Dynasty/Samurai/Anime Warriors: Lu Bu and You

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dynasty/Samurai/Anime Warriors: Lu Bu and You

«‹›8 »

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Maleketh posted:

I never realized how much I wanted this until now.

By some reports it's just an iOS/Android/Windows (via Unity) F2P mobile game; one such article has both that mention and screenshots.

# ¿ Aug 29, 2014 05:07

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 14, 2024 02:46

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

5er posted:

Or a statesman desperate for peace and stability that had a better inkling of how to play along with Zhuge Liang for the greater good, while keeping the Sun family's interests the higher priority.

And then there is TV show Lu Su who's got at least a strategic mind as both and whose disagreement with Zhou Yu is basically over timing.

# ¿ Sep 4, 2014 17:25

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Anonymous Robot posted:

So, historically, what's the deal with the whole Jing province thing? It's an important strategic point, so it makes sense if Shu reneged on their agreement with Wu and allowed their alliance to collapse over it. However, the game seems to frame it as if it may have been Guan Yu acting independently of, or even in defiance of, Liu Bei's orders. Did he just stubbornly want his own fiefdom, or was it Shu's attempt to wash their hands of their own dishonesty, or was it just an angle added by the game? (I'm referring to the Wu campaign here, the Shu campaign kind of glosses over that angle.)

Belzac posted:

It also is played like that in the TV series. It was probably either Guan Yu refusing to give up his land to Wu (who is historically and fictionally held a lot of contempt for) or a plot by Zhuge Liang to keep the blame off of Liu Bei and constantly have an excuse.

Both the novel and the TV show do suggest (the latter moreso) that Guan Yu's at immediate fault, the moment of no-return being when he refused a marriage between his daughter (Yinping) and Sun Quan's ~~daughter~~ EDIT: son (gently caress everything under the sun) in chapter 73 ("How can a tiger's daughter marry with a dog's whelp?")... but this was essentially the culmination in a long-running contention between Shu and Wu over that the marriage of Liu Bei and Sun Shangxiang only suppressed.

Another factor was that Guan Yu had developed a massive arrogant streak since, as commander of the Shu forces in Jing, he'd been delegated not only an important strategic point but what was essentially the entire eastern front of Shu. Previously his command was in cooperation with Zhuge Liang, Zhang Fei, and Zhao Yun, but all three of them (and thereby the remaining VIPs of Shu outside of Yi province) went westward to reinforce Liu Bei when the latter's campaigning in Yi province stalled out with Pang Tong's death... and as one might imagine, the responsibility presumably got to his head.

There is at least one scene in the novel where it looks like both Zhuge Liang and Liu Bei try to pass on the blame to Guan Yu, with Liu Bei telling the Wu emissary -- not coincidentally, Zhuge Liang's brother -- that "when I have finished my conquest of Hanzhong, I will transfer Guan Yu to another post, and then I may be able to return Jingzhou." (Problem of course being that -- as Zhou Yu had pointed out back when Zhuge Liang made a similar promise years ago -- Liu Bei could never guarantee just when that was supposed to be...) Nevertheless, at one point Guan Yu outright told Zhuge Liang's brother from Wu that "When a leader is in the field, he receives no orders, not even those of his prince. Although you have brought letters from my brother, yet will I not yield the territories."

Speaking of Guan Yu letting his responsibility get to his head, it's no coincidence that Lu Xun gets a more prominent role in DW8, he played a role in the fall of Jing to Wu: when Guan Yu initially put up a defense against invasion by Lu Meng, Lu Xun advised Lu Meng to feign illness and resign from his post, Lu Xun becoming formal commander while Sun Quan gave Lu Meng 'actual' command of the invasion force. Cue Guan Yu dropping his guard and committing his forces against Fan Castle because he only knew of Lu Xun as some boy who even made a show of feigned submission with verbal flattery and gifts... oh, and up until the very end, he refused to believe rumors of Wu advances into Jing even as they piled up until finally Jingzhou City was reported taken.

