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How to get involved with fixing the DNC: http://www.glyphgryph.com/index.html For your own personal crusade to fix this mess here are some good ways to help: -Local. Local. Local. Change starts with your county party and state party. Be the guy who always shows up to everything. Make them depend on you. Put a loving clown hat on and be the next Robert Marrow. Whatever it takes. -Join advocacy groups. These people need your help now more than ever. -Do not be afraid to speak out. Many people in America's minority communities are terrified right now. Do not let them think that they are alone. Do not down play their concerns. -When reaching out to people who got burned by the Clintons give them a chance. There are lots of people like me who got their lives blown up when the Clintons went down in flames and ran off into the woods. -Be prepared to argue. Do not just walk out if someone disagrees with you. That's what killed us this last go round. Don't shut down dissent. -Seriously I am not joking when I say local. It might hurt that you can't directly change the top. But the top is built on a base. Be that base. https://twitter.com/backspace/status/800375658891378688?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw tower time posted:So I was thinking about potential steps steps for the Democratic party to take, and I remembered the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Populist_Caucus which was formed in 2008 and effectively went defunct went Bruce Braley was left to pursue a Senate seat in 2014. Keith Ellison was a member, and though the group was small, it was progressive and centered around the needs of working people and rural areas. My representative is Dave Loebsack, who was a member, so I plan to call his office and ask about a potential revival of the house populist caucus. If your representative is listed as a former member, I would urge you to call and express your desire for them to brush off the cobwebs and make it active again and try to expand it. Or if your representative was not, maybe call and ask them about contacting former representatives active with the caucus to join and represent your district because the issues they represent are important to you. Excellent article on how Dems lost rural America: http://www.dailyyonder.com/analysis-democrats-turn-their-backs-on-rural-america/2016/11/14/16208/ I'll post more stuff here later. Thank you for your patience. ============================================================ Hello and welcome to the Venom "Punished" Snake autopsy thread were I attempt to lay out what went wrong. I make this post by popular request. I am 100% aware I am going to get brutally owned shortly after making this post To set the tone: Bernie and the Progressive wing of the party are in a Germany circa 1944 situation were operation Valkyrie was successful except but the Allies have refused any offers of peace. What do we do next? We have to do something or were hosed and our ability to hold them back is being lessened by the hour. It's 1942 and Stalingrad has fallen. The enemy is inside the gates. Stalin has fled the county and Germany has no interest in peace with what remains the USSR. Whats the plan now Marshal Zhukov? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XoQxqi6XkGM Clinton was defeated because the campaign was operating in another world were the democrats were winners, not losers. Obama won right? If we do what he did we will win right? The campaigns were almost entirely the same people. Except America is not the America of 2008, or 2012. How good the economy was doing did not matter. Obama's approval rating did not matter. All the progress made these past 8 years did not matter. Why did these not matter? Because for lower to middle class white American things didn't get better and to the rest of America Trump was a bad joke that could never ACTUALLY be elected RIGHT? Time and time again I (and others) dismissed incompetence within the Dem party as growing pains. Turns out those growing pains were actually late stage cancer. The Clinton Campaign put to much trust in polls and far, far to much trust in older data experts/theory crafters who were looking to build an optimized spreadsheet instead of a movement. Ultimately Clinton herself is a smart, good women but she is hamstrung by outdated loyalty to people who hate her. She was scared of being overtly left wing and turned off voters and it crippled her attempt to build a message. They say If your explaining then your losing and 2016 was one giant explanation of EMAILS!. The Campaign tried to disenfranchise Republicans and forgot in the process that they think she is the devil. Just because old failed Neocons flipped to our side means that the GOP was as split as we thought it to be. Meanwhile the democratic party is weaker than it has ever been before and not at all prepared to offer any resistance to the GOP. Another huge problem was overreaching. Instead of defending strongholds the democratic party over extended itself and got annihilated. If we would have kept the firewall we would have won by a slim margin but we would have won. Instead we chased idiotic dreams of blue Georgia/North Carolina and Arizona. Everyone in the campaign wanted to believe that dem strong holds would remain so no matter what. Resources were not allocated properly. My camp often fought to push resources towards Florida but the National