FFV Four Job Fiesta 2017: Fate of the Zerkious

The Something Awful Forums > Discussion > Video Games > FFV Four Job Fiesta 2017: Fate of the Zerkious

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

KataraniSword posted:

Some of these are just mechanically awful design choices, though.

Because it wasn't ENOUGH of a nightmare without a rod-snapping class!

Sucks if your Galuf is stuck as a naked white mage like in OFS's attempts.

So basically if you don't have Romeo's Ballad (!Calm doesn't work any more) you better be ready to eat constant Rocket Punches and Mustard Bombs.

Yeah, as the guy who's putting that list together, I had always considered myself a mobile apologist, but there are some pretty negative downsides in terms of the Fiesta. Beastmaster, Blue Mage, Chemist, Time Mage all get various levels of de-buffed (though if you were going to pick four classes...) thanks to all the exploit and glitch fixes. Arguably, Geomancer is de-buffed too, since the times where !Gaia is most effective are usually the times you want the lower level abilities. But the changes to the Omniscient and Omega fights are clearly the worst offenders here.

On the upside, Berserkers are a fair bit better (though good luck with quadzerker NED...) and Ninjas love the crap out of the Double Lance shenanigans you can pull off. But that's about it...

Personally, I've only stuck by it because it's super easy to play on my tablet, and virtual keypads drive me up the wall in a way that mobile-optimized controls don't. If I could buy FFVA from the eShop on my 3DS I would and never look back.

# ¿ May 19, 2017 17:16

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# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 12:16

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

Has someone here or on reddit made a full list of Matrix version differences? I offered to write one up last year but I never got around to it... and I think I might have forgotten some key things too. But I can try if it doesn't already exist.

I'm working on a list here: https://www.reddit.com/r/ff5fjf/comments/6bx2t2/compilation_of_changes_to_the_mobilesteam_version/

I've been editing to include any differences I've missed.

# ¿ May 19, 2017 19:15

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

Awesome! Looks great. One thing I'd add but I would need to test to make absolutely sure: although the Double Lance proc thing is beneficial in many cases, I'm pretty sure it also means you can't stop the Chicken Knife run proc if it's in the second hand.

Another thing about weapon procs: they can fire on misses. I honestly don't know if they fire on misses in the original versions, but I think someone once told me they don't. It's another thing that makes Berserkers a lot better in the Matrix versions: those Death Scythe procs happen all the time. Last year I blinded my Berserker when fighting the crystals so he wouldn't hurt them unless he was killing them.

I can confirm that the Chicken Knife !Flee still procs in the off-hand even with a Double Lance. Forgot to mention that in the reddit post.

Seems like Mobile version is really the Berserker Edition. I just can't imagine how Quadzerkers deal with NED in that case...

# ¿ May 19, 2017 21:13

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Can anyone recommend a good GBA emulator for the PSP? I remember playing FFVI on it several years ago but I seem to have deleted the emulator that I used to use.

It would be nice to go back to FFVa after a few years of fun with the Mobile version, but I'd like to play it on a mobile device with an actual gamepad and I'd let Squeenix take my money soooo much if they'd just bother to release the Advance games on the 3DS store

# ¿ May 25, 2017 21:27

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

ZiegeDame posted:

Yet another year I find myself wishing there was a mode where I could sign up for 5 consecutive runs with no duplicate jobs. Which got be thinking of a fun bit of theory crafting to kill time until the fiesta starts.

If you had to complete 5 separate runs using each job once and only once, how would you distribute those jobs?

I got as far as:
Time Mage, , ,
Beastmaseter, , ,
Bard, , ,
Chemist, , ,
Mystic Knight, Ranger, ,

This gives each team a shot at beating Omega. You'd probably want to stuff all the lovely jobs with Chemist, because even a Geomancer can use Mix.

What does everyone else think?

Decided to put way more thought into this than strictly necessary:

Time Mage, Berserker, Samurai, Thief
Beastmaster, Blue Mage, Dragoon, Ninja
Bard, Summoner, Geomancer, Knight
Chemist, Monk, Black Mage, Dancer
Mystic Knight, Ranger, White Mage, Red Mage

Team #1: This is the "lets give Berserker some useful abilities" team. Berserker's one of the few classes that wants Artful Dodger, there might also be some times where the Berserker wants Equip Katana. Haste also helps shore up Berserker speed issues.

