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MiddleOne posted:They are cool and good.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:53
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Brainiac Five posted:I love it when Europeans, obese and bloated on the blood and sweat of the Global South, sneer about Americans to distract from their complicity in and service to evil. I love it when Internet "leftists" do all they can to undermine their own movement rhetorically, also worship a series of mass produced commodities made for profit by some of the worst corporations on the planet to suck money out of foreign countries and out of working class pockets while stupifying people with politically benign entertainment.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:53
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Are we going to hold the genocide Olympics now? Announce your change of trolling plans so we can respond accordingly tyvm. Yeah quoting myself, so what?
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Oct 22, 2016 18:53
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Are we going to hold the genocide Olympics now? They were held already and America won. They have a whole continent purged of the red savage to frack to their hearts content.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:56
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Brainiac Five posted:Now, steiny may be a fascist or just a "paleoconservative" like Riso, but You loving nitwit, living in a region has nothing to with blood ties, nor does its regional history. I identify with my home city, with its history and tradition, yet I wasn't even born in Europe. Now stop having your meltdown in here and go smoke a cigarette or something.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:56
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Are we going to hold the genocide Olympics now? Announce your change of trolling plans so we can respond accordingly tyvm. What? No, I'm talking about the global system of extraction of labor and resources from the Global South which y'all benefit from as much as the US does, even if you keep the bloodshed at more of a remove. From an anti-imperialist perspective, Europeans bear no moral superiority over Americans or Japanese or Australians, and all alike are nothing but labor aristocrats. Obsessing about your own superiority is nothing more than a narcissism hopefully to be relieved by hard labor under the watchful eye of a Naxal guard unit. steinrokkan posted:I love it when Internet "leftists" do all they can to undermine their own movement rhetorically, also worship a series of mass produced commodities made for profit by some of the worst corporations on the planet to suck money out of foreign countries and out of working class pockets while stupifying people with politically benign entertainment. I love it when the right thinks their babbling is anything more than the squeals of pigs and bleats of sheep. Especially when they insist they're the true left, the kind that emphasizes a peasant lifestyle free from the tyranny of the city and of the malevolent overlords that produce Hollywood trash. Raspberry Jam It In Me posted:You loving nitwit, living in a region has nothing to with blood ties, nor does its regional history. I identify with my home city, with its history and tradition, yet I wasn't even born in Europe. I appreciate that you have already put yourself under sentence of death by lung cancer. Saves time.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:57
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Brainiac Five posted:What? No, I'm talking about the global system of extraction of labor and resources from the Global South which y'all benefit from as much as the US does, even if you keep the bloodshed at more of a remove. From an anti-imperialist perspective, Europeans bear no moral superiority over Americans or Japanese or Australians, and all alike are nothing but labor aristocrats. Obsessing about your own superiority is nothing more than a narcissism hopefully to be relieved by hard labor under the watchful eye of a Naxal guard unit. PDOs don't extract nothing from the Global South. By definition. By mere definition.
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Oct 22, 2016 18:59
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:PDOs don't extract nothing from the Global South. By definition. By mere definition. Not talking about that, talking about your delusional feelings of superiority over Americans, dumbass.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:01
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steinrokkan posted:I love it when Internet "leftists" do all they can to undermine their own movement rhetorically, also worship a series of mass produced commodities made for profit by some of the worst corporations on the planet to suck money out of foreign countries and out of working class pockets while stupifying people with politically benign entertainment. Ah yes, unlike proud local company Paneuro Foodamalgam AG which definitely isn't mass-producing food for profit, because it meets the PDO requirements.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:02
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Brainiac Five posted:Not talking about that, talking about your delusional feelings of superiority over Americans, dumbass. Stop derailing the thread then. PDOs are really important and I could post about them for pages at lenght.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:03
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"Look if I invent some dumb point about PDO being a protected designation of ethnicity instead of being what it actually is, I can then pretend that you defend PDOs because you are racists!!!!" --Someone calling himself 'brainiac'
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Oct 22, 2016 19:07
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Stop derailing the thread then. PDOs are really important and I could post about them for pages at lenght. Can you take up a cigarette habit like the other guy so I can feel safely assured your whining about "derailing" will be cut short by emphysema? Anyways, this "peasant village" socialism being implicitly endorsed by supposed "leftists", since you are apparently not primitivist socialists, would necessarily rely on other people to support you, but these would be damned as rootless, cosmopolitan, detached from the earth. That is, a new hierarchy, one which emphasizes the peasant toiling in the vineyards and with their cows, while the industrial laborer is condemned to damnation. What a beautiful vision! What an egalitarian goal! Cat Mattress posted:"Look if I invent some dumb point about PDO being a protected designation of ethnicity instead of being what it actually is, I can then pretend that you defend PDOs because you are racists!!!!" --Someone calling himself 'brainiac' steinrokkan posted:The idea that the descendants of the people who invented certain foods and beverages and passed the formulas from generation to generation should be able to retain control over the good name and rooted identity of their heritage is FASCISTIC and INCONVENIENT TO THE CAPITALIST SYSTEM. Is "steinrokkan" Czech for "brainiac", or do you feel the need to cluster together against the rootless, cultureless, American?
