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I think the Quest is just going to be the best for the majority of people, and even if you feel that you only really want to do PC VR stuff, the ability to do the fully wireless and take it wherever is just too much of a utility to pass up. Want to bring it to a party, your backyard, etc.? For reference, I have the Index, so I'm pretty on the side of "PC VR is best"
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Oct 12, 2019 00:31
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EbolaIvory posted:Yeah keep in mind I'm not talking poo poo on the quest. Love mine, Was in the first ad for it, bla bla. I just would never tell someone "buy this for PCVR". If you know for a fact that you only ever wanna do PCVR and don't ever wanna do anything else, the S is probably better enough at it to be worth picking up. If there's any chance you might wanna bring your headset to a party, travel with it, take it to other rooms of your house, then the Quest seems better. I guess I'd tell people "buy this for PCVR" only because if they're new to VR enough to be asking for a recommendation at all, they're probably going to get some use out of being able to go untethered.
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Oct 12, 2019 01:05
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sethsez posted:A higher-resolution and higher-refresh display, far better built-in audio, a mechanical IPD adjustment, and expandability via the front faceplate to allow for better tracking and additional compatibility in the future. My issue is that, even if all this stuff worked, you have to justify it against the Index at that pricepoint, which is hard.
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Oct 13, 2019 17:37
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kojicolnair posted:I'm thinking about getting an index, still somewhat unsure though as I keep reading stuff about people having to RMA and such. I hate making decisions. It was worth it for me because it's honestly great, but if a thousand bucks is big money for you, it's not something I'd get. It really is the best headset you can get, so if you like VR and have the cash...
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Oct 18, 2019 19:21
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TACD posted:Hi thread! I just got an Index as a present to myself and this thing is loving incredible. There’s a visible black line that I’m assuming is a dead pixel column in one eye though which is kind of a bummer, so I’m going to have to look into how to do a warranty swap on the headset. I shelled out for prescription VR lenses, but I honestly don't recommend them. Both the VRoptician and Widmo ones kinda dig into my forehead because the canted lenses make positioning awkward. Use contacts if you can, they're much better.
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Oct 24, 2019 12:46
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Leal posted:Also I'm sorry goons but I'm gonna do it. It's your money and you're an adult so make your own decisions, but it's really not worth it, even free. The original game had some flaws but was fine overall, the VR version can actually make you sick. Just play the flat version if you wanna play the game and a better VR game if you want that.
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Dec 27, 2019 20:46
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Welcome, new Index friends
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Mar 12, 2020 15:18
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Zero VGS posted:Uhh ok so Pimax 8KX with Bigscreen watching Alita Battle Angel in 3D 4K SBS is literally just having my own in-home IMAX theater. I'm curious how you like the 8KX, since I've heard wildly differing accounts from different people. I have an Index now, and it's pretty good, but the better res and fov is pretty attractive. The only thing stopping me is the constant "Pimax is trash" sentiment, which seems accurate for the company on a customer service level, at least.
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Mar 8, 2021 16:27
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I got the 8KX on Amazon so I could return it if it sucked and honestly, I'm sorta conflicted on it. The software is garbage, it just refused to run for like an hour and was overall just a hassle to deal with, it's not very comfortable, and the sound is ludicrously bad, but the visuals are extremely good. Like, actually the best I've ever seen. I didn't really notice how good they were until I went back to my Index and noticed the godrays and FOV. I have a month to choose whether or not I wanna return it, I guess!
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Mar 12, 2021 04:07
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Neddy Seagoon posted:The sound might be a fixable issue issue in a few months if you decide to keep it and you're willing to burn even more money I might get them! I actually kinda hate how good this headset looks, because the index is so much better and easier to use otherwise, but man does it look great.
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Mar 12, 2021 04:40
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; Rebuff Reality's has had their VR Ears Indigigo going until shipping in July, and they're functionally a third-party mountable version of the Index off-ear speakers. They clamp onto the rigid strap and plug into one of the USB-C ports.
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Oh, since VR Ears were mentioned upthread and I just saw this today, have a thing. https://prettygood3d.com/listing/932243822/oe1-off-ear-headphones-for-quest-2-kit Kinda limited since you need the elite strap, and inherently very hacky, but still. e: whoops I'm a moron they do actually have the DAS and other straps in their store they just didn't update this page Blade Runner fucked around with this message at 15:55 on Mar 15, 2021 |
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Mar 15, 2021 15:51
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Zero VGS posted:The "Tectonic BMR" speakers they mention, does anyone know what model precisely are used in the Index and where are they purchasable? More importantly, do they actually sound appreciably better than the DAS speakers if I'm not an audiophile? Tectonic is just a brand, so you can just buy their stuff. That said, I think the Index speakers were specially designed for Valve. https://www.tectonicaudiolabs.com/product/tebm35c10-4-5/?id=product-784 Here's the link to what they probably based them off of, anyway! As for sound on the Index at least, it kinda depends. The quality is better than any other headset, worse than KC 75s, but overall pretty nice and very comfortable to wear.
