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Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

pathetic little tramp posted:

Anyone know what I should get my stabbing skill up to? And what's a good level of traps & doors detection?

Stabbing is a straight up multiplier so there are no good breakpoints, but on a MuSu I would say zero. Get T&D to 10 by end of Lair to have a good chance of detecting Zot traps, which in 0.11 can be quite deadly.

You know, it would be pretty easy to have a Mummy of every race, just subtract 1 from all apts due to the mummification process.

Sif channeling was not reworked until 0.19 so you can infinitely channel as late as 0.18. If you insist on playing 0.11, just get demonic horde as the summoned creature limit was not added until 0.13. I did both lair branches in 0.11 as FeSu just running as fast as I could making GBS threads clouds of demons. Don't forget to abuse Evaporation, too.

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Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
Yeah, the Mildly-Mummered Pake was quite good a few Patches ago.

Araganzar fucked around with this message at 19:57 on Jul 31, 2017

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Toadsmash posted:

Only tangentially related, but coming from a relative newbie (I've ascended, but only once), it irritates the piss out of me that Xom seems to have been designed in the direction of "just make the game harder" when there are much more interesting directions they could take his tuning and still keep with the theme. I guess they view taking his flavor text literally as a virtue. "Very different, but not necessarily easier or harder than other choices when played correctly" is by far my preferred design paradigm for the various deities. Meh!
counterpoint:
code:
   184 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You are partially covered in molten scales (AC +1). [Xom's grace]
   184 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You are mostly covered in molten scales (AC +3, EV -1). [Xom's grace]
   184 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You can spit poison. [Xom's grace]
   184 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You have a pair of small horns on your head. [Xom's grace]
   211 | D:1      | Gained mutation: Your muscles are strong. (Str +2) [Xom's grace]
   211 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You are resistant to hostile enchantments. [Xom's grace]
   383 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You have claws for feet. [Xom's grace]
   383 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You are robust (+10% HP). [Xom's grace]
   383 | D:1      | Gained mutation: You are highly resistant to hostile enchantments. [Xom's grace]
   386 | D:1      | Haifisch: what the gently caress is xom even making me into
  3103 | D:4      | Gained mutation: Your wings are large and strong. [Xom's grace]
  3103 | D:4      | Gained mutation: You are extremely resistant to the effects of hostile enchantments. [Xom's grace]
  3103 | D:4      | Gained mutation: You can translocate small distances at will. [Xom's grace]
  3103 | D:4      | Gained mutation: You are agile. (Dex +2) [Xom's grace]
I would say that quote is accurate for Xom. Xom acts frequently in situations of high tension. This means you might get confused or swapped or distorted but you'll also get good effects that kill poo poo. You can take down some seriously OOD critters with Xom just by backing up. You also get random gifts which sometimes are artefacts or giant stacks of gold that can be total game changers.

AppleDan posted:

Felids are fun

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

FulsomFrank posted:

I haven't heard anyone complain about ghosts, is this an online complaint? Because there are a lot of people that don't play online that don't mind ghosts at all.

Yeah, it's pretty much an online issue only. I've probably made 20 posts in these threads talking about how poorly they are implemented. They are xp pinatas for strong combos while being literally impossible for many other combos to kill, often locking a large portion of early content behind a wall of death or tedium. The mechanism is easily abused by players to either make the game easier or grief others across an entire server.

The fact that they are trivalized by berserk and movespeed is really a problem with those mechanics, not the ghost mechanics. They could be good in the game as an extremely variable threat that is gamewide and requires the player to stop and think and examine them. But at the very least devs would need to reduce the xp reward, cap their stats by dungeon level or player XL, and remove incredibly stupid poo poo like giving draconian ghosts DRAIN breath. I don't think they are inherently bad or boring and wouldn't mind seeing the feature revised rather than removed.

Take what I say with a grain of salt, I really don't play anymore because I'm so tired of the arrogance and deep divides both between and within the dev and player communities. When I look back on the comments and suggestions I've made I feel like I've been part of this and it makes me reticent to play or interact with either group. It's unfortunate that there's so much negative energy obfuscating what is at its core a fun little game that doesn't take itself too seriously and I regret my part in that.

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
cutting purple chunks is the modem tax of crawl

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Heithinn Grasida posted:

I'm not a big tournament player either, even though I think I was captain of the ogre team on SA one tournament, but I'm pretty sure you just make sure the team captain knows your name and has you in their rc file and then you also have to have your team name in your rc file, I think. At any rate it's very easy. Once the tournament gets started, lots of people will be making teams here, likely, and there will be a lot of specific instructions for what to do. It's very straightforward.