Team #2: Beastmaster/Blue Mage combo is obvious. Dragoon & Ninja have pretty good synergy actually. If we're in Mobile/Steam then !Jump with a pair of Twin Lances is hilarious, but then again that means this party doesn't have an Omega kill. Dual wield helps Dragoon's lackluster offense. They also makes a pretty good !Blue Magic user.

Team #3: Geomancer can be a good back-up !Singer or !Summoner. Between Bard, Summoner and Geomancer you don't really have to worry about random encounters, and nobody here really wants the Chicken Knife, so Knight is free to Two Hand the Brave Blade to their heart's content.

Team #4: Drunken Fist Monk. Black Mage and Monk should help each other through most of the World 1 roadblocks until Chemist and Dancer shows up.

Team #5: Red Mage was hard to place... I originally had Black Mage here but the lack of multi-target White Magic buffs makes me think White Mage wants X-Magic more.

Every group has a good/decent Chicken Knife user except #3, which picks up the Brave Blade. Every group can deal with Rug Wizard without any kind of obnoxious shenanigans. Team #1 maybe hits a few world 1 roadblocks until it gets some better offense, but I can't think of big issues any of these teams should encounter throughout the game. Might be missing something.

# ¿ May 27, 2017 00:21

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Popular definitely seems like it would be fun; I'm probably going to put it off for a second run (which I will complete this year! Finally!) Registered PureChaos this year.

Re: Version differences, Mobile/Steam version is only really terrible if a) the graphics are aggressively offensive to you, and/or b) Triple Crowning is important to you. Personally I have no issues with the graphics (there are obvious technical issues if you squint at screenshots but it generally looks fine when it's in motion) and I actually like the monster sprites better in this version. Most of the gameplay changes are fixes to exploits that are generally only relevant to killing Omega (Omniscient is the other big one, but virtually every party that needs/wants to kill Omni still can fairly easily). Granted, that's not nothing, but there's a lot of hyperbolic hatred that it doesn't really deserve. At its worst it's still miles better than the PSX version. Hilariously awful translation notwithstanding.

# ¿ May 31, 2017 23:34

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

InfernoBlade posted:

Water crystal is Berserker. That's the only thing I'm putting all $5000 towards. I figure if we're spreading the love around enough to make #GUARANTEEDBERSERKER happen, the run needs one too.

The other jobs I'm actually having RK basically split the money so that I only put +500 towards them, that way others can override me this time if they want to. At least on everything but the berserker.

As such here's what I'm going to tell RK to do unless someone convinces me otherwise in the next couple hours:
Wind: ~~Thief~~ White Mage +500
Water: Berserker + 5000
Fire: Beastmaster + 500
Earth: Dragoon + 500

I don't think this is a particularly mean party, but it's also not particularly easy. IMO there's none of the broken classes in there, but it also lacks any real forms of magic damage or healing so that's going to make it a bit difficult to work with.

My vote would be Dancer instead of Dragoon for the Earth crystal, but that's just because I like the idea of introducing a little chaos into a speedrun.

Beastmaster should be fun, but my only concern is how it'll be used to cheese so many boss fights. Berserker means they can only !Release three times per fight, though, so maybe it won't be quite so cheesy.

# ¿ Jun 1, 2017 16:28

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Twelve by Pies posted:

I could not disagree more. There's a lot of other bizarre changes that basically boil down to "No fun allowed." There's things like hugely nerfing certain attacks like Beastmaster's releases so Yellow Dragon/Zuu can't hit heavy targets, making it so Chemist's mixes can miss, making Shinryu immune to blind/berserk, and even bizarre things like removing Defender's ability to cast Protect when used as an item,

I understand that the Steam/mobile version fixed a lot of bugs, some that are beneficial, but I can see the argument that it wasn't supposed to be like that (things like W2 Exdeath having Regen again, !Calm not working on non-magic beasts, I'll even grant Omniscient being able to cast Return through berserk), but the things I mentioned were not bugs and seem to only have been changed because "You're not playing the game the way we want you to" which is a really lovely move.

