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Solice Kirsk posted:I liked how Jaqen H'ghar just kinda did the Neverending Story bookshop guy nod when Arya killed one of (the only other?) his assassins and ran away. Really gave that whole chapter a satisfying ending. I think you might be confusing the show and the books. I didn't like a lot of the changes the show made to the Arya in Harrenhal scenes, in the show Jaqen kills a ton of Lannister's to free Arya because she said his name as her last owed life. In the books she named him as the third kill and he kills a bunch of Lannister's to free a bunch of Northmen and basically Harrenhal ends up switching from Lannister hands to Bolton's but Arya is still a captive. She actually has to kill a guard on her own to escape, who she tricks into bending over by showing the coin Jaqen gave her and then she slits the guards throat and escapes with Hot Pie and Gendry. I liked the book version a lot better because it didn't have Arya requiring rescuing and she escaped on her own, plus it was her first 'trickster' kill and it was a nice foreshadow of her eventual facelessman trainjng
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May 31, 2019 19:31
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Robert was alive when he got back to the Kings Landing, he basically said to Ned the boar got him and it was his own fault
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May 31, 2019 19:35
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kcroy posted:Wait what now? How do we know this? She explicitly tells Jaimes that's exactly what happened. Jaime's basically tells her she disgusts him and to never talk to him again Jaime's Feast chapters are actually really loving good
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Jun 1, 2019 05:48
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kcroy posted:I knew she cut a side deal, but didn't realize it involved set up for the red wedding. I think you're actually right about this, she was working with the Lannister's but didn't know the exact plan, one of her sons dies during the battle and she gets all uppity with Jaime because Tywin didn't give her a heads up (and because Tywin apparently was secretly planning to marry the dead son to his bastard niece)
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Jun 1, 2019 22:36
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chaosapiant posted:How do we know Bloodraven is “controlling” Bran? I don't think he's controlling Bran but it seems pretty clear he's been warging into Mormont's raven and probably Ghost as well. The biggest hint of this is in the first book when the wight is trying to kill Mormont, the raven yells 'Burn!' which is pretty convenient as it inspires Jon to use the fire to kill the wight
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Jun 20, 2019 07:03
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I suppose so, but the links between Bloodraven and Ghost are more explicit I think. When Jon finds Ghost he 'hears' something in the bush which makes him go back and he finds Ghost. Kind of odd as Ghost doesn't make any sound. We get this scene from Bran's perspective, and Bran doesn't hear anything. Normally I'd say this was just a random scene but hearing a indistinguishable sound in the distance is very similar to what happens when we see Bran talk to Theon and Ned through the heart tree, so it seems like someone was talking to Jon. Then there's the fact that both Bloodraven and Ghost are described very similarly, as albinos with red eyes, makes me think that there has to be some connection between them. Plus Ghost being the one to randomly find the obsidian and the horn of winter on the fist of the first men implies to me that Bloodraven is probably trying to stop the Others. The other interesting Bloodraven theory that seems to almost certainly to be true is that Euron Greyjoy is a greenseer who was visited by Bloodraven as a boy, but something about Euron made Bloodraven reluctant to take him on as an apprentice (probably because Euron is loving nuts)
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Jun 20, 2019 08:41
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Chieves posted:Jaime once again neglecting all personal growth and happiness to return to an abusive and toxic ex hit home pretty hard for somebody who is at the age where friends from high school are doing that very thing right now! The Jaime show ending is what's convinced me that though DnD probably had some of the general endings of the hypothetical books I'm sure they changed a lot of poo poo too. I just finished Jaime's last chapter and basically his final two chapters in the books are the exact opposite of how it all ends in the show. In his second last chapter he breaks the siege of Riverrun and receives a letter from Cersei literally begging him to come help her after she's imprisoned by the High Sparrow. He throws the letter in the fire and thinks something like 'my duty is to Tommen, not Cersei' In his last chapter he ends the siege in the Blackwood's lands and meets up with Brienne who tells him that he has to come alone to fight the hound or else Sansa will die, and Jaime apparently just leaves his army and goes off all Willy nilly. It's kind of weird cause before he meets Brienne Jaime goes and fights Ilyne Payne and jokes about how lovely he still is fighting with his left hand. From Jaime's perspective going off to fight the hound to try and save Sansa with just Brienne as backup is insanely risky and would likely lead to his death, so him actually do it shows his change into a fundamentally honourable character. But in the shows it's 'nope actually I was evil all along, well off to fight Euron Greyjoy!' brienne: 'wait who the gently caress is Euron Greyjoy'
