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Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


FISHMANPET posted:

So it's not copper, it's a silver wire so my next guess is aluminum. There's no marking on the wire except something like "Balden" and "12 duplex" and googling those words I find... automotive brake cables.

More likely to be Belden.

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Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Does anybody know why, historically, doorbells have transformers? Is it to prevent shocks if there's a wiring fault and the bell itself is live?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Is there a standard book on home electricity you guys recommend? Like, not "You are a contractor, please know how not to gently caress this up", but "This is the difference between neutral and ground, this is what the wiring diagram looks like for two switches in the same room", that sort of thing? I don't expect to be doing any wiring myself, but I like knowing how things work.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Last night I discovered my Kindle charger hadn't, so my bedtime reading was Wiring Complete. It's pretty fair; I wish the first chapter had had a basic diagram of "hot go in, neutral go out, ground go somewhere", showing an energized circuit with arrows. Good technical writing overall.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

I sure hope it doesn't, because that's not how AC works.

See? I need a diagram. :blush: :argh:

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


cruft posted:

In my house, every fixture is a "no ground wire" fixture, because they didn't run ground in 1942. I'd want to see that the fixture was double insulated, though.
Same. And no way to run new wiring, because the old wiring is knob-and-tube run through small holes drilled in the studs . We'd have to rip the horizontal beadboard off all the walls to run new wiring, and the beadboard is not replaceable. (It's made, but not in the same sizes.)

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

(unless you're in Chicago, then all bets are off and I have no idea how their code work, but you're not).
Do you feel like saying more about this?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


What does code say about doorbell wire (max 24 volts)? Can it be run on the exterior of a house? Does it need to be run through conduit? It turns out the previous owners of my house cut the doorbell wire not just at the doorbell, which would make sense, but at the porch level, which means it would have to be refished in a very un-fish-friendly house.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Extant Artiodactyl posted:

as long as the cable's outdoor rated, it's fine. hard to find specifics about doorbells in the NEC, when it comes to low voltage, they're more concerned with fire alarms and signalling circuits. it'd be nice to protect that wire, obviously, but considering that the transformer secondary side usually is just sitting there on the panel with its terminals all exposed, i don't think it's an issue.

looking at your predicament, i think you're being given the 'i don't want to do this' price by your electrician. honestly i would do the same!

That's cool; if it's safe for me to do it, I'm good with that.

e: It interests me that the electrician specifically called it "Belden wire" when talking about it to me and to his apprentice. I grew up in a town with a Belden factory, now closed. It was an auto-parts town, and all those factories are long closed. I grew up just calling it "doorbell wire"; it was what you used in My First Electric Project, as for 4-H.

Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Dec 5, 2021

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


As was gently suggested upthread, I've realized my electrician's proposal for replacing the doorbell wire was a hint at "I don't think this job is worth my time." (2 men, one day) This seems like a thing I can fix myself, with a tolerance for crawlspaces, spiders in my hair, and drilling poo poo.

I have one major question: How do I figure out which breaker the transformer is on? It's not like there's a socket I can plug a multitester into.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Anne Whateley posted:

I'm no electrician, but can you have someone ring the doorbell (or tape a pebble over it or something) and flip breakers until it stops ringing?

No, the whole problem is that the previous owner removed the doorbell and cut the wire at porch level; I need to run a new wire so I can mount a new doorbell.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Messadiah posted:

Can you have someone just triggering the chime at the chime itself until it doesn't chime? There should be 2 screw terminals in it which will be where the button was hooked up.

I'm installing a new chime, too! POs ripped out everything except the wiring under the house and the transformer.

Extant Artiodactyl posted:

if your transformer is attached to the panel you can just take the cover off and see what circuit it's on.

Are you assuming the panel would be labeled, showing which circuit the transformer was on? (it isn't.) Otherwise I'm not following you.

Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 20:08 on Dec 13, 2021

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


So, I have a question. A major electrical line is about two yards outside my window. It has a big thick ridged cylinder around it. Something is going hmmm at a semi-regular interval. Is the round thing a transformer, and is the humming normal?