And, as has been mentioned, there are some team compositions for which it's actually impossible to beat the game on the Steam/mobile versions simply because of these awful changes.

I'll give credit where it's due. The enemy sprites look fantastic, even if the PC sprites look like rear end, and they legitimately made some cool changes such as Geomancer being able to use any !Gaia skill rather than having many of them locked behind levels that no sane human being would ever reach in a normal playthrough of the game (although this change does make them more useless in many boss battles since a lot of the high level ones have instant death effects which every boss is immune to, whereas lower level ones at least usually do some damage), but overall I feel (and most people here would probably agree) the Steam/mobile version is far worse than any other version of the game. Yeah, loading times of several seconds simply to go into the menu is really annoying but I'd take that any day over the terrible mechanics changes.

Literally everything you mention is exploit fixes for cheesing bosses, most of whom are optional. PS Shinryu is still vulnerable to Berserk & Blind, there's just no reliable way to stick Blind anymore. I'll agree that Triple Crowning a FJF run is important to you, then Mobile/Steam version is probably the worst version. Maybe a LLG challenge run too?

That said, there is, as far as I know, only one team composition where it is *probably* impossible to the beat the game in the Steam/Mobile version. 99% of the changes impact optional bosses, and the mandatory boss changes are not anything remotely game-breaking. Omniscient becomes the new roadblock, but reflecting Mage Masher Silences have been confirmed to work still. Omni is only mandatory if you roll Mime in Pure Chaos, and you can Mage Masher Silence him with every possible team composition except for Monk/White Mage/Berserker. I would wager that you probably can't smash Staves of Light on him. At that point I'd just Job Fair out Mime and move on with my life.

e: Also forgot Quadzerks, who probably couldn't take down NED. Of course, Quadzerks on PSX also have to deal with NED's dummy targets, so I don't necessarily know it's possible there either.

None of this is nearly as awful as laggy PSX load times.

Ace Transmuter fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Jun 1, 2017

# ¿ Jun 1, 2017 20:36

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

I don't think the changes are as big as you make them out to be. Shinryuu can still be blinded and berserked--Omega is significantly harder but Shin is unchanged. Chemist and Beastmaster are the only classes that are really nerfed, and in the case of Chemist it only moves it from God tier to slightly-less-than-God tier. Beastmaster is still an incredibly versatile class. Berserkers are buffed considerably, to the point where they almost don't suck in most (non-Sandworm) situations, as are Geomancers.

Really, what it all comes down to is that the real reason the Matrix versions are objectively worse for the Fiesta is that you can't fast forward. When you're ten runs in and you are watching Galuf walk slowly toward Exdeath for the tenth time--the thirtieth time, really, since you've done this for three years now--that's when you want a goddamn fast forward button. This also, weirdly, disrupts the class tiers: any class with an instant run skill or that is faster than average (like Red Mage, interestingly enough) is bumped up a tier, and grinding for Turtle Shells is just miserable so I barely even bother when I get a Chemist. And the CK / BB debate is basically thrown out entirely, as you're never going to kill everything you see unless you want your runs to average 15+ hours.

Autobattle is actually pretty fast; if you can FF any grind you can Autobattle it. Doesn't help with the cut scenes which are admittedly quite slow (the beginning of the game too...)

# ¿ Jun 1, 2017 20:44

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

I've been using the same save right outside the Wind Shrine for three years now.

I've considered doing this for years but I always feel like I want to re-name my Bartz something new.

# ¿ Jun 1, 2017 23:08

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Dr. Fetus posted:

So there was apparently a pledge last year to kill Neo Exdeath with a Skull Eater. Which was unfortunately impossible due to the fact Skull Eaters only had 1 HP, and that Goliath Tonics didn't even work on enemies. Well, good news:

Goliath Tonics work on enemies in the mobile version, meaning that Skull Eaters can be tamed.

That's nifty! I'll add it to my version difference list on the reddit.