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Jun 27, 2019 21:08
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Calaveron posted:I had forgotten how obnoxious the chapter titles were in adwd No way, Theon slowing working his way from 'Reek' to 'Theon' in chapter titles was some of the best work GRRM has done
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Jul 9, 2019 00:02
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Intel&Sebastian posted:I'm being 100% honest when I say I wish he would just admit these will never be finished and walk away. It'd be embarrassing but I'd rather he just put everyone and himself out of their misery after ADWD turned out how it did. And really how much more embarrassing can it get than a bunch of HBO boob peddlers finishing off your lifes work for you because you couldn't be arsed into doing it yourself in less than a decade. I'll throw in a hot take and say that after my series re-read I'm of the opinion Dance is the second best book and maybe even the best It's a shame about the dr Seuss 'the more she drank the more she poo poo' line cause outside of that the Dany chapters are actually really loving good
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Jul 31, 2019 20:58
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kcroy posted:why tho? Tyrions chapters are poo poo and "where do whores go". Isn't Dany just moping about Daario and watching everything she built up turn to poo poo? Jon gets killed which is cool. Reek chapters are probably the best. Dance is when GRRM starts to go more 'deep' with his metaphors, and its quite subtle so most people miss what he is doing, I know I missed it my first time reading. I absolutely hated the Meereen chapters and was bored silly of them, but on a re-read I started to see what GRRM was aiming for, and knowing the ending of the series is 'Nazi Dany' the chapters make a lot more sense. Basically the Meereen chapters are about Dany's inner struggle, and her sexual choices are that inner struggle personified. She wants Daario, who she describes herself as "war and woe" He represents her 'fire and blood' desires and her conquerors instincts, but at this point shes still deluding herself (and the readers cause of POV bias) into thinking that she's a just ruler. Hizdahr represents peace and Meereen, which she finds unbearable and disgusting, there is a line in the chapters that really underscores this that is something like "she must return to her huband, Hizdahr of the tepid kisses, who had given her peace" Then there is the fun of trying to figure out all the murder mystery style subplots about who is the Harpy (the green grace) or who poisoned the locusts (Shakaz) which are also very subtly hinted at but not explicitly said and I think the Dany chapters are equal to the Theon chapters in terms of character development and subtle subplots. Tyrions chapters are kind of poo poo, but not as bad as most people say. Dance does have the problem where GRRM gets lazy with his writing and keeps repeating dumb phrases "where do whores go" "nipples on a breastplate" etc but I think the narrative is on a deeper level than any of the other books, even if the writing is technically worse. Near as I can tell the plot of the Tyrion chapters is that he is basically destroyed in the beginning, living only through hate and desire for vengeance. He doesn't think life is worth living and the only thing he wants is to see the destruction of his family. He's basically suicidal and constantly thinks about eating the poisonous mushrooms he found in his first chapter, only living because of his desire for vengeance. This all changes when he meets Penny, she represents innocence and goodness and Tyrion finds himself drawn to protecting her, even though he finds her naive and foolish. In the last chapter when they escape from their slave owners he finally throws away the mushrooms and risks himself to make sure Penny comes with him, for no other reason than he feels responsible for her. He's moved past his horrible little demon stage and is back to the Tyrion of the first three books. I can see why a lot of people don't like Dance, its not as action filled and more heavy on metaphors and hidden subplots and world building, but that's personally what I've always found most attractive about ASOIAF, as opposed to the standard fantasy poo poo about knights and dragons or whatever. People in this thread should re-read the books. They're actually pretty good
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Aug 7, 2019 03:29
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Shimrra Jamaane posted:What is Dany making GBS threads her brains out a metaphor for. drat you got me, in the book series that's longer than the bible and LotRs combined there are a couple of bad lines, the whole series is ruined
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Aug 7, 2019 03:56