Tae posted:

Also Guan Yu's pride to prove to his brother that he's more useful than Zhuge Liang possibly. Jealousy is a complete possibility, a shame Shu loses their generals to self destruction more often than Wu's loss through random magic.

The TV show has both him and Zhang Fei having jealous streaks with regards to Zhuge Liang, so at least there it's both... although they swear obedience to his orders as military advisor after Bowang Slope as in the novel, in the TV show the envy never really went away, culminating in their subplot during the marriage ploy, and Zhang Fei gets in on the "contempt for Wu" thing -- which at one point had him taking Liu Bei's place in a key scene, complete with vowing to kill Sun Quan to avenge a Wu emissary's family if Sun Quan had the emissary's family executed for his failure to get Jing back to Wu. :psyduck:

Chortles fucked around with this message at 04:43 on Sep 11, 2014

# ¿ Sep 10, 2014 05:37

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Sakurazuka posted:

I guess Guan Yu wasn't the progressive type.

Drakenel posted:

^^^^ Correct me if I'm wrong, but Like japan during similar times, Guy on guy was all the rage, but women having the choices and the fun? Pffft.

Either way, word got back of Guan Yu's refusal...

Sun Quan: What ruffianism! *starts plotting anew to conquer Jing*

# ¿ Sep 11, 2014 04:45

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Mokinokaro posted:

The books have a heavy Shu bias. Most of the Shu big names had their dark sides.

Hilariously said dark sides are so big that they manage to leak through in the actual text, it's the derivative lore that really glosses them over more. ( :sperggin: Technically it's the Mao Zonggang edition that is so biased unlike the original Luo Ghanzhong edition, but the Mao edition is more iconic.)

# ¿ Sep 13, 2014 14:01

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Davincie posted:

Guan Yu is vain and a dick to his own officers and others

Yeah, this one isn't whitewashed in the novel and if anything has the leading role in his downfall there.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 08:20

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Brony Hunter posted:

he even became Shu's official historian. (Which may be why Shu's history is far vaguer and patchier than Wei or Wu, and suffers from more biases)

This is something I keep in mind when looking at Shu's history, even the "actual" history has at least some amount of bullshit. Not least due to the inherent issue of "a history written on behalf of Jin", but also stuff like Chen Shou having to combine Zhuge Liang's papers with his own personal recollections, in some cases using sources that later historians discounted (or was that Pei Songzhi and some other guy).

Brony Hunter posted:

Yeah I'd err on the side of caution when reading the archlich's stuff. His personal biases are very apparent, and he tends to get into frothing rages regarding minor aspects of the games or characters he doesn't like. For example, he gives a lot of frankly unfair criticism regarding Koei's depiction of Shu, ignoring the near-two millennia of culture and folk lore that lead to Shu being cast as the protagonists. Him saying that Koei only made Shu the heroes because they are Guan Yu and Zhuge Liang fanboys is wrong and frankly baffling.

A goon turns out to be better than a non-goon at givin' you the business about Shu, film at 11. Koei has always built their games -- from the RTK series to DW -- on top of the folk lore and novel (the former of which is actually more hagiographic) and never the history (although acknowledging it in Encyclopedias whenever they're included), and if anything DW7's story cohesion was due to it tying its plot closer to the novel.

Re: Yi province/Liu Zhang -- Koei is obviously making up the bit about "the people want it", but even in the novel Pang Tong was pretty overtly egging Liu Bei on. The TV show's way of getting around this is to both depict Liu Bei as ambivalent (that is, both his public fealty and his private ambition are 'real' -- so Pang Tong gets himself killed to force the issue) and depict Liu Zhang as an idle hedonist (treated as a bad ruler in chaotic times that need a firmer hand) who, ironically enough, isn't listening to his more sensible/realistic advisors that are warning him about Liu Bei's force...

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 17:42

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Kraxxukalf posted:

their benevolent role in the games.

