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Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Splicer posted:

If you mean not being able to queue multiple robopops, there's a checkbox saying "build multiple pops"in the popbuild queue.

If you mean that you have to pay all the minerals up front, yeah, that hurts.

Original Idea Please Steal: Cloning vats on a planet should enable bio pop building with food.
I tried this and it was a nightmare. Might work now they've changed AI rights though- before clone pops counted as robots so Spiritualists couldn't make them in many cases.

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Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Will this apply to existing Contingency fleets or only new ones? I have a game that might be saveable if it's the former.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Aethernet posted:

Switching to lances makes the Contingency much, much easier to hard counter, which I thought they were moving away from in 1.8 - for end game crises at least.
Yeah- evasion corvettes with small autocannons to deal with the awful high-dodge seekers will be worth their weight in gold. I think maybe they're supposed to be countered by missiles and bombers (as Prethoryn are energy and Unbidden are kinetic) but since those are still no good lategame vs normal empires people won't have the tech or fleet for it.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

DrSunshine posted:

On that note, I sort of wonder which is better for robomodding re: energy? -10% upkeep, or +10% Energy (superconductive)?
+Energy is better in the early game, as you can build specialist bots on energy tiles then robomod everyone to -10% energy later. The other way around is harder as you can’t retrofit bots selectively.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
What sort of fleet powers do you need to take on the LEX leviathans? I drove a 100k fleet at the Gravekeeper and lost it without putting a dent in his HP. Do they scale to galaxy size at all?

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Nessus posted:

I have bad news about your gut flora.
It sounded like 70 or so inhabited planets were what people liked to do, everyone was bragging about taking 0.25x habitable worlds, hyperlanes only, so on and so forth.
Hyperlanes only is common but not 25% habitable planets.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

McGiggins posted:

Star spawn event is dreadful. 227k fleet of dreadnoughts, battlecruisers, carriers and strike cruisers laid low by two 20k fleets.

What can I can I do against such evil?
I really like the feel and writing of LEX but yeah. You can’t really do the events until after you’ve already won and have a good half-mil fleet power and no external threats, and they’re *always* big ‘gently caress you’ buttons. If it was rescaled to the midgame and sometimes you got the rewards before the threat appeared, it’d be way more interesting. Arcadia is better than the Gravekeeper, for example, as ‘can I leverage the obelisk bonuses to help me win before the enemies spawn’ is way better than ‘Do I have a big enough fleet to get an even bigger fleet’ is.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
I made/updated a few mods recently, one inspired by a suggestion in the thread so I'll link them:
  • Sector Shipyards - Centralise Production (updated)
    Each spaceport in a sector contributes 50% of its build speed to the sector capital. Reduces the micro involved in building large fleets.
  • Sector Edicts - Centralise Commands (new, inspired by thread)
    Allows you to enact sector-wide edicts from the capital for 250 influence. Currently only covers edicts related to energy/minerals/ethics/happiness. I'm not sure whether to expand it to cover things that aren't affected by the sector tax...?
  • Overharvest - Unsustainable Development (updated)
    Adds a policy that lets you get +10/+20% to Energy/Food/Minerals, at the cost of adding unremovable tile blockers over time. Lets you play a locust swarm that has to keep moving or die. The update makes nomadic/double-jointed pops automatically resettle to another planet if a blocker appears on their tile, and adds a 50% chance for non-sedentiary/bulky pops to do so.
  • Starvation - Rationing & Death (new)
    Makes it so starving countries start to suffer pop die-off after 6 months (1 pop/mtth 6 months). Also adds a rationing edict starving empires will use. This should help stop countries getting locked in perpetual starvation where starvation causes, unrest, causes no production, so they can't afford to redevelop buildings into farms.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Market research for y'all:
I've figured out how to more-or-less do tile-based gene modding/robomodding. Basically just adding a 'Smart Modification' trait that then gets replaced by Agrarian/Industrious/Thrifty(/Propaganda Bot) based on whatever building the pop is working. The problem is, deciding how to manage those pops who either already have the trait, or are on a tile with no buff trait. Which of these would people prefer:

  • No Change
    The trait removes itself, leaving the pops unmodified. You can then apply whatever you want to them later.
    +: Simple, straightforward, gives the player maximum control.
    -: The 'unmodified' pops were included in the cost to perform the project. That could be months or years worth of Society research that ended up not changing anything.

