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gently caress Erdogan.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:00
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IM_DA_DECIDER posted:Considering how there's literally attack helicopters shooting rockets into the city going to the embassy is probably not overreacting. But of course SA mods past histories with embassies hasnt exactly been great. It's much, much more dangerous to be in transit during a situation like this than to shelter in place. Security recommendations for civilians in conflict zones at companies I've worked with in the past are universally to stay put and let people in your organization and/or government know where you are. If they call for an evacuation of your nationality, then you try to get to the exit points. Until then, unless you're in a target location like a police station or government building, stay loving put and do not go outside into the area where helicopters may be shooting rockets.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:01
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Laphroaig posted:Get to an embassy immediately. I'm in the middle of nowhere, it would mean travelling hours at night to a major city where all this poo poo is going down. I'm making other arrangements.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:01
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VanSandman posted:Stay safe BM. Don't play Jabber Online.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:01
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quote:The full Turkish military statement reads: “Turkish Armed Forces have completely taken over the administration of the country to reinstate constitutional order, human rights and freedoms, the rule of law and general security that was damaged. Guardian has the full coup statement, and apparently Erdogan is out of the country.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:02
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kustomkarkommando posted:AFP implying an officers coup wern't the high ups in Erdogan pocket anyway?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:02
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Constant Hamprince posted:That's what we thought about Sisi. Yeah, before the Arab Spring this would've just been Tuesday in Turkey, but after I'm a lot more worried. The last thing we need right now with the civil war in Syria and increased Kurdish separatist activity is someone in power who thinks Erdogan was too soft and respected rights too much.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:03
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Thug Lessons posted:At the risk of sounding alarmist, this is quite possibly the end of the rebels and the end of Rojava as well. So if you're cheering the coup, know that that's what you're cheering for. Wouldn't the US have far fewer scruples defending their kurdish allies against a coup force than against their other ally?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:03
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My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:03
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So what do you think was the boiling point for this apparently successful widely encompassing coup? Here's some options - Purported plan by Erdogan to go after current military leadership (Guellnists, sp?) - Previous numerous times Erdogan has purged military leadership - Turkey's economy woes - Fears of creeping Islamization (I would choose this if this happened in 10 years ago, I haven't seen anything suggesting anything particularly ambitious) - Turkey purporting to ally with Assad and Russia (this would be my current choice) - The lack of success fighting with the Kurds in the South - Gezi Park-like protest against corruption by the AKP - Erdogan's increasing moves to increase his own power, attempts at changing the constitution Writing all this makes me think Erdogan was really playing with fire this year.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:03
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Brown Moses posted:I'm in the middle of nowhere, it would mean travelling hours at night to a major city where all this poo poo is going down. I'm making other arrangements. Time to get into your Fulton gear. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fulton_surface-to-air_recovery_system
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Jul 15, 2016 22:04
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Thug Lessons posted:At the risk of sounding alarmist, this is quite possibly the end of the rebels and the end of Rojava as well. So if you're cheering the coup, know that that's what you're cheering for. It doen't have to be said, but you have no basis for this whatsoever. It wasn't like Erdogan was friendly to the YPG before.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:05
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? The response to the airport bombing or situation in the south?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:05
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Brown Moses posted:I'm in the middle of nowhere, it would mean travelling hours at night to a major city where all this poo poo is going down. I'm making other arrangements. Brown Moses confirmed to be spearheading conquest of Turkey.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:05
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? Lol no. For everything I can say about Erdogan he is a democratically elected leader with the support, however caveated, of the majority of the nation. This will get really ugly if it succeeds.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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Ilustforponydeath posted:This didn't work last time. Jesus christ. Brown Moses posted:I'm in the middle of nowhere, it would mean travelling hours at night to a major city where all this poo poo is going down. I'm making other arrangements. What are you doing instead? And also what were you doing in Turkey? Good luck.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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IM_DA_DECIDER posted:Wouldn't the US have far fewer scruples defending their kurdish allies against a coup force than against their other ally? They will not intervene against a NATO ally regardless of circumstances.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? Window of opportunity due to him leaving on a foreign trip, combined with rising internal tensions, security deterioration, and compromising the national secular order the army hjas prided itself on upholding in the past.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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Yep Anadolu reporting Hulusi Akar, chief of the general staff, being held hostage by an unknown group
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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 Blocking social media seems a little fruitless in the wake of a military uprising.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:06
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Notahippie posted:It's much, much more dangerous to be in transit during a situation like this than to shelter in place. Security recommendations for civilians in conflict zones at companies I've worked with in the past are universally to stay put and let people in your organization and/or government know where you are. If they call for an evacuation of your nationality, then you try to get to the exit points. Until then, unless you're in a target location like a police station or government building, stay loving put and do not go outside into the area where helicopters may be shooting rockets. A friend of mine was in a country in Africa that was being taken over by the military. My friend calls the British embassy, and the person who worked there asked him if he saw a tank coming down his street. My friend said no, the embassy person said unless you do just stay at home. Stay safe and hunkered down Brown Moses.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:07