# ¿ Jun 10, 2017 03:17

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Unfortunately the only PSP GBA emulator I could find had some pretty significant lag with FFV (which is a shame because it worked so good with Shining Force)... I'm probably going to just play it on my Kindle again this year.

# ¿ Jun 17, 2017 00:21

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Basch may live, but I feel like someone has to acknowledge that every PS2-era single-player Final Fantasy game's actual protagonist is a female character, because Square-Enix sure as hell isn't going to.

Also this game just doesn't have enough princesses in its party already. Quadprincess run is a go.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2017 04:49

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Khisanth Magus posted:

Any recommendations for the cannon with a team of zerks and geos? I'm running 3 zerks because the geos can't really damage the cannon, all of their Gaia abilities don't do any damage to it. Level 26 after grinding a bunch, but I don't really know what to do other than grind more. I have a whole 1 hi potion and have used all my elixers.

I did it at a lower level with four Geos. Front row, knives and a lot of elixirs. You can grind for more in the Wind Shrine from Moldwynds.

# ¿ Jun 18, 2017 20:27

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

What's the best World 1 gil grind? Is it wolf genocide, or are there better alternatives?

# ¿ Jun 19, 2017 04:30

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Monk -> Beastmaster -> Black Mage -> Berserker

Seems like a fun party; I think my end-game plan is:

Beastmaster with !Focus & Chicken Knife
Black Mage with Equip Whips and Fire Lash
Berserker with Black Magic and Rune Axe/Titan Hammer
Monk with... I don't know. Probably !Catch/!Release? I'm on Mobile so it's not like it's that useful. Maybe Equip Axe so they can do some actual damage?

# ¿ Jun 19, 2017 18:00

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Fhqwhgads posted:

Wait, !Spellblade counts as magic in that fork?

!Spellblade is magic (it even shows up in your magic menu). Attacking with a Spellblade isn't, but since the Return counter is cast a spell and Silence Spellblade hits 100% of the time, you don't really have to worry about it.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2017 18:39

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

Just to clarify, Silence does work on him in the Matrix versions. It just wears off really fast. MKs apply it with every strike, though, so they work fine. What you can't do is Silence him and then Berserk him. The Berserk will work (and he will proceed to go off on you), but he will cast Return through it. One of these days I'm going to get Monk and White Mage and see if I can counter him to death.

Counter seems to me like it should work, since the Return counter trigger is based off of action commands.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2017 22:09

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Simply Simon posted:

I will never grind up Flame Rings, that is insane. I have finished about six Fiestas now without a White Mage and never felt the need to heal with spells. This one is no exception; I have just obliterated Atomos.

I do grind for Reflect Rings most of the time, to be fair, but that is far less effort and has a far better payoff (immediately - hello 2k+ hitting Bios off three reflect targets).

This is the first time I grinded up for Flame Rings... it wasn't too bad as I could do most of it on Auto Battle while watching TV. The only other time I got Black Mage I also had Red Mage and Chemist, so I never really felt like I needed healing. Never gotten Knight or Ranger but I don't really feel like either would be worth the hassle for healing; it's probably easier to grind up enough Elixirs in the Wind Shrine.

# ¿ Jun 20, 2017 22:35

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Black Mage, Monk, Berserker & Beastmaster at the beginning of World 2 (Regole). A bit over-leveled from the Flame Ring grind, so the Monk is actually keeping up damage-wise still. Equip Whips on Berserker fixes their Agility, equipping Bare-handed on Beastmaster gives them a massive Strength boost, now all I need is for my Monk to learn how to equip a real weapon before her punching starts to suck, and I've got a pretty powerful physical party at this point. Unfortunately, this is the stretch of the game where Black Mage kind of sucks. Fortunately they tend to have an answer for most of the bosses up until we get to Moore and 5th level magic.