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Sephyr posted:Tyrion's "horrible little demon" stage is barely a thing. He murders the woman who sold him out and the father who abused and insulted him, but pretty much all of his evil plans are passing fantasies that are done with by the time he's on the road to meet FakeAegon. And Tyrion's Wacky Slave Adventure is just embarrassing. Most of the stuff you're talking about is in Feast, not Dance,. I do agree with you about Brienne's story arc, we didn't need half a book of her doing nothing but being a character foil for Jaime. I'm curious what you mean by the "real story" though, isnt the real story whatever GRRM decides to write? There is a lot more to the story than just the battle against the Others, I personally am much more interested in how the 'Nazi Dany' plotline turns out, and I think the fAegon/Golden Company/Dorne stuff is going to prove very important into her eventual descent into madness. If the last books ever come out they won't I wouldnt be surprised if it ends up like the show and they end up dealing with the Others a lot faster than most people expect.
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Aug 8, 2019 01:16
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Collateral posted:The mountain that does not write has already gone on record to say that Danny is still in essos by the end of wow, but at least she gets to meet up with tyrion (right at the end). I think he said she was about to cross the narrow sea. So perhaps her host has walked across the continent through trial and tribulation, like that one crusade. I'm pretty sure this never happened? He stopped releasing WoW chapters years ago cause he didn't want to give up anymore of the story for free
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Aug 8, 2019 16:25
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I'm interested in seeing how the Iron fleet stuff all turns out, Victarion's chapters are full of Moqqoro predicting that Victarion is gonna get hosed eventually and Victarion just nodding along and not realizing he's getting hosed with
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Aug 9, 2019 02:20
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But on the other hand it was pretty smart when he hedged his bets and burned those 7 whores on the ship in the middle of an ocean as a sacrifice to the drowned god, the Red God and the Seven all at the same time
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Aug 9, 2019 19:34
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pseudanonymous posted:Only if that God is like, cool with him worshipping false idols and sacrificing in their name. This is not a common attribute of Gods. Victarion isn't much of a character that would try to put himself in the mind of a God though
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Aug 9, 2019 21:07
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Punkin Spunkin posted:So i finally read the books, and i thought they were entertaining. Really couldve done without a lot of the rape, misogyny, and racism, but since i wasnt waiting for the books i wasnt really disappointed by them. The last two were fine, i guess, and if he never writes anymore then thats also fine. Jon only threatens the baby so Gilly would give him up, he wouldn't have actually done anything. Half the reason he gets stabbed is because he (stupidly) keeps going out his way to protect randoms cause he's basically Ned and all Starks are dumb Wait thinking about it maybe it's like the Simpsons and only the male starks are idiots
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Aug 13, 2019 01:52
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Punkin Spunkin posted:I really appreciate Theon just being like "Well, Maester Luwin might be talking sense, I DO already have a buncha black clothes..." before Ramsay had to ruin it all. Presenting a potentially good future and then pulling the rug out from the character and the reader is a trope GRRM loves, it kind of gets repetitive but this is one of the best ones
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Aug 13, 2019 03:36
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Plus the Iron Islands are right across from the Wolfswood which is the biggest forest in Westeros
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Aug 13, 2019 14:50
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Mat Cauthon posted:Valyrian steel. Wasn't Ice (and a few other house swords) also like 6 feet long? I don't think Rhaegar had a Valyrian steel sword, Bloodraven took Dark Sister to the wall with him and the Golden Company has Blackfyre
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Sep 10, 2019 05:54
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Fire and Blood is poo poo, and I say that as someone who liked Feast for Crows
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Oct 6, 2019 16:29
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Solice Kirsk posted:The idiot writers for the show certainly backtracked. I could see GRRM sticking with it, but that would involve him writing and I don't think a random throw away line is a good example of foreshadowing unless you got serious Preston brain
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Oct 24, 2019 17:05
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Why are people using spoilers in this of all threads
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Nov 6, 2019 17:26
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OperaMouse posted:The constant saying that a kinslayer is cursed in the eyes of gods and men, and then one of main characters kills his father (although already dying due to poison). There has to be more to that, and the Tywin-Tyrion relationship. Why? Just because a bunch of characters say a thing doesn't mean it actually exists in the story reality. A lot of posters in this thread are really good at misidentifying throw away lines as foreshadowing
