COVID-19: People on the internet are judging me for going outside. It used to be the reverse.

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > COVID-19: People on the internet are judging me for going outside. It used to be the reverse.

Which horse film is your favorite? This poll is closed.
Black Beauty	2	1.06%
A Talking Pony!?!	4	2.13%
Mr. Hands 2x Apple Flavor	117	62.23%
War Horse	11	5.85%
Mr. Hands	54	28.72%
Total:	188 votes

[Edit Poll (moderators only)]

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

So the cinematic quality of our late stage capitalism is hitting Peak TV levels but I still say that kids taking the Delta variant back home to their parents all across the country has the potential to be the straw.

https://twitter.com/accnetwork/status/1433916233599143944

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 01:04 on Sep 14, 2021

# ¿ Sep 14, 2021 00:06

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 12, 2024 12:21

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

Mr. Pardiggle posted:

So I got my third Moderna last night and I feel like a trick hit me. Because I live in a 5 person household with unregulated visitors, I took matters into my own hands last night at the local CVS. It astounds me how harshly my body reacts to these. I think the weirdest side effect is skin sensitivity to the point where wearing clothes hurts.

At any rate, can I expect some higher level of protection as a healthy 29 year old? Long covid scares me the most.

e: also one of the members of the household tested positive this morning so funny how that works lol. Of course someone else had to tell me because neither she nor her fianc� told me.

So the Moderna shot is much larger than Pfizer, in fact the people working on the Moderna booster are saying that it will probably be a half-shot. So the reason you got drilled is that you basically just took two boosters at once.

# ¿ Sep 24, 2021 08:23

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

The problem seems to be one of what would technically be ok, but when implemented in the real world lead to a collapse. It's like the old speed limit thing. Technically, two vaxxed people meeting in the middle of nowhere is probably fine, but the moment you tell people they can do that, you can be sure that they're not only going to do that but also take things a few steps further, because that's just people, they'll never just go the speed limit.

Add to that the two countries issue, that can be seen most prominently here in the U.S. but is probably happening to at least some degree in most other countries too, which is that while many people have formed a solid mask and social distancing routine, there is a subset of the population who has spent the entire last two years behaving as if everything were completely normal and not altering their habits beyond what they were forced to do. And it only takes a handful of these blase shitheads to ruin it for everyone else. So while 95% of a country can sit inside their house for a year and a half, we know for a fact that not everyone is doing that, otherwise the coronavirus would've been over in a month.

The frustration is understandable though and if feels like something could be done to alleviate the cabin fever. Theoretically the government could do something like organize pod groups or something to that effect through an app. If three vaxxed people only ever come into contact with the same vaxxed three people, then they're unlikely to get COVID-19 since you usually need to come into contact with someone that has it. But the problem is, again, it works a lot better in theory than in the real world, where you have people who aren't going to play ball for the same reason they've been behaving as if the pandemic is over. Edit: Regardless, how a policy is likely to play out in the real world should obviously be factored in to shaping that policy.

Also, one last thing, for those of you with chuddy anti-vax relatives. Just keep working on them. My dad is an old black guy who grew up on a farm and loves conspiracy theories and my step-dad voted for Trump twice, and I was able to
convert both to get the vaccine. With my dad, he'd had a bad reaction to his last flu shot so he was hesitant, I had to explain in detail how vaccines work so he was able to see for himself that it was probably safe. For my step-dad I basically went with what I'd read about in the most recent research on convincing people; which is basically to just agree with them. So in our political discussions I made sure to criticize Biden a lot (wasn't too hard to come up with ideas) while at the same time making reasonable arguments in favor of the vaccine. I showed them Arnold's fb post on whether or not to take the vaccine and it's one of the most basic, and effective arguments I've read. I also pipelined them a lot of r/LeopardsteMyFace anti-vaxx schadenfreude to group chats. One of the most important things to keep in mind is that most people aren't as plugged into the pandemic as we are. They're not following this stuff on twitter and reading every new Coronavirus article by The Atlantic and Wapo. So a lot of the urgency is just not there for them because so much of what's going on isn't on their radar. But I've never seen people sober up faster than when I sat them down and had them read r/LeopardsAteMyFace for a while.

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 11:58 on Sep 26, 2021

# ¿ Sep 26, 2021 11:21

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

Tacier posted:

Apologies if this has been covered, but based on this article it sounds like our best data so far suggests that 100% of Covid cases, mild or severe, result in some amount of persistent brain damage of unknown duration.

https://theconversation.com/prelimi...it-lasts-166145

Not trying to fearmonger, but is there something I�m missing or is this horrifying news? The sample size is huge and they have baseline scans for everyone involved in the study.