  • Backstop List
    The trait is replaced by Conservationist (if applicable), or Talented, or Quick Learners, or...
    +: Least effort for the player. One trait, that will always have a positive effect.
    -: The desirability of each trait will vary wildly by playstyle. For example, adding Talented to a slave species is a bit pointless. There's no single backstop list.

  • Smart Modification Options
    Instead of a single 'Smart Modification' trait, there's a bunch - 'Smart Modification - Talented', 'Smart Modification - Conservationist' etc. They specify what trait will be added to the species if the food/minerals/energy traits aren't appropriate.
    +: Gives players control over what the backstop trait is.
    -: Not that obvious, lots of clutter, doesn't support modded-in traits.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Just finished this: Smart Modification - Traits by Tile.

A mod that adds a trait that you can apply during genetic modification/robomodding. Once the project finishes, the trait's removed from your pops and replaced by the appropriate +Resource one for the building they're working (e.g. Industrious for Mines) or the cost of modding that pop is refunded if there's no valid trait. This should make biological ascension perks useful without insane levels of micromanagement.

Unfortunately as there's no way to get the *resources* a tile is producing it just checks via a huge list of buildings so won't modify pops working modded-in buildings appropriately (it'll just refund them), but it's still useful for anyone running mostly vanilla.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

GunnerJ posted:

Stellaris is pretty robust about rolling with tokens it doesn't recognize (it just ignores them) so if you're willing to deal with the hassle, and users want compatibility, you can add mod-added buildings to the list. They will only be relevant if a user has the appropriate mod but they won't hurt anything otherwise.
Argh, fair enough. I've added a bit of text to the mod page telling people how to provide me with a list of buildings. If people want support they can do the legwork!

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Splicer posted:

I'll be away from my computer until late tonight/tomorrow evening so I've no idea what your mod currently looks like under the hood, but I know if you make a building you can add modifiers by checking the tile for minerals > 1, energy > 1 etc. I was trying to make intelligently transparent buildings, which ironically it's useless for since it only checks for produced resources.
Oh, that *is* useful. I was testing:
code:
has_resource = {
			type = energy
			amount = 1
}
And that would *only* return the base resources, not what was being actually produced- which meant any tile that was being overwritten by a different building would assign the wrong trait. Right, time to fix that one up too!

E: Nope, looks like has_resource is the only thing that checks tile resources. Are you sure you were getting the *current* production?

Talkie Toaster fucked around with this message at 16:51 on Nov 8, 2017

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

LordMune posted:

I haven't tested if has_resource checks actual output or base tile resource, but if it fails you should be able to use has_deposit = d_immense_engineering_deposit to check the original base deposits assigned to the tile. In theory.
I've just checked and it definitely checks the base tile resource. I don't think there is any way to check a tile's output, there's definitely none on the wiki.

The old effects_doc/triggers_doc console commands don't seem to work any more so we can't see if there's any been added since about 1.6. Is there any chance we could get a list of current effects/triggers/modifiers/scopes? Even if it's undocumented names only, it'd be a huge help. The pop={} scope for tiles, for example, isn't on the wiki or even used in any of the scripts but works.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Is there an agreed 'optimal' setup for genetically engineered species?

With both ascension perks, having mining pops that're Nerve Stapled, Very Strong and Industrious (8 trait points, +35%) makes sense.
For food, Nerve Stapled and Agrarian (5 trait points, +25%).
For science, Erudite and Natural X (5 trait points, +20-35%).
For energy, just Thrifty seems to apply (2 trait points, +15%).

I've reached the lategame in my biological ascension run and am trying to figure out how to tweak Smart Modification to make it possible to automatically manage all this but it seems, given the trait cost disparity, there's no easy way to do it. Everyone will have their own preference for 'ideal pop for X'. The closest I can think of is having gene-modding in advanced empires automatically set the pop's habitability trait to whatever's appropriate for their planet, so you only need to manage 5 templates:
- Basic smartmod template that assigns all your pops to food/minerals/energy/science/none of the above
- Food template you then apply to all your food subspecies at once
- Minerals template
- Energy template
- Science Template
But it'd still be bit of a ballache as every time you filled up a new world you'd have to do 5 Special Projects.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Xae posted:

The problem with optimal pops is that sectors fuckin' suck at using them correctly.

Plus you can't engineer at a super specific level.