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Oct 22, 2016 19:07
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fishmech posted:Ah yes, unlike proud local company Paneuro Foodamalgam AG which definitely isn't mass-producing food for profit, because it meets the PDO requirements. You are right, the rules should possibly be tighter. Nevertheless, I believe that in most cases the inherent nature of the requirements is such that even if the final packaging plant or, say the brewing process, is part of a large conglomerate, the preceding production steps are made by small units who e.g. take care of cultivating and monitoring the crops and soil whose specific characteristics are part of the regional denomination requirements. There is probably a lot of space for coupling e.g. the mechanisms of regional protection with CAP targeted small farmer subsidies. Anyway, I follow the Brainiac schhol of thought - corporations are great and cool if I like them.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:07
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Brainiac Five posted:Can you take up a cigarette habit like the other guy so I can feel safely assured your whining about "derailing" will be cut short by emphysema? Wait wait wait hold on, dude, hold on. Do you think the people who benefit from a PDO are toiling the earth and eating mud because they're trapped in some sort of medieval nightmare while the factory worker ubermensch can look toward a brighter future by voting strait Liberal in the next election cycle or what? What with the weird dichotomy between bad rural people and elightened city folks who know better what's for them? Do you think the rest of the world is some sort of greater Texas with a few beacons of light, capital cities, hopeless fighting a losing battle with entrenched bigoted lowbrow inhebriated chain-somking incest-conceived dumbfucks? You can't possibly be THAT American... 
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Oct 22, 2016 19:14
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Wait wait wait hold on, dude, hold on. Do you think the people who benefit from a PDO are toiling the earth and eating mud because they're trapped in some sort of medieval nightmare while the factory worker ubermensch can look toward a brighter future by voting strait Liberal in the next election cycle or what? Try reading the rural poverty thread in this subforum, lots of goons just hate all things rural because they have always lived in the city, and because american countryside is more often than not a depopulated wasteland.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:16
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Pinch Me Im Meming posted:Wait wait wait hold on, dude, hold on. Do you think the people who benefit from a PDO are toiling the earth and eating mud because they're trapped in some sort of medieval nightmare while the factory worker ubermensch can look toward a brighter future by voting strait Liberal in the next election cycle or what? No, I'm talking about how there's this absurd idealization of rural people as superior to urban people, with an interesting tinge of antisemitism that is hopefully accidental. You responding with some insane garbage about how much you hate factory workers and insist rural people are the most enlightened section of humanity actually only reinforces this belief. Like, I am fine with, so long as people are allowed to leave, letting you Euros demolish all your cities and factories and enacting the Morgenthau plan on yourselves globally. But I don't think that this should be enacted universally. If this makes me an American, apparently the source of all evil in the world, then whatever. I'll leave you to your masturbation.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:19
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Brainiac Five posted:No, I'm talking about how there's this absurd idealization of rural people as superior to urban people, with an interesting tinge of antisemitism that is hopefully accidental. You responding with some insane garbage about how much you hate factory workers and insist rural people are the most enlightened section of humanity actually only reinforces this belief. Like, I am fine with, so long as people are allowed to leave, letting you Euros demolish all your cities and factories and enacting the Morgenthau plan on yourselves globally. But I don't think that this should be enacted universally. If this makes me an American, apparently the source of all evil in the world, then whatever. I'll leave you to your masturbation. 