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Nov 15, 2019 08:56
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Calaveron posted:A lotta bad things happen to Tyrion after the kinslaying, kinda how bad things happen to the Freys after the bout of guestright breaking or the other kings after leech mania In the released winds chapter Euron goes on a big rant about how all Gods and societal norms are bogus and his evidence is that he's murdered three of his brothers, two when they were only babies and one playing the axe throwing game Book Euron is pretty crazy but he doesn't seemed cursed The MUMPSorceress posted:Asking again, how much of the woiaf content actually comes from grrm vs the wiki minifuckers? Everything in there was at least explicitly okayed by Martin, if not written by him. It's 'canon'. If we see Highgarden or Casterly Rock in the books, they will be like the woiaf descriptions A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 19:06 on Dec 3, 2019 |
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Dec 3, 2019 19:02
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A HORNY SWEARENGEN posted:Book Theon is the age of Robb, about 13/14. I'm pretty sure it's Jon that's the same age as Robb, Theon is several years older. I think he's 18 at the start of the series?
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Dec 3, 2019 19:23
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pseudanonymous posted:Really? I mean they're effectively not written by the same person. Spending 25 years between books means you've had a world of different experiences and thoughts... they don't really read like the same writer even to me. I can see liking the first 3, or liking the last 2, but having a uniform feelings about the whole series is beyond me. This is a really weird take. The books are all quite good, and the series will be regarded as one of the greatest fantasy series of all times. Just because you're bitter the books took forever to come out doesn't mean they aren't good. If Winds does ever come out I'm sure it will be great. 7th book ain't happening tho A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Jan 2, 2020 |
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Jan 2, 2020 20:19
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TommyGun85 posted:3 out of the 7 are good. Why do you have 6 pages of posts in a thread about a book series you don't even like?
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Jan 2, 2020 20:27
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Dance with Dragons is the best book in the series don't @ me
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Jan 2, 2020 20:31
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Intel&Sebastian posted:affc and adwd are just two halves of one bad book and even then he took out the climactic battle for some reason. They're quite bad. Besides maybe Jaime in Storm of Swords, Theon and Dany's* arc in Dance is some of the best writing GRRM has ever done *yes yes the dr suess diarrhea line was inexcusably bad Drone Jett posted:Imagine trying to defend a GRRM book in TYOOL 2018. The books that were released to widespread critical and fan acclaim?
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Jan 2, 2020 21:14
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Having just finished a re-read of the series I personally think GoT is easily the worst book of the bunch  Nice meltdown tho
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Jan 2, 2020 23:54
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Dapper_Swindler posted:honestly i am kinda surprised they never pulled off a good GOT/ASoLaF game. the best i can think of is a mount and blade mod. they had a really meh DA type rpg i believe. i remember hearing rumors one of the big publishers had one in the works but its way to late now. The GoT mod for Crusader Kings II is pretty good
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Jan 15, 2020 08:46
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whowhatwhere posted:Off the top of my head there's evidence that he might be Illyrio's son with a descendant of the Blackfyres (given how paternally Illyrio acts regarding Griff while giving no more than a mercenary poo poo about Viserys/Dany and the description of his wife sounding very Targaryen), plus it would explain why the Golden Company would drop everything to help him secure his claim (given they're all descendants of the army supporting the Blackfyres). There might be even more that I'm missing, however. There's also what appears to be foreshadowing in the story about the dragon signpost that Meribald talks about in one of Brienne's chapters. Given that the Blackfyre's sigil is a black dragon on red and the Targaryen sigil a red dragon I think this holds up quote:When the smith's son was an old man, a bastard son of the fourth Aegon rose up in rebellion against his trueborn brother and took for his sigil a black dragon. These lands belonged to Lord Darry then, and his lordship was fiercely loyal to the king. The sight of the black iron dragon made him wroth, so he cut down the post, hacked the sign into pieces, and cast them into the river. One of the dragon's heads washed up on the Quiet Isle many years later, though by that time is was red with rust.