Just remember that every KOEI game, and basically most of the lore, is derived from the propaganda.

Kraxxukalf posted:

Especially after finishing the Three Kingdoms series

Just to be clear, are we talking about the 2010 series here? Because I absolutely thought I was seeing a Zhuge Liang who was not knowing everything before it happened and planning for everything... my bigger issue with him was some of the moves that he made (even if it "mandated by adherence to the novel lore") despite being characterized as someone who in the context of the show should know better, i.e. leaving Guan Yu in charge at Jing despite having previously stated Guan Yu's faults to Liu Bei (something omitted in the novel but which makes for an even worse call in the TV show), only to ruefully tell the ailing Liu Bei about the time that Guan Yu mocked Sun Quan's marriage proposal... for me it's "You SAW THIS COMING and you still left him there instead of leaving Zhao Yun in place and taking Guan Yu and Zhang Fei westward (the latter being a given since his TK2010 version is demonstrably untrustworthy)".

(Agreed on the rear end in a top hat bit with Wei Yan, especially since we're not given anything wrong he did other than... lo and behold, disagreeing with Zhuge Liang.)

Kraxxukalf posted:

he was such a total rear end in a top hat about everything and everyone still loved him for it.

shu.txt

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 19:11

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Calax, the bit about a drunken Sun Quan and a naked Zhou Tai is in the novel. The bit about Sun Quan burning down Zhang Zhao's house... not so much.

Kraxxukalf posted:

The 2010 series, I haven't seen the 90s one, so can't really comment on that. But you're right that there are some instances where he's in the wrong, like with Guan Yu, but I feel that the cases where he was wrong are far outnumbered by the ones where he's right about everything. It was however fun to see Guan Yu and Zhang Fei be portrayed as the morons they were.

If anything, the 90s one plays the (Mao Zonggang edition) novel's versions of events and Shu bias much more literally and at face value, while I'd say that the Shu bias is at least relatively lower in the 2010 series if only because it's is way more nuanced and sympathetic to the other factions.

I don't quite see things your way though -- my problem with him in the 2010 series is that "forced adherence to the novel" has Zhuge Liang acting in ways that make less sense than they did in the novel, i.e. I think novel-Guan Yu let the power get to his head after he was left alone in Jing while Zhuge Liang already knew (and was telling Liu Bei) about TK2010-Guan Yu's problems before the Yi province campaigns, and both Liu Bei and Zhuge Liang recognized TK2010-Zhao Yun as not dumb... so in the context of the show it's even more hollow to see him leave Guan Yu in charge (even if his actor may have been making "please don't gently caress this up for me" eyes at Guan Yu's actor). It's also a little weird to imagine "I need Zhao Yun as a hedge against Zhang Fei loving up on the way to Yi province" as the reason, because he'd already foresworn Zhao Yun -- preferring that he protect Liu Bei instead -- when Liu Bei gave him a secret order for Zhao Yun to back Zhuge Liang if Guan Yu and Zhang Fei tried to commit a coup against Zhuge Liang.

Kraxxukalf posted:

But again, the Chi Bi scenes with Zhuge Liang and Zhou Yu battling it out and Zhuge Liang constantly having the upper hand, and then Lu Su acting as the messenger boy who is in awe every time Zhuge Liang says something smart. It just ended up being really irritating.

... that's hardly the version I got of what happened, if anything Lu Su was the most "awesome by adaptation" upgraded character in the thing, able to gently caress up Zhuge Liang's attempt to sweep Huarong Road under the rug hard just by being present, and otherwise more readily in-the-know of what's going on. Hell, at one point Zhou Yu admitted that his more aggressive posture was due to how little time he had left (having racked up so many wounds from the wars) and that otherwise he'd be cool doing things Lu Su's way instead, and then he immediately "saw through" Zhuge Liang's mourning at Zhou Yu's funeral (although a later scene has Zhuge Liang telling Pang Tong that it was sincere.)