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Mar 16, 2021 08:08
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Nuts and Gum posted:lol yeah the dude looks exactly as I imagined he would, but he seems pretty grounded and just fuckin' loves attention to detail. As far as I've heard about the guy, he really just likes guns because he thinks they're cool and fun to shoot, but hates violence so he despises the concept of putting human enemies in, so
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Mar 30, 2021 23:04
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I've decided to get rid of my Pimax and go back to my Index because of the weird focal length and the comfort factor. It kinda sucks, since it really does make things look way better to have the FOV and the crazy resolution, but it's annoying to adjust and get it right, and the focal length makes you feel like you're looking at a screen close to your face. The Index, in spite of the FOV, just feels vastly more immersive. Oh well.
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Jul 20, 2021 05:41
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Nuts and Gum posted:To celebrate why not shoot some nazi balls? Powerful username/post combo
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Jul 20, 2021 05:51
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Zero VGS posted:Out of curiosity, what model Pimax was it? I found the focal length on the 5K and the 5K OLED to both be fine, but when I tried an 8KX from Amazon the focal length was horrifically close and I had to return it. Yeah, it was the 8KX. You can get 90 Hz in 4k per eye with a 3090, but eh. The foam was also good, but it wears out really quick. After a few hard sessions in thrill of the fight, it soaked up enough sweat as to be basically useless. It was also difficult to get it into a good position, and prescription adapters basically just don't exist for it. Also, it's really hard to describe how much I actually care about the little things after going back to them; like, the controllers turn off automatically when you leave Steam VR on the Index, and you can just click the game button and start.
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Jul 20, 2021 17:08
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It's kinda funny how people who are both anti and pro-removal are making the point that it's just a dumb shooter game so it doesn't really matter Anyway, my take which nobody cares about is that I didn't really pay any attention to any of that stuff when I played through the game and its removal will not effect me in any way, but this seems more like a thing they did to try and get an article written about their relatively old game than anything else. It doesn't add much and removing it isn't the the end of the world. That said, I ultimately don't see why they can't just make it opt-in, honestly; while I definitely see the point and agree that it shouldn't be opt-out, I feel like if you're saying that people will go into the options and turn on the scenes that will then cause them discomfort and suicidal ideation, you're being a little disingenuous. If someone purposefully exposes themselves to something that will cause them mental and emotional distress when they have to actively take steps to do so and miss out on nothing by not, it's difficult to say that's something that anyone can do anything about.
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Jul 22, 2021 16:45
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I only bought VR Kanojo for the gameplay I swear Anyway honestly all of this pales in comparison to the sex weird degeneracy of VRChat, which I hate
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Jul 22, 2021 16:53
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Cabbages and Kings posted:have you used virt-a-mate, I am curious what the comparison here looks like It's mostly just people having weird fetishes that you don't have to interface with at all if you're only looking at your own weird porn. But VRChat is primarily user created content, so it's basically all DeviantArt poo poo.
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Jul 22, 2021 17:18
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VelociBacon posted:I find it interesting the reverb g2 doesn't come up at all when people are asking for recommendations. It's the best out there for sim racing which is why I have it but I thought it was a contender for general use as well. Most people just want ease of use. I'd love the G2 if it were the exact same specs but released as the Index 2, with an easier connection to SteamVR and basestation tracking. Oculus is also very easy to plug in and go. The G2 works fine, but getting it working in general use can be a hassle, so.
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Jul 24, 2021 22:07
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Argue posted:Okay VRChat is amazing. I entered, and after looking around my Home space or whatever I clicked "Cozy worlds" and entered a portal labelled "Tuscany". It was a nice secluded villa overlooking the sea, and it seemed wholly empty. I had a look around and while I was staring into the ocean, some guy in a Miles Morales costume screams at me from the balcony, "hey, you down there! Get the gently caress off of my property!" He was very committed to the bit or just really insane, either is equally likely
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Jul 25, 2021 17:42
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King Vidiot posted:Yeah, I'm kind of afraid to get back into Thrill of the Fight now because the last time I played I hosed my neck and shoulders up for two straight weeks. Only in the past couple of days have I not had at least a little bit of pain in my neck tendons. It's worth looking into some basic guides on how to do boxing movements on YouTube and practicing those before really getting into it.
