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Tom Perez B/K/M? This poll is closed. |
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77 | 25.50% |
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160 | 52.98% |
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65 | 21.52% |
| Total: | 229 votes | ||
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Sneakster posted:I don't want to turn Trump thread into bitching about DNC, but Ossoff is such a pathetically weak candidate that against the weakest imaginable opposition and almost every other factor involved in his favor, he was so weak that his loss is probably the specific reason the DNC decided to throw women's rights under the bus to peel off just a just a few more Republicans to not have to compromise the donors. He's a loser, right down to the quarks and gluons keeping him from liquefying in place. I'm just not going to talk about DNC stuff in there anymore, at least until we get a better view of who's running in 2018 and 2020. There's a lot of ego tied into insisting, "We couldn't have done any better than Hillary/Ossoff/Lieberman." evilweasel had a bit of a meltdown earlier this week over me suggesting that maybe, perhaps just maybe, Blanche Lincoln wasn't a very good politician. 
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Aug 11, 2017 01:27
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Yeah that was weird.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:33
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Yeah, I really didn't mean to set that off about the DNC, but I'm starting to suspect embarrassed republicans might feel a little self-conscious about how embarrassingly bad center right candidates are reflect on who'd they'd vote for if the alternative wasn't frothing nazis.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:35
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The scary ones are the people that admit if a leftist candidate gets nominated somehow they won't vote meaning they prefer fascism and nazis. I don't think I've seen those people here but there's tons of dorks with #resist on their twitter profile that are proud to say it.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:39
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Both parties have shifted to the right since the 70s with a reprieve on social issues because its good PR for big business. If the democrats are successful in picking off enough of the upper middle class that Republicans demographically collapse it could give room to DSA to establish some space to drain out the left of the democrats while the GOP is too radicalized to maintain a national presence. Thinking Trump is a retard is clearly not enough to bridge some ideological gaps and being willing to caucus with the Democrats isn't enough to sustain investment in a party that represents me only the most token issues. Ironically dismantling the electoral college is probably the only way the Republicans can win a presidential election after Texas goes blue.
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Aug 11, 2017 01:49
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People that were proven wrong desperately shout "how dare you hold me accountable for my views", film at 11
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Aug 11, 2017 05:37
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Call Me Charlie posted:Your long history of 'misremembering' and twisting people's positions is worse than my belief that we need to stop our proxy war with Russia over Syria, which caused the refugee crisis, instead of pretending we're humanitarians for taking 10,000 (or 80,000) refugees a year from Jordan/Turkey as we continue to flood their homeland with weapons. I don't think anyone here is against stopping the crisis that's creating the refugees. What's bizarre is that you seem to think that we have to stop accepting refugees to make that happen. It's a very strange thing to be insisting upon, and it makes people think there's something wrong with your head, hth.
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Aug 11, 2017 07:11
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Radish posted:The scary ones are the people that admit if a leftist candidate gets nominated somehow they won't vote meaning they prefer fascism and nazis. I don't think I've seen those people here but there's tons of dorks with #resist on their twitter profile that are proud to say it. Do I need to post the fishhook theory image again? Its true every goddamn time.
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Aug 11, 2017 08:11
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Sneakster posted:Both parties have shifted to the right since the 70s with a reprieve on social issues because its good PR for big business. If the democrats are successful in picking off enough of the upper middle class that Republicans demographically collapse it could give room to DSA to establish some space to drain out the left of the democrats while the GOP is too radicalized to maintain a national presence. Thinking Trump is a retard is clearly not enough to bridge some ideological gaps and being willing to caucus with the Democrats isn't enough to sustain investment in a party that represents me only the most token issues. This implies that the Democrats would be in any way successful at attracting upper middle class Republicans.
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Aug 11, 2017 09:22
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Based off the Trump thread having people who voted GOP post Bush and being hostile to reductions in federal subsidies that prop up segregation, they clearly are. The DNC has been courting the professional class for decades, the GOP is firmly the billionaire and nazi vote. Sneakster fucked around with this message at 14:11 on Aug 11, 2017 |
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Aug 11, 2017 12:29
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In that case, that the professional class isn't pretty drat small in the first place and shrinking rapidly with the economic clusterfuck.
