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Danger posted:Yea, it’s not like high ranking Nazi war criminals were recruited and welcomed into NATO leadership or anything. I mean by that logic can we point to the USSR version of operation paperclip and say that Russia is also a Nazi country? Seems fair
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Feb 14, 2022 20:02
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BIG FLUFFY DOG posted:Current team: Russia, Nicaragua, belarus Don't forget Syria
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Feb 22, 2022 22:27
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Sir John Falstaff posted:Yes, although videos themselves can be part of a disinformation campaign. E.g., the number of times a video of some atrocity has been posted only to find out later that actually it's a video taken a decade ago during some entirely different conflict. I've seen two videos involving ATGM hits that seem to be propaganda already (one involved old footage, one involved a vehicle that the Ukrainians apparently don't even field) so do try to be careful when posting footage.
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Feb 22, 2022 23:29
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I don't expect Ukraine to push forward, they're probably busy digging in as hard and as fast as they can. Russia seems to be waiting for all their pieces to be in place before advancing. If they're confident in their military superiority, then a disorganized assault would be more dangerous than a couple hours/days delay. Remember, their heavy stuff was still mostly positioned in Russia, makes sense to get it all lined up in occupied Ukraine before advancing into Ukrainian held territory.
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Feb 23, 2022 02:01
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Another problem with speculating about a potential cyber war with Russia is that cyber war is kinda like espionage, where you want to hold your trump cards close to your chest because the second you use them they're spent and the enemy can start taking actions against them. If I was a Russian cybersecurity person I'd be more worried by the silence than anything, because that to me just means that systems are compromised and they don't know yet. Or the West just sucks at computers, which honestly is probably the real answer.
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Feb 23, 2022 20:02
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Yeah the best case scenario is to force the Russians into urban combat and make them go block by block clearing out the opposition. And this best case is essentially hell on earth and you can imagine what will happen to civilians caught in the middle. Like that twitter guy said, Aleppo or Grozny
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Feb 23, 2022 23:04
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Willo567 posted:Oh my god, Putin doesn't want to radiate the entire loving world for Ukraine, stop reading clickbait tweets. I know I'm one to talk since I used to worry constantly about Trump getting us into a nuclear war with North Korea, but this isn't healthy He doesn't want it but he sure is threatening it.
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Feb 24, 2022 04:20
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At the end of the day if this was Finland and not Ukraine, maybe sanctions go out quicker but why would NATO risk WW3 over a country that they're not allied with. Although I can see Finland applying for NATO and getting in a lot quicker than Ukraine. Like I think if they came under serious threat they'd be in a long as they asked.
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Feb 24, 2022 15:46
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khwarezm posted:If I may ask, is the war currently looking like a complete curbstomp of Ukraine by Russia, if there is enough info to make a call like that? Ukraine is putting up some resistance, but this was never going to be close. It's just a matter of whether it takes days or weeks for Ukraine to fold.
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Feb 24, 2022 16:13
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OwlFancier posted:Does it count as air superiority if they have a sufficient ground based air defence network that the enemy air force can't operate effectively? Air superiority is both "Our opponents can't effectively use their air force" and "we can use our air force freely", Russia still hasn't accomplished the second part.
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Feb 25, 2022 16:55
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CommieGIR posted:For those who want it or those who donated to the relief thread, we are working on a gangtag by goon Loden Taylor Quoting this to remember to donate (again) when I get home
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Feb 25, 2022 19:40
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Nenonen posted:
Tanks need to pull in air from somewhere for the crew to breathe and it can't be on the underside (dust and mud from normal operations can block them), which does result in certain places that a sustained fire will make the crew have a bad time. This usually isn't an issue because tanks are supported by ground infantry and you have to be close to use one, but the Russians haven't been disciplined in this so far. Also a sheet of fire obscures optics and thermals pretty well
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Feb 25, 2022 20:34
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The NATO military is designed to deter Russia and there have been critics (including people on this forum today) saying there's no way the US/France/Germany/UK etc would defend their allies if push came to shove. This is literally what it was designed for, has been maintained for and why troops are moving today. We're showing our allies that it doesn't matter if you're Estonia or the USA, an attack on one is an attack on all. It would be much more worrying seeing troops leave the Baltic and Poland etc right about now
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Feb 25, 2022 21:00
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Putin has been disappearing the oligarchs who could be a threat for decades, and probably has thoroughly infiltrated the staff and accomplices of the survivors. There will be no coup
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Feb 25, 2022 21:10
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ZombieLenin posted:Holy poo poo, and it’s not the SWIFT ban I’m holy making GBS threads. If the United States follows suit, the Russian economy was just destroyed. US is mentioned as one of the countries in that tweet. The real question is what banks. It could be anything from a meaningless gesture to financial ruin.
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Feb 26, 2022 23:20
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Given San Francisco would be one of the first targets for the Russian nuclear sub a couple miles away, I'd say anywhere from 2-5 minutes assuming everything goes right.