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Jul 25, 2021 19:01
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I mean, it's not really a sensible argument either way. Standalone VR is great and the Quest is an extremely good machine that offers a lot of advantages, but the fact is that it's not winning because it's standalone so much as because Zuck is apparently fine with losing cash on it to gain long term control of the market. The machine itself is extremely heavily subsidized, but so are a ton of games on the platform, with Facebook happily dumping stupid amounts of cash into making games they don't seem particularly bothered about losing money on. I think standalone VR is where a large portion of the market is going regardless, but the Quest being propped up by a billion dollar corporation just dumping money into it can't really be ignored when talking about long term survivability in the space.
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Aug 2, 2021 19:15
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Lemming posted:PCVR isn't dead, it's doing better than it ever really has I think, but it's microscopically small is all Sure, but if they sold it for a profit and included the price of the phone in the front rather than brutally undercutting the cost, I don't think they'd be nearly as successful either. I guess my point was it's not successful just because it's standalone. If the HTC Focus had come out instead of the Quest at the exact same time, for example, I don't think it'd be nearly as popular. It's a combination of it being standalone and being cheap enough that it's an impulse buy or Christmas gift for many.
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Aug 2, 2021 19:37
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Lemming posted:From what people in this thread have said who seem to know better, it appears that Facebook is most likely selling the headsets around cost. That said, the investment of R&D will most likely have heavily outweighed any subsidies, but you can also look similarly at games they paid to make for PC that didn't pan out despite significant investments. I'd say that investing the extreme amount they did into R&D and then selling at cost is a pretty heavy net loss. It's a similar strategy to console pricing as compared to PC, and I feel a lot of the same adages apply relative to cost and simplicity vs. fidelity of experience. The main difference is that Oculus also doesn't seem to expect their actual storefront to turn much of a profit now, because they believe more profit will come when they've achieved market dominance. Though, do you sincerely believe the Quest would really have been nearly as successful if it cost five or even six hundred dollars, which is probably about what most manufacturers would need to sell it for to recoup the research investment if they couldn't easily take that hit?
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Aug 2, 2021 19:54
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Lemming posted:Yeah, that's what I was getting at, that the main investment was in the R&D and not in selling the hardware itself at a loss compared to the cost of manufacture. That said, I think this is more "fair" way to do it, in the sense that I think it's a better product and they aren't just making something artificially cheap. I agree with this to a point, but you also have to be very uniquely positioned to try and compete with Oculus right now. Essentially, you have to be a large enough company that you can take the hit of VR not being profitable to you for years, and you have to deal with the fact that even if you do start pumping ridiculous money into this stuff immediately, you're years behind Oculus in terms of research. I sincerely think the only two who'd be able to do it right at this moment are Sony starting up the PSVR again, which they seem to be doing, and Valve, who essentially put out the Index and then moved on to other things because hardware development is difficult, requires entirely different staff than software development, and also Gabe got distracted by BCI stuff and only wants to do that now. Valve almost definitely could put out a standalone headset, but I think going to a model where they separate the Steam store into things that can and can't run on the theoretical Steam Quest would be more detrimental to them than not, so they just have no interest in it. e.: To note, I really do think that other companies like HTC, for example, are going to keep existing, but they need to make money off of just their hardware sales, so they'll never be able to compete with Oculus. That's why they went to the enterprise space, they were banking on pushing the ad campaign that Quests are fancy toys while their models are for real business consumers, etc., etc. Either way, yeah, I don't think PCVR is going to 'die' until at least every current PCVR game is easily playable on a Quest natively, which I can't see happening in the next five years just due to the performance required. Though at that point I will indeed just sell my soul to Facebook because like gently caress it I'm not holding out anymore if that happens, really. Blade Runner fucked around with this message at 01:43 on Aug 3, 2021 |
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Aug 3, 2021 01:38
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Lemming posted:https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Daydream#Lenovo_Mirage_Solo Yeah, but that's also from Google, a company which constantly looks into new things and then immediately gets bored and wanders off. lovely as it seems, I think you really do need someone like Zuck or Gabe (Obviously the latter more than the former, since Valve is literally just a private company where Gabe has pretty much total control, but Zuckerberg still exerts pretty significant influence over Facebook) to say 'I think this thing is where profit is going to be, so we're doing it now and it doesn't matter if we lose money on it for the near future' Where we are now, though, I think Facebook has a significant research gap over companies who haven't even gotten into the VR business yet.