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Aug 11, 2017 12:43
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https://twitter.com/brandyljensen/status/895988825234821120
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Aug 11, 2017 14:02
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she should credit dril if she's gonna paraphrase his "actually there's zero difference between good things and bad things" tweet. also, she's wrong. keith ellison is a perfectly lovely person and brain disease free. ditto bernie and nina turner
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Aug 11, 2017 14:06
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Condiv posted:she should credit dril if she's gonna paraphrase his "actually there's zero difference between good things and bad things" tweet.
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Aug 11, 2017 14:15
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Sneakster posted:Sanders is great because he's clearly mentally ill. The first thing he said waking back up from surgery was something about healthcare being a human right. He just constantly rants about poverty, there's years of videos of him just castigating congress over it. Thats a big part of the reason I trust the guy, he's unhinged enough to actually believe in socialism the same way Ron Paul is unhinged enough to support letters of Marque and that welfare causes crime. there's nothing mentally ill about wanting to help the poor and having a good heart. anyone who does care about the poor would be ranting about the world we live in now, which basically treats the poor as nuisances that can't die fast enough Condiv fucked around with this message at 14:19 on Aug 11, 2017 |
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Aug 11, 2017 14:16
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Condiv posted:there's nothing mentally ill about wanting to help the poor and having a good heart This would be him if he was normal. Condiv posted:anyone who does care about the poor would be ranting about the world we live in now, which basically treats the poor as nuisances that can't die fast enough
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Aug 11, 2017 14:28
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Sneakster posted:I don't want to turn Trump thread into bitching about DNC, but Ossoff is such a pathetically weak candidate that against the weakest imaginable opposition and almost every other factor involved in his favor, he was so weak that his loss is probably the specific reason the DNC decided to throw women's rights under the bus to peel off just a just a few more Republicans to not have to compromise the donors. He's a loser, right down to the quarks and gluons keeping him from liquefying in place. It's interesting that your takeaway from GA-6 is deficiency in the candidate as the cause for the defeat. That's plausible, but what if the lesson is the opposite? That individual candidates matter less than macro-level party shifts? It also is interesting that voting patterns in that election resembled closely the previous Presidential election. You could even use this viewpoint as a framework for more leftward movement in the party: "People vote primarily based on party ID. We don't need to worry about appeasing more moderate Democrats with higher turnout rates, because we can assume that they will vote for us anyway out of party loyalty. Instead, we need to retool the party in a broad way to pick up lower turnout voters with a more leftward message. Broad change is what is needed, not a focus on the individual failings of each candidate" Notice too how more moderate Republican voters turned out for Trump and Handel, even when the Republicans took measures to to expand their electorate by shifting rightward.
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Aug 11, 2017 14:34
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A more leftward shift would alienate donors and require raising taxes further alienating gains with centrists. People in the Trump thread were livid at the idea of raising taxes on the loving 90th percentile, and those are people who are democrats. Poor people barely vote and certainly can't afford to fund candidates, it's a calculated move by the DNC to minimize donor liability and maximize electoral viability. It is impossible to exaggerate how terrible a candidate Ossoff was.
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Aug 11, 2017 14:42
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Sneakster posted:A more leftward shift would alienate donors and require raising taxes further alienating gains with centrists. People in the Trump thread were livid at the idea of raising taxes on the loving 90th percentile, and those are people who are democrats. Poor people barely vote and certainly can't afford to fund candidates, it's a calculated move by the DNC to minimize donor liability and maximize electoral viability. I suppose the argument there would be that moderate Democrats would be as hesitant to abandon their party as moderate Republicans have to abandon theirs, and that party ID is the biggest predictor of how these people will vote, not issue bases. The gains are to be made on the margins.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:10
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Those margins would reduce donor funding.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:15
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Democrazy posted:I suppose the argument there would be that moderate Democrats would be as hesitant to abandon their party as moderate Republicans have to abandon theirs, and that party ID is the biggest predictor of how these people will vote, not issue bases. The gains are to be made on the margins. nah, they'll drop the party the second they have to shoulder the tiniest bit of burden to make sure the poor aren't living in misery. i still can't believe all the centrists in the trump thread clutching their pearls over people with $500K+ mortgages getting a tiny bit less help from the government. meanwhile, these same people told us all through 2016 that we were being selfish and wanting free stuff when we ask for programs that would help the poor like medicare for all or free access to college for anyone who is smart enough to get in
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Aug 11, 2017 15:16
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Sneakster posted:Those margins would reduce donor funding. Maybe, but internet fundraising and targeting is making the bundler less valuable than they were a decade ago, and, aside from non-ideological patronage donors, tend to be pretty strong D anyway. The moderates of the party may complain, but if the Republican experience is anything to go on, they won't switch parties or stop voting. It's in their nature to compromise and participate.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:37
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Democrazy posted:Maybe, but internet fundraising and targeting is making the bundler less valuable than they were a decade ago, and, aside from non-ideological patronage donors, tend to be pretty strong D anyway. If the Republicans dismantle the electoral college to maintain viability post Trump, voting will dramatically increase simply due to every vote actually mattering rather than disengaging landslide states.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:47
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Sneakster posted:Those margins would reduce donor funding. Good! gently caress those donors. Get the money from the people. Put forth candidates like Bernie and Ellison and DSA endorsed candidates. Or even better, all campaigns are publicly funded like in other countries. gently caress. Those. Donors. And. gently caress. The. Grifters. Who. Take. Their. Money.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:55
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Turns out money doesn't influence politicians or political organizations. Imagine that.