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Feb 28, 2022 05:50
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Why are India being forced to go with western suppliers? Last I heard they were basically the same as China, i.e. not condemning Russia and refusing to stop trade with them. Just the thought that sanctions will make it harder for Russia to deliver?
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Mar 4, 2022 07:49
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VorpalBunny posted:Was the Russian stock market supposed to open again today? Or ever? The last time it closed like this it only opened 75 years later, so I wouldn't hold my breath
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Mar 5, 2022 06:57
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Kraftwerk posted:Is the west fully expecting Ukraine to collapse soon once the Russians snap out of it and get their poo poo together? I thought Ukraine was winning. Russia has a lot of artillery and a lot of dumb munitions, and a lot of soldiers. They can take a lot of losses, continue loving up and still win, and if they go totally mask off they could reduce most Ukrainian cities to piles of flaming rubble and call it a win. They've been playing relatively nice so far. Ukraine isn't winning, they're losing slower than anticipated. It's still an open question what the end result of the war is, but the major question is something like "do you consider everything east of the Dnieper including Kiev being Russian" a Ukrainian victory? Because right now that looks like the "good" outcome for Ukraine. Also obligatory gently caress Russia, I'm not saying this as some Russia Strong type thing, just that is a realistic assessment.
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Mar 5, 2022 22:07
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Yeowch!!! My Balls!!! posted:didn't nuland admit we've got bioweapons labs in Ukraine yesterday, complete with 'actually if any kind of bioweapon goes off we blame russia' Nuland said Ukraine has biological research labs (of course they do literally every country on earth does) and that there was concern they would be seized by the Russians. There's a big difference between "Ukrainian biological research lab" and "US funded biological weapon research lab", but they're close enough the Russians figure they can seize a lab dedicated to say improving fertilizer and then claim it was actually for weaponizing smallpox or some poo poo
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Mar 9, 2022 14:32
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Mozi posted:I'm hoping we can send them a bunch of more sophisticated air defenses, seems that that might go a bit further. More sophisticated air defenses tend to take years to train on and integrate where a stinger takes a couple hours maybe. If Ukraine survives maybe they get more sophisticated air defenses, but they'd be useless right now and right now is what matters
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Mar 9, 2022 15:55
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https://twitter.com/crampell/status/1503458523874828289 https://twitter.com/jonostrower/status/1503462532954177539 Sanctions having an effect
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Mar 14, 2022 21:26
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E: beaten
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Mar 15, 2022 21:09
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Interesting that your opinion is that Ukraine surrenders, why not Russia? They are a party to this war, they could also surrender. Why shouldn't the rest of Eastern Europe surrender right now under that logic as well? After all aren't the potential deaths of potential genocide and oppression lesser than a potential war? While we're at it the US should probably surrender as well and become a Russian vassal, after all if Russia starts a war with the US a surrender will avoid any civilian deaths. We should all just preemptively give up and turn ourselves in to the nearest dictator. It'll save so many lives.
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Mar 16, 2022 22:31
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That tank video is brutal, it's on reddit of you are curious. Don't be, unless you want to realize that those rag doll physics you see in video games are applicable to humans (and pieces of them) in real life.
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Mar 17, 2022 16:50
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SourKraut posted:I honestly don't know where I am at in terms of being pro- or anti-intervention on the part of NATO, the US, or others, but I would honestly like to know, for those who are anti-intervention, what is the line at which intervention becomes reasonable and/or necessary? The line is when he attacks a NATO country or ally (I guess he could attack Japan or Australia for example lol). That's the whole point of NATO and has been affirmed and reaffirmed for decades. The argument of "well you won't defend a country with zero defense treaties who wasn't even historically in your sphere of influence, would you defend your own lands?" is just kinda absurd. To put it another way, NATO is trying to avoid an escalation where they are brought into the conflict. If Russia attacks NATO then the escalation already happened, so there's nothing to avoid.
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Mar 21, 2022 07:25
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mobby_6kl posted:drat, how are SAMs still an issue? You'd think this would be a key part for anti-russia defense. Or did the existing stuff actually get sent to ukraine? NATO air doctrine mostly focuses on using planes to shoot down planes. Not that there isn't need to have ground based AA, just that there is advantage to having say F-22s that can be deployed anywhere in the world in a matter of hours to days over ground based systems that have to be transported rather than flying. Those hours/ days until reinforcements arrive could be rough though.
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Mar 23, 2022 14:08
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The Lone Badger posted:3 years from now, Deteriorata is the only poster on this thread, still bumping it daily. In three years I expect to see "Another dawn is breaking in Moscow and it's still Ukranian" at this point.
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Mar 25, 2022 05:18
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Staluigi posted:"Failure rate" is such an insidious catchall for missile platform. Does it mean These two are the most common, along with "flew to target and hit it but warhead didn't go off".
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Mar 25, 2022 14:05
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cant cook creole bream posted:It feels a bit gross playing devil's advocate here, but how would we know, all of those dead bodies are civilians? They're probably not all civilians, but without a doubt most of them are, and there are also some that were undoubtedly civilians. For example, executed children were definitely not soldiers.