Kraxxukalf posted:

And yeah, the Wei Yan plot was over the top, as when he's talking with a dying Zhuge Liang he affirms that he'll be loyal to the end and will do what he says. Zhuge Liang even says he's the most talented and should take over when he's gone. Then seconds after Wei Yan leaves Zhuge Liang basically says to his buddies 'gently caress him. He's a traitor, have him killed.' Total rear end in a top hat move.

For me the issue from a modern perspective is more that Wei Yan isn't depicted as otherwise a problem guy other than in having a more aggressive stance during the Northern Campaigns... but I remember the scene slightly different, as being more of "kill him if he tries to force the issue of army command after I'm gone".

(As for Ma Su... considering that he got upgraded from an otherwise random gently caress to Zhuge Liang's student throughout the years, his situation -- and Zhuge Liang sticking him at Jieting despite what would happen -- reeks of "mandated by adherence to the novel".)

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 21:59

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Judge Tesla posted:

What happened to story mode in 8, it seems like its a "Best hits" edition, and was really disappointing compared to 7's which showed the rise and fall of every kingdom, and deaths of most of the cast.

That's been a consensus opinion here and I suspect that someone at Koei-Tecmo made the decision that basically anyone who was still playing the DW line games (as opposed to other Musou titles) was already perfectly aware of the lore.

# ¿ Sep 14, 2014 22:11

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

TooManyUzukis posted:

Originally, there was some slight Shu whitewashing because the original historical record (commissioned by Jin) was compiled by a Shu historian. Even so, there was an even larger Wei bias since Jin had usurped Wei, and thus establishing Wei's legitimacy was paramount to establishing Jin's.

Hence why I'm ambivalent about weighing in that hard on the history and stick mostly to the novel when discussing Three Kingdoms lore in this thread.

TooManyUzukis posted:

Finally, the dynasty following the Yuan (the Ming) brought an end to Mongol rule and sought to establish itself as the legitimate successor to the Han. Once again, Shu's struggle against Wei and previous association with the Han made them appear in a favorable light. This is the era in which the original novel was actually written.

Anyone really interested in the full explanations (and not my confused half-remembered reasons) should read the papers in the back of the Moss Roberts edition of the novel. He delves into some very interesting analysis.

We've gone over it more than once in the thread, although I can't remember how many pages back. Also, ironically the even-more-Shu-biased version that we're basically all more familiar with (than Luo Guanzhong's original, no less) and from which the popular lore (and video games) was derived... was written during the Qing dynasty (Manchu rule).

# ¿ Sep 15, 2014 03:35

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

I CANNOT STOP LAUGHING

# ¿ Sep 17, 2014 00:25

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Likewise minor, but Knights of Valour 2015 is a thing that is happening:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZbLJ3WusQ4&t=44s

# ¿ Sep 18, 2014 00:56

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Endorph posted:

All of those things would distract from what makes Warriors games fun, though, which is just jumping in and killing tons of dudes. I don't want to worry about siege weapons, forts, and supply lines. I want to kill tons of dudes.

Apparently Tecmo-Koei executives were outright stated to feel this way as well, back when a goon was said to be working on localizing for them.

# ¿ Oct 8, 2014 19:29

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Anonymous Robot posted:

Edit: This is some awesome writing, though: "Ugh...To have met an end like this...Why did I ever become a eunuch?"

Makes way more sense in context due to the past/historical closeness of the court eunuchs to the Emperor and therefore a de facto political force in between the Yellow Turbans and Dong Zhuo stages.

# ¿ Oct 12, 2014 01:16

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Section Z posted:

The point was probably to make Solomon look like a smartypants and not any actual lesson, like "See this clever thing Solomon does, he's so smart and that fake mom is so dumb I can't believe she fell for it."

Cross-posted from BSS' funny panels thread because I literally just realized that this is Novel Zhuge Liang In A Nutshell(tm).