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Oct 22, 2016 19:21
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Apparently, European socialism is all about altering the existing hierarchies rather than demolishing them. No wonder y'all defend a jackass who posts about the demon SJWs.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:22
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Brainiac Five posted:Is "steinrokkan" Czech for "brainiac", or do you feel the need to cluster together against the rootless, cultureless, American? I'm not responsible for steinrokkan's posts and I'm sorry to say but nothing in the legal definitions of PDO & co. require people to belong to a particular set of families. So perhaps instead of tilting at the windmills of one internet forum person's post you could look at the actual factual reality? Brainiac Five posted:No, I'm talking about how there's this absurd idealization of rural people as superior to urban people, with an interesting tinge of antisemitism that is hopefully accidental. You responding with some insane garbage about how much you hate factory workers and insist rural people are the most enlightened section of humanity actually only reinforces this belief. Like, I am fine with, so long as people are allowed to leave, letting you Euros demolish all your cities and factories and enacting the Morgenthau plan on yourselves globally. But I don't think that this should be enacted universally. If this makes me an American, apparently the source of all evil in the world, then whatever. I'll leave you to your masturbation. Wow, more windmill tilting. I guess of all European countries, the one you hate the most is the Netherlands.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:24
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Cat Mattress posted:I'm not responsible for steinrokkan's posts and I'm sorry to say but nothing in the legal definitions of PDO & co. require people to belong to a particular set of families. So perhaps instead of tilting at the windmills of one internet forum person's post you could look at the actual factual reality? But I'm not saying that about PDOs generally, since I'm contrasting the reality of PDOs with steinrokkan's ideas he won't defend. So you're just relying on me somehow forgetting the content of my posts and sucking your diseased Euro dick. Not happening. Or, rather, instead of arguing against what is actually said, you are defending an imaginary argument because your feeble little brain can't deal with the horrifying prospect of thinking. I do like that, instead of repudiating a fetishization of a particular kind of labor, you guys just show off your manifold personality defects.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:28
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steinrokkan posted:You are right, the rules should possibly be tighter. Nevertheless, I believe that in most cases the inherent nature of the requirements is such that even if the final packaging plant or, say the brewing process, is part of a large conglomerate, the preceding production steps are made by small units who e.g. take care of cultivating and monitoring the crops and soil whose specific characteristics are part of the regional denomination requirements. There is probably a lot of space for coupling e.g. the mechanisms of regional protection with CAP targeted small farmer subsidies. Europe should actually subsidise farming less, and small farmers are not some special needs class worthy of protection. The spinning frame obsoleted yarnmakers and the gps guided tractor obsoletes ~~~traditional farmers~~~.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:29
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I CANNOT EJACULATE WITHOUT SEEING NATIVE AMERICANS BRUTALISED!
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I won't defend my ideas because I never expressed them. If you picked up on some hint of something because of one marginally misused word in a ESL poster's sentence, you are just a pedantic rear end in a top hat.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:29
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steinrokkan posted:You are right, the rules should possibly be tighter. Nevertheless, I believe that in most cases the inherent nature of the requirements is such that even if the final packaging plant or, say the brewing process, is part of a large conglomerate, the preceding production steps are made by small units who e.g. take care of cultivating and monitoring the crops and soil whose specific characteristics are part of the regional denomination requirements. There is probably a lot of space for coupling e.g. the mechanisms of regional protection with CAP targeted small farmer subsidies. I feel like the PDO requirements as they tend to be now are exactly the kind of half-baked doesn't-fix-the-problem solution that everyone claims the whole EU is, as it stands now. They do very little to protect actual small time producers in the regions in question, unless those people already had pretty good collective-action going before it came in.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:29
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Brainiac Five posted:Apparently, European socialism is all about altering the existing hierarchies rather than demolishing them. No wonder y'all defend a jackass who posts about the demon SJWs.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:32
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steinrokkan posted:I won't defend my ideas because I never expressed them. If you picked up on some hint of something because of one marginally misused word in a ESL poster's sentence, you are just a pedantic rear end in a top hat. You talked about the whole "connection between blood and land" thing over multiple posts, and now are trying to pretend you weren't and that I'm bullying you, as though all the goddamn thread weren't rushing to defend your dysenteric rear end anyways. A Buttery Pastry posted:To be fair, the same criticism be made against the typical focus of "SJWs". That being the altering of existing capitalist hierarchies to be inclusive to minorities of all types. In conclusion; nuclear war is better than PDO discussions. To be fair, the USA should militarily intervene to protect refugees in Europe. Brainiac Five fucked around with this message at 19:34 on Oct 22, 2016 |