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Apr 3, 2022 23:37
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EscapeHere posted:Can any finance or forex goons here explain in simple terms what's happening with the ruble? i.e. why is it higher now than when the war started? All the predictions were that it would crash heavily. Russia's central bank says "you can buy 100 rubles from us for $1, anything else is illegal". Because you can't trade rubles for dollars internationally (not convertible, illegal) and banks can't offer other exchange rates (also illegal) that's the "exchange rate". Also most of those transactions are one sided, i.e. the average citizen can buy 100 rubles for $1 but cannot buy $1 for 100 rubles. It is not sustainable long term
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Apr 5, 2022 19:00
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EscapeHere posted:Thanks, that explanation helps. Is it illegal due to US sanctions, or due to Russian laws? Yes. US/EU sanctions prevented it so Russia turned around and outlawed it as well, kinda a "you can't fire me I quit" type of thing. There are restrictions on basically all financial products (stocks can only be bought and sold by Russians, dividends only payable to Russians, etc).
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Apr 5, 2022 19:20
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It's pretty impressive that during maybe the strongest showing of unity from "the west" in decades people are still arguing that countries in that group will be left out to dry because ??? No NATO Isn't going to just let Russia invade the Baltics, the EU won't let Finland be taken over. Ukraine less than a decade ago was solidly in Russia's "sphere of influence" and they are currently not only recieving billions of dollars in aid but also benefiting from levels of sanctions on Russia that, let's be honest, seemed insane at the start of the war. Now take a country like Finland that is economically, socially, culturally and financially integrated into the west. The "west" from Germany and France to the US and UK would have a decision to make. Continue the policy of ensuring peace in their sphere of influence which has been beneficial for all parties, or let it all fall apart. Russian forces would burn. NATO and the EU wouldn't push into Russia, that would give them justification to use nukes, but the conventional force used would be overwhelming, if for no other reason than to put rest to the idea that anyone could do such a thing in the future. I have no idea what would happen with Taiwan, but attacking Europe? Lol.
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Apr 6, 2022 17:36
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Despera posted:I wonder if the invasion keeps going this poorly if the fins go "lol russia" and think joining nato is overkill I think the mass graves and bombing of children make a compelling argument that even if Russia can't beat you in a war, it's generally better for the war to not happen at all.
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Apr 7, 2022 01:53
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NATO has shown equal determination in defending both London and Tallinn, or Paris and Riga. I am curious why all of a sudden people are thinking "but Putin might use nukes" would be a valid argument for letting Russia take the Baltics, but not for letting Russia take, say, Alaska. If the conclusion is that world leaders have decided anything is preferable to nuclear war, then Russia might as well start carving up the US and Canada because we can't respond, because nukes. If, however, the argument is that NATO has very clear red lines it defends and doesn't see an advantage in intervening in Ukraine currently, but would defend the Baltics, or Berlin, or NYC, everything leaders are doing and saying makes perfect sense. mobby_6kl posted:Ok maybe I'm misunderstanding how this would work since I'm not actual military guy, so please correct me. Wouldn't the individual members have to sign off before actually sending their forces? What's stopping president Le Pen from sayng, well he's not going to attack us, why would I risk getting Paris nuked for Lithuania? The NATO response force of 40,000 soldiers would immediately be deployed with no veto action possible by France or any individual member, they're NATO forces first and foremost. From there individual countries also determine what aid they would send. So you'll have soldiers from the US, France, Germany, the UK, etc fighting and dying on the ground before leaders make the decision to support and not, and dead soldiers is a very compelling argument for intervention. ranbo das fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Apr 10, 2022 |
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Apr 10, 2022 20:36
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Just waiting for the claims that NATO won't support the Baltics because they promised to invade Russia if they used chemical weapons in Ukraine.
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Apr 11, 2022 21:24
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TheFluff posted:
This was a very good and informative post and much appreciated
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Apr 12, 2022 01:46
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were of interest to someone.
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the white hand posted:Interesting, can you say more about this? Supporting defenders can be a proxy war. Even if you agree with it, the US and other states are arming Ukraine and have a dog in this fight. What other conditions would you postulate for it to meet that condition? The traditional definition would be a proxy war is instigated by an outside power who is not directly involved. A lot of the "proxy war" talk has been from Russia et al trying to claim that NATO is the real aggressor and forced them to invade Ukraine by existing I guess. Which is why you'll get pushback. No one was pushing for Ukraine to go to war.
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Apr 14, 2022 14:58
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cinci zoo sniper posted:My operating definition of Clancychat includes foreign armies marching into and conquering territory that Russia legally recognizes as its homeland. Ukraine also legally recognizes it as their homeland so I feel like there's a difference between Crimea and say Moscow. The most likely course is Ukraine can't/ doesn't retake it, but if this war went the likely course Russia would have won by now
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Apr 15, 2022 21:08
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Ola posted:Or perhaps he just did the right thing. Nah, suicide is never the right thing to do. Someone with that rank acting as a saboteur or informant could do much more damage alive than dead. Ramming his ship into another Russian warship would be the right thing to do
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Apr 18, 2022 17:57
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