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I wonder if Boris Johnson will read out his Erdogan poem when he makes a statement on this?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:07
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Shageletic posted:So what do you think was the boiling point for this apparently successful widely encompassing coup? Here's some options If Erdogan's out of the country, would that still make him the government in exile? Part of me wants Obama and everyone to go "Yeah...about that" and kick his rear end to the curb.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:07
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I mean other than the Kurds (which is a pretty big deal anyway) the military's stance on most things are probably more palatable for me/most people in this thread than Erdogan. But the fact that the Turkish army keeps having to execute a coup every decade when the reigning government doesn't just disband to avoid one doesn't speak to its long-term success. It doesn't matter if they depose one party of Islamists if the next one just gets voted in a few years later.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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Shageletic posted:It doen't have to be said, but you have no basis for this whatsoever. It wasn't like Erdogan was friendly to the YPG before. Okay but the military hardliners, believe it or not, make Erdogan look like Apo. They are also not very keen on Erdogan's jihadist friends in Syria and those are the only people propping up the rebellion at this point.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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As a long time lurker, just wanna say stay safe Brown Moses.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? From what I've followed on Turkey, Erdogan is essentially wanting to rewrite the constitution to make himself dictator. I'm guessing as soon as the HDP was chucked out and the majority in the legislature was assured for AKP's move, the military started planning. I think the specific catalyst is Erdogan being out of the country. Honestly, I'm surprised they hadn't done this a year or so ago during the purges. Erdogan made an enemy of the military in a country where the military prides itself on being the protector of Ataturk's legacy. Whether they actually are or not is irrelevant, because the military thinks they are, and thus are invested in their status in the country. Erdogan trying to kick them to the curb was asking for this.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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Mr. Gibbycrumbles posted:I wonder if Boris Johnson will read out his Erdogan poem when he makes a statement on this? His first move with SIS, to reduce diplomatic embarrassment.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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I'm not a military strategist but I think the military can probably win a fight against police and citizens.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:08
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People on Twitter believing things henceforth are going to be good if Erdogan's ousted. Sure, gently caress him, but do we have any idea who's even behind this? Are there elements in the military who're worse than Erdogan?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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Reports that helicopter was firing on MiT headquarters
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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Young Freud posted:If Erdogan's out of the country, would that still make him the government in exile? Part of me wants Obama and everyone to go "Yeah...about that" and kick his rear end to the curb. I guess he will become another Yanukovich unless his cronies push back against the military effectively enough / the uprising turns out to be more limited than it seems.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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Insurrectionist posted:I mean other than the Kurds (which is a pretty big deal anyway) the military's stance on most things are probably more palatable for me/most people in this thread than Erdogan. But the fact that the Turkish army keeps having to execute a coup every decade when the reigning government doesn't just disband to avoid one doesn't speak to its long-term success. It doesn't matter if they depose one party of Islamists if the next one just gets voted in a few years later. Yeah it's Morsi all over again.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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Fuligin posted:My very sketchy understanding is that the Turkish military has generally operated as a safeguard of democracy, right? I know Erdogan is an increasingly authoritarian shitheel, but was there something in the past few weeks that might have directly precipitated action this drastic? They've traditionally acted against left wing and islamist governments. "Purged" might be the better word. They could care less about democracy.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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cheesetriangles posted:I'm not a military strategist but I think the military can probably win a fight against police and citizens. Not according AMerican second amendment worshippers.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:09
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cheesetriangles posted:I'm not a military strategist but I think the military can probably win a fight against police and citizens. The question is whether it's the entire military, or a faction.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:11
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cheesetriangles posted:I'm not a military strategist but I think the military can probably win a fight against police and citizens. Depends on how many they're willing to kill.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:11
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Young Freud posted:If Erdogan's out of the country, would that still make him the government in exile? Part of me wants Obama and everyone to go "Yeah...about that" and kick his rear end to the curb. From past history? Hell no. Western governments will work with whoever controls the military.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:11
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kustomkarkommando posted:Yep Anadolu reporting Hulusi Akar, chief of the general staff, being held hostage by an unknown group is he a erdogan supporter or dissenter?
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Jul 15, 2016 22:12
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Shageletic posted:So what do you think was the boiling point for this apparently successful widely encompassing coup? Here's some options This coup must have been long in the making, but lately Erdogan was trying to purge the judiciary. If you planning to do a coup that's the alarm bell for you.
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Jul 15, 2016 22:12
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