# ¿ Oct 20, 2014 18:30

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

SirPhoebos posted:

On a less positive note, I'm not a fan of making Ginchiyo play second string to Muneshige. Curse you, Gaming Patriarchy!

The thing that stood out to me about DW7-8 was how much this had happened to most of the women as opposed to the prior games.

# ¿ Dec 3, 2014 02:59

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Thanks to a ChinaSMACK article that had it, here's Zhang Fei at Changban on an excavator.

Ryoji posted:

I recently got DW8 on Steam. Never played this series or anyhting like it before. I just bought it, because I want to read the novel "Romance of the Three kingdoms" and it might be good to get some picures for all these numerous names.
Oh boy, this game is a blast. Time flies by!

Check out the 2010 TV series Three Kingdoms while you're at it on YouTube! Goons have raved about it... in contrast to the 1994 series.

# ¿ Dec 29, 2014 05:16

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Ryoji posted:

Please share some links for more media about the Three kingdoms stuff (tv shows

DONE and DONE!

# ¿ Jan 7, 2015 07:59

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Tae posted:

They should really rename it to Cao Cao and friend's rad adventures because outside of him and later Sima Yi, it drags on in parts. Even Lu Bu is more interesting than a majority of Shu/Wu scenes, especially in the last quarter of the show.

In Cao Cao's case both the actor (Chen Jianbin) and director (Gao Xixi) specifically set out to do a 'non-traditional' Cao Cao, while in Lu Bu's case the director specifically decided to focus less on the iconic "strength" and more on Lu Bu as a person and the Diaochan love story, though the latter takes precedence for him to a degree where in essence Chen Gong is the de facto warlord.

I do agree that TK2010 is full of "standing/sitting/walking and talking" exposition, sometimes between characters who should already know the answers, but at least that grants context (both for the overall Three Kingdoms story and for the show specifically) that DW8 and sometimes even DW7's stories left out, and the show gives a lot more time/weight to Wu (at least until after Yiling) than most other tellings.

Morter posted:

It's worth it just to see Cao Cao make a total fool out of Yuan Shao. The entire build-up, the reveal, is glorious.

It's so unintuitive, yet upon the reveal it's immediately obvious what Cao Cao was going for and why -- and Yuan army advisor ("strategist" in Koei-cliche-speak) Xu You only figures it out just too late to actually stop it.

Brony Hunter posted:

Most of the Shu and Wu scenes really drag, especially the endless debates about Jingzhou. Zhang Fei and Pang Tong are hillarious and quite refreshing, however.

Pang Tong's basically a bro, while Zhang Fei... :ohdear:

Let's just say that a lot of Liu Bei's troubles (or at least inconveniences) are Zhang Fei's fault.

Brony Hunter posted:

The main draw is obviously the Wei stuff. Cao Cao is basically the main character for the first third or so of the show, and the last third is all about Sima Yi. They're both great characters, and Cao Pi and his attempts at scheming and winning his father's favour are quite fun to watch too.

This is built up in no small part because of how much of a loser Pi is treated as (and for public displays of filial piety forced to play along with) up until then... just look at the scene where Guan Yu is (re-)introduced to Red Hare. :stare:

Chortles fucked around with this message at 21:55 on Jan 9, 2015

# ¿ Jan 9, 2015 21:53

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

SeanBeansShako posted:

I'm afraid you are going to have to put up with Zhang Fei for a while. I'm enjoying it, but the guy who is Lu Bu looks well not hardened enough for the character.

Yardbomb posted:

That got me a little yeah. Great show but with how much screen time Lu Bu gets, his actor being that clean looking of a dude was kinda "huh?" I guess.

According to the actor (Peter Ho) his casting may have had to do with his height, as the director "wanted someone tall and with a heroic air to take on this role and who can have a little romantic feel as well".

As far as the whole 'pretty' thing though... apparently that's actually closer to Chinese traditional depictions* (although there was 1994 Lu Bu) whereas "big burly brute" seems to have actually originated with Koei's designs...? (Trivia: The last photo in the Tumblr post has opera Zhang Fei.)