PostNouveau posted:

Yikes! Yeah, that is horrifying. We should take some steps to avoid this, I think!

....And on that note....

https://twitter.com/MonicaGandhi9/status/1440698563051196425?s=20
I've been wondering what Conservatives next big COVID related stance would be after going from anti-mask to anti-vaccine to pro-ivermectin to hyperfocusing on monoclonal antibodies, in their tireless efforts to take the opposite side of whatever the Liberal stance is. I guessed that their next pivot was going to be literally just Pro-COVID, but it looks like the Emily Oster gang tag crew has beat them to it.

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 20:57 on Sep 27, 2021

# ¿ Sep 27, 2021 20:52

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

mod sassinator posted:

None of this guaranteed, and if we're just making pie in the sky fantasy fiction about COVID's future then you have to also add, "a vaccine resistant variant emerges and we are back to March 2020 for everyone again". Two thirds of epidemiologists polled about their opinion on vaccine evading variants expect one to emerge in a year...

Our life expectancy has dropped about two years already (https://nypost.com/2021/09/27/life-expectancy-of-american-men-fell-2-years-amid-pandemic-study/). How much worse do you think it's going to get if we go for more years of this bungled response attempting to 'live' with the virus? Will your children be lucky to see age 60? The current COVID strategy of voluntary vaccination, voluntary NPI usage, no lockdowns or social distancing mandates that actually drive down Rt is a disaster.

Yeah, I've been reading about Evolutionary Selection Pressure in Viruses and everyone seems to agree that Sars-CoV-2 is getting plenty of practice coming up with a version of itself that can escape our artificial defenses and will do so, if not soon, then almost inevitably on a long enough timeline. Unfortunately, as mentioned a few pages back there doesn't seem to be as large a consensus on if it will evolve to be less deadly.

Here's an interesting article...

scientific american posted:

How will the Coronavirus evolve?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/how-will-the-coronavirus-evolve/

With declining rates of new infections and the rollout of vaccines, some are beginning to speak of an end to COVID-19. But that rhetoric, in my opinion, is ill-considered and premature. Based on what we know now of SARS-CoV-2, it may no longer be a question of months before an end to the pandemic but a question of years, if not decades. We should plan for it.

Viruses exist to thrive. Those that infect humans are faced with an impressive array of defensive weaponry, not just our natural adaptive immunity but also our intelligently designed defenses�vaccines, drugs and social controls. For a virus to survive, it must be adapted to its chosen ecological niche�in this case, us�and capable of further intricate adaptation to overcome our best efforts at prevention and treatment.

Initially, many assumed that coronaviruses in general and SARS-CoV-2 in particular were more stable and less prone to adaptation than other RNA viruses because of their error-proofing mechanisms. But we have since been proven wrong. Last summer, a researcher in Texas noticed that a mutated SARS-CoV-2 virus with a substitution in the spike protein had overtaken previous forms to become the dominant strain. Since then, multiple new variants have emerged with mutations that can make the virus more transmissible, more lethal and more able to evade our immune defenses.

These variants have seemingly been forged in fires of our own making. In Boston, a middle-aged man struggled with a COVID-19 infection for five months before succumbing to the disease. He was undergoing treatment with immunosuppressive drugs when he fell ill, and, during his illness, he received multiple rounds of additional treatment, with remdesivir nonimmune gamma globulin, and with monoclonal antibodies. Under this intense immune pressure, key mutations in the virus emerged. The doctors and scientists who witnessed their birth called it �accelerated viral evolution.�

Other viruses, like influenza, have shown themselves similarly capable of rapid evolution when faced with our best defenses. Indeed, based on what we�ve seen of SARS-CoV-2 and its capacity for variation, I�d say this virus is much more like influenza than any other virus known to date.

Which means influenza�s evolutionary pathway may hold important clues about the road COVID-19 will follow.

Influenza, as we know, comes and goes in seasonal waves in the Northern and Southern Hemispheres. In the tropics it occurs throughout the year, with only shallow peaks. This pattern mimics what we know of cold-causing coronaviruses, which, ever since their discovery in the 1960s, have returned annually to infect us. For the flu, antigenic drift�the accumulation of small genetic changes in the virus�has been the primary explanation for recurrent seasonal epidemics. Dominant flu strains evolve from year to year, and the immunity we develop in response to a previous strain has only a muted effect on the new strain. We�ve learned more recently that immunity to influenza also fades, often disappearing within a year, which also makes us susceptible to reinfection.