Cellphone picture taken intno the sun through a window screen, sorry.



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L-x8ZpWQSLM

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Methylethylaldehyde posted:

That's a splice box for cable tv wire. It's a low voltage signal, and most easement/setback rules for it are 'as long as it doesn't rub on things when it's windy'. It's also why it's the lowest on the pole, nothing bad is gonna happen if you bump it or grab it. Power lines are generally up much higher and have a much larger setback requirement.

Edit: The humming is most likely the actual electrical lines further up.

Thank you!

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Inner Light posted:

Barenaked Ladies fan eh?

Very much so.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


tater_salad posted:

at night does this light up your room?

Haven't grabbed a fluorescent bulb to check.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


https://twitter.com/USCPSC/status/1537473976825413632

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


What's the best tape to use to wind around a @#$@#$@#$ computer power supply that has broken free of its connector again? (No wires exposed yet.) Electrical tape is way too sticky.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


VelociBacon posted:

Absolutely don't use a damaged cable... If you have two monitors maybe just grab the power cable from one of them for now until you pick up a replacement.
Well, boo. This is a Dell laptop cable, and apparently they've gone over to the Apple scheme of profits through fragility. Hi-ho, off to the parts store.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


slurm posted:

I'm guessing you mean the part that's hard wired to the power brick and goes into the laptop?

Yup. Those really are machine specific. e: And it's not USB-charged.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


H110Hawk posted:

Carpets give mild static shocks that go bang and are done in a microsecond.
I haven't lived in New England since 1992. I still reflexively touch the back of my hand to the top of the car door when getting out. (On a dry New England winter day, any car can build up a hell of a charge.)

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


KS posted:

I have seen ground potential melt cat6, and buildings with the second vendor's equipment replace 20% of their cable plant in a year.

I've seen things you people wouldn't believe... Cables on fire in the racks of DC2... I watched fiber glitter in the dark after a backhoe cut. All those moments will be lost in time, like my stock options... Time to die.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Btw, antiquelampsupply.com is great for finding reproduction parts (sockets, cord, pull chains) that match the original. For instance, twin cord.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


:eng99: question: What differentiates "hot" and "neutral" wires given that you're dealing with AC and current flows in both directions?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Our house is old, and the upper floor has historically been unheated, or heated by a 1950s --at latest-- portable space heater that plugs into (I think) a NEMA 220-30 outlet. Picture below. I have worried about the safety of the heater for some time; my husband loves it because it heats up so fast. I asked the electrician who was coming to do other work to rewire it; he took it to his shop and said that in conscience he couldn't repair it, because it was unsafe. The plug was partly melted, meaning that either the wall wiring or the heater itself was faulty, and of course it had no tip-over protection. I was relieved to have the unsafety of the heater confirmed.

So. We have heavy-duty wiring up to the office. Is there an alternative other than a baseboard heater? I have searched extensively, and as far as I can figure high-amperage heaters are available in Europe, but not the US. There are garage-quality heaters, but they don't have tip protectors and aren't safe for household use.

If we do a baseboard heater, do they have to be under the window?

Constraints.
The house was built in 1931. All the walls are either painted beadboard or knotty pine; neither can be easily replaced if damaged by removal and reinstallation. There is no central heating, and no ductwork. The only gas service to the house is propane, and there's no line up to the second floor. Mini-splits would have to be installed 20 feet in the air, with long supply lines down to the ground.

Thoughts?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


tangy yet delightful posted:

My non-wiring thought is could you just buy a heater from Europe? ebay.eu.com or whatever?

Assuming your electrician who attempted that re-wire says they could wire up the correct plug from a euro heater anyway.