Pureauthor posted:

It helps show that he's a kid who doesn't know what he's doing.

From the same interview linked above: the director was specifically going for Lu Bu as "a more naive person", who (incidentally, like TK2010 Yuan Shao come Guandu) "is easily tempted by the plans offered by others", and focusing on the Lu Bu/Diaochan love story while playing down the "killing his foster fathers" because the latter is so cliche in the traditional folklore.

Yardbomb posted:

Also it's always worth posting this when the show's involved.

You left out the most important part!

Yardbomb posted:

Cao Cao rules normally and he rules especially hard in the show.

He's even the proverbial devil in the Chinese version of 'speak of the devil'.

# ¿ Jan 17, 2015 05:47

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

A Capcom guy said that non-Japanese fans had their chance (with Sengoku BASARA 3: Samurai Heroes) and they blew it, so Capcom won't try again.

# ¿ Jan 22, 2015 08:25

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Wasn't George III also reputed for symptoms of mental illness even during the American Revolutionary period? (The Madness of George III/The Madness of King George chalked it up to a blood disorder while more recent research pointed at mental illness.) By Musou standards that'd probably result in an Imagawa Yoshimoto-style caricature...

Also, in the vein of goons' WTF at Peter Ho as Lu Bu, apparently Godfrey Gao is set to play him as well in a Zhao Yun-centric drama?

# ¿ Feb 17, 2015 20:01

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Jibo posted:

I like that they have multiple "Where is Zhang Fei's Wine" levels.

The GIG posted:

The amount of levels and scenarios where Zhang Fei gets drunk and ruins everything in recent games is pretty great.

And I remember DW7 having a specific one in Conquest mode about Lu Bu invading Xu Province while Zhang Fei was drunk... the Three Kingdoms 2010 version is amazing though:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJ2_TUdsXVo&t=784s
Best part is 10 minutes later:

Chen Gong posted:

One, drunkenness is not allowed. Two, no temper tantrums. Three, no beating or castigating of soldiers. That [Zhang Fei] is really adorable, how terribly adorable! With one bowl of wine he violated all three rules, and lost the city to boot!

Keep watching though and you'll see how often Liu Bei coerces his brothers with suicide threats. :stare:

Legend of Cao Cao Online? :eek:

# ¿ May 20, 2015 03:23

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Brony Hunter posted:

Legend of Cao Cao was amazing. I really hope they revisit that series, and I pray for an English release!

I played that, and I believe both Legend of Heroes (Liu Bei) and Legend of Kongming (Zhuge Liang) as a wee lil' goon... :swoon:

# ¿ May 20, 2015 11:03

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Brony Hunter posted:

Nice. I believe only Legend of Cao Cao got a fantranslation, and I played the HELL out of that English patch. I believe there were also "Legend" games about Oda Nobunaga and Mori Motonari. To be honest I'd also love a Legend of Wu, but Wu always gets neglected by Koei...

Yeah Motonari and Nobunaga also got their own Legend games, rounding out the series. On the other hand, my still favorite "Officer"-based game of all of Koei's: Taikō Risshiden V :swoon:

Oh, and don't blame Koei -- Wu gets neglected, period, by almost everything that isn't Kōtetsu Sangokushi or The Ravages of Time (albeit that's just been wrapping up Chibi).

# ¿ May 20, 2015 11:55

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Airspace posted:

Taikō Risshiden V is goddamn amazing and it's a shame it never got localized over here.

I still have PC savegames for it! I don't remember though, did it get a fan translation patch like Brony Hunter mentioned about Legend of Cao Cao?

Brony Hunter posted:

Oh yes, I know very well of Wu's pop culture neglect. To be honest I blame the Romance for making them the third wheel - Wu actually has a very fascinating history with some remarkable figures. The period after Sun Quan's death has some of the most convoluted and interesting political intrigue I've ever read about.