# ¿ Jun 21, 2017 21:21

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Vernatio posted:

So, my team for my second run is White Mage/Mystic Knight/Beastmaster/Dancer, and despite having a few fairly powerful classes, I still feel pretty weak? White Mage is amazing at keeping me alive, and I'm sure that Holy will nuke people when I get it, but Mystic Knight is starting to disappoint me. Break Blade is godly in random encounters, but takes a turn to set up, and a lot of bosses are immune to whatever sword magic I have, making the Mystic Knight feel like a less powerful Knight in a lot of fights. Beastmaster is kind of tedious to use, even with the gourd, but whips are nice for a team as squishy as mine. Dancer has the highest damage potential on my team, but it is incredibly squishy.

Are there any synergies I'm missing? White Mage seems to be barely holding this team together, even though the individual parts should be really powerful.

White Mage makes a pretty good Fire Lash user (alternatively, you could give them the Sage Staff for Holy nukers, and give !White6 to Beastmaster for super-powered Firaga procs). I'm not actually sure if !Dance and !Spellbade have synergies. Every knife but Man-Eater is !Spellblade compatible; as long as !Dance doesn't overwrite your !Spellblade a Sword Dance Flare Sword will suitably wreck anything that you can't demolish with elemental or status effect !Spellblades.

All this takes a while to build up to though. Catch/Release can get you past a lot of roadblocks (including W2 Exdeath) as long as you aren't on Mobile; it's a shame that it takes so long to learn for everybody.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 17:09

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Supremezero posted:

They do stack, by the way.

Sounds like a pretty excellent end-game win button, certainly for the Dancer if not the Mystic Knight.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 17:24

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

Okay, I'm only doing 750 per hit so I guess he doesn't have 0 def? I don't know how this can happen if I can't at least get him below 4000. Is his script totally random until then?

It's possibly that Rugwizard, like LiquidFlame, is permanently in the back row in the Mobile version, because this version of the game hates you.

Besides, doesn't !RapidFire ignore defense anyway?

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 21:34

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

I don't suppose the Air Knife would be any better? I know RugWizard has a weakness to Wind but it might not be enough to make up for the Chicken Knife's ridiculous attack power.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 21:37

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

Tried that, only does 250. I can't believe he's in the loving back row. This is some bullshit.

Looks like you're going to need at least two, if not three, Berserker silence procs to stick in a row. Don't know the odds on that. It's possible that it would be less onerous to nab the Artemis Bow and extra Aegis Shields as steals in the Rift.

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 21:54

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

OzFactor posted:

HOLD UP WAIT A SECOND how much damage can I expect to do to the Rugfucker if I blast through the lamp? Holding an Air Knife for Syldra boost?

edit: that motherfucker

Yeah the react script is based off of the command you select, not the nature of the attack. Don't know if that's true in other versions, but Matrix doesn't want physical-only FJF teams to beat Rugwizard.

As for weapon options, I think I'd go with Thor's Hammer. Having at least one 'zerker in the back row will help reduce some of the physical damage you''ll take. That'll hopefully, in theory, free up more turns for the Ranger to attack, and they're going to want to soften up that 3rd NED target and limit the number of Meteors you'll have to face tank. It might even be worthwhile for the third Zerk to wield the Hayate Bow and spread the damage around a bit (I don't think Gaia's Hammer's Quake procs will help as much).

# ¿ Jun 22, 2017 22:50

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Nasgate posted:

I will report back if the quick leak works on mobile

My understanding is that the Bio works and the Sap sticks, but it wears out in real-time, whether you're in the middle of Quick or not. If the target is Heavy that means it doesn't last particularly long.

# ¿ Jun 23, 2017 16:25

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Admiral Joeslop posted:

It maxes out at 127 attack, I think. One attack per run.

I could be wrong about all that.

One attack for every two successful flees, I believe

# ¿ Jun 25, 2017 17:24

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

I know the conventional wisdom is that Monk is pretty worthless except as an item slinger or as a secondary utility action command user (like !Mix or !Sing), but I guess conventional wisdom never bothered to give them a weapon? Having a Monk that equip whichever Whip or Axe is most appropriate to the situation has been pretty awesome. Highest strength, highest HP, innate counter, medium armor has a ton of great options, and they're a pretty reliable damage machine.