campaign pushed back hard. Nobody actually took the idea that traditionally dem states could be in play seriously for a second. The Obama team brought on to give us another 2012 or 2008 gave the dems a 2000 instead. Right now from the little I still hear they are in a state of disbelief or have just given up. 8 years of hell and Obama will be handing the keys to a man who thinks he's a kenyan muslim traitor. Disconnection between the National campaign and local campaigns was also a problem looking back on it. Many local offices went underfunded as more and more money was diverted to winning the ad and communication war. Clinton had supporters. Trump had followers. Clinton was careful about what she said. Trump was willing to say anything to anyone. Clinton had the support the Dems who held a minority in both the senate and congress with less than 30% of governors and state legislators. Trump had the support of majority's in both the house and senate as well as governorship's of several blue states. Clinton said she was going to raise taxes. Trump said he would cut the most taxes of anyone ever bigly. Diagnoses: Trump and Obama had a movement. We had fear. Fear of Trump was never going to be enough to win. We needed a candidate who energized the base and appealed to what people want not don't. Would Bernie have won? It isn't my right to say. After all I was wrong all along lol To people who supported Hillary like me: We blew it. We can't give up though because the party needs a new direction and it would be wrong to give up now. Whoever steps up to lead in the aftermath should have our support. To people who supported Bernie: It's your show now if you want it. Unite people behind your banner. Alienating them like we did will get you the same fate that befell us. To Dems in general: We either unite now and try and rebuild or were hosed. Ill answer any and all questions to the best of my ability. Ill write more as it comes to me.  IK Note: Please no excessive slapfighting about the primaries. No coulda, woulda, shoulda talk over it. You can analyze what should have been improved on for future primary fields. 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Nov 10, 2016 01:09
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FizFashizzle posted:a. you're unemployed now. what was the kill video you claimed existed? A. There probably was no video. All I ever heard was rumors. B. Warren has given up. Bernie is also on the verge of throwing in the the towel. The only person I know willing to present opposition/unification right now is the Tim Kaine crowd/NOVA dems who believe we should rally around Bernie's primary message. Even if he himself won't do it. Pener Kropoopkin posted:Amazing that the OP assumes rural poverty is a myth, and that the Obama recovery was somehow a boon to agricultural workers. Rural poverty is not a myth and the Obama recovery did not fix America's economic divide. Even still it's worth pointing out that all the normal factors that would contribute to a less did not exist in this election. Fullhouse posted:turns out when your entire campaign is actually explaining how bad the other person is instead of giving anyone a reason to vote for you instead, lots of people just won't vote This
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Nov 10, 2016 01:24
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Grondoth posted:Holy poo poo whoever worked in that campaign should be banished from politics forever. That's incredible arrogance from a campaign that MUST'VE KNEW they were running a candidate that could in no way guarantee the turnout Obama did. Well. The people running the campaign WERE Obama people. The problem was there was no message to couple with GOTV. Obama had a message and GOTV, we had......not that. Grondoth posted:Mr Snake, I want you to consider maybe this idea: That for lots of people things didn't get much better over the past 8 years I know.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:26
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Thoguh posted:Or just maybe things are actually getting worse for lower to middle class America, especially for people outside a handful of cities. And touting job creation numbers doesn't do anything if you can't find a job because nobody is hiring within a 50 mile radius. If the democratic party won't accept that people voted for Trump for reasons other than racism they are doomed to continued failure. I am not specifically talking about economics. White America was very concerned about a lot more than just economics in this election. You are correct that jobs and growth were not distributed equally! The Kingfish posted:I just realized that Bernie and Warren are the leaders of the party now. Warren doesn't want the Party reigns. It remains to be seen if Bernie wants them. I wouldn't blame him for giving up.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:29
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The Kingfish posted:Everybody knows this. But when Hillary talked about it, she spoke as if she was conceding the point to Trump. That doesn't come across well if you are actually suffering. Agreed. slave to my cravings posted:The Tim kaine nova crowd is the same a Clinton as far as I'm concerned. Any attempt to follow bernies primary message will be viewed as entirely disingenuous and reactionary and completely ignored. Then were doomed I guess.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:33