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Aug 3, 2021 02:36
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Lemming posted:Totally, I just mean to say that I don't think this is a situation where Facebook being the frontrunner of VR was an inevitability, it was the result of other companies choosing not to compete with them, they definitely could have given different priorities I think this does raise a question of whether or not, without Facebook, we'd be in the same place. Would another company have picked it up and ran with it instead, or would we just not have had something like the Quest at the price point it is to drive adoption? Lemming posted:I would by and large agree with this but I think you're overstating how closed Quest is, it's so way more open than any traditional console it's not even close. There are even large modding communities for games, which I don't think you get on any other platform than PC. I would agree that this is open to change (though I don't think it will), but currently it's pretty open. I will say that lovely as Facebook is, right now the Quest doesn't really do very much to collect your data and the platform is pretty open due to essentially just being Android. It's absolutely a great machine as it is. However, the reason I think this is going to change, and a lot of people think that's going to change, is that a lot of that relies on Facebook turning either no or a very marginal profit while they push people into their storefront, because they really want the "Well I already have games with Oculus" effect to come in later. Will they leverage that control to close off their store more and make more profit at some later time? It's possible they won't, certainly, but it's a little difficult to imagine it won't happen at some point. Basically, Facebook has to turn a profit on this somehow, and waiting for how they're going to do that can be kind of a sword of Damocles.
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Aug 3, 2021 02:53
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Lemming posted:Well, I don't think those are good ideas for them for the reasons you've outlined, having things more open allows more innovation to happen, and at this point they pretty much automatically benefit from good VR stuff getting created anywhere, since there's a high chance someone will use one of their devices to play it even if it's on PC. That said, I think that's a different issue than the status quo, which is still pretty open at this point; at least, it's not a roadblock for people making/sharing right now. Well, driving adoption of their platform isn't in itself the long term goal in absentia of everything else, and I'd be curious about how much profit they actually make off of their store. They currently benefit from these things, yes, because their current goal is to get people onto their platform. Once everyone is on their platform, though, who knows what they're going to do and how they're going to pivot with that dominance? I understand that this can seem mildly like fearmongering in the sense that "Well we can't know what they might do in the future" is a pretty meaningless statement, but if they're not really making any money off of any of this, they're going to have to do so eventually. The way they do that is likely going to be closing off the platform more so they can charge a premium on software; or, in Facebook form, selling data. Which of those it'll be is kind of up in the air, but I don't see a way for them to make the amount of profit they want while also continuing on in this fashion. Cuts of software sales can make a ton of money long term, but I don't think the current way they're doing it would be enough for them to actually turn a significant profit on what's likely been an enormous investment. Either way, us pontificating about this is kinda a moot point; PCVR definitely isn't going anywhere, but Facebook pretty much owns VR currently, and I can't see that changing any time soon.
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Aug 3, 2021 04:45
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Lemming posted:Any kind of external-device based solution is going to be so much worse and so much more expensive than arm-based locomotion unless technology somehow drastically improves for mechanical devices, or we get brain machine interfaces working well As a corollary to that, I really liked NaLo's implementation of basically running in place with the trackers on. It feels silly and honestly is kind of silly, but it works really well compared to just using a stick.
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Aug 15, 2021 13:33
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Neddy Seagoon posted:It's not ARM, it's an x86 processor if it follows Steam Deck. Which could put a dent in Quest's marketshare given it'd be running PCVR software natively, so devs can make one build for the Steam headset running standalone AND PCVR. It'd have to be pretty insane to run modern PCVR games at anything resembling a decent resolution while not having a much, much higher weight than the Steam Deck. The Deck at 399 is already an insanely low price and has nowhere near the power to run the Index, and 1600x1400 is already kinda long in the tooth. Strapping a headset onto it and having that be under 1,000 dollars is kind of a pipe dream, imo.
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Jan 19, 2022 17:55
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Neddy Seagoon posted:Same build !== Same graphics. You just wind up having a version that runs on lowered graphical settings for the standalone headset. I mean, maybe, but that seems like a lot of optimization, especially trying to get it into a significantly smaller form factor while also being significantly cheaper. SCheeseman posted:The APU used in the Deck is only deficient in it's graphics performance, which barely compares to a GTX1050. 1050ti-level performance might be enough given some compromises, foveated rendering could get it over the line. GTX 1060 performance would comfortably run most PCVR games, but getting that much power in a 15w TDP SoC is impossible today, maybe in an architecture generation or die shink? The Deck is targeting a single 800p screen at 30 FPS for most modern games, iirc, with 60 FPS being a good bonus for less straining games. I think running two higher resolution screens at at least 90hz in a smaller form factor is kinda optimistic.