I mean, there are obviously better classes, but Monk has not been the albatross around my neck that I was worried it was going to be.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2017 17:01

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Exercu posted:

The issue is that a monk equipping an axe or a whip or whatever gives him a decent !fight command. But very few jobs want to just !fight, even among the physical ones. Each of them would love a force multiplier like !dance, !rapidfire etc etc. If you give Monk a weapon, they don't get to use those force multipliers at the same time.

edit: giving him Equip Swords makes him a Knight who can't two-hand or use shields. Giving him Equip Axes makes him a controllable Berserker who does less damage than a real Berserker, which is nice enough, I guess. But "lower damage than Berserker, and only able to !fight and !Item" is not exactly the benchmark we want to hit. Giving him !Equip Lances makes him a Dragoon who can't jump or use shields.

In seven years I'e never gotten a Ranger or Dancer (or Mystic Knight, for that matter) so I'm rather used to !Fight being my main source of physical damage. I also think that end-game Axes and Whips are more powerful than you're giving them credit for. Of course, my Monk is still my lowest damage dealer overall (she usually tops Beastmaster round-to-round on damage, but the Firaga procs powered by !Black6 put her over the top) but she's still topping 4-digits every attack easily. They're still probably one of the worst physical classes (and thus worst overall classes) but they're hardly the dead weight dumpster-fire I'd been led to believe they are.

If nothing else I'd take Monk with a decent equip ability over Dragoon any time.

# ¿ Jun 26, 2017 17:23

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Genocyber posted:

Oh boy, Gilgabot's been kind to me this year. First Chemist, then Bard, then Ninja...what could I possibly pull for Earth?!

*gets Monk*

Little late on that call, aren't ya?

I realize that in light of Chemist it's kind of moot what other jobs I get, but I find it hilarious I got Monk at the least useful place.

Nobody loves good food and song more than a Monk.

!Mix and !Song can boost the Monk's levels, and therefore unarmed damage, ridiculously high

# ¿ Jun 26, 2017 21:23

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Kashuno posted:

Yep, this is exactly the strategy I used.

The Hand form also runs out of MP fairly quickly, so the only real danger eventually becomes the Human form's Blaze.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2017 16:14

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Schwarzwald posted:

That must be another change for the mobile version, because I don't remember berzerkers respecting rows originally.

Yup, Mobile 'zerkers only target the default (typically front) target every time. It tends to make them more useful basically at every point until the last ten minutes of the game, where they become a horrible liability.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2017 17:03

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Monk, Beastmaster, Black Mage and Berserker team has made it to the rift just before NED, hopefully will have time to beat it tonight.

This has... not been an exceptionally great party, overall. There's been a surprising amount of synergy (Beastmaster, Monk and Berserker trading Equip abilities back and forth, and both Berserker and Beastmaster have great weapons they want !Black6 to boost the power of), and Flame Rings take care of healing, but there's not a lot of raw power here. I took the time to grind out the Chicken Knife, but giving him !Focus takes away my secondary healer, unless I gave it the Monk, but then I'd have to take away him Thor's Hammer, and I think that might actually be a decrease in power ultimately (that and you can't target with !Focus). Plus I like having everyone but the Berserker in the back row. I'll report back on NED when I get there. No Triple Crown with this party unfortunately.

Think I might take a break after and run Popular later in the summer.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2017 23:05

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Exercu posted:

Why no triple crown? You've got a beastmaster, and that's really all you need. Omega can be !Calmed and releasing a Mammon can be used to berserk Shinryu (and Galajelly can be used to blind Shinryu). You can do it, friendo.

On Mobile, so !Calm works as intended (which is, not on Omega). Not sure if the releases for Shinryu are blockable but even if it were it would require too much at this point. I'd probably put the work in if Triple Crown were possible, but dragon-but-not-robot always feels like a hollow victory.

# ¿ Jun 27, 2017 23:27

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

I definitely think those four (Monk, Red Mage, Geomancer & Dragoon) probably represent the worst classes in a FJF, and it's fairly fitting that there's one for each crystal. Berserker probably rounds out a "bottom 5" but for all of its flaws, it's still considerably effective on its own, while the other four aren't. I think any one of those four are fairly party-dependant and could be considered the "worst" depending on what else you draw.