We used to believe that the cold-causing coronaviruses were stable�meaning no antigenic drift�but returned yearly because of faded immune protection. But over the past year, our understanding of coronaviruses has improved and we now know that at least one of the cold-causing coronaviruses, designated 229E, undergoes antigenic drift similar to that of influenza.

SARS-CoV-2, like 229E, has already shown that it can drift. But, like influenza, it has also shown itself capable of much more abrupt and substantial changes. One way these major changes happen occurs when a virus jumps to a new population, for example from animals to humans or back again. When a virus makes this jump, big things�and often bad things�materialize. Both influenza and SARS-CoV-2 have huge animal reservoirs. Coronaviruses have infected every type of vertebrate, from whales and bats to salamanders and snakes. Influenza is similar. This means they both have the potential to evolve to become much more damaging to our population. The two previous coronavirus outbreaks both started when coronaviruses jumped from animals to humans, from civet cats in 2003 with SARS and from camels with MERS in 2012. The 1918 influenza pandemic likely started with a jump from animals too.

If we�re lucky, SARS-CoV-2 will evolve, like the 1918 virus dubbed the �Spanish flu,� to become less lethal. After infecting an estimated 500 million worldwide and killing at least 50 million, the 1918 flu virus receded. But hope that this coronavirus will attenuate over time is no guarantee that it will. We already know that coronaviruses can become much more lethal; we need look no further than SARS-CoV-1, which killed 50 percent of those aged 65 and older, and MERS, which killed one out of three infected.

So where does that leave us?

First, we must accept the harsh truth told by this virus and its variants. We can expect it to come back�potentially for years to come�and we need to prepare ourselves for the possibility that when it does, it may be more lethal and even more transmissible than the variants that exist today. We must adjust our vaccine development pipelines and public health interventions to account for emergent and future variations. Much like what has been proposed with influenza, we must develop COVID risk assessment tools that can identify the viral properties of dominant strains�how transmissible they may be or how resistant they are to current drugs or vaccines�to help us align our public health response with the level of risk. Otherwise, we�ll be setting ourselves up for failure once more.

I have often likened SARS-CoV-2 to the mythical Proteus in Homer�s Odyssey. Like Proteus, SARS-CoV-2 is the quintessential shape-shifter, able to alter its form whenever grasped. It is only through sheer persistence that Menelaus, the great hero, is able to wrestle Proteus to a standstill. By claiming victory too soon, we risk losing our battle with this shape-shifting virus, a tragedy that would unfold this time not in words but in many more millions of lives lost.

February 19, 2021

So basically either we get serious about eventual eradication, or the whole planet makes a post on facebook asking for prayers and donations to our gofundme that the virus actually does eventually attenuate.

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 23:18 on Sep 27, 2021

# ¿ Sep 27, 2021 22:26

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

mod sassinator posted:

People really need to think of this thing as a totally unemotional and determined killing maching, like a Terminator.

Ironically, if the US's response to the Coronavirus had been something more akin to the bugs in Starship Troopers, complete with Trump cheering young kids as they stomped on whatever cockroach stand-in they could come up with to represent microscopic protein-coated RNA, things probably would've turned out a lot better here. The one time Republican's hyper-patriotic Red Dawn fantasies might've actually paid off but ofc they choose to side with the North Koreans.

Watching people gathering together to burn their masks during a pandemic was surreal. It's darkly ironic that Conservatives always preached survivalism and preparedness, many even spending decades stocking up on extra resources, prepping for the next big global disaster, and when it finally hits they go out and basically do cartwheels in the radiation zones.

Rather than pulling together and gearing up for a fight, prepping for some sacrifice and hardship like we usually do in a crisis, a lot of the country has just had this blase attitude about it. And that includes the people who thought that restaurants were magically safe to eat inside again just because the capacity restrictions had been lifted. Like, it still blows my mind that most schools were closed last year but even the ones that were open did more NPI than wer're doing now AND we're facing a more transmissible and deadlier strain. I don't know what the hell Biden was thinking with that.

So yeah, watching how things have played out here, I'm not at all surprised that normal people are starting to burn out. I lost my cousin to the virus last summer and all I can say is get some nature, go for a walk in the woods, stay in touch with your people, set up zoom parties if you have to. It actually really does suck that the gyms are closed because it can't be overemphasized how much exercise benefits mental health. But you can still do a lot with a few dumbbells, that's what I've been doing, and it's working. Maintaining self-care is critical, just do what you gotta do.

# ¿ Sep 28, 2021 01:52

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

freebooter posted:

We also have about 1/5th the population of California and have been under incredibly strict lockdown for two months now, so this actually looks very bad IMO! (Unless California is undertesting, which is probably true of anywhere that's mostly gone back to normal.)