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Oct 22, 2016 19:32
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blowfish posted:Europe should actually subsidise farming less, and small farmers are not some special needs class worthy of protection. The spinning frame obsoleted yarnmakers and the gps guided tractor obsoletes ~~~traditional farmers~~~. A cultivated countryside is nowadays mainly a zone for recreation away from the city, and to fulfill that function, it requires lots of manpower engaged in jobs that are not really marketable, and work more like public goods.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:32
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Brainiac Five posted:You talked about the whole "connection between blood and land" thing over multiple posts, and now are trying to pretend you weren't and that I'm bullying you, as though all the goddamn thread weren't rushing to defend your dysenteric rear end anyways. I never said anything about blood and land, you idiot, I said that local population should be able to protect the meaning of trade practices it historically devised by empowering the current generation of producers, you read some stupid ethnic meaning into it.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:33
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steinrokkan posted:I never said anything about blood and land, you idiot, I said that local population should be able to protect the meaning of trade practices it historically devised by empowering the current generation of producers, you read some stupid ethnic meaning into it. steinrokkan posted:I understand that it's difficult for Americans itt to grasp the concept of culture, but some people have an appreciation for the connection between a thing and the land and people who made it and perceive it as a sort of value in itself, and do not take kindly to impostors trying to turn this cultural connection into a marketing gimmick. Like, I can quote your own words right back at you. This tactic of pretending to be stupid is a fruitless one.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:36
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Brainiac Five posted:Like, I can quote your own words right back at you. This tactic of pretending to be stupid is a fruitless one. "People who made it" are you saying that people do not make things or what? I don't care if Champagne is made by Polish immigrant, I care if they went to Champagne to work in the towns and vineyards there and learned from the local experts how to do things properly, and that in twenty years they will pass the learned skills to another generation of people in Champagne, whether they were born there or not. I also hope this will contribute to the harmony among the people in the region, who now have some common cultural heritage to care about and to use for their own wellbeing. You are obsessed.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:38
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fishmech posted:I feel like the PDO requirements as they tend to be now are exactly the kind of half-baked doesn't-fix-the-problem solution that everyone claims the whole EU is, as it stands now. They do very little to protect actual small time producers in the regions in question, unless those people already had pretty good collective-action going before it came in. steinrokkan posted:A cultivated countryside is nowadays mainly a zone for recreation away from the city, and to fulfill that function, it requires lots of manpower engaged in jobs that are not really marketable, and work more like public goods.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:39
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steinrokkan posted:"People who made it" are you saying that people do not make things or what? I don't care if Champagne is made by Polish immigrant, I care if they went to Champagne to work in the towns and vineyards there and learned from the local experts how to do things properly. You are obsessed. I'm saying that your emphasis is on the blood and not on the process. I am saying that your way of thinking is wrong, and because you have made it clear in god knows how many posts that you are not amenable to any sort of outside opinion that isn't already aligned with you, I must resort to the tactic of attempting to batter you into shutting up. This is not particularly efficient over long-distance communications, alas.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:41
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Brainiac Five posted:To be fair, the USA should militarily intervene to protect refugees in Europe. So you're not so much against "European superiority" on moral grounds, rather you just want to make it clear you believe in "American superiority". All wrapped up in posts and posts of obfuscating babble.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:43
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Tell us, in detail, how you would batter him if you were real close.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:43
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Brainiac Five posted:I'm saying that your emphasis is on the blood and not on the process. I am saying that your way of thinking is wrong, and because you have made it clear in god knows how many posts that you are not amenable to any sort of outside opinion that isn't already aligned with you, I must resort to the tactic of attempting to batter you into shutting up. This is not particularly efficient over long-distance communications, alas. Xes, I do think it's healthy that people like the place where they live, and do not think about it as just a place where they sleep and through which they commute to work. This attitude helps people to be happier, be more engaged with their commnity, and to take better care of their environment. It also makes them put more effort into their jobs, so they get better results and are under less stress. And anybody should be free to participate on this - which is fostered by EU's unprecedented protection of the freedom of movement of the individual  :
steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 19:46 on Oct 22, 2016 |
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Oct 22, 2016 19:43
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In my limited American understanding, I don't see how adulteration isn't orthogonal to PDOs. What bothers me about my country's food regulation is not that our cheddar cheese is allowed to be called cheddar, it's that it's allowed to be called cheese, even if it has ingredients which the law use to treat just like sawdust added to bread flour. By all means, please ban our "cheese" from your shores by saying it can only contain the four ingredients engraved on some medieval tablet. Frankly I hope you're doing that already. (I use america rather than china because the image of poisoned and polluted chinese products feels a little precious-bodily-fluid-y to me) But how is this PDO stuff not a regionalist-protectionist program, with nothing to do with food quality? I don't think it's bad to be protectionist, or to admit it. As was already said: GaussianCopula posted:A new producers only needs to abide by the rules set out by the EU with respect to the production process and location. It's simply a scheme to protect certain region from competition and the preamble of the Regulation specifically states that it's meant to protect "less-favoured or rural areas". Any company can make WhateverTheHeck, as long as they build the factory in the WhateverTheHeck region, and employ the marginal constituency therein, and everyone who already has a factory agrees that there should be another factory (which obviously could require other promises and investments). It's a clever system for distributing small but real (and sometimes meaningfully symbolic) economic boons to all sorts of folks. A sophisticated, even cultured kind of pork barrel. But how does it make food safer or better? I'm half-expecting to be realize the answer is obvious and that I'm actually an idiot, since I just made a post essentially in agreement with a guy who says things like: Brainiac Five posted:Supposedly, European educational systems are better than American ones, but this seems handily disproved by the intellectual abilities on display here.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:46
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Bring back the guilds.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:47
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Unfortunately the epidemic anomie of depressed and self-hating Americans makes them hateful, violent, and incapable of seeing the wisdom of allowing people to self-govern their communities, and decide about the future of their communal intangible property.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:48
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Doc Hawkins posted:Any company can make WhateverTheHeck, as long as they build the factory in the WhateverTheHeck region, and employ the marginal constituency therein, and everyone who already has a factory agrees that there should be another factory (which obviously could require other promises and investments). It's a clever system for distributing small but real (and sometimes meaningfully symbolic) economic boons to all sorts of folks. A sophisticated, even cultured kind of pork barrel. But how does it make food safer or better? It doesn't make safety better, as far as I know. Maybe the opposite, if the particular standard codifies practices that would be otherwise deemed impermissible? Health regulations are a separate matter. steinrokkan fucked around with this message at 19:54 on Oct 22, 2016 |
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Oct 22, 2016 19:50
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Doc Hawkins posted:(I use america rather than china because the image of poisoned and polluted chinese products feels a little precious-bodily-fluid-y to me)
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Oct 22, 2016 19:53
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Regarde Aduck posted:So you're not so much against "European superiority" on moral grounds, rather you just want to make it clear you believe in "American superiority". All wrapped up in posts and posts of obfuscating babble. On the contrary, I'm replying to some hateful nonsense built on a neutral observation in kind. There's plenty of liberal antiracism and feminism and so on, and it would be moral to guarantee the safety of refugees against possible pogroms. doverhog posted:Tell us, in detail, how you would batter him if you were real close. Why do Finns think they have a right to talk? Doc Hawkins posted:I'm half-expecting to be realize the answer is obvious and that I'm actually an idiot, since I just made a post essentially in agreement with a guy who says things like: You're an idiot because you think acquiescence to gibes is moral and responding in kind is immoral. Without having authority over the other person, suffering such things in silence only presents you as an easy mark. steinrokkan posted:Xes, I do think it's healthy that people like the place where they live, and do not think about it as just a place where they sleep and through which they commute to work. This attitude helps people to be happier, be more engaged with their commnity, and to take better care of their environment. It also makes them put more effort into their jobs, so they get better results and are under less stress. And anybody should be free to participate on this - which is fostered by EU's unprecedented protection of the freedom of movement of the individual I'm in favor of dragging you to America and watching you curl up and die like a beetle, since you're so terrified of the place. Just put you in sight of a soul food restaurant and listen to the music you make as you shriek in pain and horror.
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Oct 22, 2016 19:57
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