the results of a Rumbling in the second ED and it wasn't pretty. I also would implore people to go back and watch that ED before the next episode coming up.

Trying to quantify things can lead to some absurd conclusions. 600 thousand is about the entire estimated global population of the 1700s.

Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 01:59 on Feb 3, 2022

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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Decimals are hard.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Saagonsa posted:

At the time a lot of people felt like it was a cop-out resolution to a story arc that had dragged on for like 11 months at that point. People were way more down on the series at that point, especially because at the time nobody knew what was in the basement or if it was going to pay off at all.

It felt like the story had grown kind of toothless. It was a while since the protagonists faced a major setback or had any major characters die, but it was leading up to the big fight against the titan shifters so it felt like the stakes were about to get real. And then... the armored titan got blown-to-gently caress but didn't die. Levi fights the beast titan and both come out alive. There's a big "oh no, is Armin going to die?" moment, but no, they save him. I remember worrying that Armin getting the colossal titan was the story jumping the shark.

I'm still kind of down on it, at least in the manga version.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

DamnGlitch posted:

I mean, the internet has a huge problem understanding with “portrayal is not endorsement” In all media for like almost a decade at this point, though we are few years since the peak of this phenomenon at least

"Ah, so even though the show depicts some characters as being anti-murder-everyone, through careful literary analysis we can see that the true message is..."

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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McNutty posted:

Starship Troopers is the closest obvious comparison and that is a satire based specifically on how disgusting this kind of media is.

howabout that

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

MJeff posted:

I was at UniQlo today and I found a "Best of Attack on Titan in Color" book, it's got a bunch of chapters from all over the manga done in full color. It's really cool. It's even got the final character poll. No points for guessing who 1, 2 and 3 are. :v:

Misread this as an Attack on Titan coloring book at first and recoiled.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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Steve Yun posted:

Asymptotic Titan

wasn't that Genndy Tartakovsky's show

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Alan_Shore posted:

It's funny because the English translation makes no sense. I assume the Japanese is more "The Attack Titan"?

iirc before "Attack on Titan" was presented as the official translation fans originally called it March of the Giants (or at least something along that line)

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

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icecastle posted:

Aren't all eldians the direct descendants of Ymir? Wouldn't they all have royal blood?

I think the implication is that non-royal Eldians were descendants of the other members of Ymir's tribe.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Irony Be My Shield posted:

To be honest I regard the online freakout about the ending as the last in a long line of borderline dishonest misreadings of the manga intended to push a narrative that Attack on Titan is fascist propaganda

Bread Set Jettison posted:

Idk I was onboard with the way the manga was ending until the official translation had Armin saying “thank you for doing a genocide”

IMO the real sin of the late 10's media scrupulousity that swept through social media (not just that one article about AoT, but also super hero movies, children's cartoons, etc) is that it poisoned the well against actual discussion. Like, we should be talking about fascism in relation to AoT, this story about how a group of children enlist after a heinous and cataclysmic trauma is engaging with that topic. It's worth investigating how well or how poorly it does so, but it's hard to do so when every depiction of something bad happening is taken as enthused endorsement by an audience that's conditioned themselves to take a paranoid reading of everything.

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Bread Set Jettison posted:

Yeah the whole “depiction means endorsement” reading of basically any piece of media sucks and AoT was one of many things that happened too.

It didn’t happen for no reason, it was a weird time in media. I know it was annoying but It was an important discussion to have. I remember lots of “edgy-ness” being used as a smoke screen while the alt-right began to form. That combined with the historical context of japan’s fascist/colonial history complicated authorial intent at the time too.

I want to push back on this — the social media witch hunt against problematic media only ever served as a tool of self-flagellation or as a weapon. It didn't uncover a strain of hidden secret fascist ideology, it promoted a lens of interpretation so paranoid as to silence writers like Isabel Fall and 14-year-old fan artists. You do not have to hand it to them.

Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 16:22 on Nov 8, 2023

Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink
So what's the context for that quote?

edit: like, is there a link to where exactly Tomino wrote that? Searching for his magazine just brings up that quote again.

Schwarzwald fucked around with this message at 00:09 on Nov 26, 2023

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Schwarzwald
Jul 27, 2004

Don't Blink

Fluffdaddy posted:

I was wrong. He just used the youtubers username at some point. Which is even lamer.

what the gently caress

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