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Zikan posted:Since the party is effectively broken and leaderless, could a Jeremy Corbyn style takeover with the progressive caucus leading the charge with someone like Keith Ellison or Tulsi Gabbard succeed? Someone who just stands up and gives people someone to rally to by complete repudating CLintonism, who isn't perceived as from the Clintonite camp as Tim Kaine and the NoVa Dems? Or would there be too much backlash from the remaining Clintonites "Clintonites" are not a thing anymore. Everyone just wants to move on. Tim Kaine and the NoVa dems want to give the reigns to the progressive wing and present an actual challenge to the GOP. The problem is the Progressives might have just given up. Raskolnikov38 posted:the 2020 primaries are going to be hilarious when Tim Kaine shows up in them thinking he has a snowball's chance in hell He is not going to run for president. I know him personally. He's tired. But he knows if everyone gives up now were hosed. FizFashizzle posted:B. lol thats it? A white guy with a harmonica preaching liberalization and gay rights? They are 100% willing to hand over everything to the left right now. Again I'm not saying they want control; all they want is the ship to not go under.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:41
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Oh Snapple! posted:Do you think Democrats want Bernie to have the reigns and would actually allow him to take them if he himself actually wanted to? There is nobody left to oppose him.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:42
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slave to my cravings posted:It's gonna be Cory booker and dems will never learn their lesson There is no "dems" left to learn dude. We have the least amount of control in the history of the entire party lol
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Nov 10, 2016 01:43
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Oh Snapple! posted:My general perception is that the party politicians don't care for Bernie because they's affluent and comfortable capitalists and Bernie is A Threat to that lifestyle. They have either bent the knee or vacated the premises.
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Nov 10, 2016 01:46
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Senor Dog posted:It hasn't been that long since Trump was declared the victor. How do you know all this about their new positions? How do they have these new positions already even? Has this been brewing for a while or is it a position made while in shock that can easily be changed later? Clinton and Friends blew it so hard that a neo nazi rapist is now president. They are on the next boat to Hawaii. I know what I know because Iv been talking to the Kaine crowd here in NOVA and from the people I follow for information. The Kingfish posted:No way, that's not how this actually works. They don't have a plan right now, but I can guarantee they are not "100% willing to hand everything over to the left" Heres something to feel smug about : They all now realize that under a bernie like person they would keep most of their income and now they might lose it all cause Trump and Ryan don't know gently caress about economics. Whoever takes control is whoever wants it. Peel posted:seriously: they'll appear, and rally, if a left wing seems to be seriously taking over If they did It would mean there is someone still at the bridge of the ship. There is nobody in the control room and were caught in the orbit of a star going supernova.
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Nov 10, 2016 02:08
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FizFashizzle posted:so VS are you saying this is the end of the DNC as we know it? No the Democratic Party exists as a an old abandoned hosed up fortress but it's still there. All it's waiting for is someone to make it their home.
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Nov 10, 2016 02:19
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Adventure Pigeon posted:It's a small lesson, but next time avoid shining the light on Lena Dunham, Lady Gaga, and their ilk. I doubt you could find two people that better embody the stereotype of a wealthy coastal liberal that doesn't understand or give a poo poo about anyone outside their bubble. Obama had lots of celebrity support but he won. It's about coopting those people with a message. The HRC campaign did not have a message
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Nov 10, 2016 02:20
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anime was right posted:that was an awful post and im sorry It was a very good post. Thank you for posting it  Porpoise With A Purpose posted:I think the most important thing that we can do at this point is take advantage of this defeat and push the democratic party toward the left. Right now there is a power vacuum at the top, and if they right people move to fill it, we can probably push forward in 2018, and hopefully take something back by 2020. People like you give me hope!
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Nov 10, 2016 02:46
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Not a Step posted:Is it gonna be against minorities or doubling down against whites is the real question It depends on how much progressives are willing to stomach if it gets economic progress.