Otherwise you just play normally if you're on a casual team, or go for banners (achievements, basically), streaks and nemelex' choice combos to get more points. I don't like the competitive aspect of Crawl, or of any game at all, and my connection is spotty at best to websites outside of China, but the tournaments are fun in that they get a lot of people, both casual and competitive, playing and discussing the game at once.

Teams are not cemented until a week after the tournament starts so you can just start playing and worry about joining your team or even finding a team until later.

Playing this tournament seriously was a great experience that I wouldn't recommend to anybody. It will make you a better player and give you a much better understanding of risk in the game. It will also take your life away and then break your heart when you lose your 5 streak to a frigging Storm Giant at the Orc 1 entry. We had a good shot at winning before I took a 40 pt large rock climbing those stairs.

I also still hate extended and the tourney demands you knock out a couple 15 rune wins.

They should have nerfed the spawn rate of recharge scrolls rather than removing them. This would not give the player meaningful decisions but would preserve the illusion that they do which is all that's important. The core dev team is largely driven by and influenced by people who are interested in this as a scoring game so expect this sort of thing to continue to happen to player agency for the average crawler.

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
Crawl 0.12: Monsters No Longer gently caress

Crawl 0.21: Draconian Player Tiles Now Show Hats, also WJC

Craw 0.21: Wu Jian, Planned train, Gnoll things, Wands hosed with

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
Crawl 0.21 - Goons wrote everything cool in this release

If Wu Jian doesn't make it in, it should be Crawl 0.21 - No Wu Jian, Gnoll Cry

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

TildeATH posted:

Christ why is playing an octopode such a trial? Is it supposed to be not fun? I feel like the early game is "Oh a ghost/bad roll/anyone with armor" means you're dead. I just wanted to play with rings, man.

I didn't find octopi all that hard....



















Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
I'm changing my suggested new thread title to:

Hellcrawl 9: The Skeleton of a Good Idea

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Tollymain posted:

here's an alternate idea. what if instead, going into hell gave you an unremovable (other than by just leaving) debuff that gave you a chance of a specific hell effect happening when you take an action other than resting. the specific effect changes at random but fairly regular intervals and is displayed as the current debuff name, meaning you can see what you're risking by acting. sort of a hell weather system, if you would. for an in-play example, you're pushing through tartarus and you see that a contamination storm has kicked up. now you're presented with a handful of choices here about how to try avoid this, such as just stopping where you are and hoping nothing finds you before its over, or taking the risk of contamination happening while you duck into a safer position with more of your los blocked off.

I think solving paralysis would solve hell effects. I like the idea but it's definitely a big buff as the whole idea of hell is you are supposed to be deciding between resting and getting the FO and coming back when you can get further faster due to having mapped levels. I would still be in favor as it provides more player agency and hell is a big enough pain as it is.

Really if you could fix hell effects this way, fix charms aka hellcrawl, and get rid of trog and okawaru you'd really just have to deal with mutations to have a game even the pissiest goons would have trouble hating. Oh, and bring back book amnesia and singularity.

Of course, the eventual trunk charms "fix" will be the hellcrawl fix, but in addition to MP reservation you'll have extra contamination and hunger effects. All of it will be calculated by going through 2 stepdowns and a non-linear transform with a random factor based on the digits to the right of the decimal in the temperature of an arctic weather station. You won't know how much MP you have left but the game will help by giving you a wildly inaccurate % chance to use a spell or power. If your ping to the weather station is too high the game will compensate by killing you.

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Zaodai posted:

It is usually safer to apply Hanlon's Razor instead.
"Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."

I'm reminded of my favorite Sherlock Holmes Quote:
"When you have eliminated the unnecessary, whatever remains, however optimal, is not worth loving playing"

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

tweet my meat posted:

"The devs literally do not want the game to be fun" is an idea that gets tossed around a whole lot in this thread and it's pretty silly.

This is not totally accurate but it's also not a totally ridiculous conclusion to reach if you've been paying attention the last few years.

Why do just goons notice this? Users on the Tavern are the 1% who are supporting these changes, reddit users are the lowest common denominator, 4chan users make the lowest common denominator look unreachably elite.

I don't doubt the current devs want to make a good game, but the ones driving the changes we complain about appear uninterested in what the majority of the player base considers fun, and their own definition of the word as it applies the their game is extremely narrow.

You need devs like this so your game is a not a goddamn mess but you also need some Yoko Taro so your game has a soul. Whatever the soul of crawl was, the removal of purple chunks is a strong indication it's been forgotten and discarded.

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe
Oh hey, I've had the flu for a few days, let's just see if there's been any activity in the crawl thread...

:bravo2: :bravo2: :bravo2: :bravo2: :bravo2: :bravo2:
:captainpop:

I will be coding book amnesia back in the game, if you don't commit the branch Vehumet will send you bad mexican food so your butthole BURNS IN HELLFIRE.