I wasn't sure if rewiring the plug would be safe.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Qwijib0 posted:

There are UL Listed 240v portable heaters, like this one for example

https://www.globalindustrial.com/p/dual-heat-240v-fan-forced-heater

It needs a 6-20 plug instead of what you have, but it sounds like you should probably replace it anyway.
Waaay too high-powered for indoor use, also no indication of tip protection. And we've thrown away the old heater.

e: Thank you, movax. That was helpful in understanding.

Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 05:14 on Jan 11, 2023

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


The issue is that I wonder if there's a way to take advantage of the existing high-power line to feed a fast-warming heater. Otherwise we'll just stick with Vornado (in a different outlet) early in the day, to be turned off as the sun warms the room..

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


This is all very helpful, and I'll put it in my pocket until it comes time to deal with the upstairs heat. Right now, I am focused on the roof :aaaaa: and the septic system :ohno:.

If you're wondering why we put up with all this,

Arsenic Lupin posted:

I didn't even mean that as a humblebrag. Sorry.
e: Living room.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


My son's bedroom has a hard-wired 240 volt heater. The controls don't work and ! can't be turned off.

I called the local electricians to have it removed and they said, yeah, we'll call you back.

It's two months later, no callback. Is removing the heater and capping the wires something I can trust my handyman (recommended by the appliance store, FWIW) to do, or do I need to wait for the boys with the certification?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

So it this circuit a single breaker that you've turned off?
I'll check the subpanel. In this house, though, there's a good chance it's the same 240 line as the upstairs heating outlet.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

Gross, it's an ancient Zinsco panel. It's maybe okay, probably not gonna burn your house down but don't be surprised if some of the breakers are "soft" (i.e. trip below their rating) and then yeah.....who knows which ones won't trip at all. I'm not sure I've ever heard of that as an epidemic Zinsco thing though. Not like it's a stab-loc.
Our inspector flat-out said that our Zinsco subpanel had to be replaced, period end. We got money taken off the price to pay for it.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

Good to know. We have very few of those (left?) on on this coast so I've not personally run into a problem/investigation where they caused an issue.

But like I said.....seriously.....anything that old needs replacing.


Waitaminnnit, I'm as old as a Zinsco subpanel. :commissar:

e: Found this list

Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 03:33 on Jul 25, 2023

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Idle curiosity question. We just had a hideous fixture removed from our pantry. (Thanks for the rec of the farmhouse style lights; they were perfect.)
The back of the fixture looks like this:

Based on the wiring, when would you guys guess it was bought/installed?

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


It's cloth, all right.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


With this house, it's much much more likely to be original. I mean, there's a hand built wooden ironing board - not built in, standalone - and a 220V outlet in the upstairs to run an electric heater. Plus three different obsolete vacuum cleaners.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

Looks like you live in California and that's a title 24 switch.

You may want to pop that out enough to find a manufacture and model number a look up a cut sheet. It MIGHT have a mode to stay on based on some keypress dance/just hold it in for 5 seconds/etc. And if not you should probably find an "occupancy switch" that does that rather than parallel wiring.
Looked it up. Goddrat do I hate automatic vacancy sensors. Spent too much time waving an arm above my head because the sensors didn't detect me because I was sitting still typing.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic, remind me how I can identify whether my house is balloon framed? I remember something about going into the crawlspace, but not the details.

Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


kastein posted:

Yeah the ground neutral tie part confuses the hell out of me. I need to read over it again at some point.

A fire in the basement will do it right quick but is generally not recommended

Good point. X-ray gun would probably work as well.

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Arsenic Lupin
Apr 12, 2012

This particularly rapid💨 unintelligible 😖patter💁 isn't generally heard🧏‍♂️, and if it is🤔, it doesn't matter💁.


Motronic posted:

You needed big, old growth trees to mill 20-40 foot 2x stock that was straight enough to use, and you needed to be able to get them to the site. Even if balloon framing was a good idea, we just don't have the forestry stock to do it anymore. It would have to be done with engineered lumber.
My area was dominated by old-growth redwood lumbering, so I can make a pretty solid guess as to what the cheapest, most available wood would have been. In fact, I don't have to, because old redwood is exposed in various places

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