Which is why I prefer abilities that are always in effect like cheaper consumer goods.
Well, I made a mod that *let* you engineer at a super-specific level, that's why I'm asking. As far as I can tell sectors won't reshuffle pops once they've grown, so auto-assigning traits based on the tile they're on should hold fine- it'll un-staple pops on power plants, etc.

Nevets posted:

I've always thought genemodding your species into multiple specialized subspecies (one for mining, one for research, etc.) would be better handled as a policy choice, since you are basically setting up a caste system anyway. Those strong resilient pops are all going to be miners & soldiers, as will their children & their children's children.

You could have a residency option that unlocks when researching genemodding that works like an advanced version of the caste system, with smaller happiness & influence penalties, and increased range of habitability. As you research more advanced genetic engineering techs the bonuses would get bigger & penalties smaller.
We can't add extra residency options, as far as I'm aware- the tokens the UI uses are hardcoded. Wonder if we can add optional bonuses based on tech in the same way as buildings can have optional resources based on traditions?

Talkie Toaster fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Nov 10, 2017

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

McGiggins posted:

Yeah, but I want my enslaved fallen/awakened empire species soldiers riding xenomorphs into battle.

And I can have that, if I participate in the least well thought out UI process in the game. So my point is, either make a better way of doing it, or remove it because no one uses it because it sucks.

Maybe make the upgrades into empire bonuses to armies instead. I don't know.

Wiz has repeatedly said he wants to change how armies work. I think he even says it in the latest dev diary.

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens

Bloodly posted:

Doesn't matter if they're dead first. And they will be since they don't actually dodge anything.
You can disengage at <50% health. Few weapons in 1.9 will take a corvette from 100-0% in one hit, and we don’t even know the damage for 2.0. So... when the designer says they will get to disengage that’s probably true?

Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Given gates and jump drives are in it should be easy to mod in a hiver-style wormhole race anyway. Start with JD and gates, increase JD warmup by a factor of 100. Now it takes years to jump into a system but you can build a gate there, job done.

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Talkie Toaster
Jan 23, 2006
May contain carcinogens
Whilst waiting for 2.0, I'm trying to mod in some 'pacifist win conditions', starting off with building Enclaves- the idea being that they'll outlive your empire, etc. etc.. Plus, they neatly focus on science, unity and :10bux: so give handy paths.

Roughing out the Science one at the moment, I've got 4 stages and the requirements for upgrading each are meant to mirror the benefits of the Enclaves: Research buffs, buying star charts, and selling scientists.
  • Platform: 10k minerals, 300 influence, Technological Ascendancy AP, deep space stations.
  • Stage 1: 20k minerals, all level 3 lab technologies.
  • Stage 2: 20k energy, have survey data on all systems in the galaxy.
  • Stage 3: 300 influence, give up 3 level 6 scientists to staff the enclave.
  • Stage 4: ???
Each stage completed grants you more of a 'Curator Insight' strategic resource that gives a +15% research boost and a +25 opinion boost to you from anyone you've traded it to, so you can play as a friendly curator giving out buffs to everyone. I'm considering adding a boost to your trust cap as well (to make it easier to survive when border pressure starts heating up), but annoyingly you can't apply that via a megastructure.

Currently, I'm torn on what the final 'You Accomplished Your Goals!' stage requirement should be. Under consideration are:
  • Find a precursor homeworld: Even if it's fixed in 2.0, it's sort of folded into the 'have survey data on all systems' stage. You're likely to have already scored this by the time you get to Stage 4.
  • Learn expensive techs: E.g. all the power/armour/shield upgrades or special new ones. Seems a little bit underwhelming? You already have research gating on stage 1, though it's not very severe.
  • Explore a difficult new anomaly: E.g. you have to scan 3 different black holes and then the SMBH at the galactic centre. You'll have given up your 3 best scientists in stage 3 and will have a hard time getting more up to level 5 to do the projects, which seems a bit dickish.
  • Finish a Leviathan research project: Neatly ties into the Enclave habit of giving out info on how to beat Leviathans, but it's also a midgame thing and worse one you can potentially be permanently locked-out from if you're unlucky.
  • Have X Research Agreements: If you're an enclave, you should be sharing your knowledge. Slightly hard to manage given the amount you want would change with galaxy size.
Anyone have any particular thoughts on the above?

Talkie Toaster fucked around with this message at 16:23 on Feb 16, 2018

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