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Aug 11, 2017 15:57
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It's more like it turns out pouring money into politics has diminishing returns when you end up with politicians literally unable to say they have policies that will help people.
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Aug 11, 2017 16:10
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Radish posted:The scary ones are the people that admit if a leftist candidate gets nominated somehow they won't vote meaning they prefer fascism and nazis. I don't think I've seen those people here but there's tons of dorks with #resist on their twitter profile that are proud to say it. They're here, they post in the Trump thread.
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Aug 11, 2017 21:35
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For Joementum: https://twitter.com/jamyerson/status/896154710603845632
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Aug 12, 2017 02:53
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What the gently caress is this argument that Donald "I'm going to bomb the poo poo out of them!" Trump ran against war?
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Aug 12, 2017 03:03
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https://twitter.com/chrislhayes/status/896155627617005568
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Aug 12, 2017 03:06
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WampaLord posted:What the gently caress is this argument that Donald "I'm going to bomb the poo poo out of them!" Trump ran against war? He did run against war. He also ran for war. It was part of his schtick of saying everything. He criticised basically every war America had been in since WWII and said he would focus on America first instead of getting into dumb wars over nothing. If you wanted you could very easily have seen Trump as the anti-war candidate.
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Aug 12, 2017 03:36
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Trump ran on the campaign equivalent of button-mashing in a fighting game.
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Aug 12, 2017 04:21
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Inescapable Duck posted:Trump ran on the campaign equivalent of button-mashing in a fighting game. He was E. Honda just spamming the hundred hand slap, while Hillary didn't know up on the stick could make you jump- or that her character could throw fireballs.
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Aug 12, 2017 04:39
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Hope the centrists are enjoying their gettogether in Charlottesville today.
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Aug 12, 2017 07:17
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Futuresight posted:He did run against war. He also ran for war. It was part of his schtick of saying everything. He criticised basically every war America had been in since WWII and said he would focus on America first instead of getting into dumb wars over nothing. If you wanted you could very easily have seen Trump as the anti-war candidate. He ran against the stupid wars that the Bushs and Clintons of the world love while also saying he would be extremely tough on terrorist groups like ISIS....which sounds stupid until you realize that's what most americans want. Call Me Charlie fucked around with this message at 18:05 on Aug 12, 2017 |
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Aug 12, 2017 17:11
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Has any Democrat of note addressed the Charleston debacle? Or are they still triangulating and calculating how many potential voters they might alienate?
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Aug 12, 2017 17:50
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Sephyr posted:Has any Democrat of note addressed the Charleston debacle? Or are they still triangulating and calculating how many potential voters they might alienate? https://twitter.com/andrewperezdc/status/896397414248087554
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Aug 12, 2017 17:54
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Sephyr posted:Has any Democrat of note addressed the Charleston debacle? Or are they still triangulating and calculating how many potential voters they might alienate? https://twitter.com/billclinton/status/896419211362410496
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Aug 12, 2017 18:15
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We really need to start ignoring Neera. She is very dumb and bad.
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Aug 12, 2017 18:22
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Matt Zerella posted:We really need to start ignoring Neera. She is very dumb and bad. Her brain probably broke extra hard given she was likely going to be in the Clinton cabinet.
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