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Yep, part of the defense's case is that the amount of force that Chauvin used was appropriate to the risk presented, and therefore was not negligent in causing Mr. Floyd's death. If they can prove that Mr. Floyd was on drugs, then they could argue that what would normally be perceived as excessive was necessary to subdue a drugged (as in Coked-up and raging) suspect. E: Corrected some statements that I was incorrect about. Velocity Raptor fucked around with this message at 17:17 on Apr 8, 2021 |
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Apr 8, 2021 17:12
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Kalit posted:Yep. I didn't even know NM rescinded it, but I guess it just got signed into law yesterday: https://www.forbes.com/sites/nicksi...sh=5b56d42c79ad I thought it was pretty damning as well, especially when they pointed out in that one image that Chauvin's feet weren't resting on the ground when he was kneeling on Mr. Floyd's neck. However, I should preface this with I fully believe Chauvin should be convicted, so my views are biased. E: Honestly pretty impressed with how well the prosecution is busting down each of the alternate causes of death presented by the defense. Velocity Raptor fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Apr 8, 2021 |
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Apr 8, 2021 21:33
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Sjs00 posted:What is going on Not entirely sure of the prosecution's angle right now (sympathy?), but they've got George Floyd's younger brother on the stand. E: Seems like they're establishing Mr. Floyd's lifestyle as being active. Velocity Raptor fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Apr 12, 2021 |
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Apr 12, 2021 19:36
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I'm hesitant to pass judgement on the defense's performance since I'm not a lawyer, nor do I have a law background, and because I realize that this is probably a tough case to defend, but can any law goons speak to whether Nelson is doing a good job? It seems quite a few of his questions (with this witness, at least) have been answered to the contrary of the point the defense was making.
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Apr 12, 2021 21:55
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Right now it seems the defense is presenting its case that a person being prone is not typically a cause of death. But that really seems like a dangerous road to go down, because wouldn't that further cement the fact that Mr. Floyd was killed not because he was prone, but rather because Chauvin was kneeling on his neck?
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Apr 14, 2021 17:45
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LeeMajors posted:I’m not sure what cops are taught or why it is so common in LE, but during physical or chemical restraint we are taught to specifically NEVER prone anyone. EVER. Even without sitting on their necks or backs. Yeah, one of the prosecution's witnesses a couple of days ago was talking about proper police protocol and how the only time anyone is supposed to be placed prone is to cuff them, and even then it's only supposed to be a transitory position. Once the cuffs are on and the suspect is restrained, they are supposed to be rolled onto their side, in a recovery position.
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Apr 14, 2021 18:08
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Christ, this witness like to hear himself talk. "Yes or no, sir. Is this true?" "Yes because  "
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Apr 14, 2021 20:04
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"Sir, did Mr. Floyd complain of a headache?" "Yes, I believe he did." "You do?" "Well, I can't remember, actually."
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Apr 14, 2021 20:41
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Boy, Dr. Fowler seems to have a chronic issue with misunderstanding the questions he's been answering, or accidentally misspeaking...
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Apr 14, 2021 21:27
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Apr 14, 2021 21:42
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Gaupo Guacho posted:my dad suggested something about a mistrial? I was pretty confident wed get at least a conviction on one count but freaking out a bit now He may have been talking about at the start of today's proceeding where the council was talking with the judge. The prosecution had submitted evidence regarding carbon monoxide levels in Mr. Floyd's blood after Dr. Fowler's testimony, and the judge was saying that they can't accept it because it's way too late in the hearing. The judge said something to the affect of "Allowing this evidence so late would open the door to a mistrial since the defense wouldn't have time to properly prepare, so I must show prejudice on the side of the defense and not allow this evidence to come forth." This is why the prosecution ended up going with the questions blood-oxygen saturation in relation to carbon-monoxide saturation. E: Example, "Mr. Floyd's oxygen saturation was 98%. That means that there couldn't have been more than 2% CO saturation, correct"
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Apr 15, 2021 16:56
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LeeMajors posted:I hope not. I mean, that's literally the question the prosecution asked. https://lawofselfdefense.com/chauvin-trial-day-14-wrap-up-mistrial-narrowly-avoided-closing-arguments-monday/ Article posted:First, the state claimed that the Hennepin County Medical Examiner, Dr. Thomas Baker, after hearing Fowler’s testimony yesterday on the carbon dioxide issue, had somehow dug into the hospital’s records and found that Floyd’s blood concentration of CO had, in fact, been measured at the time—but had never been previously produced when the parties had subpoenaed Floyd’s medical records.