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Internet Kraken posted:

Dream sheep are cool but its really dumb that they just replaced every instance of sheep with them. Some vaults that had sheep in them as a joke became ridiculously dangerous because they now contain dream sheep, usually shoved behind a bunch of other monsters.

Uh Yeah....like a giant slaughterhouse filled with freezing clouds and dream sheep that also has death yaks and armed humans who open the doors and let them all out.

You can possibly run into this one pre-Lair and pre-Orc.

pre:
##############################################################################
# Slaugherhouse (Zaba)
#
# Butchers have either knives (daggers) or hand axes. They have some chance
# of opening the doors so animals can go for a walk, that's intended.
#
NAME:   slaughterhouse
DEPTH:  Lair:5-, D:11-
TAGS:   no_monster_gen
ORIENT: float
WEIGHT: 5
MARKER: F = lua:fog_machine { \
                pow_max = 10, delay_min = 10, delay_max = 40, \
                size = 4, size_buildup_amnt = 4, \
                size_buildup_time = 25, cloud_type = "freezing vapour" \
            }
MONS:   death yak w:5 / dream sheep w:3 / yak w:7
MONS:   generate_awake human ; dagger | hand axe
SUBST:  F=d, 2=2.
ITEM:   ration w:5 / nothing
MAP
 cccccc       ccccccc
 cddddcxxxxxxxxcddddc
 cdFdd+..+..+..+ddFdc
 cddddcxxx..xxxcddddc
 cccccc..x..x..cccccc
.........x2.x.........
.nnnnnn..x..x..nnnnnn.
.n1111nxxx..xxxn1111n.
.n1111+..+..+..+1111n.
.n1111nxxx..xxxn1111n.
.nnnnnn..x..x..nnnnnn.
.........x.2x.........
 xxxxxx..x..x..xxxxxx
 x...2xxxx..xxxx2...x
 x..2.+..+..+..+.2..x
 x...2xxxx..xxxx2...x
 xxxxxx  x..x  xxxxxx
         x++x
          @.
ENDMAP

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Captain Monkey posted:

This. The amount of content crawl refuses to just spawn each game is hilarious, especially when they keep taking things out in addition to it.

What's going to be left to do in the NG+ dungeon if you spawn everything every time?

Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

Internet Kraken posted:

TSO isn't a great early god but he doesn't actively hinder your character development the way Jiyva does. Jiyva also makes the game harder for your character in a way that is difficult for the player to understand. You won't realize just how much experience and loot you are missing due to the slime spawning.

IMO Jiyva shouldn't be a temple god but there should be a guaranteed altar spawning at the slime entrance. By that point the passive slime spawning won't take any appreciable amount of exp.

This, the current mode of "going Jivya" is to get to the slime entrance in Lair and hope it has an altar. Then if you are a spriggan and have blink scrolls you can still (almost never) make the altar on Slime:6. Usually you have a spriggan or troll doing this because of the advantages they get from an early-mid Jivya outweigh the disadvantages. And let's not forget the other reason Jiyva is not a temple god and is usually placed on Slime:6 - otherwise, the god provides a free rune and a free rune vault full of loot!

Making the altar spawn 100% would still indicate this is not a recommended early-game god while allowing people to take it without having to clear Slime. J should never be a temple god because of the relative power of slimes to early dungeon monsters and the importance of early-game consumables and other pickups, as well the fact that the god provides a FREE RUNE which also means free entry into Vaults.

Really, your jelly buddy power shouldn't apply in Slime which is ruled by TRJ who considers you an existential threat.

edit: Also, don't like the way Jiyva juggles stats? Change it! Make it into an advantage! This is GoonCrawl!

Araganzar fucked around with this message at 17:49 on Dec 23, 2017

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Araganzar
May 24, 2003

Needs more cowbell!
Fun Shoe

cheetah7071 posted:

I wrote in that crabs should move faster when going sideways

Why are we just considering one crab species?

Hermit Crab - must wear body armor, starts off wearing leather, as player levels up can wear higher levels of armor with no or greatly reduced encumbrance, eventually can only wear plate mail or dragon scales, special bonuses for maxwell's, lear's, and OCP
Fiddler Crab - has fighting claw that starts out equivalent to a flail with +5 SH, as player levels up eventually becomes as good as GSC with SH increasing as well - can still use offhand for attack or shield
Soft-Shell Crab - -AC, +EV, no other special abilities but produces delicious meat when killed as monster
Japenese Spider Crab - octopode armor slots, extra AC as levels, at XL 13 gives all weapons or unarmed Reaching

Maybe at XL7 you find out your species ala draconians?

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