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Jan 19, 2022 19:11
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I mean the much bigger move would just be sticking a small and not particularly performant computer in there to facilitate low latency streaming The Deck is good but the performance for actually running PCVR just isn't there yet imo
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Mar 17, 2022 12:24
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EbolaIvory posted:Yeah but this is my point. Quality to Garbage ratios matter. Thats all. Your point sort of falls off when you consider that what you're actually saying is just "There's a bunch more garbage low effort games on Steam than on the app store because the app store is more curated"(This isn't necessarily true in itself for the app store, but y'know) because this isn't a thing specific to VR, it's just a mobile game vs. PC game thing. Quality to garbage ratios don't really matter, and you can mostly just refer to Sturgeon's Law on this. Really, most people aren't actually playing a ton of new games all the time. Lemming posted:I mean the problem there is the industry's insistence on continuing to use stick locomotion, which is one of the worst kinds for nausea. Hand based locomotion where you use your hands to push and pull on the environment to move around are a lot more comfortable, but for some reason devs don't seem to be picking up on that and using it You sort of have to design the whole game around doing that, which is something you yourself obviously did very well, but it seems like it locks you into some difficult constraints. A fantasy game where you play a wizard who grabs reality and pulls it around themselves to move is an interesting concept that could be very fun, but you can't really do that for every fantasy game.
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Dec 27, 2022 12:23
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School Nickname posted:My brother is begging me to set up Dolphin VR for Metroid Prime VR. Bitched and moaned about every VR app I threw at him due to the control schemes, until he came across an Oblivion world in VRchat. He converted there and then, but won't admit it ("Just want to see Metroid Prime in VR"). You'd probably have more fun if you went into magic or the old tried and true stealth archer thing, honestly. Neither really requires much arm movement.
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Dec 28, 2022 18:57
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Turin Turambar posted:So, about why there isn't a Homeworld VR. This is sorta just an effect of modern gamedev being expensive and there not being much return on the investment in VR specifically, I think
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Jan 11, 2023 20:26
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Lemming posted:I think people are also underestimating how long those kinds of games actually had to "cook" in terms of the medium as a whole. In a lot of ways the progression of flat screen design has been limited by technology, but it's also had time to mature along the way. Flat games are decades and decades old, even at the point where a lot of those things were made. VR as a mainstream thing is a lot younger, so maybe we've just been really overestimating how fast people are able to iterate on and learn how to do things "properly" for the new medium (and I really do think it comes down to the fact that VR is a new medium, and not just a new way to play flatscreen games) That's pretty true. We can even look at older control schemes, for a direct comparison to your VR locomotion annoyances - FPS tank controls were, nostalgia aside, extremely bad.
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Jan 11, 2023 21:04
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Turin Turambar posted:Or Blade Edge of Darkness / Severance. Great game at the time, with very advanced lightning and physics... and tank controls :/. Even past VR games in specific being expensive to make, it can't be overstated that large scale games are also kinda just expensive, these days; Skyrim VR is by far the biggest open world VR game because it's also one of the biggest open world normal games, and it cost 100 million dollars or something to make. The flatscreen version was absolutely worth it and has made its money back several times over, but I doubt that's true of VR dev stuff, so you have a system where not only is it more expensive to make things to a large scale because of the removal of abstraction, but also where you have vastly less potential customers. Smaller games like Beatsaber or Gorilla Tag can do very well and be extremely fun, but they're hardly the same scope as AAA VR stuff like Alyx, which seemed to be mostly pushed by Valve just wanting to make it.
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Jan 12, 2023 12:28
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njsykora posted:That's the CEO of the Pistol Whip devs for anyone who wants to know the guy's credentials. Though I deeply question this part, VR is not a threat to the AAA games industry my dude. That part mostly reads like cope for the disinterest of large studios; they don't see it as worth the investment and this isn't because it's difficult to monetize and has a witheringly small userbase comparatively, but because they're threatened
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Jan 12, 2023 13:53
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Turin Turambar posted:The part where I raised an eyebrow is this one: " traditional publishers typically don't care about VR." It also ignores that, whether those projects were good or profitable or significant amounts of effort, a lot of traditional publishers have put out a bunch of VR games, so they're obviously not actively ignoring it
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Jan 12, 2023 14:44
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