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Apr 16, 2021 05:41
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The Lone Badger posted:Isn't that manslaughter? As I understand it, the difference is that with manslaughter, someone died by accident and it was unforseen. Like if you set up a zipline over a ravine, and had people over to use it. Then the line snaps and someone falls to their death. That would be manslaughter. You can draw a line from you building the zipline to someone's death, but it's clear that your intent with the zipline wasn't meant to harm, much less kill. Murder 3 is a death resulting from having no regard for human life while you're doing something. A good example of this is keeping someone prone in order to control them (not something that could be expected to kill someone by itself) but keeping them prone by kneeling on their neck for almost 10 minutes, causing that person to die. You were negligent to the fact that kneeling on their neck could cause death by either strangulation or oxygen deprivation. The other argument for murder 3 could be if while kneeling on that person's neck, you're told that the person you're kneeling on had no pulse, but you keep kneeling on their neck. It's this blatant disregard that separates murder 3 from manslaughter.
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Apr 19, 2021 12:51
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I wonder how long it will take for a verdict to be returned.  if it's decided tonight.E: vv Ooh, that is good.
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Apr 19, 2021 21:58
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What is this about "belittling of the defense?" I didn't watch the closing arguments. Nelson is calling for a mistrial due to "Prosecutorial misconduct."
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Apr 19, 2021 22:01
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"Motion for mistrial is denied."  E: Vitamin P posted:It's twee dogshit, just like putting literal children and unprepped civies on the witness stand was twee dogshit. The prosecution seems to be more concerned with emotive brand-building than winning the specific case.  It's a memorable way to close out arguments and it sticks with people. I think that'll go a long way staying at the front of the jury's mind while they deliberate.
Velocity Raptor fucked around with this message at 22:14 on Apr 19, 2021 |
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Apr 19, 2021 22:11
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:How soon do we think we will get a verdict? And I suspect Chauvin could appeal as well? Appeal is pretty much a given. The judge even told the defense they should file that relatively quickly.
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Apr 19, 2021 22:24
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Crosby B. Alfred posted:Ugh.... If it's any consolation, an appeal isn't a whole new trial. The appellate court simply reads through the records and verifies that everything was handled properly. https://www.uscourts.gov/about-federal-courts/types-cases/appeals quote:Appeals are decided by panels of three judges working together. The appellant presents legal arguments to the panel, in writing, in a document called a "brief." In the brief, the appellant tries to persuade the judges that the trial court made an error, and that its decision should be reversed.
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Apr 19, 2021 22:29
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Don't cops get a lot of poo poo from the other inmates in prison as well?
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Apr 20, 2021 00:49
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IANAL, but I would imagine that coercing someone on the jury to reach a specific verdict (even from someone on the same jury) could be grounds for a mistrial if it gets made public, especially with receipts.
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Apr 20, 2021 14:31
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idiotsavant posted:I have no idea what Maxine Waters said or didn’t say, but I’m confused how anything she’d say might be grounds for appeal given that the jurors are ostensibly sequestered and only living in the world of the courtroom right now? https://www.cnn.com/2021/04/19/politics/maxine-waters-derek-chauvin-trial/index.html Maxine Waters posted:Waters said she was in Brooklyn Center, Minnesota, on Saturday night to show her support for protesters amid ongoing protests over the police killing of Daunte Wright and to also support his family. Here's a video with the defense's argument against what Ms. Waters said, for context of what all this call of a mistrial is about. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SYjrAdcQBDU
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Apr 20, 2021 17:53
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Jaxyon posted:Tell me more about how horrible LA is, while we discuss the "violent" rhetoric of this "low IQ individual" Maxine Waters. You're being super defensive about Congresswoman Waters. This isn't a case of two extremes. Good people can do dumb things and it doesn't change the good they've done. Similarly, people can disagree with and criticize what someone did and it doesn't mean they're now cancelled. What Ms. Waters said wasn't dumb or even wrong. However, the timing of her statement was ill thought out. This was the day before a jury was about to be sequestered for deliberation and (however small it was) she gave the defense lawyer of a racist murderer a solid piece to use in an appeal to a potential guilty verdict.
