EvilHawk posted:

Instead the DUP are deliberately dragging their heels to (I think) get the best deal for themselves. The longer it goes on the more time Labour can trot people out to the press shouting about the "Coalition of Chaos". The 1922 committee cannot possibly get her to resign now as it would basically hand the government over to Labour. They have to hope that the Queen's Speech will go through smoothly (and I sense that Corbyn is going to do everything in his power to stop that from happening). Any other action will absolutely lead to an election in 6 months.

Ludicro posted:

Sorry I should specify this was my parents house. I moved back a few years ago after my relationship broke down and I lost my flat, since then I bounced back, met my current girlfriend and have spent a few days a week there while we house hunt as it's a 20 minute walk from work rather than a 37 mile drive.

Basically she started arguing with me almost as soon as I came through the door (I'd been staying with my girlfriend since Thursday as usual). Tried to avoid the discussion as I know it never ends well, but ended up responding as she seemed convinced that the Tories won, Labour lost, and that all "you young people" voted for Corbyn because we wanted free handouts. She blew her top when I commented that the Tories view the sick and disabled as scroungers (she is disabled) and screamed at me repeatedly to pack my stuff and get out.

Luckily I was able to go back to my girlfriends place which is where I am now. Bit of a shock tbh.

goddamnedtwisto posted:

Not Operator posted:

I'm genuinely shocked by this level of self awareness. I just assumed they repeated it until this bollocks until they believed it.

Ludicro posted:

Basically she started arguing with me almost as soon as I came through the door (I'd been staying with my girlfriend since Thursday as usual). Tried to avoid the discussion as I know it never ends well, but ended up responding as she seemed convinced that the Tories won, Labour lost, and that all "you young people" voted for Corbyn because we wanted free handouts. She blew her top when I commented that the Tories view the sick and disabled as scroungers (she is disabled) and screamed at me repeatedly to pack my stuff and get out.

Overminty posted:

Been away for the weekend so I left this til I got back.



Also as I was catching up on my phone and wanted to come back to your quote later so I saved the link to google keep. The pic it decided to go with said link was, well...



All hall Ober communist bitch

Noxville posted:

Even if they do get a Qieens Speech through I can't see this attempted government lasting that long, and going into another election with May in charge is suicide. I'd have said the Tories best chance would be installing one of the less obviously off sensible MPs like Philip Hammond in charge with time enough for him to have had a few months in charge before the election and with a new manifesto that is not so transparently nasty, grasping and spiteful.

Another election is not too far in the future and they'll take more significant losses than in this one if they don't stop the bleeding quickly. Look how discredited May became during the campaign, add more on for the embarrassment of the outcome and then further for using the DUP to prop her up. She'll poison the party.

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

That kind of thing is unfortunately what happens when people who've bought whole hog into the right wing narrative get smacked in the face with reality. Cognitive dissonance translates into panic anger.

Sorry man.

Not Operator posted:

I'm genuinely shocked by this level of self awareness. I just assumed they repeated it until this bollocks until they believed it.

Gorn Myson posted:

I like that journalists are only now realising that Lynton Crosby isn't some evil genius, hes actually full of poo poo and is working with a very limited and transparently obvious set of tools.

Baron Corbyn posted:

way back but supposedly Corbyn and McDonnell see Rebecca Long-Bailey as their successor.

Fans posted:

There's no way May goes into the next election. The reason she's still there is because who'd even want to be leader at this point?

Right now the party is reeling and it ain't going to get easier.

quote:

How much leverage do the Democratic Unionist Party have over the Conservatives?

The traditional conservative party that is Northern Ireland’s largest is negotiating an arrangement with the Tories to keep them in office, after Theresa May fell short of a majority in the election last week.

There’s one reading that says that the DUP have precious little leverage. Their antipathy to Jeremy Corbyn due to his historical meetings with the IRA during the 1980s means that, unlike with previous Labour leaders, they cannot do a deal with Labour. Nor can they go back to their voters having put Corbyn in Downing Street.

So they’re stuffed, right? Whatever the Conservatives put on the table, they have to accept. Well, not really.

The DUP have already agreed in principle to a “confidence and supply” deal – that is, they will support the government on budget votes and votes of confidence – but the details are still to be hammered out.

But what is being missed are the consequences of the Fixed Term Parliaments Act of 2011, and the increased leverage it gives to the DUP. Under the act, a parliament runs for five years unless there is a two-thirds majority for an early election or the government loses a vote of no confidence and no-one is able to form a new government within 14 days.

The really important thing about that is it significantly reduces the scope of what “confidence and supply” means. When Labour ran a minority government for five years from 1974 to 1979, they were both more vulnerable (they could have fallen almost at any time) and more powerful (as they could turn difficult votes into “back me or sack me” issues). And it was assumed that finance bills and Queen’s Speeches were confidence issues.