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Nov 10, 2016 02:51
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Porpoise With A Purpose posted:Are we as a forum going to do anything? I know something awful has historically been a source for a lot of old memes and we still are from time to time, maybe its time we put that power to good use? I don't know. The biggest political movement this forum had lately was the Bernie thread and I dunno if those players are up for it again. Personally we should all do our best to volunteer and campaign. Tatsuta Age posted:didn't read the thread but gently caress you venom snake 
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Nov 10, 2016 03:00
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Oh Snapple! posted:Actually the goal, as presented by a lot of folks here, was simply to up the number of people with insurance. That it remained unaffordable was irrelevant to them, because that number went up, and any negative experiences with it were to be not only ignored, but snidely derided and even questioned. Dude when Obamacare is gone a lot of people are going to die straight up. One of my closest friends is only alive today because of it. Do not poo poo talk it. Flubby posted:I know this is off-topic and probably inflammatory, but I think you have to give credit to Venom. He was around last night, through all that poo poo. Where is Epic High Five and A Winner Is Jew and about five other turd burglars that laughed down at anyone that called out Hillary as being a weak candidate? Rats off a sinking ship, gone before the waters had even gotten rough, and probably trying to duck their ban. poo poo on and ridicule anyone not in their group think bubble and when the poo poo hits the fan, poof. Gone. All the work Iv done is nothing but piss in the wind If I give up.
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Nov 10, 2016 03:18
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Vox Nihili posted:What about Obama?? Obama and his crowd do not give a gently caress about anything any more dude. Hes giving the keys to a dude who called him a fuckin kenya muslim lol
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Nov 10, 2016 03:54
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comedyblissoption posted:even if clinton is not corrupt, she still has the extreme appearance of impropriety and conflict of interest when she gets giant bags of money rained down on her from wall street Clinton does not matter anymore. What we do next matters.
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Nov 10, 2016 03:55
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Peel posted:when i heard about the secret wall speech speeches thing i wasn't much bothered by it - clinton is friendly with wall street? you don't say - until i discovered they were given post-2008 Yeah, but like I'm more interested in how we fix the failures than just screaming into the void yknow? We can argue about the actual person clinton herself but I think the biggest gently caress ups lay with her high level campaign operatives tbh
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Nov 10, 2016 04:02
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HannibalBarca posted:Did you ever meet people like Mook or Podesta? What was the impression you got from them? Because I am beyond furious with them now. I think this is at their feet in a lot of ways. Iv met both but never talked to either on a regular basis ever. Mook was 100% certain in data and models which proved hilariously inaccurate and Podesta was more in that "we need to harness populism or were hosed" area. Both are done now though.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:52
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Necc0 posted:love trumps hate was the dumbest loving slogan ever but we go high when they go low though right???? There is nobody left at the helm to block him. Obamas hosed because his legacy just got flushed down the toilet. The Clintons have given up.
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Nov 10, 2016 04:55
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Pener Kropoopkin posted:I think enough time has passed to talk about how scapegoating Russia and painting Trump as an agent of the Kremlin was a dumb idea. he was absolutely russia's candidate of choice dude
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Nov 10, 2016 05:02
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Clinton did not lose because she pushed false narratives, she lost because she had no narrative for herself
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Nov 10, 2016 05:02
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HannibalBarca posted:Did that resonate with voters though? I can't imagine anyone outside the intelligentsia in the big cities cared about that, and hey, guess what, we already had those. Maybe I'm wrong though, I dunno. gently caress it, there were so many mistakes, and this was just one of them. What Hill needed was to poo poo on trump AND talk about what SHE was going to do to make everyones life better. Instead we got "we go high" lol
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Nov 10, 2016 05:08
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Adventure Pigeon posted:Someone who makes tweets like this Assange is a rapist moron and im fine with anyone making GBS threads on him. Podesta was an insufferable twit at times but he saw the writing on the wall. Or at least Id like to think he did
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Nov 10, 2016 05:09
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Raskolnikov38 posted:oh dear lord he actually loving tweeted that You can be a rich ponce whose out of touch and still realize yer going to lose your head of poo poo gets to bad. shame they completely jobbed it though so everyone's going to lose their poo poo.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:12