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Jul 10, 2020 09:46
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The point of Dany's Meereen chapters were to foreshadow her turn into crazy Targaryen. GRRM has said that he was trying to do some ~metaphorical~ poo poo where Hizdar represents peaceful rule of Meereen (and Dany finds him completely unappealing) while Daario represents "War and woe" and Dany can't stop fantasizing about being with him. I mean it's not great but certainly better than 'and then she heard the surrender bells and went insane' that the show pulled I actually enjoyed the political whodunnit part of Dany's Meereen chapters where the characters and the reader both try and figure out the mystery of who the Harpy is
A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 03:05 on Jul 11, 2020 |
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Jul 11, 2020 03:03
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emanresu tnuocca posted:I figure Jaime and Cersei play a much smaller role in the hypothetical books, Jaime probably dies very early in TWOW, his arc effectively complete, he already decided he's going to let Cersei get executed, what more finality does he even need? I'm going to nerd post about this because Jaime is my favourite character, about midway through SoS he has a dream that is clearly prophetic in at least someways. He actually has a bunch of dreams throughout the series so the first time I read this I didn't even notice, but most of his dreams are about working out his inner trouble and conflict about who he is and who he wants to be or whatever, but he has one dream that seems particularly important because it's when he turns around his story and goes to Harrenhal to rescue Brienne, but also because he's literally using a weirwood stump as a pillow quote:The moss glimmered pale upon the stump where Jaime has rested his head. The moss covered it thickly he had noticed before, but the wood was white. It made him think of Winterfell, and Ned Stark's heart tree The dream starts with him in casterly rock and he gets confronted in the dungeon by Cersei, Joffrey and Tywin but only Cersei is holding a torch. I think think this is what clearly establishes it as a prophetic dream as this seems like clear symbolism with only Cersei being alive at the end of the book, but at the time of the dream all the Lannisters are still alive quote:beside Lord Tywin stood his sister, pale and beautiful, a torch burning in her hand. Joffrey was there as well, the son they'd made together, and behind them a dozen more dark shapes with golden hair. They then dip out but first Tywin gives Jaime a sword (another example of foreshadowing of something that will happen very soon in the actual story) quote:"Give me a sword at least" He then meets Brienne and gives her a matching sword. I think the colour being silvery-blue means this is supposed to represent the sword Ice which has been melted down into two matching swords. Jaime and Brienne then get confronted by what turns out to be the ghosts of the Kingsguard, which could be seen in the context of the dream as Jaime confronting his demons, but the way the Kingsguard members are described is very suspicious because it's also exactly how the Others are described by GRRM quote:Something was moving in the darkness, he could not quite make it out... and then quote:Brienne touched his arm. "There are more" So my favourite fan theory is that Brienne and Jaime will have some role to play in the fight against the others, and that they'll use the matching Valyrian steel swords that were made from Ice in someway A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 14:05 on Jul 12, 2020 |
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Jul 12, 2020 13:59
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Why does GRRM use bougie terms like ‘gorget’ and ‘helm’ when he could just use ‘neck guard’ or ‘metal hat’ like a normal loving American?
A Typical Goon fucked around with this message at 11:21 on Aug 7, 2020 |
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Aug 7, 2020 11:18
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