Monk is the physical early bloomer class. They're incredibly effective in World 1 then fall off a cliff unless you over-level, and even that doesn't help you out for too long. They have the highest HP and the highest Strength, so there's way to make them a little more effective, but they still lag behind as a physical damage dealer. High HP makes them a fairly good secondary support skill user, and with the right classes (Bard & Chemist) can actually be very effective on their own.

Red Mage is the magical early bloomer. It's hard to scoff at -ra level spells, rod-breaking and heal-staff using, but all of this kind of falls off fairly early on in World 2. There are other classes who love !Dualcast but if you don't have the proper class they don't have much to offer. They make decently effective !Dance-users, especially if you can get a Lamia Tiara to drop for them, but in general they're very dependent on having the proper other classes to support.

Geomancer has the extremely conditionally-useful !Gaia and make a few dungeons much less of a headache (but then, so does Time Mage). !Gaia is hard to recommend overall, as there are too many situations where their effects are either ineffective or heal the enemies/bosses of a specific area, but come in handy in a few particularly difficult bosses (see: Byblos). They can't equip rods or staves so they don't even make great back-up casters, though the Gaia Gear and Air Knife make them fairly effective mid-and-late-game secondary summoners, if nothing else. Possibly the worst overall class on its own, but has its rare corner cases of effectiveness.

Dragoon is probably the most effective of the four classes overall, but is still one of the least powerful physical classes with a terrible weapon set and worse synergy. !Jump can get around telegraphed attacks (or attacks you otherwise know are coming via AI), which can make them pretty effective Blue Mages or mini-Chemists (with either !Mix or even !Revive in some strats) but they don't have much to offer anyone else and don't really benefit from other abilities. !Jump is at least a way around the Chicken Knife's !Flee? Probably the least "bad" of the four classes but definitely the most boring.

# ¿ Jun 28, 2017 00:53

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

gatesealer posted:

so I feel like I'm using goblin punch wrong. I have my blue mage equipped with the chicken knife and it is currently maxed out at 127, but I deal 0 damage with goblin punch. Am I missing something?

Goblin Punch only takes the weapon's base attack value, which for Chicken Knife is 1. On the flip side, Goblin Punch always treats Brave Blade at max value no matter how many times you've run.

# ¿ Jun 28, 2017 03:11

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

Is there a Beastmaster !Release that will a) petrify the Almagest casting part of NED and b) still work on the Mobile version?

# ¿ Jun 28, 2017 20:12

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

So I'm stuck on NED. My party is Black Mage, Monk, Beastmaster, and Berserker. Playing on Mobile so !Releasing for 9999 to all 4 parts is out.

For most of the game I've been relying on Flame Rings for healing for I don't output enough damage fast enough to get past Tree Exdeath's Meteor spam unless I switch to Hermes Sandals. Beastmaster has been secondary Black Mage, Berserker has Rune Axe and Monk has the Titan Axe, so everybody's capable of dealing around 2-3k per round. NED just straight up wrecks me with Almagest every time.

I've been considering a new strategy where I use Reflect Rings and bounce spells off of my party, which should hopefully get me past Meteor Spam. This will let me ignore the Magic casting part and try to get Break to stick on the Alamgest-caster (last year had Summoner and had success with a similar strategy casting Catoblepas, not sure if Break has any different chance to succeed or not). Also not sure if a Release would help (again, Mobile version).

Did the Mobile version change Tree Exdeath's AI routine? I remember White Hole being fairly rare but he spams that thing at me constantly and it slows my offense way the hell down because it takes three actions to cure and I only get two per round thanks to Berserker.

Might have to grind levels for enough HP to survive an Almagest. What's the best place in W3 to do that?

# ¿ Jul 12, 2017 16:17

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# ¿ Apr 29, 2024 12:16

Ace Transmuter: May 19, 2017; I like video games

purkey posted:

Holy crap, what level do I need to be to beat Sol Cannon with Geomancers and Bards?!

Low to mid 20's. Sit in the front row and stab away. Bring a lot of Elixirs

# ¿ Jul 13, 2017 06:07

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