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FAUXTON posted:
...No The material evidence from sites in southern Chile is roughly contemporaneous to the migrations along northern routes. It's tinfoily because it doesn't suit our old narrative of people coming down the ice free corridor and the peopling of the Americas branching from there littering the ground with Clovis points as they go. There is actually a considerable amount of physical evidence for multiple pathways to the Americas (esp in the fjordlands of Patagonia), even without getting into the actually-tenuous arguments that center on exchange of agricultural plants between S. America and Africa or Oceana. My igneous petrology prof has done a lot of work on identifying obsidian tools by individual sources (lava flow/volcano by time and place) that are found in southern Chile and Argentina. That said, this second wave empty America thing is crazy nonsense that sounds like typical nazi flat Earth conspiracy bullshit
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Dec 2, 2019 15:35
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there's abso fuckin lutely nothing in the archaeological, anthropological, or paleological record that supports such a horseshit myth
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FAUXTON posted:poo poo I didn't know there was hard evidence, even contemporaneous with the Beringia timeline - I'd only thought they were basing the idea on something like a similar word for yams. No, not at all. The Monte Verde site in Chile has hearths, wooden posts, and human footprints. Best estimates using carbon isotope place the date at about 15ka, so actually just a bit older than the oldest material markers in North America. The multiple pathways thing absolutely had been regarded as tinfoil in the past, but that was a product of how eurocentric and dogmatic the academic communities studying these questions were, even in the face of mounting evidence from colleagues in the far south of the Americas. Good reading on that topic in particular can be found in Red Earth, White Lies by Vine Deloria, Jr.
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Dec 2, 2019 16:11
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Mr. Nice! posted:I personally think what happened isn't that people crossed the atlantic and south pacific earlier than beringa. Rather, people crossing beringa did so mostly be sailing along the coasts as people have done basically as long as people have been moving around. People settled up and down the entire western coast of the Americas before they penetrated inland. Your version is how the Monte Verde evidence is generally interpreted in context of the Bering/ice-free corridor/Clovis man evidence as well (at least in the 1000 level archaeology I took). The biggest problem is that boats made of reed or whatever are about as perishable as material culture gets, so it's hard to say one way or another whether the people popped across the south Pacific or down the west coast of the Americas. Edit: the key point here is that the Americas were settled in much more complex paths than the originally supposed big vector down the middle from Alaska. Either interpretation of the Monte Verde (from the north or the west) leads to this conclusion. US Berder Patrol fucked around with this message at 19:09 on Dec 2, 2019 |
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Dec 2, 2019 19:05
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Plastic_Gargoyle posted:I'd qualify that, as Deloria has some extremely hoary ideas about Natives not having migrated here "because their mythology says they didn't." I wholeheartedly agree. I'm reading it as a geology student, and he claims to be a young earth creationist of a sort, so there are plenty of points in the book where it's like, "oooh kay". Still, he makes a lot of solid points about academia relying more on doctrine than evidence at intersections between science and indigenous culture or history. I've actually read a few things he wrote and always find them pretty powerful.
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Dec 3, 2019 01:10
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Vincent Van Goatse posted:The easiest explanation for the earlier dates of first known habitation in places like Monte Verde vs. North America is that they were established by a maritime population who followed the coastline, and most of their habitation sites along the West Coast got drowned by rising sea levels. This is perfectly reasonable, and probably correct, anyway. The biggest hurdle in understanding it is definitely a tandem between the sea level rise that followed the last glacial maxima and the perishability of their material culture. The sea level rise could also provide lots of opportunity for artifacts to be sedimented in place and aged by stratigraphy, much moreso had it occurred on a tectonically passive margin. Unfortunately, stuff like cedar bark skirts or yucca fiber sandles and what have you don't take much abuse, especially under those kind of geochemical regimes. Monte Verde was sedimented over by muddy stuff in anoxic conditions. Stuff left soaked in water, on a sandy beach or washed to sea isn't going to make it.
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Dec 3, 2019 04:25
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that's what I meant about the tectonic margin all that south america poo poo is riding sidesaddle on a subducting plate turning everything into arc volcanoes all around it
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Dec 3, 2019 06:52
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Speaking of the study of material culture: https://www.latimes.com/entertainment-arts/story/2019-12-02/tom-kiefer-exhibition-el-sueno-americano LA Times: Border Patrol threw away migrants’ belongings. A janitor saved and photographed them An artist working part time as a janitor at a border patrol den or nest or hive or whatever photographed migrants' belongings thrown in the trash. Bibles, rosaries, baby shoes and lots of cold pills. He has a background in graphic design and made cool art of it.
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Dec 3, 2019 15:36
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Casimir Radon posted:So when I found out Clint Eastwood was making a Richard Jewell movie I wondered if it was just some excuse for pro-Donnie demonizing of the FBI and media. Turns out that's exactly what it is. loving go away Clint. Can someone sing me the Richard Jewell saga, I don't remember what happened. Foiled bomb plot at the Olympics?
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Dec 3, 2019 23:26
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McNally posted:I will never apologize for being racist against upside-down people.
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Dec 4, 2019 07:06
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We're gonna build a wall, and Canada's gonna pay for it
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Dec 4, 2019 16:26
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Yeah but any Lanyard that earnestly describes themself as rank-equivalent to a bunch of enlisted and previously enlisted is a giant turd dressed in a polo shirt and 5.11 trousers when deserves every ounce of mockery
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Dec 5, 2019 04:38
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Whoopsie daisy
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Dec 5, 2019 04:39
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Nostalgia4Butts posted:if you wear 5.11 trousers i judge you no matter what War criminal or aspires to be one, 100% of the time
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Dec 5, 2019 04:41
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Internet Wizard posted:It belongs in the Smithsonian, not some techbro's ~private collection~ It belongs in a museum!
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Dec 10, 2019 16:48
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McNally posted:Studying the American Civil War in Finland is probably a non-starter. ... So you're going to study it in Scotland instead?
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Dec 13, 2019 23:27
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McNally posted:Edinburgh. Ok, well drat that actually sounds pretty interesting. Good luck with your application! I only spent an afternoon in Edinburgh once, but it was a beautiful city.
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Dec 14, 2019 05:52
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That Works posted:One of my old roommates when I lived in OK was a youth minister. He went away to work at a summer camp and came back with a girlfriend who started staying over all the time. He was 27, she turned 18 on Labor day. She was one of his... (students?) at the camp. Yeah but she is pretty old by biblical standards and the alcoholic beverages weren't anywhere near as strong in those days as today In conclusion american protestant christianity is a land of contrasts
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Dec 15, 2019 21:00
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Going UA or AWOL will always be an honorable decision in my book
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Dec 16, 2019 18:49
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Onward christian so-oldiers Marching as to waaaar
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Dec 30, 2019 17:41
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Everybody making Benghazi comparisons is due to be deeply disappointed when this embassy storming is immediately forgotten by everyone in charge, including dem congressturds
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Dec 31, 2019 20:58
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FrozenVent posted:The president tweeting classified satellite imagery. Hahaha yeah drat that's a good one
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Dec 31, 2019 21:19
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| # ¿ May 18, 2024 03:59 |
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man oh man
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Jan 1, 2020 05:10
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