I remember your posts back during the lockdown you guys did over there towards end of last year, iirc it was a grind but you all eventually starved out the 2nd wave of the OG strain I think. Respect for putting in work like that.

# ¿ Sep 29, 2021 00:26

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

CommieGIR posted:

Some interesting data has leaked about a Doctors group linked to Pro-Trump stuff, providing "consults" and unapproved treatments for COVID

Yeah, America's Frontline Doctors are one of the primary drivers behind coronavirus disinformation. You see them mentioned in a lot of the private facebook groups as FLCCC, where everyone is downing ivermectin and trying to argue with hospital doctors to change treatment protocols to include useless garbage. I'm surprised people are just talking about them now, they've been around since the beginning. It looks like they're just getting some internal records now though. These people are scum and I hope the Feds eventually get around to going after them.

# ¿ Sep 29, 2021 16:25

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

poll plane variant posted:

Unless we do something differently there is no reason we won't end up right back here in a month. These things come in waves, but they do come. It doesn't really just go away but people always want to act like "this time it's gone for good" which gets us complacent and right back here!

Seriously this cant be emphasized enough. The peak and drop off is a due to people being more cautious ie. masking up again and probably putting in more effort into NPI along with increased vacc uptake...which they did in response to this surge....which occurred because they stopped doing all those things before....

Anyone think we're not going to relax our daily standards again now that things are headed back downward?

EDIT: Cat Tax.

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 20:33 on Sep 29, 2021

# ¿ Sep 29, 2021 20:27

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

Thorn Wishes Talon posted:

I mean, yes, there is no such thing as 100% immunity. That doesn't change anything substantial with regards to what I said. What matters is that reinfections tend to be milder. Whether people build their immunity via vaccines or by contacting Covid, sooner or later the virus's threat level will decrease.

Speaking of which, has there been any discussion about boosting with Pfizer if you have Moderna or J&J? I don't expect anything prompt or cogent from the CDC, but are they doing it anywhere else like in Israel? Particularly with the recent discussions surrounding the possible cross protective properties of the BCG vacc?

# ¿ Sep 29, 2021 21:07

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

bane mask golem posted:

Respirators aren't "scary bane masks."

Scary Bane Masks are dope. I feel like if Trump hadn't set such an anti-mask tone so early on things could've easily gone a different way and every guy who drives a black lifted truck would be walking around dressed in full masked Operator cosplay right now.

# ¿ Sep 30, 2021 00:20

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

How is NZ's vaccine stocks? And what's their populations vaccine hesitancy levels at? I read somewhere that they had to wait in line a bit so they couldnt get people the jab as quickly as they wanted it.

It sounds like their lockdowns failed to wrangle Delta because of a small number of marginalized groups. It really is a "you're only as strong as your weakest link" problem. If a minuscule percentage of your population is ignoring the lockdowns for whatever reason and their numbers are significant enough, it essentially won't matter that 99% of the population hasnt stepped outside their house in two months. You'd think this would be something that could be addressed with an information campaign blitz, social services targeting those groups and increased police presence to promote compliance for anyone who has just been flipping the government the bird and doing whatever they wanted, but perhaps they already ran the numbers and realized that wouldn't work for some reason.

Either way NZ'ers have been the little engine that could through this whole thing and they should be proud of their accomplishments. They showed the world what a country can do when everyone is on the same page and cooperating, and that's no small thing.

# ¿ Oct 5, 2021 00:22

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

enki42 posted:

The groups being marginalized and "increased police presence to promote compliance" isn't a great look when put together, and I don't know much about policing in NZ but if it's anything like North America declaring open season on indigenous folks (and also saying they're the reason for lockdowns) is going to end pretty horribly.

(I know that in any population that less vaccinated populations aren't exclusively marginalized / racialized / indigenous / etc, but a significant proportion are).

Certainly PR is an important factor in the cost-benefit analysis of any policy initiative. It sounds like some of the groups are homeless as well which is why I mentioned an info campaign and social services, (who tend to be much better at addressing those communities issues than cops) doing things like vaccine outreach. Law enforcement presence also doesn't necessarily mean direct contact, it can be more along the lines of how people suddenly stop speeding when they see a cop on the road. Anyway it looks like they decided what the best course of action for them was, and while its certainly possible that as someone mentioned upthread, Arden was influenced, NZ's performance during this crisis has been pretty solid so far so I'd probably lean toward the side of trusting that they got to this decision through legit analytics, rather than anything else.