Thanks to the Fixed Term Parliaments Act, “confidence votes” have been explicitly drawn to exclude votes on the Budget or the Queen’s Speech. A government only falls if it loses a vote of no confidence. It no longer falls if it loses a major vote, a Budget vote or even the Queen’s Speech.

This obviously increases the leverage of the DUP – and Labour’s ability to harry the government day-to-day. The DUP can hold the government up, by backing them in confidence votes. But they can also let them down by deserting them on essentially everything else to secure bigger concessions from the Conservative Party.

Far from being trapped by the Conservatives, the DUP have more leverage over them than a minor party has ever enjoyed in a hung parliament before.

Firos posted:

Could you imagine having to choose between Clive Lewis or Rebecca Long-Bailey in a Labour leadership contest? What an agony of choice

Hieronymous Alloy posted:

That kind of thing is unfortunately what happens when people who've bought whole hog into the right wing narrative get smacked in the face with reality. Cognitive dissonance translates into panic anger.

Sorry man.

Skinty McEdger posted:

The situation they're in makes it even harder for a credible new leader to emerge. She can't afford to bring genuine new blood into the cabinet without alienating one of the established big dogs, and so the only MP's who are likely to have a chance of making a bid are those same old names who have terrible image problems to start with.

Ludicro posted:

Sorry I should specify this was my parents house. I moved back a few years ago after my relationship broke down and I lost my flat, since then I bounced back, met my current girlfriend and have spent a few days a week there while we house hunt as it's a 20 minute walk from work rather than a 37 mile drive.

Basically she started arguing with me almost as soon as I came through the door (I'd been staying with my girlfriend since Thursday as usual). Tried to avoid the discussion as I know it never ends well, but ended up responding as she seemed convinced that the Tories won, Labour lost, and that all "you young people" voted for Corbyn because we wanted free handouts. She blew her top when I commented that the Tories view the sick and disabled as scroungers (she is disabled) and screamed at me repeatedly to pack my stuff and get out.

Luckily I was able to go back to my girlfriends place which is where I am now. Bit of a shock tbh.

dispatch_async posted:

Here's the DUP version of kustomkarkommando's fanfic:

There's something everyone has missed about the DUP and the Fixed Term Parliaments Act

Zephro posted:

Are you going to write back to them? I mean, they're completely wrong and that seems pretty significant.

mehall posted:

Yeah, I've went back to them, and am asking my MP on twitter (after congratulating him on re-election) to confirm UK Policy, telling him the BBC said otherwise.

Captain Fargle posted:

So what do you folks think actually will sink the agreement between the DUP and the Tories?

Captain Fargle posted:

So what do you folks think actually will sink the agreement between the DUP and the Tories?

feedmegin posted:

So traditionally, losing a vote on the Budget is no confidence and an instant election. Makes sense; the government no longer has the legal right to spend money. What the hell happens if that happens now? Do we get yank-style shutdowns of the whole administration?

Fans posted:

If you want a Gang Tag drop me a PM. Please don't fill up the thread asking for them.



They'll take a little to turn up.

dispatch_async posted:

Here's the DUP version of kustomkarkommando's fanfic:

There's something everyone has missed about the DUP and the Fixed Term Parliaments Act

Gort posted:

Well, I guess Labour would get a chance to form a government, probably refuse, and then we'd get a new election.

feedmegin posted:

So traditionally, losing a vote on the Budget is no confidence and an instant election. Makes sense; the government no longer has the legal right to spend money. What the hell happens if that happens now? Do we get yank-style shutdowns of the whole administration?

CestMoi posted:

Everyone please remember to sign the petition to investigate Labour's electoral fraud, because students have 2 places they can sign up, so they obviously voted twice. We need to deliver this petition to the Sun newspaper.

https://www.change.org/p/uk-electoral-commission-labour-general-election-fraud-2017

quote:

We should not abandon vellum – it tells us that our laws are serious

No one disputes the need to cut parliamentary costs. But inscribing acts on paper instead of calfskin will save little, and undermine the authority of UK legislation

Intrinsic Field Marshal posted:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Kirchick#2016_presidential_elections

Well Surprise Surprise that the Hillary Clinton Supporter is complaining about too much democracy!

too intelligent for democracy

CestMoi posted:

Everyone please remember to sign the petition to investigate Labour's electoral fraud, because students have 2 places they can sign up, so they obviously voted twice. We need to deliver this petition to the Sun newspaper.

https://www.change.org/p/uk-electoral-commission-labour-general-election-fraud-2017

Looke posted:

My boy Rees-Mogg with the real news


https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/feb/17/vellum-laws-parliament-paper-costs?CMP=fb_gu