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Podesta being rich n out of touch did not cost hill the election, her not taking charge of her candidacy or owning anything cost her the election. Instead of standing up she was nice and courteous.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:15
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HannibalBarca posted:Was anyone sounding alarm bells, like on a "we're going to lose this election" at any point? We all saw that Politico article from early this morning about how Bill was badgering people about the sort of midwest turnout disaster that ended up happening, and the data wonks all basically laughed it off. Was there anyone at the Michigan state office level, or something, who were trying to draw attention to the problems here? Nobody expected it but it makes 100% sense looking back. We got Kristol'd
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Nov 10, 2016 05:16
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Raskolnikov38 posted:of course not but its like "loving really dude? you're posting that in october of an election that's very anti-elitest. did you think for a loving second?" Trumpinmosttastelessgoldapartment.png poo poo like that doesn't matter. Its what you make your message and campaign about that matters. Raskolnikov38 posted:bill is scum but goddamn the man knows how to run for president He is from Arkansaw. She is from Chicago/NY. He saw the writing on the wall tbqh.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:25
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Necc0 posted:another thing i just remembered: why the gently caress weren't they going through the wikileaks site and posting highlights of things they were proud of? it was clear wikilieaks wasn't reading all of that and just releasing their shockers amidst tens of thousands of emails so there was plenty of material to choose from. that seemed obvious to me just a month or two into that whole circus Imagine I quoted that article about too many cooks and all that. There was never any focus.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:32
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Necc0 posted:do you know if this was even floated? No. I dealt with surrogates and talking points. Not super high level poo poo like "what do we make the campaign about". What I do 100% know is I got told at times that I shouldn't be worried about keeping the dem base excited 
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Nov 10, 2016 05:35
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HannibalBarca posted:You've got to be loving kidding me. I wish Thundercracker posted:Did the DNC not just ..... arggh.. just not pay attention to loving anything? "Trump will turn them out for us" and "Disenfranchisement is overstated" The polls showed this. To bad all the polls were completely loving wrong lmao. Oh Snapple! posted:VS I can't remember if we've interacted poorly in the past but you seem like you worked hard and I'm sorry that work was directed so incompetently. Iv had a lot of hate throne my way by bernie friends angry about how huge of a gently caress up this was but I even though I feel bitter at times I'll never return that hate. To me everyone on the left is an ally and I hope we work together. One of the big problems with discourse on the left is the automatic assumption of malice. God help us all we need to be united now in unfucking things more than ever.
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Nov 10, 2016 05:52
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Larry Parrish posted:Neoliberals aren't leftists dude. They're merely the Blue-painted version of neoconversatives, with some disgusting levels of patronizing thrown in if you happen to not be white I'm not talking about neoliberals when I say the varied shades of leftists need to get something going together
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Nov 10, 2016 06:14
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Larry Parrish posted:Well, they do, but you said 'we'. Not sure how you reconcile being a leftists with literally working on the campaign of a neoliberal warhawk, but hey. I'm here to help. If your decision is to call me a neoliberal warhawk and  me than okay I guess 
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Nov 10, 2016 06:20
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NumberLast posted:We need to purge like we're the loving Titanic if we want to save this party, because we are. He said, kicking down the door to an empty room. The neoliberals got brutally owned and are now out of power. What do we do now?
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Nov 10, 2016 06:22
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NumberLast posted:you can't be serious The neolibs just blew the most important election in decades lol
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Nov 10, 2016 06:26
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NumberLast posted:I won't believe they're out of the power in the party until it happens. I expect them to cling as hard as they can. There is nobody at the helm my man
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Nov 10, 2016 06:36
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Oh Snapple! posted:Is my mental image of these aides who thought they knew more about campaigning than Bill Clinton as douchey, Silicon Valley dweebs who chug Soylent accurate? ALL HAIL THE CLOUD
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Nov 10, 2016 07:04
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Strep Vote posted:my friend, it's not that you hate us, it's that you do not respect us. even now you are not listening. If I had no respect for the left I wouldn't be here
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Nov 10, 2016 07:20
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anime was right posted:ya'll my comrades. we in this together.
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Nov 10, 2016 07:43
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