# ¿ Oct 5, 2021 01:24

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

How are u posted:

I mean one could kind of argue that the CCP has sort of done it, utilizing their intense media control and willingness to back up mandates with military force.

That some people look at what's happened over there and say "ah that's the ticket, that's the way!" is their own choice, but I don't think the tradeoff is worth it, personally.

VitalSigns posted:

Thank god we killed 700,000+ people instead

The funny(not actually funny) thing about this number is the implication that it is in any way final.

China seems to be managing their occasional minor delta outbreaks well enough for the majority of their population to live normal lives. And with the new city-sized quarantine operation they just built in the time it took for some redshirt in a fly over state to go from posting anti-vax memes on facebook to grinning in a picture on a GoFundMe for their funeral bills to be paid by the wife and 4 kids they left behind, it doesn't seem like China is in all that untenable a position.

I also looked it up and it appears that China doesn't even have a national vaccine mandate, some local governments were getting overly aggressive and harassing people about it over the summer and the CCP shut it down. Now a few of them are just talking about vaccine passports.

Do we, on the other hand, have a Coronavirus pandemic exit strategy at all? Last fall we had a year to prepare for open schools and instead of gaming out the next 12-24 months people just hyper focused on the vaccines making everything 2019 again resulting in lax population NPI habits, getting completely blindsided by a very nasty surprise variant, and schools doing literally nothing to get ready for reopening this Fall.

Given the lessons of the last year, has there been any spitballing on the plan after the mandates are completed and the boosters are out? Has there been any serious discussion about what things might look like a year from now, two years, or five years?

# ¿ Oct 5, 2021 23:50

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

freebooter posted:

What do you think happened in Australia and New Zealand?

It is hilarious to me that rather than actually read and learn about how and why lockdowns stopped working when Delta arose in real-world COVID jurisdictions, this thread is full of Americans wargaming the perfect pizza delivery scenario that Solves Covid.

Love this. Literally the most on brand thing about the U.S. I've seen in a while.

Trump could've made the Coronavirus his dissent crushing/approval rating skyrocketing 9/11 and sailed into a second term so easily if he'd put even the smallest amount of effort in.

World's only global superpower baby! Woo!

-Blackadder- fucked around with this message at 05:53 on Oct 6, 2021

# ¿ Oct 6, 2021 05:49

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

NoDamage posted:

...At that point you might as well be lamenting the fact that Paxlovid didn't exist in March 2020 if you're trying to think up fantasy scenarios that would have saved a million lives.

Speaking of which, I've been away for about 6 months and haven't been following pandemic related news, but my mom just tested positive. She's 65+, is fully vaccinated + two boosters, however she got the most recent booster about the same week that she probably contracted the virus. I'd heard there was an anti-viral pill on the market, but not much beyond that. What's the current consensus on it? From what I'm reading online it sounds pretty solid.

# ¿ May 27, 2022 03:26

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

PostNouveau posted:

It's good. Here a goon did a thread about how to get it easy from telehealth people

https://twitter.com/ToonyGoons/status/1524538401839628289

Fritz the Horse posted:

It's not harrumphing to point out the fact that Paxlovid has some serious medication interactions and Blackadder's mom should consult with her doctor to make sure it's safe. That does not make Paxlovid a bad or ineffective drug, in fact it's really amazing if taken early in a COVID infection.

I don't understand your desire to handwave away interactions and side effects, it's bad medical advice.

Been juggling a few things over the weekend so I'm just catching up on the thread now. First, thanks to everyone who replied and voiced their concern for my Mom. I was able to get her to one of Biden's Test-to-Treat locations (ironically it ended up being one of the local pharmacies she already goes to so they already had all her medical info on file) and after making sure all her medications were up to date and consulting with their Physician on staff they gave her a prescription for Paxlovid. And I'm happy to report that aside from some annoying metallic taste in her mouth she's actually made a pretty miraculous turn around. I don't know if it was the antiviral or the worst of the virus passing, but she's doing a lot better!

* Also, just to clarify, I would never take nor advocate for anyone to take medical advice from "the internet" or any other source that was not medically licensed and qualified to give it. You guys did, however, save me some time in narrowing down what my options were and what I should be asking doctors about, so thanks again!

# ¿ May 31, 2022 20:55

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 12, 2024 12:21

-Blackadder-: Jan 2, 2007; Game....Blouses.

So is there an updated booster coming out or Fall or what? Tryna determine when to get my next.

# ¿ Jul 21, 2022 00:02

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Debate & Discussion > COVID-19: People on the internet are judging me for going outside. It used to be the reverse.