To some degree you can blame this on a mix of the novel's Shu bias -- at least that's the only way to explain its focus on Jiang Wei's nine failed invasions after Zhuge Liang's death, the last of which was the year before Shu's fall -- and even Three Kingdoms 2010 basically writes Wu out of the story after Wu is convinced (by Ma Su in the show) not to join in marching against Shu, at that point the story becoming pure Shu vs. Wei. Then again, I suppose it's harder in Koei's mind to make a big Wu backstory out of "Sun Quan went all Aerys II"...

I'd also point to the fact that Wei and Wu never really made territorial headway against each other for decades until Jin forces marched on Wu in the last years of the period (which got a throwaway mention in the DW7 Jin ending) during the terminal decline under one of Sun Quan's grandsons.

Let me add though that Wu gets major time in Ravages of Time to the point that Sun Ce ended up getting his own accompanying novel (albeit one which piles on the daddy problems even higher):

Bofu, pg 85 posted:

You can�t die just yet, you haven�t hugged me properly yet�

Except for when he was still a baby who couldn�t remember anything, Sun Ce had never experienced being embraced by his father.

And now, the first and last time he could hug his father, this bed of arrows, so cold and so stiff, were getting in his way.

Chortles fucked around with this message at 23:29 on May 20, 2015

# ¿ May 20, 2015 23:22

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Brony Hunter posted:

I dunno, Wu and Wei fought a LOT of battles that don't really get shown in games or any other media. As you said, the novel does skip over Wu after a while to focus on Shu. Historically, Wu and Wei fought each other much more often than Wei and Shu, and although there were minimal territorial changes, Wei certainly considered Wu a bigger threat than Shu.

Aye, but I confess that I'm not sure how I'd write a story around "Sun Quan went Aerys II minus the wildfire", nor on "Wei considered Wu a bigger threat than Shu" despite basically ending up with status quo ante bellum outcomes for most of the period with the "Yangtze" River (Chang Jiang in Chinese and in DW) as the rough border, whereas Koei (probably following on the book's heels) found a way to write up -- and focus DW7's Jin plot around -- the intra-Wei intrigues that led to Jin.

Brony Hunter posted:

Even Jin didn't immediately conquer Wu. There was a long campaign in Jiaozhou that served as the prelude to the main invasion, and interestingly you had former Shu generals and soldiers fighting Wu in that region under the Jin banner. Then there was the protracted stand off between Yang Hu and Lu Kang, a rather fascinating story of two enemy commanders whose mutual respect eventually became genuine friendship.

You could get at least one stage out of that, generally, but with Koei's habit of 'compacting' that you mention it'd basically be wrapped up in a single Jin-vs-Wu stage at most.

Brony Hunter posted:

It's also pretty criminal in my mind that much of early Wu also tends to be glossed over. I'll never understand why Koei tends to shove Sun Ce's entire 6 years of campaigning into one or maybe two stages.

I suppose it's easier because so much of his early campaigning is against relative-mooks who're mainly known for "got beat by Sun Ce" -- though Ravages of Time made even the early Wu years awesome -- whereas Sun Quan's time had Chibi, Hefei, Fan Castle, and Yiling, all against Wei and Shu.

# ¿ May 20, 2015 23:57

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Airspace posted:

Not that I'm aware of. I've kicked around the idea of translating it, but it would be 'barely above Google Translate' level of English. Also I have the PSP version, the text sometimes looks like a blurry mess.

Dammit... thankfully when I played it I could read enough traditional Chinese to get the gist of stuff, and now I'm listening to the OST all over again. :allears:

# ¿ May 24, 2015 06:55

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

I have no context for this except that it came from here:

# ¿ Sep 8, 2015 04:01

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Policenaut posted:

Big news for Romance of the Three Kingdoms fans coming out of Tokyo Game Show this morning, as Tecmo Koei confirmed at SCEJA's Asian market-oriented TGS pre-show conference that RoTK 13 will be localized into both Simplified and Traditional Chinese, Korean, and most important of all English! This does not confirm a North American and European release of RoTK 13, but it does confirm that the game will be accessible to English-reading markets overseas when the game releases in both Asia and Japan on December 10th. Presumably only the Asian release will contain English, so please make sure to double check before you put any money down. As said before, RoTK 13 is coming out on PC, PS3, and PS4.