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Apr 20, 2021 18:34
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redreader posted:I haven't been reading the thread and I came to ask a question so I apologise if this has been covered in depth already: IIRC, the judge went over their instructions at before he sequestered them on Friday. Basically they just have a form that has each of the 3 things Chauvin is convicted of (with explanations of what each specifically means) with a simple "Guilty/Not Guilty" check box underneath. The jury is to come to a conclusion for each of the counts and check whether Chauvin is guilty on any of the counts individually, and the head juror marks it down. The jury could've been the ones deciding the punishment as well, however Chauvin waived that right and instead the judge will be determining the punishment depending on the verdicts the jury returns.
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Apr 20, 2021 18:51
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Jaxyon posted:When was a "good time" for her to express her feelings about oppression and death she lives with every single day? If it was just her expressing "her feelings about oppression and death she lives with every single day" then it wouldn't have come up. Instead she said publicly that if Chauvin wasn't given a guilty verdict then people need to march on the streets and not back down. Again, WHAT she said isn't the problem. However, saying specifically this the literal day before a jury for the Chauvin trial (who she called out specifically, mind you) was to begin deliberation could be used (and is!) in the appeals case that there was coercion for the jury to reach a guilty verdict. If she said this after the jury began deliberation (when the jury is sequestered, so they can't see that she made this statement) no one would be having this discussion. It unnecessarily gives ammo to the defense to appeal a potential guilty verdict. Yes, the defense was going to appeal anyway, but giving them more grievances to add to the appeal doesn't help and could actually undo justice.
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Apr 20, 2021 20:18
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Jaxyon posted:HAH I never said that what she said was wrong. In fact, I literally said the opposite. Velocity Raptor posted:If it was just her expressing "her feelings about oppression and death she lives with every single day" then it wouldn't have come up. Instead she said publicly that if Chauvin wasn't given a guilty verdict then people need to march on the streets and not back down. Like, I get you're upset that cops disproportionately target BIPOC. I am too, that's why it's frustrating that this now is a factor in the appeals filing.
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Apr 20, 2021 20:26
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Piell posted:Verdict incoming in the next hour and a half This is central time, correct?
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Apr 20, 2021 20:35
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That's not a good sign.  Hopefully that's just a general precaution and not a precaution of "people are gonna riot because Chauvin has been acquitted."E: Link to live stream: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm48swwALnc vv That's good to hear. Velocity Raptor fucked around with this message at 20:44 on Apr 20, 2021 |
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Apr 20, 2021 20:42
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Skyarb posted:If he is found guilty today, will he also be sentenced today? I don't know how this works. Within 90 days, typically, according to google. quote:Typically, sentencing will take place ninety days after a guilty plea or guilty verdict. Prior to sentencing, the judge must calculate the applicable guidelines range. The Sentencing Guidelines are a set of rules which apply in federal sentencing.
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Apr 20, 2021 21:18
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ryde posted:So I'm not sure if I'm messing up time zones, but the verdict should be read in about 5 minutes right? Nope, you've got it right. Starting in a couple of minutes. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mm48swwALnc
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Apr 20, 2021 21:27
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Kalit posted:
She started rambling after a bit and the reporter ended up cutting her off.
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Apr 20, 2021 21:41
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Wow, they just showed a view from outside the court house, and there are a LOT of people gathered.
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Apr 20, 2021 21:43
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Cmooooon. Read the verdict. "Verdict will be read between 3:30 and 4." *verdict read at 3:55*
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Apr 20, 2021 21:53
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Kirios posted:Didn't realize Comcast ran this courtroom. Apparently they are. They've missed the appointment.
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Apr 20, 2021 22:00
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It's starting!
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Apr 20, 2021 22:05
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 Guilty on all counts!
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Apr 20, 2021 22:07
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Holy poo poo, the look of fear in Chauvin's eyes.
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Apr 20, 2021 22:08
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Saxophone posted:Post a picccc 
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Apr 20, 2021 22:10
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It seems that when it came to the police... Chauvin crossed the line.
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Apr 20, 2021 22:18
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Apr 20, 2021 22:21
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The other cops that were involved in George Floyd's murder are going to have their trials broadcast, similar to Chauvin's. https://www.independent.co.uk/news/...n-b1840363.html Full story quoted because paywall quote:Some in the Minnesota legal system were apprehensive about allowing the live broadcast of Chauvin's trial over the killing of George Floyd but the video feed had no major problems and bolstered the public's understanding of the trial, Minnesota Public Radio News reported.
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Apr 30, 2021 20:37
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