Here's a new trailer.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Dwz1acY5ykA

Looks like a "character not ruler" RPG, this pleases me~

On the other hand, it seems like the developers decided to lean on Sphere of Influence for the mechanics, particularly battles and the "nodes" approach to the strategic map.

# ¿ Sep 16, 2015 22:42

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Policenaut posted:

And ha ha ha we can't even get Koei to put Jin in RoTK games

Depends on how you define Jin -- their whole DW7 story is technically under the guise of Cao Wei, as the concluding cutscene concedes -- but I remember the RTK games having a few post-Zhuge Liang scenario-starts here and there.

# ¿ Jul 14, 2016 20:17

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Billzasilver posted:

Yo I'm watching the early episodes of Three Kingdoms and Dong Zhou's attitude is loving identical to Donald Trump's. Like when he gets whiny and pissy at the 9 yr old boy. And I guess Lu Bu is the...Jared Kushner of this story?

Nah, he's a little more complicated/sincere here than earlier depictions such as in the older series but I remember Wang Yun pulling the strings, albeit here guilt-tripping Diaochan into the scheme instead of her volunteering herself.

# ¿ Oct 9, 2017 20:46

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

disjoe posted:

Make a game where Shu are the bad guys straight up, bill it as the most historically accurate version since IRL Liu Bei was an rear end in a top hat.

I dunno, the 2010 show already beat Koei to this for some folks, especially if you interpret its Liu Bei as "Records Liu Bei posing as Romance Liu Bei up until Liu Zhang's capitulation in the Riverlands".

# ¿ Aug 15, 2019 17:54

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Leal posted:

Koei sale on steam, bunch of games on sale.

..... You'll still be paying 30+ because a ton of their games are still 60 dollars at regular price.

Thanks for this, I ended up picking up Nobunaga's Ambition: Sphere of Influence[/i], RTK11 w/ PUK (I'll hope someone made an English translation patch) and RTK13 w/ PUK ("Fame and Strategy Expansion Pack") from the sale!

# ¿ May 9, 2022 22:20

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

Amusingly, a side effect of Oda Nobunaga as 'stock shonen hero' is Imagawa Yoshimoto going from the intro battle boss to first arc final boss... complete with showing up at the Battle of Nagara River and beating Nobunaga in single combat without backup, leading to Oda Nobuyuki's rebellion after his older brother's retreat.

# ¿ Dec 5, 2022 19:55

Adbot: ADBOT LOVES YOU

# ¿ May 14, 2024 02:46

Chortles: Dec 29, 2008

kirbysuperstar posted:

13's PUK let you do it and so did the Sphere of Influence standalone PUK thing

I think 14 and the NA that came after that dropped it again and were both bad tho

In addition to these, last year there was Taiko Risshiden V DX (essentially the HD remaster to 2004's Taiko Risshiden V for PC and PS2, but based on 2009's PSP port) and unlike Nobunaga's Ambition: Sphere of Influence - Ascension, instead of being limited to climbing the samurai ranks or staying at the top, you could play/progress on five basic paths -- samurai, ninja, swordsman (in practice weapons master), pirate/navy, and merchant -- while picking up skills between roles, changing roles, and even taking on side roles such as blacksmith, tea master, and more.

Unfortunately, this one isn't available in the North American Steam region (unlike earlier RTK and NA titles that also didn't get an English localization for PC), but it's available in Japanese on the Nintendo Switch if you're able to import.

# ¿ Feb 15, 2023 00:53

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > Dynasty/Samurai/Anime Warriors: Lu Bu and You

«‹›8 »